We keep going in circles

It doesn't matter what we call this group of people, Illuminati, O.T.O, the Brotherhood. It doesn't matter because at the end of the day they are still the top one percent of society and they are still screwing us over.

We shouldn't look up to these people. They cheated and stole their way on easy street or it was simply given to them.

When are some people going to stop denying the obvious? We can't run away from this stuff because we're still heading for a world dictatorship. UN is being reformed and when that reformation is done nobody here is going to lbe comfortable with what it looks like.

Is it really going to take a police state for some people to actually realize? I know alot of people out in the world still think that it's not happening but look at the police forces before 9/11 and look at them now. They aren't police anymore they are military police with all kinds of new weapons, gadgets and even hummers with sonic weapons.

"Those who surrender freedom for security are dumb and stupid..." My take on Ben Franklin.

I have a question for you.

Would you agree with this statement?

....There is a vile threat to the "rugged American individualism" that actual created the U.S.A. by the bureaucratic crowd who want society to be a convict prison.

"Safety first" -- there is no "social insecurity," no fear for the future, no anxiety about what to do next -- in Sing Sing.

All the totalitarian schemes add up to the same in the end. And the approach is so insidious, the arguments so subtle and irrefutable, the advantages so obvious -- that the danger is very real, very imminent, very difficult to bring home tot he average citizen, who sees only the immediate gain, and is hoodwinked as to the price that must be paid for.

I agree with the qoute/statement. I also believe that people who give up their rights for security deserve neither. We are a small group that sees what is going on. Many of the other people in America or even around the world won't buy it. Even though every year it gets worse and worse. It's not going to be long and what Hitler did the Jews is going to look like a vacation. All these FEMA camps around the country will soon be filled with people the Gov. feels is a threat. All I can say is keep educating yourself on these people and don't believe everything FOX News is telling you. Look up Northwoods document. It's been proven that our Gov. has sponsered terrorism on its own people. 911 isn't that much different.

They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. – Benjamin Franklin

He was a prognosticator!

However, I do not believe that this stated 1% really want a police state. Honestly, if they really were in charge and had all that control it would already exist.

I agree that it does not matter whether we call them Moriah Conquering Wind Or Illuminati or the Society of 300, or whatever* I imagine they seldom think about what they call themselves* I do think we should differentiate this power mad corporate Illuminatie from the Illuminists of many spiritual traditions who seek to help mankind, not rule them*

One way we can do our part to fight the "Illuminatie" is by converting our homes to solar power and living off grid, driving solar or electric vehicles, and generally supporting as many private businesses rather than megacorporations as we can*

On the mental/spiritual? side, we could train ourselves through pranayama to control our fears, these people thrive off fear, they build empires from it: If we are not afraid then they have already lost

Originally posted by Cug
I have a question for you.

Would you agree with this statement?

I propose a more fundamental analysis of the problem.

There is an ancient bargain, older than Man and inherited by him from the animals, according to which the strongest in a social group enjoy dominance and leadership, in exchange for protecting the group against external threats and maintaining order within it.

That bargain remains the basis of all society. We can't escape it; an instinct for social hierarchies is built into us, just like our instincts for nurture and self-preservation. But during the modern era, the bargain came to be renegotiated on terms more favourable to the mass of mankind. Today, many societies (though by no means all) enjoy the benefits of a somewhat altered arrangement. The powerful are no longer free to act as they please; their action is limited and curbed by the laws, regulations and customs built into our increasingly elaborate societies. These restraints on the unfettered abuse of power by the elite were hard won. The struggle lasted thousands of years, and the greatest victories were only won in the last two hundred years or so.

When people try to exchange liberty for security, they throw away those hard-won curbs on power. In offering yet more power up to the powerful in exchange for the protection they crave, they betray the toil, tears and blood of our ancestors.

[edit on 13-11-2006 by Astyanax]

Originally posted by jinsanity
It doesn't matter what we call this group of people, Illuminati, O.T.O, the Brotherhood. It doesn't matter because at the end of the day they are still the top one percent of society and they are still screwing us over.

Here's the problem, OTO is not the 'top 1% of society', neither are the masons, or any other group like that. Its senseless to say that there is a problem, and then incorrectly identify, of all things, OTO as the source.

We shouldn't look up to these people. They cheated and stole their way on easy street or it was simply given to them.

The people in the top 1% or the people in masonry and groups like OTO?

They aren't police anymore they are military police with all kinds of new weapons, gadgets and even hummers with sonic weapons.

