Schools teaching students to fight back against school massacres!

I really cannot believe that this is being advocated. I do understand that doing nothing is doing nothing, but this type of attitude has "backfire" written all over it. Aren't those first few kids rushing in just jumping towards their demise? I don't know but I'm interested in hearing others opinions.

AAC


www.cnn.com... index.html

Is an assault a better plan than sitting at your desk, or cowering under it? Yes.

Is getting the Hell away from the guy with the gun a much better plan than either of those options? Absolutely.

I'm a pretty tough guy, I've been a bouncer and a security guard, and I have the stature of an NFL lineman - but if there's a gunman looking for someone to shoot, given half a chance I'll beat feet and find somewhere nice and safe to hide until the noise has died down.

I can only speak for myself, but if there was a shooter at my school, I would be trying very hard indeed to find out where he was, so I could find myself somewhere else in a hurry, yaknow?

How dumb are these kids, to be listening to their teachers when they're told to either a.) sit at their desks and pray to Jesus while Johnny stalks the halls with a semi-automatic rifle, or b.) rush at Johnny and through force of numbers tackle him to the ground and restrain him before he's shot too many of us dead.

:shk:

The kids with half a brain will be out the windows at the first shot, running a zig-zag pattern across the quad. Seriously...

I'll take a detention over a bullet in the chest any day.

Now, if the only two options available are to sit and wait for death or bum-rush the gunman, the latter option is obviously more sensible. It's all situational.

What the Hell is wrong with this picture? They're training these kids to sacrifice themselves even in situations where escape is possible? Stupid, stupid, stupid.

They can't leave the school grounds, because there's a gunman on the loose! They might get shot! But it's okay to run at the guy with a gun!

:shk:



[edit on 14-10-2006 by WyrdeOne]

Why not just give the kids guns in the class room so if somebody does come in trying to kill them they can return fire?

sepryo, very funny.

And Wyrde pretty much summed up my thoughts. Why go for the source of the problem when you can run away from it as fast as possible?
Most schools here is Aust are single story, so window jumping would be possible (no doubt most of them do it anyway), but I suppose if your only way of getting out is the door, go for it! Maybe they all need small personal shields like SWAT uses? Just reduced in weight 100 fold, perhaps . . .

[edit on 14/10/2006 by watch_the_rocks]

Maybe they should hire a couple of security guards for schools. Keep a watch on the kids. Im sure the kids cant hide the automatic weapons under their shirt. It wud show. Atleast the attackers behaviour could alert the guards before any harm can be done.

If I was a guard, I would convince the kid to kill the other guard so I can ask for an increase in pay later. Then, I wud use the kid's gun to shoot myslef in the leg and then shoot the kid in the head. This way I look like a hero and can ask for a pay raise and also sue the shop/store/person who sold the gun to the kid. MUAHAHA

This is a major mistake.

Kids come in all different sizes, shapes, ages, and personalities. You can't treat them all like little army combat troops. I know the world is tough .. but this is wrong.

The Amish boys all obeyed the gunmen and left the girls to die. If a gunman tried to pull that same crap in a middleschool in Chicago, he would get himself killed by the kids. Older streetwise boys could possibly gang up and disarm however younger kids, or those sheltered, wouldn't have a prayer and would be slaughtered.

It's a MAJOR MISTAKE to expect children to be able to handle the situation.

This is a last ditch thing, I think. We have drills up here, and I summed them up on the other thread:

Better two thirds than all of them. They're talking about giving teachers guns and stuff...and I suppose that's better yet. I mean it's a one in a million thing...better prepared than dead.

And it's not like crazed shooters are the only problem, there's also gangs.

Anyways, I think it's better they do SOMETHING than nothing. I mean, they're doing drills up here where the students lock the door, shutter the windows, and curl up in a corner. Of course, any potential shooters can now PLAN for that, as well as being un-brilliant as far as strategy goes. Hooray! Less ammunition expended to kill more people!

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Given the choice between several story drop, trying to break out of a window, or hoping for the best...your escape chances are pretty slim, especially if your window DOESN'T face anywhere useful. Better some die than all die, I suppose.

DE

Its a great idea, also if there is a fire in school the kids can deal with that as well, and maybe if there's an RTA outside the school they can sort that out as well.

Who are these people, who in their right mind would tell children to tackle people with guns and bombs, can you imagine the law suits, well little jonny was doing real well tackling the gunman till he got his head blown off.

Whats the point in parents telling there children how to keep themselves safe when you have bufoons telling them to take on psycho's with guns. I mean what next, kids taking down crack dealers etc.

know it's a pretty touchy issue in the US but some form of gun control would probably help stop these types of things occuring then maybe teaching kids how to defend themselves wouldn't be such an issue?

A child shouldn't be afraid to go to school because there's a very real chance someone could come in & kill them or leave them maimed in a physical/mental way, should be afraid of if they didn't do their homework etc

I guess if there is no escape it's ok to fight back, but it wouldn't make much sense to "fight" someone who has a gun when there is an escape route available. Try to escape first, and if there is no escape possible, and if the gunman is going to start killing, attack the gunman.

