US / Canada Border Fence

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
Personally, I hope it's never built. The greater accomplishment would be to end the problem of a religion that wants to destroy the other two-thirds of the world's population.

We won't be able to keep Islam at bay forever. There have to be better solutions and I don't include surrender in those options.

On this, we agree...there is a wider war being waged when seen in the big picture. Small conflicts rage in many countries which are divided through religious intolerance, and those wars are on the increase, imo.

Our concerns are the same. On the question of post 9/11 changes within Canadian Immigration laws, I have found some interesting items...

www.parl.gc.ca...

Before the new Act was even through Parliament, however, the events of 11 September 2001 in the United States again focused attention on certain aspects of Canadian law and policy, in particular, the refugee determination system and border controls.(5) Although initial American suspicions that the terrorists had gained access to their territory through Canada were disproved, Canada came under pressure to heighten border security measures. On 12 December 2001, then Foreign Minister John Manley and U.S. Homeland Security Director Tom Ridge signed the Canada-U.S. Smart Border Declaration, which contained a 30-point plan designed to ensure the free movement of goods, while increasing security and combatting terrorism. A number of the goals in the plan have immigration and refugee aspects that will take a significant time to come to fruition.

The Smart Border Declaration - mentioned above...

www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca...

In the wake of the terrorist attacks in the United States on September 11, 2001, Canadian and U.S. government departments and agencies have worked in partnership to improve security and services on the shared border. Enhancing the security of the border, while facilitating the legitimate flow of people and goods, are objectives for both countries. Formal agreement on these mutual objectives came on December 12, 2001, with the signing of the Smart Border Declaration by Deputy Prime Minister John Manley and Tom Ridge, U.S. Homeland Security Director.

Where the CSIS is focussed...they were recently threatened by a plot to blow up their headquarters in Toronto.

www.csis-scrs.gc.ca...

Role of CSIS
CSIS is at the forefront of Canada’s national security establishment and as such, its programs are proactive and pre-emptive. The Service’s role is to investigate threats, analyze information and produce intelligence; it then reports to, and advises, the Government of Canada, so as to protect the country and its citizens. Key threats include terrorism, the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction, espionage, foreign interference and cyber-tampering affecting critical infrastructure.

Through its Security Screening Program, CSIS prevents non-Canadians who pose security concerns from entering Canada or receiving permanent resident status or citizenship; the Service also safeguards the confidential information of the Government of Canada from foreign governments and other entities that may present a risk.

However, countering terrorist violence is the top priority for CSIS. Terrorism, which has become a global phenomenon, is a very real threat to our national security. Terrorists and their supporters span countries, cultures, political systems and socio-economic backgrounds. They include both highly educated elites and more humble “foot soldiers.” Followers are recruited from around the world, including our own country. CSIS strives to prevent terrorist acts from being planned in Canada, from occurring on Canadian territory and from affecting Canadian citizens and assets abroad.

I believe this is just the visible tip of the iceberg, though, and much more is being done which is not freely viewable on the internet. I'll keep digging, though.

I'm glad to see that diplomatic relations between the two nations have borne fruit. I felt that this must be the case, but was unsure.

Canada already lets in every poor fool in the world who asks to come in, the border fence is not for your sake, it is for America's sake to prevent the ME that can get assylm there, they may move south. Are you worried about Americans going north? Mexicans? There are plenty of jobs here for them, I do not see a Mexican imigration problem in Canada...

Originally posted by Rockpuck
Canada already lets in every poor fool in the world who asks to come in

Yeah, I know, I was one of them in 1954. I'm not a poor fool anymore, though. Canada gave me the opportunity to make something out of myself, marry a good Irish/Scottish woman, raise two boys and afford them a university education which they put to good use. Any semblance of foolishness on my part has since been successfully eradicated by my involvement in abovetopsecret.com.

Just a footnote about Canadian security measures post 9/11. The RCMP have created a group of teams (with a reasonably sum as backing) called 'INSET'.

www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca...

The RCMP has refocused its National Security Intelligence Sections (NSIS) to become Integrated National Security Enforcement Teams (INSETs). The purpose for this is to increase the capacity for the collection, sharing and analysis of intelligence among partners with respect to targets that are a threat to national security and; create an enhanced investigative capacity to bring such targets to justice; and enhance partner agencies collective ability to combat national security threats and meet all specific mandate responsibilities.

