Images From A Demonstration Of Peace

These images are supposed to be from a demonstration about peace. Please take a look and post what you think about them.

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[edit on 17-8-2006 by RedGolem]

So you posted up some pics of angry Muslims with some idiotic placards.

.....and so what?

A tiny minority within an already very small minority
(Muslims are approx 1.5 - 1.8 million people in the UK depending on source......and not all of asian ethnicity).

There is no sign of a credible civil war 'threat' here (as you implied on the other thread).

It is a pity that the only pictures that seem to be available are the ones from the nutter extremist element.

A far more balanced and sober assessment of Musdlim feeling in the UK today - and which stops the usual trend for picking out an extremist and pretending it is typical - is the excellent Channel 4 film 'What Muslims want'.

It is available here www.torrentportal.com...

- It's a far more interesting, honest and accurate assessment of what is going on and where we are than the attempt by those on the UK far right-wing who attempt to pretend that the sky is going to fall in any moment because of 'these people'.

Originally posted by sminkeypinkey
So you posted up some pics of angry Muslims with some idiotic placards.

.....and so what?

A tiny minority within an already very small minority
(Muslims are approx 1.5 - 1.8 million people in the UK depending on source......and not all of asian ethnicity).

Sminkeypinkey,
I am glad you think that these pics mean basically nothing in the grand scheem of things. Yes I would say the people are angry, but the protest does not seem to be a small one. And the idotic placards, as you put it, seem to me to have the intent to instill terror.

So you are saying that this particular happening would not bring a second glance or a topic to talk about over tea to the vast majority of people in the UK?

Well, ok, seeing as you asked.......

Originally posted by RedGolem
I would say the people are angry, but the protest does not seem to be a small one.

- The protest pictures are merely a tiny part of a larger but fairly small protest.

Naturally the photographers and TV crews focused on the most outrageous part of it .......but if you watch the Channel 4 film you'll see that they were not typical of the protest at all.
There were many others there with very different placards.

Just as Mary Whitehouse pursued a successful blasphemy case through the courts in the 1970's on the basis that she and other Christians had been deeply offended by what had been said so some Muslims can legitimately claim that they too were offended by the publications referred to.

Under our free speech laws they have the right to peacefully voice their concerns too, right?

They weren't all claiming to want be-headings or the imposition of Sharia law.

And the idotic placards, as you put it, seem to me to have the intent to instill terror.

- Yeah and so what?

A handful of mouthy nutters acted like the mouthy nutters they are in public.
Big deal.

No matter how anyone tries to claim otherwise they are not 'typical' of British Muslims, nor even young British Muslim men and women.

So you are saying that this particular happening would not bring a second glance or a topic to talk about over tea to the vast majority of people in the UK?

- No, I'm saying that we have been there and done this so many times before.
It isn't going to bring any kind of 'back-lash' or any other coded BS of a far-right wet dream.

Last time it was Ireland and the Irish people......and that concerned a far more serious and real 'threat' all across the UK.
Now, Irish people aren't anybodies' idea of a 'problem', (well, excepting for the tiny rump of nutters amongst us no-one takes any notice of).

No civil war, no deportations.
In fact IIRC in a recent poll when asked if they had to choose another nationality which it would be the most populat British response was 'Irish', by far.

The truth is that despite the day-dreams of each bunch neither the tiny bunch of politico-religious extremists of Asian ethnicity nor the so-called 'British' (thought they stand contrary to almost every actual British value there is) far-right extremist nutters are going to bring about their version of a revolution.

They'd love to kid us all different and love to make various dire predictions and exaggerate their piffling real and actual 'standing, of course.

Interestingly each set of extremists share the same 'quality', deluded and completely blinkered zealots solely able, it seems, to be a totally annoying and thoroughly distasteful bunch of loser irritants.

They have absolutely nothing positive to offer anyone, and certainly nothing constructive or of any value to our wider society
(which, interestingly each again similarly despise totally and fantasise about destroying to be rebuilt according to their own rather infantile plans).

