Are White People the stewards of the United States of America?

What is the United States of America? The Constitution, I say. An idea of freedom, liberty, democracy, I also say. For the record, I don't care who maintains these institutions, but the current climate in the United States of America makes me curious of other's opinions, and to see if I am in the minority.

If the majority of the United States of America was not white, if English was not the principal language spoken, would the United States of America's flag still wave in glory?

If Asian, Hispanics, Blacks, etc. were in control, the majority, and still upheld the principles that made the United States of America great by it's Founding Fathers (of course, realizing the period of which they lived and would not let Asian, Hispanics, Blacks, etc. have any rights, but applying these principles to all human beings) would it still be the United States of America?

Or would the United States of America be a shell of it's former self if Whites were the minority, no matter if the principles of which the United States of America were created were still observed? Or are the two inseparable?

My my my.. you know how to throw your self to the wolves my friend! This is one of those post I don't know if I want to participate in because I know I would get torn apart for being so politically incorrect.. What the hell EH!??

NO I do not think we would be the same nation, with the same level of respect if the white population was the minority and for good reason. We are a European society, and that in it's self has shapped who we are and what we believe in.

Had America been founded by blacks, hispanics or asians, would we have been as great as we are now? No.. because why on earth would a black dominated or hispanic, what ever, dominated country want to help Europe in the WWI WWII era? They wouldn't, and that is what has set us up as a world super power.

Would we be a democracy? No.. because the form of government was a European philosophy.

Do I think that minorities are capable of running America.. well sure, just our history is what it is because the European society made it that way, and that is something that cannot be refuted. You could say "But oh the poor slaves they worked so hard for the economy!" well it was white folks who shakled them to work for them for their economy to support what they thought as their nation. We where the dominate race, not because we where better in any way as humans, simply more of us with better technology. That is the way of things.

It does'nt matter what the ethnic majority of the country is,
as long as the constitution is upheld and supported America
will be what it's meant to be.

Also, don't know if you had this in mind when you were making
this thread, but in 50 years white people will be a mjoirty in America.

And no I don't have a link/source to refute that, I heard it on a news
documentary a few years ago.



EDIT:
Spelling.

[edit on 9/5/2006 by iori_komei]

Not only in America, but European populations in their own homelands are dwindaling, few industrial countries have surplus birth rates. Soon, even in the UK or France, the minorites, mostly blacks and Arabs will be a majority by the end of the century. I cannot imagine that happening without a massive hate wars and other racial sparked violence..

I don't think blacks/asians/hispanics will rule the US anytime soon, even though whites will be the minority soon. Will it still be the US? Sure I guess...now ask me if the US will become like black and spanish ruled countries such as Mexico, Columbia, South Africa, etc....who knows...

Well, I hope this doesn't turn into a "Let's find out who are racists" thread, but an honest discussion on what the United States of America means to people.

Let me preface this with full diclosure... I am a white middle aged conservative [NOT neocon] male raised in a rural state where I grew up with very few minorities... that being said...

Originally posted by curme
What is the United States of America?

America is made up of ALL of its citizens joined by certain ideals that was decided by people who were born, fought, and died long before we were even thought of. It was created using a document that was, by its very design, intended to change, albeit very slowly as the citizenry changed. It is a very different place than was seen when the Constitution was created. The government as it is today would be overthrown by the people who created it, because it does not give proper representation of the people, nor does it protect the people as it was intended, from tyranny.

Originally posted by curme
If the majority of the United States of America was not white....would it still be the United States of America?

Whew! first see above, as is no longer the goverment it was intended... Secondly, it is not about the color of its people, but by the "the truths we hold self-evident..." Which today no longer seem so self-evident, and is no longer protecting the people for whom it was created. When created, the idea was to protect it citizens from a ruling class that decided religous standards, collected taxes that put the burden of running the government on the poorest of its citizenry, and allowed the rich to benefit from its decisions... (Sound familiar?) I guess my argument is: it isn't the America as it is supposed to be with Whites running the show... What will make those of another race, who idealize what whites have done, any different?

