"White slut" not racial vilification?

AN Aboriginal girl who kicked a woman and called her a "white slut" did not engage in racial vilification because the slur was common street language. A magistrate from the West Australian goldfields threw out a landmark race-hate charge yesterday against the 16-year-old, saying the slur against Kalgoorlie woman Melissa Blackney was "the patois of the street".

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Growing up in a small country town, my friends and I were constantly subjected to taunts, insults and abuse from Aboriginal people who felt it was their god given right to call us "white c****" and our women "white sluts".

The one time my friend responded in kind, telling a group of young aboriginal teenagers who were harrasing us to "bugger off you little black bastards", he was charged with racial vilification.

This double standard so ingrained in Australian culture, has been a constant source of angst for members of the community that is absolutely fed up with indigenous Australians playing the race card to excuse their bad behaviour. Australians have already had to deal with the "mistake" of the stolen generation* which Aboriginals and the usual civil rights loonies have been harping on about for as long as I can remember.

With this sentencing, the magistrate has effectively told Aboriginal people who engage in this kind of behaviour that it is ok. Apparantly its the "patois of the street".

Patois : A regional dialect, especially one without a literary tradition.

I find it simply unbelievable that this judge is suggesting that abuse in any kind, is acceptable because its the dialect of the street! Next they will be telling us that it is ok for them to assault someone who refuses to give them ciggarettes or 'money for a phone call' (believe me it happens) because it is part of their new found culture!

Note: The stolen generation was a generation of Aboriginal children who were taken from their parents and placed in the care of 'white' Australians. This was done due to concerns that the children were not in a safe environment, unfortunately a large number of families were split up and parents never able to see their children again. Recently in Australia, a culture of sexual abuse in inidigenous families has become apparent and authorities have been reluctant to remove the children from their abusive environments due to the whingeing and protests that has resulted from the last attempt.

Funnily enough, a number of aboriginal leaders have come forward to say that they want the government to remove the kids from their current environments. Frankly I wish they would just make up their bloody minds what they want the government to do...move the kids? or not move the kids?

I don't know what can be safely said about this situation. I often counsel others that sometimes it is best to simply take note of circumstances for future reference.

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
I don't know what can be safely said about this situation. I often counsel others that sometimes it is best to simply take note of circumstances for future reference.

hehe you sound like a politician

I was just having a rant, because I've been in the same situation that the girl who was abused was in and it frustrates me.

There are so many aboriginal people who make a good positive contribution to our society, yet the culture of excusing and ignoring the bad behaviour of the others ruins it for everyone.

Well, I must admit, I have seen white sluts in the U.S., but I had no idea that Aboriginal sluts existed

It is just the double standard which is being practiced.

Whites are often descriminated against like this and have no legal recourse...

Western Society at large acts as if there is a tabboo so that a white person can not say anything negative about somone of color. yet, the opposite is clearly not true and is actually encouraged.

Unfortunately the situation the aborigines find themselves in today has it's beginnings with the intrusion of the white man into Australia.
Yes there are double standards now as there where many years ago when the situation was reversed. I think the 'guilt' of mainstream politics and justice in Australia has swung the balance back towards aborigines today perhaps further than intended.
It must be remembered that the rate of aboriginal deaths in custody is many times greater than that of any other group. so other methods of rehabilitation must be found for minor infringements of the law.
Not only did aborigines have to suffer through the indignity of the stolen generation but they were also forced to endure the erosion of there cultural history by not so well meaning missionary's, dislocation from there lands by land owners and the government, segregation from society, lack of decent health care facilities and education.
Now at least there are more opportunities for aboriginal youths in all of these area's, though the drug problem, particularly in outback communities is still rampant as is the child abuse.
But who in the first place shunted these people of into these communities and then left them to fend for themselves.
I also have had encounters with some of these volatile youths but i've also made some very good aboriginal friends over the years when growing up in the Northern Territory and also since moving to the city.
I personally dont find this to be a big deal, a small price to pay for previous injustices so long as there lives improve to the point that we can all be judged by the same standard in the years to come.

