School Shootings- Suspicious

I am just astounded by the "emasculating" post. Civilization has existed with women in positions of power before 40 years ago. Plenty of countries have women leaders today without wild rape and pillage in the schools. I don't even know where to start with a response to your cat among the pigeons. I think that real men can deal without restraining little amish girls or anyone for that matter. Burping, farting and watching football can hardly be equated with rape. And I don't think the freaks i've seen shooting up these schools are metrosexuals or they would be far better groomed in these snapshots they have on TV. I think I have to go lay down. Who teaches you ideas like this? Is it your church or your husband or aliens? Can you honestly feel this way or is that just a post to bait responses? Seriously? My god "women's lib", I haven't even't heard that phrase in like 30 years. Did you just come up out of a time capsule? How can you really think this affected this guy in Pennsylania. He reached out to his wife to confess. They sounded tight. I mean HOW do you get to these conclusions? Seriously.

Beyond that, what we need to see people, is that our society has become so materialistic, that even marraige and relationships are subject to destruction based on desires that we have now that werent there 30 years ago. And when the family units are destroyed and subjected to these stresses, society begins to collapse.

Are you kidding me? That weren't there 30 years ago. Why do you think Shakespeare's plays have held up over hundreds of years? Because it's one human condition that we keep repeating. The stresses are just different. Societies are always in collapse, just like the universe.

So ... murder isn't immoral??

Face the facts Losonczy. In today's world human life is disposable. From the pre-born .. to the handicapped .. to the elderly. It is disposable and that is the message being shoved down people's throats starting at a very early age.

Let me just check myself...you're quoting me this, and you quote Edgar Allen Poe in your signature line. How perverse were his writings. He talked about heinous murder, and he's quotable, but our current writing and media exposure are somehow more perverse. The word is just getting out in a different way. At the moment, at least not this weak on Fox, we're not feeding Christians to lions. I suppose it's likely to be Muslims this go around first given the current temperature. And abortion is all of a sudden a radical and rare concept when in past times...not too past...we let babies be born and killed female children in asia because they weren't "cool".

I'm not saying it's all peachy. I'm just saying we're nuts if we think this is new and we're unique. We're not. This is old. This is tired.

Lovingsoul, what you've said makes perfect sense, and I'd like to add to it only in this respect, that men, more so than women, NEED to feel needed.

Twenty years ago this was not the case, but clearly I could see a man who watches, waiting, to see the turn society makes...especially the turn women make. Then said man sees something similar in the media catch his attention...a school where an aggresor attacks ONLY women (girls in this case, but to the mind of the aggresor thats only a matter of chronology) and relates to it...associates his either hatred OR feelings of no longer being needed (read: any woman in his life can live just fine with or without him) and snaps! bang! Now, he feels this inherent need to exact his emotions on those that would invariably end up like all the rest of the women; not NEEDING men.

Let's try this one, everyone needs to be needed in some way, but not always sustenance and leadership. Aren't their other ways to be needed and nurtured? Where are the women killing all the men for the last 2,000 odd years of not feeling appreciated enough? They shouldn't be so I'm glad they haven't been. Talk about some snot-nosed kids with a sense of entitlement. Who entitled anybody to anything without earning it. What the heck does genetalia have to do with it?

For those looking for a motive: This man admits to molesting two young female family members twenty years ago. That would have made him about twelve years old at the time. It is not uncommon for young children to “explore their sexuality” upon puberty. We don’t know what this molestation was, whether fondling or intercourse, but it appears that this man may have felt that God was punishing him for this (these) act(s) by the loss of his own daughter. His first child, a female, died shortly after her birth.

He claimed to have had reoccurring dreams in the past few years of repeating his early childhood experiences with young girls. It is my belief that these dreams haunted him due to his own guilt and feelings of being punished by God. In order to live with guilt, he probably began to place the blame for his own actions onto his young victims. He may have felt that theses girls enticed him into molesting them. Over time, the guilt, hatred, and obsession could have prompted him to seek revenge.