[edit on 17-8-2006 by sminkeypinkey]

Sminkeypinkey,
Thanks for your rather complete and some what well though out responce. That does seem to make things quite clear. And I am glad that these right wing nutters are the very small minority. I did also see where you have been through all of this before.

I did try to look at the video but did not manage to make it work.

thanks for all your info again.

NP, RG.

This is the place to discuss such things and you are very welcome, anytime.

Pity you can't get the torrent to work, it's a very interesting film.

Rather surprisingl is a part where Jon Snow is interviewing an apparantly highly 'fundamentalist' young Muslim man in a park, the man's anti-western comments are are overheard by another Muslim man and this 2nd Muslim man interrupts to begin arguing with the 1st Muslim that he is all wrong in his interpretation of the Koran and it's teachings as regard living in a non-Muslim place.

The film highlights the convergence and divergence between the '2 world's - especially amongst the young Muslims interviewed - and is fascinating.
The mix between some extraordinarily reactionary and highly conservative right-wing views (ironic considering the far-right's claims to loathe 'their values') colliding with 'western' liberal' attitudes and ideas is stark and thought-provoking.

Maybe you can google for it (I've seen it is available in several sites) and try again?

[edit on 17-8-2006 by sminkeypinkey]

If I went to a demo and held up a 'behead all those who support Islam' placard I'd be hounded by Muslim's.....not them all because some do preach the real Koran, but those who believe in the 'holywar'.

Islam as a whole is going thru a bad phase just now and people venting thier anger in this way are just adding fuel to the fire.

Whats needed is the leaders to start weeding out those who are preaching Jihad, if not there is an old proverb....

If you fly with the crows you get shot with the crows.

Things wil get worse, and personally I don't trust many muslims now.....I've stopped going to thier business's etc, as have many others who feel until they turn over the trouble makers they are all tarred with the same brush.

Originally posted by Pictnation
Whats needed is the leaders to start weeding out those who are preaching Jihad, if not there is an old proverb....

- Try and give that film a go, you'll see Muslims arguing for (and begining to organise and establish for themselves) exactly that kind of leadership.

Things wil get worse, and personally I don't trust many muslims now.....I've stopped going to thier business's etc, as have many others who feel until they turn over the trouble makers they are all tarred with the same brush.

- Well as I keep saying, been there done that.

We had all of these arguements during the last bout of 'the troubles' in Ireland.

But that really didn't mean Irish people generally were a 'threat'.
I'm sure some people did avoid Irish businesses but the majority didn't and 'Irish' as a kind of 'brand' couldn't be more popular in Britain.

'We' need (and should want) the Muslim people 'on our side' (cos the alternative of an alienated and hostile Muslim population would be a complete disaster and be just what the torrorists want).

Treating 'them' as an enemy is IMO the surest way of getting more and more of them acting as one.......and that would be a real and very dangerous way to see things actually "getting worse".
The truth is such a disasterous situation is totally avoidable (as would be any damage or casulties caused by such a stupidly short-sighted approach).
The torrorist element would still be responsible for their own actions, it would not excuse that.
However making matters worse by such idiotic tactics would be wholly dependant on the choices 'we' would have made.

Personally I find this type of language quite worrying, although I agree that this is a very small minority.

I think the greater tragedy for these people is that they are so ignornat of the world around them because if the society that they appear to want was ever achieved they would be the first against the wall.

Totalitarian regimes with Islam as the core (let's face it, they want the Taliban) would not entertain anyone with an opinion or a desire o protest.

These people need to get out and look at the world.

Regards

Originally posted by paraphi
I think the greater tragedy for these people is that they are so ignornat of the world around them because if the society that they appear to want was ever achieved they would be the first against the wall.

Totalitarian regimes with Islam as the core (let's face it, they want the Taliban) would not entertain anyone with an opinion or a desire o protest.

These people need to get out and look at the world.

Paraphi,
That is all very well put.
Thank you for yout coments