Originally posted by mojo4sale
Unfortunately the situation the aborigines find themselves in today has it's beginnings with the intrusion of the white man into Australia.
Yes there are double standards now as there where many years ago when the situation was reversed. I think the 'guilt' of mainstream politics and justice in Australia has swung the balance back towards aborigines today perhaps further than intended.

I agree with you there Mojo, the 'guilt' factor has done more harm than good for Aborignals and the rest of Australia. Bloody greenies... j/k

It must be remembered that the rate of aboriginal deaths in custody is many times greater than that of any other group. so other methods of rehabilitation must be found for minor infringements of the law.

That may be trure...though the rate of Aboriginal incarciration is much higher than any other group too.

Not only did aborigines have to suffer through the indignity of the stolen generation but they were also forced to endure the erosion of there cultural history by not so well meaning missionary's, dislocation from there lands by land owners and the government, segregation from society, lack of decent health care facilities and education.

I agree that they have suffered a lot of indignities, what I dont agree with is them being stuck in the past and holding onto it as a reason for all the bad things some of them do.

The african american people have done so much better than the Aboriginals - and they were slaves!!

Now at least there are more opportunities for aboriginal youths in all of these area's, though the drug problem, particularly in outback communities is still rampant as is the child abuse.
But who in the first place shunted these people of into these communities and then left them to fend for themselves.

They werent shunted, they stayed in the communities that they grew up in and that their families grew up in. there has been plenty of resources allocated to the federally, unfortunately the state governments havent been holding up their end of the bargain (no surprise there though, it is Labor after all).

I also have had encounters with some of these volatile youths but i've also made some very good aboriginal friends over the years when growing up in the Northern Territory and also since moving to the city.
I personally dont find this to be a big deal, a small price to pay for previous injustices so long as there lives improve to the point that we can all be judged by the same standard in the years to come.

Dont get me wrong, some of my best friends to this day are aboriginal. Guys that I play football with, go to the nightclubs with and even work with.

As far as a small price to pay...I dont agree with you there. I did nothing wrong to any of the people that have abused and assaulted me. What people did decades ago is not my fault, and it does not give them a right to take their angst out on me. Especially since they werent even around to suffer the injustices of the past! They are just using the race sympathy card to behave like thugs and criminals and Im just expected to put up with it?

In my opinion, people are judged by the same standards. If they actively try to be the best person they can be, and really try to make a positive contribution to society (like my mates) then society will judge them the same as every other person of every other race who is doing the same.

Yeah mate I heard it on the radio on the way to work and its sickening to see racism only goes one way. We are surely lucky that our aboriginal population continually wars with itself as this directs alot if its violent nature away from the white communities, this may sound racist but its a fact as I have just witnessed major family feuding in a town next to mine.

Originally posted by Ezekiel
They werent shunted, they stayed in the communities that they grew up in and that their families grew up in. there has been plenty of resources allocated to the federally, unfortunately the state governments havent been holding up their end of the bargain (no surprise there though, it is Labor after all).

Well at least we agreed on some stuff. There families did not grow up in the one place, the aborigines were nomadic tribes. Believe me, where i'm from they were shunted off into missions and refused permission to leave it's boundaries. This still happens today in some of the communities around Alice Springs.

Originally posted by Ezekiel
As far as a small price to pay...I dont agree with you there. I did nothing wrong to any of the people that have abused and assaulted me. What people did decades ago is not my fault, and it does not give them a right to take their angst out on me. Especially since they werent even around to suffer the injustices of the past! They are just using the race sympathy card to behave like thugs and criminals and Im just expected to put up with it?

And there are gangs of white youths running rampant in the northern and southern suburbs of Adelaide who blame everything on their social and economic background/upbringing. Same card, different suit. No we shouldnt put up with it, but some understanding of the issues faced by disenfranchised youth of any race also needs to be considered.

Pretty gutless of Australian citizens to allow such a thing to happen.

