Will Bush conspire to overthrow the 2 term limit?

It really concerns me when I see people in these forums speak out of ignorance. I believe that it was American Madman who referenced the 2 term limits for Presidential office as being instituted just after WW II.

The 2 term limits for Presidential office was brought about by the one of the only men since WW II who could have won a 3rd term if he wanted...Ronny Rayguns. He succeeded in putting the USSR into the poorhouse and crushing Russian Communism by outspending them in a cold war arms build-up.

To this day, many Americans aren't sure whether Ronald Reagan was an absolute political genius or just incredibly lucky. It was probably a bit of both.

Anyway, in the 80s, Reagan nearly tripled our national debt from $1 Trillion to $2.9 Trillion in his bid to win in the arms build-up. In retrospect, it was a good move and well worth the money. The U.S. had many in the world who were willing to buy into that debt because of the reputation we had.

If it were not for the 2 term limit that Reagan worked with congress to put into place, he undoubtedly would have been elected again in a landslide. He left office with about a 76% approval rating. This paved the way for Bush Sr. to ease into office without much of a fight.

Bush Sr. continued building stockpiles of weapons and building our national debt to 4.4 Trillion even though we had no need for more munitions or more debt. But it was simple....we needed to keep the economy going and munitions is what we were good at making. This eventually led to a need to dispose of some of these munitions stockpiles that were aging and in danger of becoming unsafe from storage.

Saddam Hussein in 1991 provided the most perfect means of weapon disposal we could ever find. He invaded Kuwait and thumbed his nose at the U.S. and the rest of the world. Bush Sr. proceeded to mount a devastating military against Iraq and then let loose with the most incredible fireworks show the world has ever seen...30 days of precision explosives were delivered aerially into Iraq. Finally, when the aerial campaign let up, Iraqi soldiers that survived crawled out of their bunkers and sometimes got shot because they surrendered with too much enthusiasm as they were mistaken for attackers.

Saddam agreed to an unconditional surrender. The conditions were laid out and he signed it. All weapons of mass destruction were to be destroyed. Iraqi military planes, the few that survived the bombing, were not allowed to fly within 30 miles of their borders with other countries. Violaters were shot down. All rockets capable of delivering an explosive as far away as Israel were to be destroyed.

Saddam complied for 10 years and there has been no evidence found that he did not. The occassional Iraqi military airplane that flew into the no-fly zone and didn't turn around fast enough was shot down and everyone in the world said they had it coming.

In spite of this overwhelming victory, Bush Sr. lost his bid for presidency to Bill Clinton. Clinton immediately initiated a "don't ask, don't tell" policy for Gays in the military. This ticked off a lot of us right wingers.

He then proceeded to cut government spending in the budgets that he sent to congress for approval. The result was that the budget got cut and many military bases were slated for closing. This hurt areas that depended on those bases for local revenue and it took many years for most of them to recover, but most did recover. Annual spending was actually reduced for the first time in over 100 years and this country learned to make something other than munitions. We all went to work building the computer revolution. The national debt increased only 1.4 Trillion in Clintons 8 year term of office to 5.8 Trillion, less than Bush Sr.'s 4 years in office. He did the half of his job that required that he present a viable budget to the Congress each year. The other half as Commander-in-Chief of the armed forces? History will tell.

Though Clinton likely could have won a 3rd term even in the face of a sex scandal in the oval office, he abided by the terms of the law regarding presidential terms being limited to 2 and stepped down.

Today, it is still undertain who actually won the election of 2000. The ballot counting was never completed and Bush Jr. laid claim to office. The U.S. Supreme Court granted his petitions and he took the presidency. History is yet to be determined about this president. However, he has written budgets that have made every president prior to himself look like tight wads. The national debt has risen from 5.8 Trillion to a current $8.5 Trillion. That is at a rate of about $500 Billion per year in new national debt. It will be pushing $10 trillion before he leaves office. I would not want to be the president to follow Bush Jr. and that massive debt.

Today after so many questionable political moves by this administration by which power grabs were made in almost every move, one does have to wonder if Bush Jr is willing to surrended such a power to a duly elected succesor.

This is a question of honor with Bush Jr in regards to the 2 term limit. The limit that was created under the Reagan Administration and honored was then honored by the Clinton Administration. There has been some question raised as to whether Bush Jr will be willing to step down when his 2 terms are up.

What do you think? Will he relinquish control of the presidency in January of 2009 or will he find a means to retain the office?

Will the 2 term limit find it's way to the congressional floor to be overturned? Would Bush be able to squeeze off yet another narrow claim to the presidency? Would he actually stoop to some sort of coup or conspiracy to maintain his hold on power?

What would you expect from him?

Clinton did such things and more.

He's not comming back.

There are some of us who think that the Bush Family is a regime and has been in power since Bush Sr. was head of the CIA. IMO, Reagan and Clinton were Bush Family puppets. Perhaps not so much Reagan at least until March 30, 1981, that is, but Clinton and Bush have some very interesting ties ala BCCI and Barry Seal. But to address your question directly, the Help America Vote Act (literally an Act of Congress) has made any conspiracy for control Moot and we now have a system in place which has completely undermined our electoral mandates, even the ownership of our votes is now given to private ownership...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

This is what I think as an American.....

