White people paying a price!

Ok so let me get this right... Since the African Americans of America's recent past were slaves for a century, they have suddenly done more hard work than millennia of accomplishments and hard work from all other races???

if you went to a prison and took a man that had been shackled for the last 5 years and put him in a race right after being de-shackled, would it be fair?

Analogy Fails. The African Americans of today have never been slaves so how can they be compared to a man in shackles. It been 50 years since the Civil Rights Movement, America is hardly new to the idea of a racially equal country. How are African Americans, or any other race/gender supposed to be so handicapped in society? They are given the same opportunities as everyone. Why should Caucasians suddenly be shackled for events greatly predating them?


You think that I, a hard working Caucasians, should have to pay African Americans reparations because my ancestors MAY HAVE been a part of their ancestors POSSIBLE slavery. Hmm that sounds so amazing I can't believe I didn't think of this sooner / (end sarcasm). No way do I believe in reparations for an event taking place over a century ago.

Originally posted by Halcy0n
Ok so let me get this right... Since the African Americans of America's recent past were slaves for a century, they have suddenly done more hard work than millennia of accomplishments and hard work from all other races???

i meant in the history of the united states
that is the reason i added AMERICAN
african americans have done more hard work than any other group in the history of the united states

Analogy Fails. The African Americans of today have never been slaves so how can they be compared to a man in shackles. It been 50 years since the Civil Rights Movement, America is hardly new to the idea of a racially equal country. How are African Americans, or any other race/gender supposed to be so handicapped in society? They are given the same opportunities as everyone. Why should Caucasians suddenly be shackled for events greatly predating them?

i'm just saying that as a whole african americans started off with a disadvantage
they need to catch up
and the civil rights movement isn't finished
just look at all the cases the southern poverty law center takes on

You think that I, a hard working Caucasians, should have to pay African Americans reparations because my ancestors MAY HAVE been a part of their ancestors POSSIBLE slavery. Hmm that sounds so amazing I can't believe I didn't think of this sooner / (end sarcasm). No way do I believe in reparations for an event taking place over a century ago.

so, those who were enslaved should get nothing for their hard work?
that sounds very unamerican
the japanese put into internment camps during WW2 get something
but those that were treated as nothing more than livestock get nothing

OK..... So the brave men who fought off the British for a free America, they didn't break a sweat? The for-father who set the guidelines for this country, piece of cake. Writing the Constitution, psshh no hard work involved, right? The men who have fought and died for this country; the men who have held it together, they are all lazy bastards..... That is what you would have everyone believe? The only hard working people in the entire history of the United States are the African American slaves of the past? Not only do you disgrace the foundation this country was built on, but also you also clearly insult African Americans as a whole. They have done nothing harder than pick cotton in fields, according to you. They should be known for nothing else, Right?? I am supposed to believe that since over a century ago they were enslaved, they can now do NO GOOD for the World or Themselves!! Now they need handouts from the rest of the world for this???!?! They need to be treated higher than the average man because they went through some hardships?

Guess what buddy, all man from all races cultures and sexes have suffered through great hardships. Does everyone where it on their sleeve?? Is it SO much of a chip on their shoulder that they need to be given accommodations and be measured by a lower standard?? NO. I repeat...NOOOO.

so, those who were enslaved should get nothing for their hard work?

OK show me one African American or any other race who is enslaved in America at this very moment. Shackled and the property of another man. GO AHEAD SHOW ME. I will pay them this very second and congratulate you on besting me. What’s that??? Oh that’s right, you’re talking about people over 100 years ago. If I had a time machine I would gladly go and pay those enslaved African Americans. I don't, you fail, end of discussion.

[edit on 19/1/2007 by Halcy0n]

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
african americans have done more hard work than any other group in the history of the united states

I'd like to see you defend that statement to a group of coal miners. Or those that built the railroads across this nation. Or many others I could mention.

I am what most would categorize as "white," though I refuse to see myself as such. I prefer the moniker by which I call other people; namely, "human."

Before commenting on the topic addressed in the initial post, I feel the need to say something, and that is this: I grew up in and out of homeless shelters, standing in line at soup kitchens, and with the constant threat of spending the night on the street looming over my head. My parents did everything in their power to remedy this situation. They continuously sought work in every place they could find, and on a relentless basis. They took what aid they could get when work was unavailable, and they never gave up hope. They maintained contact with social services so as to capitalize on what aid was available when it was required. Regardless of these efforts, most of the time we were barely getting by. I watched as other, less fortunate families who made the same amount of effort ended up on the street, often simply due to worse luck or being further behind us in whatever line - be it literal, or red tape - they were standing in.