Originally posted by curme
Or are the two inseparable?

What makes those whites who created this country different is the persecution that they experienced at the hands of a very distant and uncaring ruling class... That ruling class made decisions with not a whit of care regarding those that those decisiions affected most. Basically they were outcast and, in a sense , second class citizens. The current population of this country, for the most part, does not in most ways, even remotely relate to those that died creating this country. So, they are already "seperated," and this great country has been hijacked by those homegrown ruling classes...

Once again just IMHO....

SkittlesLA

Originally posted by Rockpuck
Not only in America, but European populations in their own homelands are dwindaling, few industrial countries have surplus birth rates. Soon, even in the UK or France, the minorites, mostly blacks and Arabs will be a majority by the end of the century. I cannot imagine that happening without a massive hate wars and other racial sparked violence..

HAHAHA! No they won't. You do know that 92% of the population of the UK is still White, yes? How on earth will that change so drastically by the end of the century, bar a killing off of the indiginous population.

The usual argument for this subjext is soemthing along the lines of

"Yes, but they have 8 kids per family and whites don't"..

That is so untrue as to be a joke. They may have 8 kids when they live in Backendofnowherestan, where child mortality is high, education standards low and they need the kids to herd the goats.

In the UK, the cost of living is high, the cost of raising children (and childcare) is very high as to be prohibative to having a large family. Many second generation immigrants actually have the same amount of children as whites, as they just cannot afford, nor do they need, so many children.

In the end of it, the non-whites make just as many babies as the whites, so unless there is a mass cull, or a huge wave (bigger than the already huge wave of 600,000 Poles!) of immigrants, the UK WILL NOT be majority black/arab at anytime in the furture.

I wonder, do you actually live in the UK?

Originally posted by curme
If the majority of the United States of America was not white....

Demographically speaking most of the south west part of America will be hispanic and 'not white' within a few decades. Demographics shift all the time. This one is coming.

Obviously no race has stewardship over America.

I think what really causes some people anxiety and sometimes gets mislabeled as "control of the country" or other things is what American culture is and what it's becoming.

That's a valid concern. You come up in a certain culture and thats where you can function comfortably, and you may have found that you really don't function so well with certain other cultures.

Of course its not just "white" or "black" or "brown" culture either, but there are specific nationalities and income levels and economic backgrounds and religious preferences that can factor into the demographic composite of an area.

I live quite a ways from the Bible Belt, praise god. If protestant christian fundamentalists started moving out here in large numbers it would freak me the hell out. If that demographic became the majority out here, the economy would be less likely to support certain industries that I like: I'd have a smaller selection of bars to go to, the local radio programming would shift away from the tastes I've acquired, even the vocabulary around here would change: I don't speak Christian as a first language: I speak in terms of getting things rather than receiving them, I get lucky rather than blessed (no pun intended), I know how to omit profanity but not to substitute words convincingly. Long story short I would stand out like a sore thumb. I would feel like an outsider in that environment.


Well that's what's going on as far as race and other demographics are concerned. It's scary when you find yourself becoming an outsider and not able to identify and fit in very well with the direction the culture is headed. No wonder people are willing to fight over this stuff and equate it to control of the country, because it does make you feel like you're not welcome.

Is there a sollution? Not entirely. Find where you fit in. Thats about the best I can offer you. Even immigration reform and an end to affirmative action etc is going to really end the tension because there aren't just 3 monolithic mainstream races- as I said, there are cultures that overlap. You could shut off immigration at this point and a lot of the supposedly "Mexican" things that I can't really identify with wouldn't go away. Some people will still talk differently from me, still listen to rap instead of metal and want dropped impalas instead of super-charged chevelles.