The mind of a psychopath is a twisted labyrinth of self hatred. There is really no way to determine what went through his mind. When we blame society for the actions of disturbed members, we absolve those members of their own responsibility and accountability. However, if you wish to blame society, you may begin by looking into the mirror.

Darkelf-

The story also goes that this man exhibited absolutely no problems whatsoever right up until he committed these crimes. He was a loving, even tempered person.
Somebody got a hold of him, imo, and had him do what he did...not before he left a suicide note with the whacky story.

Any number of these shooter types could be programmed automatons. Sirhan Sirhan exhibited documented symptoms of trance. Only a fool would believe that ALL "lone gunman" actually act alone or in an unaltered frame of consciousness.

James Earl Ray, Lee Harvey Oswald, John Wilkes Booth, Timothy McVeigh, Ted Kaczynski.

What IS a mad scientist to do with all that ever usefull mk-ultra-type nazi-derived information after all? Anyone can study how to conduct mind manipulation for nefarious purposes these days and there is a never ending increasing supply of candidates.

If you're not paranoid then you're not paying attention.

Originally posted by dgtempe
Darkelf-

The story also goes that this man exhibited absolutely no problems whatsoever right up until he committed these crimes. He was a loving, even tempered person.
Somebody got a hold of him, imo, and had him do what he did...not before he left a suicide note with the whacky story.

dg, the first time I was institutionalized (locked up in a psych ward), people who knew me were shocked. I seemed to be the most rational and stable person they knew. I was the last person they would even consider to be capable of committing suicide. The Monday morning quarterbacks never saw it coming.


Folks with mental disorders are excellent actors. They try so hard to convince themselves that they are perfectly normal that they often succeed in convincing others around them.

I'm not saying that there is no room for conspiracy theory here, I'm only trying to exhaust all other possibilities first.

I don't know how many of you remember, but we actually had a member here on ATS who was the perpetrator of a school shooting last year. This took place at a high school on an Indian Reservation.

I can't remember his name (real name or member name), but I think it would benefit us to examine all of his posts he made to see if there seems to be any evidence of mind control.

Are you referring to this?

School Shooting

Originally posted by darkelf
Are you referring to this?

School Shooting

Yep, that's it. I think I remember a thread that had a compilation of all of his posts and threads he had here. If someone can just remember his username then we can probably look them up.

Close To Home

It's still painful, and I have some personal misgivings about it still, but in the spirit of Denying Ignorance...

Username Weise here at ATS was Minn. Shooter Killer

More than suspicious. something is obviously up. amish are not connected to the world so this is the way in to monitor the education/ push for armed guards? To be honest the amish killer was just to much, did anyone look at his equipent a couple shotguns a 9mm and zip ties? what was with the container or gun powder was he going to make a big sparkler? here is the damn solution. a parent volunteer each day with job salary payed buy employer-tax break ( armed parent) in each class room with com units to communcate between other parents 30 students that gives at least 15 parents that can grow some nuts and buy a sig-45 precision instruments. DO NOT ALLOW MORE TAX MONEY TO BE FUNNELED TO POLITIANS FOR SECURETY BULL. the problem is not gun control it is a lack of the citizens having them ie- teachers when i was in school every one had a gun i personally kept an sks and a 357mag in the car. these things didnt happen then PERIOD this was the norm during Hunting season there were more rifles in the back windows of pickups than the damn army. So here is the answer we already tried limiting weapons lets take a shot a allowing them . AGAIN MY little brother is damn sure he is packing. you have to if your school's in new orleans. WHO would try holding a school hostage if he new walking in the door there were at least 5-10 highly pissed off parents with there highest priority at risk.

cant read all the way thru longer threads cuz therez usually so much stupidity choking them up so im not sure if anyones mentioned the link yet between every many or all of the school shooters with seratonin reuptake inhibitor drugs and government appointed psychiartrists? and as mentioned before the amish county shooting reeks of mk ultra type manipulation. For anyone who actually understands mind control science would see the signs. And before anyone bitches about mind control being imaginary, i ask them them to do some research first and open their mouths later. The science behind it mind control, both on a one to one basis and mass control is as old and well researched as any psychological processes.