Originally posted by Shabaz
Pretty gutless of Australian citizens to allow such a thing to happen.

Whhaaat the!!

Btw welcome to ATS Shabaz, but you might want to watch the one line posts, particularly if they dont add anything to the discussion.

Originally posted by mojo4sale
Well at least we agreed on some stuff. There families did not grow up in the one place, the aborigines were nomadic tribes. Believe me, where i'm from they were shunted off into missions and refused permission to leave it's boundaries. This still happens today in some of the communities around Alice Springs.

Being uneducated in those kind of issues I'll take your word for it

That is terrible that they were basically imprisoned. Makes me feel sick to think that its still going on.

And there are gangs of white youths running rampant in the northern and southern suburbs of Adelaide who blame everything on their social and economic background/upbringing. Same card, different suit. No we shouldnt put up with it, but some understanding of the issues faced by disenfranchised youth of any race also needs to be considered.

I agree with you. I cant abide people who refuse to take responsibility for their own actions - especially when those actions are criminal in nature.

I think what these kind of disenfranchised youth need is a sense of self worth. A lot of them are missing self respect, due to being uneducated and unemployed. However, you cant help someone unless they help themselves

Pretty gutless of Australian citizens to allow such a thing to happen.

So Shabaz, where are you from that allows YOU to call Aussie citizens gutless?

The sole cause of ridiculous cases like this is when governments attempt to legislate social behaviour in a knee-jerk, vote-winning reactionary response to racist idiots like the neo-Nazis mentioned in the article. People have been fighting, swearing at, and insulting each other since the day there was more than one person on the Earth, and skin colour is just another excuse to fight. You can legislate against violence and incitement to violence, but you cannot legislate language, ideology, or thought. Sheesh, what have we become with this political correctness on steroids? I'm glad it was thrown out of court so that it doesn't set a precedent. The judge was absolutely correct when he found, "the girl's one-off slur in a heated confrontation did not constitute serious, substantial or severe racial harassment as legally defined."

An Aboriginal girl who kicked a woman and called her a "white slut" did not engage in racial vilification because the slur was common street language.

What's wrong with this picture? A girl kicks a woman, and instead of folks wanting her charged with assault, because she's black and used a racial reference in her insults, it's suddenly a "race hate crime", and to top it all there's a national outcry when the judge says baloney to that but rightly finds her guilty of assault. Hilarious! It was a physical assault for Pete's sake! If they were both black and the girl called the woman a "fat bitch", what then? Would that be a hate crime against fat people? Should there be a law against that? What if she called her an idiot? A hate crime against intellectually disabled people?

Heaven forbid Australia becomes like the States. Australia is becoming litigious enough as it is. When I was a kid, you could ask the local shop owner to use their bathroom if you were desperate, but now they won't let you near it just in case you trip over and sue them.

The only way to modify social behaviour is by social pressure. You can't legislate political correctness, end of story, and if you try, you only end up making it worse and creating a backlash - you create division where you were attempting to negate it. And you most certainly cannot legislate what people say when they're physically assaulting someone.





[edit on 2006-9-15 by wecomeinpeace]

Originally posted by XphilesPhan
It is just the double standard which is being practiced.

Whites are often descriminated against like this and have no legal recourse...

Western Society at large acts as if there is a tabboo so that a white person can not say anything negative about somone of color. yet, the opposite is clearly not true and is actually encouraged.

Whites discriminated against!!! Say it ain't so. What a terrible travesty of justice. How dare them call you names, you poor dears. I hope you can recover from that. Oh for the good old days, eh? When whites could treat the people whose land they stole with impunity. And to think that some of them got angry over it. White people crying foul when they get a taste of their own medicine. Here's a thought, how about giving them their land back? It could help.

Anyone got her number? Picture?

Originally posted by Ezekiel
This double standard so ingrained in Australian culture, has been a constant source of angst for members of the community that is absolutely fed up with indigenous Australians playing the race card to excuse their bad behaviour.

Many races seem to do this and it's starting to irritate me as well. I am against all forms of biggotry.. but that does not mean I'm willing to bare the brunt of other peoples' complexes.