In a recent case, they were able to stop a terrorist attack in Toronto which targeted, amiong other facilities, the headquarters of CSIS.

In a series of raids Friday, police arrested 12 adults and five young offenders. In the process, they seized enough ammonium nitrate fertilizer to build an explosive device three times more devastating than the one used in the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing.

-snippety snip-

Ammonium nitrate, when mixed with fuel, is highly explosive. Police seized three tonnes of the substance. By comparison, the bomb made by Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols that destroyed the federal building in Oklahoma City used one tonne of the fertilizer.

LINK

Masqua, wasn't that plot more of a show? I mean they were going to behead the PM, but they didn't even know his name? Something isn't right with this whole thing.. if only I could put my finger on it....

from your link
"In a statement, Prime Minister Stephen Harper said the arrests showed that Canadians are not immune to acts of terrorism."

Now, if you'll excuse me I'll be hiding under my desk

Yeah, the beheading of our Prime Minister was supposed to be part of it. I'd almost forgotten that part...it must not have shocked me very much.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Edit to add;

It was no movie plot, though...here's a Harvard study of the incident;

As such, the 17 terrorists captured in June had specific demands to be met: the group allegedly planned to kidnap politicians and hold them hostage until Canadian troops were removed from Afghanistan. One of the captured, Steven Chand, had an even more specific mission—beheading Harper himself.

hir.harvard.edu...

[edit on 18-9-2006 by masqua]

Didn't all the 9/11 hijackers enter the country legally ? (I'm not 100% on this though). Still the idea of a fence is borderline retarded (no pun intended). You have hijackers and god knows who else crossing legally via immigration checkpoints without any problems. How in the hell is a fence across such a massive geographic area going to serve any use? Shouldn't the INS/US border patrol be more concerned about making sure what they have in place works first and foremost? I found this quote and had to laugh(probably old news I know):

Four mid-level Immigration and Naturalization Service managers were reassigned Friday, reports CBS News Correspondent Stephanie Lambidakis, in the wake of the agency issuing visa approval notices for two of the hijackers six months after they flew airliners into the World Trade Center.

src: www.cbsnews.com...

brill

.


The USA may need a fence, but Canada certainly does not - as this article indicates:

Man Loses Fingers Trying to Get into Canada

March, 7 @ 14:19 GMT
soficrow

Unable to get into Canada legally because of a robbery conviction, Charles Gonsoulin of Los Angeles attempted to sneak across the border to meet an Internet lover. Police found him dehydrated, babbling and severely frostbitten on a golf course in Manitoba. He will lose all his fingers and half his toes, and will be deported once he recovers from his amputations. In all, he managed to travel about seven kilometers.

Of course, the situation may change if global warming continues unhindered.






brain burp

[edit on 18-9-2006 by soficrow]

Mas,

I certainly don't think it is a movie plot, and there is little doubt in my mind that the streets are better with them known. However, what was displayed to the country and the world at large had, in reality, only a passing connection. They hyped it as if they deciphered, tracked and captured the worlds most evil, insane out of their mind terrorists - in reality it was a small group of people who, prior to the media ban, seemed to be more stupid than dangerous.

Maybe I am reading too much into it. I am a cynic at heart. It just seems to me that what happened was more crafted to give an impression, and when the story started to be criticed they shut down all reports of it. Not sure if the trial themselfs will also be on a media blackout, but if it/they are - I will bet you dollars to donaughts that they just needed a take down, any take down. This poor saps maybe even wanted to carry out their plans but were clearly too incompetent(The PM's name?) and lacked any real backing(or you wouldn't hit them, you'd wait to try and get their connections as well) and being already known they would present zero danger. But they played it to the max, to give the illusion it was something it wasn't. These holy terror's were going to attack us! They were even planing on choping off the PM's head(At the time all the beheading were still fresh in our minds)!!! Those crazy MF'ers!! But when it came out they didn't even know who the PM was, the story started to fall apart and a media blackout is put in place.

Like I said, I am a cynic so I could be wrong.