A chair through a window, and you are gone. Many classrooms also have fire escape doors in the back of the classrooms to climb out of. Bullies are one thing, Bullets are another.

Esad, where I went to school, all the glass was the chickenwire, heavy-duty security glass meant to do exactly not that- stay in plac,e not shatter, not move. To compound the issue, the chairs were rickety plastic and tubing that you felt lucky every time they didn't collapse under your weight. It isn't that easy anymore.

DE

So this is what it comes down to?When the time comes,every man/woman for themselves.Parents send their kids to school to be educated and protected.Its not up to the kids,when the security fails,to suddenly become power rangers.This will lead to more deaths then the current plan.And no,just sitting there waiting to be shot isnt the best idea.But,its better than someone rushing a gunman and making the situation worse.The kids trying could be killed and that will lead to others being shot in a state of panic.Our system has fallen so quickly.When its now up tp our kids to defend themsleves.

Well here in california, at least in southern california all the high schools have armed police officers stationed at their schools. Not to mention at least 8 security guards on campus. I was more worried about being hit by a car on the way to school than i was about getting shot at school.

To me it seems that people/youth here arent too concerned about school shootings. If it happens it happens,you are way more likely to be caught in the crossfire between the cops and the idiot gangs in the park across the street from the school.

The media always blows stories like school shootings WAY out of proportion. This new curriculum is nonsense. Schools in general create stress and competition between students. Whether it because of grades, sports, girls, or mental instability there will always be a catalyst for violence at school. Teaching this sort of thing will only bring more attention to the matter, distracting everyone from what they SHOULD be focused on - educating themselves for the life ahead of them. If they really want to lower school vioence, the government should ensure that we are given lunches that consist of actual food and/or shorten the school day. State-emplyed prostitutes working adjacent to the school building would do wonders for student productivity as well.

DE has a point, in saying that it's not always so easy to escape through the windows. One school I went to was 5 or 6 floors, I can't remember. We had chicken wire on all the windows, and you'd have to be pretty desperate to even think about jumping in the first place.

Of course, another school I went to was only two stories, and the windows could be opened without a problem.

It's all situational.

Rather than teach kids one strategy that's as likely to get them killed as it is to save their lives, why not impress upon the parents how important it is to teach their children how to THINK.

The schools do teach nonsense, most of them. They don't help kids learn how to think, they just inspire a bunch of regurgitation under pressure.

Projectile knowledge vomit won't do squat against a gunman.

Teach the kids how to solve problems from an early age, and make them understand that it's one of the two most important factors in their survival and the quality of their lives - right next to luck.

If you teach them how to think, they should be able to do some good in any situation that arises, be it a gunman, or a terrorist attack, or a drunken teacher making passes. Fill their heads up with situational solutions, and they're not going to be prepared for the unexpected. Why hamstring these kids like that? Does our society hate them so much, that we actually want to see them get screwed up?

This is a damned if you do and damned if you don't issue. The local school district here just announced that they are putting metal detectors in the elementary schools. It took exactly 1 hour after they made the announcement before there were people complaining about it on the local news.

For the poster who advocated gun control, it is already illegal to have a gun on or near a school. Doesn't work very well does it?

Personally I have to go with the statistics that show that a child is safer in school than almost any place else. Every time something like the Amish shootings or Columbine happens you end up with a media frenzy that tries to make this a bigger issue than it really is. Our local news, last night, lead off with a story about a gun being found near a school in Pittsburgh. All of the ads for the newscast showed pictures of kids getting on and off busses at some of the local schools. Small problem, the school it was found near was closed 5 years ago. That little fact wasn't mentioned except as an after thought at the end of the story.

It comes down to two options. One, you can turn the schools into armed camps, complete with checkpoints and their own SWAT teams. Two, you can get better cooperation between the schools and the local police and try to reduce the risk as much as possible. I don't believe in teaching the students to attack, nor do I believe that arming the teachers is an option.

Funny thing that I have noticed about ATS, for all of the members who believe that their govenments are a threat to their way of life and personal freedoms, there is a high proportion of anti-gun people here. I find that kind of interesting.

Life is about risks, and in life and work you assess risks and you then put appropriate control measures in place to reduce or remove the risk, lets say like mon n dad putting a guard up to a fire or stairway so their child is protected. teaching children to tackle people with guns and bombs is not an appropriate control measure.

Each school should be made to carry out a risk assement and do whatever is neccesary to protect the children and teachers, this could be anything from, security guards, safe rooms, a better means of escape from classrooms, secure entrances etc. I know many will say this all costs money but how do you put a value on a childs life.

I think that this is a decision in the moment. and if you feel well enough equiped in the moment, then its justified. This country is founded by risk takers. Risk takers have taken this continet to where it is. Just name anouther country or continent just like it!
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