What really struck me as odd, especially in this day and age, is the Amish community response. This killer of children was bent on revenge for something real and or imagined and took it out on this community. Yet, the members of this community are offering forgiveness rather than revenge. Finally, a religious group that practices what it preaches.

Does anyone else think that the media should stop pursuing every last detail to put on the news over and over. I just can't help but think they are giving to many unstable people to many ways to perfect their delusions. Even if these people do not mean to their sick minds absorbe every little bit of info. I do not need to hear that this guy had 2 tubes of K.Y. jelly repeated over and over. That my friends is how add companies get you to buy things.

Originally posted by dgtempe
The story also goes that this man exhibited absolutely no problems whatsoever right up until he committed these crimes.

That doesn't mean anything at all. Sometimes there are clues in a persons outward behavior and sometimes there aren't. Any forensic psychologist will tell ya' that.

Somebody got a hold of him,

Nope. It was just him. That's the way it works many times.

No one really knows what goes on inside another person.

Originally posted by Majic
It's still painful, and I have some personal misgivings about it still, but in the spirit of Denying Ignorance...

Username Weise here at ATS was Minn. Shooter Killer

Seriously Majic .. when that happened it shocked the heck out of me. I was astounded that I had been posting at a site where someone who went out and did that. It made me very aware of posting my own personal information. It also made me very nervous. You NEVER know who you are really talking to. Never. What people show on the outside isn't always what is really going on inside.

Again .. just because people didn't see any clues before this happened doesn't mean anything. Seriously. Sometimes you can look back and see it and sometimes you can't.

Originally posted by Losonczy
Can you honestly feel this way or is that just a post to bait responses? Seriously? My god "women's lib", I haven't even't heard that phrase in like 30 years. Did you just come up out of a time capsule? How can you really think this affected this guy in Pennsylania. He reached out to his wife to confess. They sounded tight. I mean HOW do you get to these conclusions? Seriously.

If you would pay attention to how she originally structured what she had said it was a THEORY.

Why would you seemingly get so offended by her stating as much? Seems to me you've got some anger management issues yourself to work out.

That said, for starters, there is no mass pillaging in the street, nor wild rape/murder scenarios that we're talking about here, in fact, we're talking about a singular isolated incident, and certainly that COULD have been the case for this guy. IMO (and the fact that it is MY OPINION is important) her's was the most logically structured reason for another person commiting such a heinous act as opposed to all the "conspiracy theories" flying around about government mind control.
Let's face it, it would certainly take more than one amish town schoolhouse shooting to disarm America so if THAT is the breadth of the government mind control program they clearly need to go back to the whiteboard.

AB1

Originally posted by Losonczy
Talk about some snot-nosed kids with a sense of entitlement. Who entitled anybody to anything without earning it. What the heck does genetalia have to do with it?

Snot-nosed kids with a sense of entitlement? What are you talking about? This doesn't even fit into the conversation at all. I'm seriously beginning to believe that your's is nothing more than posts to perpetuate anger and negative response, of which, there is REALLY no place for here, so tone down.

With respect to genetalia, that has nothing at all to do with it. The mindset of the KILLER however, has everything to do with it. Having had experience before in this arena, believe me that anything at all at one particular time that is on their mind (ie., their mindset) is the singular thing that is important to them, and if it happens to be that he doesn't feel needed by women then THAT IS IT..and he will exact revenge either now or 20 years from now depending on when exactly he can find the right catalyst.


Edited for clarity

[edit on 4-10-2006 by alphabetaone]