Iran, Chinese, and Russian Alliance Saves USA

danwild6 i don't dispute anything you've said but the original point was that they wouldn't actually challenge us successfully but instead would help us by stemming our own political in fighting which could grow out of control.

oh where oh where have the moderates gone?

Originally posted by JackJuice
danwild6 i don't dispute anything you've said but the original point was that they wouldn't actually challenge us successfully but instead would help us by stemming our own political in fighting which could grow out of control.

Yeah guess I should take my own advice. But I think it would be necessary for the US public to perceive a direct threat to the US to achieve this unity of the general American populace. The politicians would go along after that.

Well I agree the US isn't an empire in the traditional sense - empires in the traditional sense are as obsolete as Model T's... The US does however abrogate to itself many of the powers of an empire, and we do seem to think we have the right to dictate to most of the planet internal and external policy. We have a military that is so far beyond what is necessary for our own defense that it's kind of hard to see us as anything other than a kind of empire - "global dominance" doesn't mean we go around handing out cookies to those who oppose our will.

[edit on 9/16/06 by xmotex]

Originally posted by xmotex
The US does however abrogate to itself many of the powers of an empire, and we do seem to think we have the right to dictate to most of the planet internal and external policy.

And we'd be criticized if we didn't. We're constantly shelled for supporting regimes with bad human rights records then told to butt out when we speak up. When nations like Iran, North Korea or Libya start their sabre rattling we step in and then we're the bullies trying to push the peaceful despots around. But then when it breaks into open conflict we're criticized for not putting an end to it or stopping it in the first place. Quite simply the US is in a no win scenario we're damned if we do and damned if we don't.

Originally posted by xmotex
We have a military that is so far beyond what is necessary for our own defense that it's kind of hard to see us as anything other than a kind of empire - "global dominance" doesn't mean we go around handing out cookies to those who oppose our will.

Or global peacekeeper. Face it the reason why in this day with our national popularity were it is and the fact that an alliance of the nations above or any other group of nations hasn't developed is because our military dominance is a stabilizing and beneficial influence on the world(bare in mind there are always exceptions to the rule). In much the same way the British were(largely)a stabilizing influence. I think that is where you get the comparison between the British and the Americans.

Quite simply the US is in a no win scenario we're damned if we do and damned if we don't.

Boo-freaking-hoo. I hear this complaint all the time, and sure, we'll be criticized if we don't intervene. Any government is going to face criticism no matter what it does, that's simply the nature of politics. On the other hand, while we might face "criticism", we wouldn't have 2800 civilians dead in NYC and DC, we wouldn't have 2500 soldiers dead for an occupation of Iraq which has gained us absolutely nothing, etc, etc...

And this response is disingenous anyway - we're not over there out of charity and good-heartedness, that's BS and we know it. We're out there, like any other country, acting in our own interests. Unfortunately the "interests" of those running things now are completely orthagonal to the interests of the average American citizen.

What benefits Haliburton, Exxon-Mobil, Lockheed-Martin, etc. does not neccessarily benefit me or mine in any great way, if at all.

Or global peacekeeper.

"Global peacekeeper" only applies if we're keeping the peace, which we aren't.
We're starting wars, not stopping them. We're making things worse, not better.

Better to mind our own damned business.

[edit on 9/17/06 by xmotex]