Australians have already had to deal with the "mistake" of the stolen generation* which Aboriginals and the usual civil rights loonies have been harping on about for as long as I can remember.

The thing is.. that was the Catholic church more than australians themsleves [they've been doing it for a millenia]. There have been many other people that have recieved the same brutal treatment at the church's hands. The church should be held accountable.. not innocent people.

With this sentencing, the magistrate has effectively told Aboriginal people who engage in this kind of behaviour that it is ok.

He's given her a licence to go around abusing people for their race. 'Street talk' doesn't cut it.. if it did the 'n word' would be sociably acceptable.

I find it simply unbelievable that this judge is suggesting that abuse in any kind, is acceptable because its the dialect of the street!

'White trash' is the other one that gets used. :shk:

Recently in Australia, a culture of sexual abuse in inidigenous families has become apparent and authorities have been reluctant to remove the children from their abusive environments due to the whingeing and protests that has resulted from the last attempt.

I saw something about that.. the girls are in very vulnerable circumstances and some communities are actually asking for help. [edit- after thought] I heared that a major problem is that status.. which used to be reserved for elders is being given to the wealther aboriginals. Western culture is not always compatable with aboriginal culture so finding a middle ground id nearly impossible.
To be fair.. the last time kids were taken was simply because people did not understand that that was how they lived. They thought they were doing the 'right thing'.

Funnily enough, a number of aboriginal leaders have come forward to say that they want the government to remove the kids from their current environments. Frankly I wish they would just make up their bloody minds what they want the government to do...move the kids? or not move the kids?

Perhaps they could move them to the self imposed 'dry' communities? Surely they have some sort of shelters? Perhaps not. It would be better than the kids running away to the city to become addicts.

[edit on 15-9-2006 by riley]

Originally posted by BlackGuardXIII
Whites discriminated against!!! Say it ain't so. What a terrible travesty of justice.

So do you think it's okay that I have been assaulted for being a white woman? [had a large rock hit me]. A couple of years ago I had a friend who was renedered infertile because she was pack raped for being a white chick [the Sydney ones.. though it never went to court]. They used 'objects' which cut her up.. she almost bled to death. So.. given you think racial slurs are funny.. do you think this funny as well..? They're just extreams of eachother. You should be ashamed.

How dare them call you names, you poor dears. I hope you can recover from that. Oh for the good old days, eh? When whites could treat the people whose land they stole with impunity.

Exuse me but NO ONE has condoned what YOU refer to as 'the good old days'.

And to think that some of them got angry over it. White people crying foul when they get a taste of their own medicine.

An eye for an eye eh?
And again history repeats.

Here's a thought, how about giving them their land back? It could help.

In fact they have got land rights. :shk:

[edit on 15-9-2006 by riley]

Originally posted by Xeven
Anyone got her number? Picture?

*quirks eyebrow*
That desperate?

This is very sad. If you have to use a racial term, it's a racial remark.

Originally posted by wecomeinpeace
People have been fighting, swearing at, and insulting each other since the day there was more than one person on the Earth, and skin colour is just another excuse to fight. You can legislate against violence and incitement to violence, but you cannot legislate language, ideology, or thought. Sheesh, what have we become with this political correctness on steroids? I'm glad it was thrown out of court so that it doesn't set a precedent. The judge was absolutely correct when he found, "the girl's one-off slur in a heated confrontation did not constitute serious, substantial or severe racial harassment as legally defined."

While I agree with everything you have said - the fact remains that if I was to call a black girl a "black slut" I would be branded a racist and a neo nazi that was out to destroy the rights of aboriginal people.

What's wrong with this picture? A girl kicks a woman, and instead of folks wanting her charged with assault, because she's black and used a racial reference in her insults, it's suddenly a "race hate crime", and to top it all there's a national outcry when the judge says baloney to that but rightly finds her guilty of assault.

