What if Islam were true?

I mean think of the implications. I know when I say 'imagine if it were true', that I could offend alot of believers because it makes me look like I'm saying Islam isn't true. I am not saying that it is not a true religion, it is, and worshipping God through it in my opinion is sufficient enough to attain heaven, just as you would if you were a good Jew or Christian. And if you are very bad, you'd get the same judgement by God. So with that thought, let me move on. (1st point = Muslims are true believers in the 1 God)

Islam is a word. It means to submit, or submission, roughly. I learned that on Discovery Times, btw. The practices of Islam, called the 5 pillars, are to goto Mecca once in your life(pilgrimage), give alms to the poor, participate in Ramadan(fasting), worship only Allah, and pray toward Mecca 5 times a day.

If we look at some of the strictness of conservative Islam, it makes conservative Christianity look like a joke! Porn is distasteful? How about women covered from head to toe all the time?

But the practices are the most ardent, the most in-depth. No other religion demands this much faith and prayer from the adherants, none. You dont HAVE TO pray 5 times a day as a Christian or Jew, and you dont HAVE to be on your knees when you do.

Considering mankind's history, and the things he has collectively done, if we took the Bible and Old Testament as being true, and all the events since the last events depicted in the Bible, though before Revelation, and put them together, we'd have an overall poor moral performance by far. And to this day in the modern times, it's getting worse and worse, so naturally would the religion need to be stricter and more encompassing to combat the ills of the world against its' adherants?

I can't think of a single monotheistic religion where people are more actively devoted on a daily basis toward God. Even your Joe Schmoe Blow KNOWS its time to go when he hears the speakers from the mosque playing; its time to pray. 5 times a day! that is a lot of times to stop what your doing, get on your knees, and bow down before God.

Now of course we could go into the bizillion of not so good things of Islam like the Islamic radicals who are (hopefully - because i dont want to believe that their version is true) warping the global image of Islam into one of a very bad image. Well didn't it say in Revelation that God's two witnesses will call down all sorts of wrath on mankind, and mankind will hate them? Doesn't it say that when the second coming occurs, that the 'antichrist' or Satan will attempt to pose as the second coming to be worshipped? Does it not say that when Jesus returns he will have a new name, which even he does not know until the day cometh. I've read that part so I know its in there.

And the rebuilding of the Jewish Temple? The 3rd Temple, the one we're "waiting for" to signal the countdown to doomsday? It's already there, it's called the Al-Aqsa Martyrs Mosque, and it sits ontop of where the Temple once stood. Most see this as an obstacle to the rebuilding of the Temple and I'm amazed that none stop just for one second and think about the possibility that it IS the Temple rebuilt?

So it leaves me at a crossroads. Mohammed could've been one of a few different things, and which he truly was determines what Islam truly is. Was he the return of Jesus? Doubtful .. Was he Messiah? No.. Was he the fulfillment of God's promise to Abraham that his firstborn Son, Ishmael, would be made a great nation? Yes, I think so. Do I think Mohammed was divinely inspired to create Islam? Yes, I do. But at the same time, do I hold the possibility to be possible that maybe he was lying and making things up? Yes. So you see, he could also be the False Prophet of Revelation, and he could be the messenger from the Pit (False Prophet's lackey), because it says the followers of the false prophet will kill the non-believers, and will strike out against them everywhere they may be.

So I get left at this crossroads mentally .. and normally I'm quite the skeptic of Islam, and openly denounce the radicals, I mean truly despise them and wish their deaths, and I celebrated when Mabus died, but I just don't know anymore what is true and what isn't..

[edit on 10/31/2006 by runetang]

It may be true, but which sect would then be true? there is a lot of variation there.

What do you mean 'if?'

It IS TRUE.
Religion is like a milky way candy bar - dark shell on the outside (this is false/dead/mirror/shattered evil of men) and it is war - war comes from envy and fear called hate because of differences in the Tangible See - minds in prison perceive this as a pair of BALANCE beams which require constant adjustment (spill blood/give blood/drink blood) in order to ACHIEVE balance and MAINTAIN balance.

That is murder - but in the middle it is a light and fluffy sweet cloud - rather like MARSh mallow Whip - is the TRUTH and it RULES; it is LOVE.

All men's religions are creations based on HIS ideas of God - but God is LOVE and so nothing can built upon any foundation that is not LOVE.

So all are true and all are false.

Allah, though, Allah is our granny and she is a bear! She loves us Gave us LIFE and guards our LIVES and so today we all LIVE.

Sarah our Mother - Mother of ALL. No child left behind.

Apex - I think it is the APex.

It is the Apex. To the point.

They deny Christ jesus his true status as the Son of God, and whom through we will reach the Kingdom of heaven. he said it in his own words that no one can go to God except through him (Jesus).

That makes them in my eyes the tool of the anti Christ. I also agree with you about them being the anti christs army as they lash out and kill any thing that does not bow down to them and their ways and thoughts....


They are the Anti Christs army, and the anti christ himself will rise out of islam.

Why do i think this? well, if you don't to them, they you or or or ....so yeah religion of peace my ass!

Originally posted by queenannie38
To the point.

Sorry, i dont think i see what you mean there.

i think it was Ghandi who said "All religions are true" which is probably the best way of looking at it.

Originally posted by D4rk Kn1ght
They deny Christ jesus his true status as the Son of God, and whom through we will reach the Kingdom of heaven. he said it in his own words that no one can go to God except through him (Jesus).

That makes them in my eyes the tool of the anti Christ. I also agree with you about them being the anti christs army as they lash out and kill any thing that does not bow down to them and their ways and thoughts....


They are the Anti Christs army, and the anti christ himself will rise out of islam.