The change is definitely coming. Where I live I'm already a minority (being white). Although I know my city is no bible belt, I did go to school out in Arizona for 3 years and felt like a minority again in Tucson (once again not the bible belt). I've lived 4 places in the United States and 3 out of 4 I've been the minority. Maybe that time is closer to 20 years

I do believe that European ideals created the America we know, and not just how the founding fathers knew it. Whites have definitely molded America. But I don't think we're special, as someone else pointed out, just more advanced at the time. Any race on the planet could create a democratic or republican society, we just happened to make the one that works the best. Maybe the land, maybe the constitution, i don't know.

But i don't think it's because our skin is white, im not shallow enough to suppose my pigmentation has any effect on my intelligence, morals or goals.

Back to the founding fathers, although they may not recognize certain parts of us/America, and may not relate to some of us/America, I firmly believe the founding fathers would find us kindred spirits. I'm a damn Philadelphian. I walked by Independence Hall and the Liberty Bell an hour ago. Sometimes, I even re-read what's on it. Things change, but i think we still got lots in common, like guns and the freedom to take a piss as long as the law ain't watchin



[edit on 6-9-2006 by Philadelphite]

Originally posted by Philadelphite
Whites have definitely molded America. But I don't think we're special, as someone else pointed out, just more advanced at the time...

Back to the founding fathers, although they may not recognize certain parts of us/America, and may not relate to some of us/America, I firmly believe the founding fathers would find us kindred spirits... Things change, but i think we still got lots in common, like guns and the freedom to take a piss as long as the law ain't watchin.

You have voted Philadelphite for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have two more votes this month.

I don't do that too often, but I just wanted to commend you for your words. Your sentiments echo my own feelings on the subject. I feel similarly rooted in the American experience.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
No.. because why on earth would a black dominated or hispanic, what ever, dominated country want to help Europe in the WWI WWII era?

That's not neccesarily true. Lots of people of color fought and died in those wars. Who's to say they wouldn't have made the same choices if they had been in charge?

Originally posted by curme
If Asian, Hispanics, Blacks, etc. were in control, the majority, and still upheld the principles that made the United States of America great by it's Founding Fathers ... would it still be the United States of America?

Emphasis mine.

I haven't read all the responses but I wanted to get my thoughts down, then I'll go back and read them.

Very interesting question, curme!

My first impression of your quesition is that you mean if the white population (for some reason) diminished or the now-minority population increased to the point where white people were the minority. NOT what if white people were never in the majority from the beginning.

My first response is that absolutely it would still be the same nation. As long as they upheld the Constitution and principles that made this country great, it would be the same to me. That's what the country is. In fact, because of the special circumstances some minority races have endured here, and their unique context, if they were to come into the majority, it might even be better than it is now.

It will be interesting for sure.

Originally posted by curme
If Asian, Hispanics, Blacks, etc. were in control, the majority, and still upheld the principles that made the United States of America great by it's Founding Fathers [...] would it still be the United States of America?

Of course.

It has nothing to do with the melanin concentration of the upper layers of the dermis, you're spot on.

I have often heard people say that 'if all the white people in the US disappeared today, the country would fally apart'. Sure, indeed, it would. Whites are the majority, and in a position of power (priviliged, earned, whatever), so elimate that, and you'll have problems. Or, alternatively, take the people that are living in the ghettos and slums, and multiply them a few times over and put them in power, and you'll have problems. But thats true if they're from the hood or the trailer park.

It's hard to say exactly what might happen when eventually citizens of European ancestry are in the minority on this continent. The Constitution is a marvel to anyone who takes the time to study it both from a legal, historical, or cultural perspective. There is no question that the nation has its roots in the Western tradition, but in my experience, people of all ancestries devote their lives to the preservation of American ideals.

One must consider whether America will survive until such time as the massive demographic shift in question takes place. I think we'd be much better served to keep our eyes on the more immediate threats than to entertain such long range hypotheticals.

Originally posted by HarlemHottie

That's not neccesarily true. Lots of people of color fought and died in those wars. Who's to say they wouldn't have made the same choices if they had been in charge?

I think once people throw away misconceptions brought on by religion, society and the media we all act pretty similarly.