I say the above not to change anyone's mind, but merely to explain why I myself do not subscribe to the belief that poverty and homelessness are always the fault or responsibility of those who languish in them. It has been my life experience that sometimes, no matter how hard one tries or how few poor decisions one makes, things can easily go awry. I acknowledge and recognize that there are those who "keep themselves" in bad situations, whether they intend to or not, and that those individuals would be better served by making better decisions, or being educated with regard to how they might go about doing so. Nonetheless, I maintain that this is not universally true, and that homelessness or poverty can afflict anyone under the right conditions, sadly. I respect and understand the views of those who disagree, however, and as I said, do not seek to change those views. I merely felt compelled to say what was in my heart in this instance.

The topic of this thread, however, is the potential for federal and local initiatives such as affirmative action to unfairly limit the financial or social success of people categorized by most as what some call "white." I choose not to categorize people based on individual race, but rather, to categorize them by species. In this instance, we are discussing the species known as "human," and how certain cultural or arbitrary subsets thereof interact economically, legally, and socially. I will offer my humble opinion with regard to this issue regardless, however.

I do not agree with anyone being kept from fulfilling their full potential regardless of so-called "race" (read: cultural background and/or skin tone) and would, were it not for one inescapable point, therefore at first blush find myself having ethical problems with affirmative action. However, having befriended many so-called "black" individuals in my lifetime, I find myself forced to concede that one aforementioned point which I, personally, find inescapable. That point is this: my parents and grandparents didn't get sprayed by fire hoses on the basis of the color of their skin (though they may have for allying with "blacks,") and I don't have living ancestors who can recount a time when they had to sit on the back of a bus based on the same criteria. Many "black" people do. This is a critical difference in experience and perception that can be empathized with, understood, and comprehended, but perhaps not fully related to, and I find myself having to respect that. For that reason, above all, and because of all that comes with it, I believe that affirmative action is the lesser of two evils. The first of those evils, the scenario in which affirmative action exists, would be a world in which "blacks" are empowered to get ahead despite their status as a minority ethnic group, but "whites" may occasionally be prevented from doing so in certain cases. The second evil, in which affirmative action no longer existed, would be a world in which "blacks" would not be empowered to get ahead at all. That is why, at least as a stop gap measure until such time as things improve, I must support affirmative action. I understand and respect the views of those who do not support affirmative action, for the reasons specified above. I have simply reached a different conclusion for myself.

All of that having been said, I feel compelled to profess that in truth, I find both to be insufficient solutions. I support affirmative action so long as a better solution eludes us, but I believe that not enough is being done to speed our journey toward the day when that can become a reality. My dream is that a day shall come when there is no more distinction between a "white" person and a "black" person than there is between pink and red roses; that both will be counted as the mere variations of a single, united species that they are (or should be,) both will be regarded as equally beautiful despite being different, that both will be afforded identical opportunities to fulfill their potential in every respect, and that, most importantly, both can sit beside each other and complement one another's strengths and qualities the way I saw "black" and "white" families helping each other survive during my youth.

I would like to add, before the end of this post, that I intend no disrespect to "blacks" and "whites" who are proud of their own individual heritage, and that I do recognize and respect your heritages regardless of the quotes I use around the words "white" and "black." The quotes are for my own benefit, because I personally refuse to regard people as anything other than people. I do respect individual heritage; I merely believe individual heritage should be superseded by the shared, universal heritage and history of humanity's past, present, and future. My hope is that our future will be a future in which all of us are united, rather than divided.

"first of all
saying we don't need affirmative action is like saying it's fair to allow someone recovering from a broken leg to enter a race when it's halfway through"

Do you think that the son or daughter of a black brain surgeon needs aa to get into a school.
Lets take it to another level. You have a black family who's combined yearly income is over 200 grand a year.
You have a white family that has a combined income of 45000 a year.
Who should get finacial aid. We can go on. Reverse racisim is just as bad.

The difference between black Americans and other ethnic groups is that other groups voluntarily came to the continent to seek a better life through hard work and assimilation at least for the most part.