Why do i think this? well, if you don't

to them, they

you or

or

or ....so yeah religion of peace my ass!

first of all...
there is 0 evidence outside of the bible that jesus existed

2nd, that quotation from jesus was several decades after his death

third, last time i checked, only a few muslims do that
subpoint: christians used to do it as well

islam at its core shares the same message as christianity
-have faith in a being which does not reveal its existence to you or you will suffer

Madness,
difference is that we grew out of it many many many years ago and decided being nice to each other and giving each other religiouse freedom is a better way to live than killing the unbeliever....


Now.... as for islam and christianity being the same...well they did 'borrow' large swathes of our Bible to make theirs thats true...but hell they tacked one hell of a lot onto it to make 'islam'... then they have the damn cheek to call us christians unbelievers!!! (as for idol worship...eeeerrr what about that lump of rock?? their so quick to attack our crosses and paintings yet are happy to circle a rock in the miday sun!!??!!)

Rofl they are so bare faced cheek its amazing!

Now if they were tolerant, forgiving, and respected other faiths (2000 year old buddah statues ?? were very nice till they blew them to pieces...) I might have a bit of respect for them. But their not, so I don't.

Originally posted by D4rk Kn1ght
...well they did 'borrow' large swathes of our Bible to make theirs thats true...but hell they tacked one hell of a lot onto it to make 'islam'... then they have the damn cheek to call us christians unbelievers!!!

which is exactly the same as what christianity did to the jews. Perhaps we shouldn't forget that when we judge other religions.

Sarah, if you speak of the Sarah in Genesis, Abe's wifey, is not the mother of all.

It states pretty clearly she is just the mother of the Israelite people, as the mother of his firstborn son Ishmael was indeed a different woman named Hagar. So, Semitic Israelites and Semitic Arabians are like half brothers of anutha mutha'. But where is the brotherly love?

This isnt sibling rivarly on a grande scale is it?

The past is not applicable to the present in this regard people.

You can't say, "Since this people oppressed those people a thousand years ago, its normal and okay for those people to oppress this people 1,000 years later".

Because society is vastly different now than it was 1,000 years ago. The spread of ideas is so much faster, the freedoms are greater, the truth is more evident yet it is also more falsified with disinformation.

Society is fundamentally different now, in modern times.

If you say it is okay for Islam to have violence as a doctrine (Convert or Die if we conquer you, unless you are a Christian or a Jew, in which case you become a 2nd class citizen with humiliating rights and rules under the Umar pact, and must pay tax) because Christianity had violent Crusades led by the Catholic Church and the Pope which are all a bunch of tools and boy molesters back in 1100 A.D, then you are crazy. I have faith that you are not crazy.

Now if there were real Crusades in modern times, led by the purpose of Christianity, created by the Pope, made up of all Catholic nations, then people could say Islam's Jihadism and Violent Fundamentalism are only the same thing, and thus okay. But clearly this is not the case. Back in medieval times, Islam and Catholics were both savage, the Catholics more-so but it was of the times. Crusades are no modern excuse..


[edit on 11/2/2006 by runetang]

Well, but was not Hagar Sarah's handmaiden? Ishmael was intended to be Sarah's son, right - is that not how it works? Please correct me if I AM wrong - I no longer reference but rely on inner hard drive for recall...

AND remember Moby Dick
Her Man M'elvil
the WHITE whale
Call me Ishmael
In that day you will call me Ishi and not Baal
For I AM the God who HEARS you.

Islam
=
Is LAM
Atl ant IS
Ant I Christ
Aleph Ants
Never Forget
Peace love and unity
MAKE love NOT war
Even all alone
MAKE LOVE

Sibling rivalry is war! No more war, war pigs! Allah says: 'Don't break my babies' arms or I will break you!'

Honor your FAT HER and your MOT HER....

BAD to hate brother to kill brother - no more sacrifice! Play nice!
Cain will guard his brother the apple of his eye.

Originally posted by D4rk Kn1ght
Madness,
difference is that we grew out of it many many many years ago and decided being nice to each other and giving each other religiouse freedom is a better way to live than killing the unbeliever....


Now.... as for islam and christianity being the same...well they did 'borrow' large swathes of our Bible to make theirs thats true...but hell they tacked one hell of a lot onto it to make 'islam'... then they have the damn cheek to call us christians unbelievers!!! (as for idol worship...eeeerrr what about that lump of rock?? their so quick to attack our crosses and paintings yet are happy to circle a rock in the miday sun!!??!!)

Rofl they are so bare faced cheek its amazing!

Now if they were tolerant, forgiving, and respected other faiths (2000 year old buddah statues ?? were very nice till they blew them to pieces...) I might have a bit of respect for them. But their not, so I don't.

This entire post is a nice example of taking the actions of a very few and equating them to an entire religion as a whole. If you really want to say that no christians are killing others in their religions name...shall we look at those extremist christians who bomb abortion clinics and kill the doctors/nurses knowingly?

And Christianity did "borrow" a large portion of the Hebrew texts, tacked a whole bunch on and then had the audacity, as you would say, to call the Jews nonbelievers. As Christianity views itself as the "completed" manifestation of worship to god, so to do does Islam...just one "manifestation" further.

It is when people lump entire groups of peoples under the banner of the very small minority wthin them that blind and ignorant hate is spawned.

Originally posted by D4rk Kn1ght
Now.... as for islam and christianity being the same...well they did 'borrow' large swathes of our Bible to make theirs thats true...but hell they tacked one hell of a lot onto it to make 'islam'...

I could be mistaken, but isn't the Koran shorter than the bible? How could they tack anything on and make it shorter?

then they have the damn cheek to call us christians unbelievers!!!

I believe the term is 'infidel.' Which doesn't mean one without belief - but rather one who lacks the constancy of fidelity. Being true to one's committments.