I think that you really need to understand the context and the environment here in WA, especially in places like Kalgoorlie and my home town (also in the Midwest). In towns like the one I grew up in, if you made even the slightest remarkt that could be construed as racist ie. "piss off you black bastard" - you were branded as a racist for the rest of your life. Everywhere you went there would be aboriginal people slinging insults, rocks and even fists at you.

Sometimes they wouldnt even need a reason to start a fight with you. Just looking at them was enough to warrant a gang beating. I have lost count of the number of times that I have been out at night and threatened by a gang of aboriginal people because I didnt give them a cigarette when they asked - regardless of the fact that I dont smoke and therefore NEVER had cigarettes on me.

The police would never do anything about it - because all they could was slap them on the wrist and put them back ont he street.

For the judge to throw this out was huge, because for so long groups of aboriginal people have been intimidating and bullying whoever they felt like and getting away with it. The decision to say "OH no calling her a white slut was ok" is basically saying "Go for it - abuse the white people who dont give you a cigarette or a dollar, we dont mind" when the message they needed to send was that they should show respect for the people who pay taxes, which ends up in their welfare check each Thursday morning.

Heaven forbid Australia becomes like the States. Australia is becoming litigious enough as it is. When I was a kid, you could ask the local shop owner to use their bathroom if you were desperate, but now they won't let you near it just in case you trip over and sue them.

Totally agree with you again, I remember the fish and chip shop in our neighbourhood used to be owned by Mr. Tan and his family - a really cool old chinese dude who would give us free spring rolls and chiko rolls towards the end of the day on the way back from the beach (because otherwise he would just have to throw them out).

Unfortunately one of the neighbourhood kids got sick, blamed it on Mr. Tan's spring rolls (couldnt have been the marijuana cake he ate down the beach...) and Mr. Tan got in big trouble - and stopped giving us the free spring rolls

The only way to modify social behaviour is by social pressure. You can't legislate political correctness, end of story, and if you try, you only end up making it worse and creating a backlash - you create division where you were attempting to negate it. And you most certainly cannot legislate what people say when they're physically assaulting someone.

Again I agree with you, you cant legislate political correctness - however you can punish someone for behaviour that is unacceptable to set an example for the rest of the community.

Whites discriminated against!!! Say it ain't so. What a terrible travesty of justice. How dare them call you names, you poor dears. I hope you can recover from that. Oh for the good old days, eh? When whites could treat the people whose land they stole with impunity. And to think that some of them got angry over it. White people crying foul when they get a taste of their own medicine.

Well since no one here has ever called what happened in the past 'the good old days' Im just going to assume that you have some angst about the way your ancestors were treated? (Im assuming you are not caucasian - please correct me if im wrong).

I do not begrudge you for having angst and anger about the way your ancestors or your race might have been treated in the past. A lot of races have been treated terribly in the past.

However, excusing anti social and RACIST behaviour when our society has supposed to have moved on from those times, just because "whites did it first" is pathetic. I do not believe in racism of any sort. And if you truly did not believe in racism, and you truly did not believe that it was helping our society go forward, you would not tolerate racist actions against INNOCENT member of society who had nothing to do with the actions of governments and community groups generations ago.

When whites could treat the people whose land they stole with impunity.

Ive never stolen anybodys land, and neither have any of my friends who have been assaulted or abused by aboriginal people. Whats your point?

Here's a thought, how about giving them their land back? It could help.

So they can do the whole of Australia what they have done to places like Halls Creek Western Australia? If you dont know where that is, I suggest you google it. Theres plenty of articles on the rampant alcohol, drug and oh yeah..CHILD abuse in the community.

The fact is, Aboriginal people have got land rights in Aus. There are a number of ways Aboriginal people can claim back land that is rightfully their ancestors. However the aboriginals were a nomadic people, so a lot of the time - tribes never had a certain area that was their one home.

Now, while it would make us feel all warm and fuzzy inside to give them ALL The land back, that would simply be impractical and would be unfair to the MILLIONS of people who never stole the land in the first place, and had nothing to do with the atrocities suffered by the aboriginal people.