Blacks were dragged there in chains, robbed of there own cultural identity and heritage and through the years of slavery were systematically brutalised, dispossessed and degraded in many ways, and this continued after slavery ended right through to recent years. The perception always has been one of an inferior race to a significant minority of the other populations with precious few mechanisms at work to actively help restore a sense of worth and/or assimilation and shake off these old prejudices, therefore as a group they were sitting ducks for any and all of the social ills and deprivation that existed. Other than the native American population (another group who's sulture and heritage was forcefully oppressed) I can't think of any other group that have struggled so much to find their niche within that nation. That kind of history MUST have an impact on the sensibilities and perceptions of black americans.

I don't neccessarily agree that every tale of woe has to be directly related back to white oppression, nor do I agree with black racism against whites I also think that unfair as it is the black community has to take some responsibility and burden to move forward but all in all it was a disadvantaged start distinct from other minorities problems.

Originally posted by ubermunche
Blacks were dragged there in chains, robbed of there own cultural identity and heritage .....

the blacks that were forced to this country were POWs. tribal wars and the loser was sold for profit.


i abhor slavery, but the truth is every race and gender has had their time in shackles.

slavery still exists today in other countries around the world, yes the black community of america had a ruff run but its over now. im not responsible for it and i refuse to comply to their cries.

the people that are responsible dont care either, they will solve these issues with time. they will ignore it till it goes away. as it should be handled, consider your self blessed your not a slave now.

slavery isnt a white mans creation, the blame is lost in history.


but racism is bad, its real bad for whites as compared to others. of all races whites are unanimously called the the devil. thats insane compared to other racial slurs. there is a huge difference of degrading somone and removing their humanity.

the problem is when you call someone worthless they can walk away and recuperate. but if you call someone the devil , its not as easy to shrug that off.

Originally posted by mondegreen
For thousands of years the caucasian, white, aryan, european race has dominated the world in politics, trade,war, stability and the building of a civilized world.

Boy, what a load of crap.

Europeans have controlled the world for only the last FIVE centuries. Thousands of years is a joke. As for building a civilized world...please. People around the world had empires and civilizations while Europeans lived without civilization.

If it weren't for the Moors (Africans and Arabs) initiating the European Renaissance in Portugal and Spain, Europeans wouldn't even have been able to dominate the world for the last 500 years.

Today; because of what has happened in the past those same decedents are being punished with laws to not allow then to rise any higher then a piece of paper states that they can. It does not matter really whether your in america or not really, the things that built empires in the olde world is now causing a back lash to the white race as we granted freedom to the native populations around the world.

More crap.

After the Moors helped bring Europe out of the dark ages, the Europeans went around stealing from pretty much the rest of the world. You ever been to a primarily white neighborhood? How the HELL can whites not rise? It seems like you are a white male; are you aware that you will make more than ANY OTHER GROUP OF PEOPLE IN AMERICA who has the same qualifications as you?

As for your empire building in the old world, other races had them before whites did. In fact, the Egyptians influenced the Greco-Roman civilizations; the European Greek scholars went to study under the African Egyptians BEFORE they contributed their works of knowledge.

The biggest we are seeing the the rise of China, and states of south america.

Your very own white race leaders of this country are contributing to the rise of China. You know how many jobs have went from here to there and are still going?

Should one race or several races be allowed to have favored abilities to step ahead of whites just because of something that happened hundreds of years ago or even fifty years ago. No of course not, to pass laws to favor one race above another for any reason is nothing more then political racism.
Should we consider the abilities of others to do things the best way and not allow failures just to satisify a political law. Of course we should not, eveyone should be equal in work, community, church, school, and laws of this land. When we hide behind a politically correct law, what are we doing id destroying the fabric of that nation.

Like madness said, this is a rant against affirmative action.

1. You assume that EVERYONE who benefits from AA is inferior to white males (this includes white women, btw, who have benefitted the MOST from AA ).

2. You ignore the fact that minorities (including women) who benefit from AA will STILL make less money than white males.

3. Everyone is NOT equal now; that is why AA is necessary.

Thanks for an informative thread, though. I just keep learning and learning about whites in these forums...

White race has been enslaved MANY TIMES throughout the history. Asiats, Mongolians, Turks, Arabs - all of them have had white slaves, for HUNDREDS OF YEARS. Spain is an example, but so is modern Turkey (taken from Christian Greeks).

White people have MUCH LONGER HISTORY OF BEING SLAVES THAN BLACKS WILL EVER HAVE.

The reason the whole myth is so popular is that the rulers of the world want to remove ALL SMART PEOPLE and have just one type of inhabitants on this planet - obedient. They are not just removing white race, they are removing anybody with IQ high enough to see through their lies.

As simple as that.