They're not military. And using 'sonic weapons' is good, they are non-lethal crowd dispersal devices. Far better to use a disorienting blast of sound to clear a street of a crowd that a shotgun.

"Those who surrender freedom for security are dumb and stupid..." My take on Ben Franklin.

Here's the problem, Franklin was talking about essential liberties. Having the government tap international phone lines, especially while in a state of war, isn't surrendering an essential liberty. And the people in Franklin's generation enacted the Alien and Sedition Acts, which make the Patriot Act look like a libertarian manifesto.

I also believe that people who give up their rights for security deserve neither

Then franklin himself deserved to be shot, because he was part of the organization that scrapped the confedartion in favour of a stronger, more centralized, more restrictive, Federal government. Heck, they created government over the states in the first place.
Not every restriction on liberty is a destruction of essential freedoms. The founders explicity recognized that, thats why they created the federal government in the first place. The american government is based on the idea of a social contract, we exchange freedoms for, not only security, but wealth, services, etc.

We are a small group that sees what is going on.

And what exactly is 'going on'?

Well it looks like the original poster is not going to answer my question. But so far it looks like people are agreeing with the quote I posted.

Anyway the quote I posted above was written by James Wasserman in the book The Slaves Shall Serve - Meditations On Liberty pg 144. So what you say? Wasserman is a high ranking member of the O.T.O. and he is commenting on Aleister Crowley's Liber Oz.

So as you can see it really does matter what names you use. Casually throwing in names like the O.T.O. as groups that are out to restrict liberty is exactly what big brother wants.

Really this whole NWO conspiracy theory is a conspiracy in itself. It's nothing but an advanced brain washing operation created to create a defeatist setting of "there is nothing we can do" and "the top 1% control everything" and "it doesn't matter who you vote for, all sides are part of the NWO".

Ironically the only solution you ever see presented is to ban the groups that really care about man's liberty, such as the Masons, the O.T.O., and the now defunct Illuminati.

In answer to your question I think we're simply getting screwed over. Time and time again. It's a never ending process.

I think they are probably above labels and consider themselves along the lines of God or gods. They figure they built the entire system so its rightfully theirs. Fear not, there is a higher authority and its patience is wearing thin with the rulers.
I call them "the bastards at the top"

[edit on 13-11-2006 by magnito_student]

[edit on 13-11-2006 by magnito_student]

quote: We are a small group that sees what is going on.

The rise of police state. The use of bio metric scanners. It seems to me like it's getting tougher and tougher to just walk around outside with the fear of big brother watching your every move. I don't like all this tech. stuff.

www.infowars.com...

I'll give you link below. Forget about the David Gergen stuff. Watch after that when Alex Jones is talking to the guy snapping pictures of him and his camera man. This is what I have a problem with. Peaceful protesters getting heckled by a F.B.I. guy and taking his picture and not telling him why. It's like the Russian secret police. As far as the N.S.A. wire taps I don't like to talk on the phone when someone else maybe listening in. For what? It would only be a matter of time before someone in that job position would tap into any phone they wanted and listen. Terrorist or not. I have a right to privacy and I have done nothing wrong. Just have someone listen in because I'am a suspect B.S. on all that. If I say I don't like Bush does that make me a terrorist? No. Does that give them the right to tap my phone? No. I stayed within my first amendment right. I never made a threat or anything. So what gives big brother the right to tap my phone? Nothing, nothing at all.

www.infowars.com...

I believe this is the video. If not just search for Alex Jones and David Gergen. It should pull up them up.

Fear is as strong as we're prepared to let it become. Fear quavers in the face of determined attention.

Well the OTO certainly is in the minority, they are not running anything* The only connection you can draw with Crowley and the Illuminatie is Weishaupt is one of his Saints of Gnosticism and he called his Eiquinox journal "Scientific Illuminism"

Those are pretty weak connections if you ask me* If you are searching for mystical societies to pin the blame for the Illuminatie on you should probably look into the Thule Society, which produced Adolf Hitler and National Socialism, and you should definately draw a link between the Thule Society, the Aryan races supposed roots in Atlantis, and the Order of the Skull and Bones*

I find the post about Ben Franklin amusing: it is true he aspoused individual liberties and freedom from monarchies while he himself was a proud aristocrat he did work to centralize government

Try putting a point in these circles!

So Ngydan who exactly runs the world then? It can't just run itself. The Federal Reserve (not a government owned bank??)

I've had the chance to interview former employees of Brook Street resort who were there at the Bildeburg meeting and they said they saw so much Masonic jewellery that it wasn't even funny.