I supported bush's agressive actions and voted for him as my first president I ever voted for, although I must admit I was close to voting for kerry, but the vietnam scandal disgusted me too much for that.

As an American I demand that bush has served his two terms to the best of his ability and must now step down.

If he tried to have the congress overturn the law created under Reagan I hope congress will shoot him down. He has had his mark on history it's time for someone else to step up.

I do not believe even if by some miracle the law was overturned hed have a chance in hell of being re-elected. Not becuase I would not support him but his approval rating is through the floor and his spending through the roof.

HE was dealt a very bad hand.....9/11 would of been tough for any president and then katrina made matters worse.

I will not criticise the man for his decisions but his time is done in 2008 and even his GOP base will not like a law being turned over just for him.

I am hoping whoever our next leader is..... he will be able to turn 7 years of war around and maybe find a solution to our economic problems as well.

....Think Happy thoughts

Ex Post Facto Law

Originally posted by davenman
The 2 term limits for Presidential office was brought about by the one of the only men since WW II who could have won a 3rd term if he wanted...Ronny Rayguns.

[...]

If it were not for the 2 term limit that Reagan worked with congress to put into place, he undoubtedly would have been elected again in a landslide.

This is not true.

From the U.S. Constitution:

AMENDMENT XXII
Passed by Congress March 21, 1947. Ratified February 27, 1951.
Section 1.
No person shall be elected to the office of the President more than twice, and no person who has held the office of President, or acted as President, for more than two years of a term to which some other person was elected President shall be elected to the office of President more than once. But this Article shall not apply to any person holding the office of President when this Article was proposed by Congress, and shall not prevent any person who may be holding the office of President, or acting as President, during the term within which this Article becomes operative from holding the office of President or acting as President during the remainder of such term.

I don't know where this fairy tale about Reagan instituting the two-term presidential limit during the '80s came from, but it is fiction, not fact.

This in turn casts reasonable doubt on the overall validity of your thesis, since it is founded on a demonstrable fallacy.




Edit: For the record, Reagan actually opposed the 22nd Amendment, and campaigned to repeal it:

en.wikipedia.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

Again, verifiable facts are at odds with the premise of this thread, and these aren't the only apparent fabrications.

Deny Ignorance.



[edit on 8/12/2006 by Majic]

Firstly, Bush did win the election, he did not simply lay claim to the office in the midst of the confusion of ballots, which I believe in itself was a conspiracy by leftists to give Kerry as much of a chance as possible.

Secondly, Bush will not attempt to stay in office another term. Any man who has put up with as many false charges and and has been such a scapegoat, I believe, will be relieved when his term is over. I believe that no man should be in office more than two terms, although it will be interesting to see how Bush's successor follows up on his campaign and on his accrued debt.

Thirdly, it is my belief that the Bush family is not a regime and is in fact a pawn in a conspiracy much more widespread in the US government, involving those who orchestrated the 9/11 attacks and blamed it on Bush.

I may have strayed off topic a bit, and if that is the case, my apologies.

I have very strong beliefs.

I am also opposed to the 22nd Amendment. A Supreme Court justice gets a lifetime appointment, a Senator gets as many 6 year terms as he can get elected for. Yet the President is limited to 2 4 year terms?

But as far as a conspiracy to get Bush 4 more years...if Clinton couldn't do it, what makes you think Bush could.

Although I would love to see Bill Clinton vs George W. Bush in 2008! It's not going to happen.

Bush will not seek another term. Its against the law. And why would he want he want to be president any longer with so many wackos out there spreading lies and hatred against him....for no reason. I'm stll looking forward to Cheney/Rove 08

Nothing short of Martial Law on the day of election will allow Bush to stay in office. Even if he was allowed o run again he would lose. People would vote for miss Cleo or that talking Kool-Aid jug before they re-vote Bush. Not bashing, just pretty much saying it as it is.

Damn, Majic, you beat me to the punchline. lol.

Its posts like these which make people think that conservatives live in backwoods sheds with no clue whats going on.

I don't think that the President will try and change the constitution so he can run for another term.

However the neo-cons think that it is their divine right to maintain power and they have the mechanism to do so. So The Presidential o8 elections will be meaningless; their lackey is assured an easy win, whomever they might choose.

If voting really made any difference; it would be illegal!



It's a brave new world, welcome to the monkey house!

honestly, i think they need to remove the 22nd ammendment, they need to limit it to a 1 term limit

that way the president won't worry about campaigning throughout the second half of the first term

Bush is no coming back but. . . while he is in power his political party and benefactors can make sure that congress stays in Republican hands as to ensure that any president elected if Democrat be against a wall.

Originally posted by davenman
It really concerns me when I see people in these forums speak out of ignorance.

I agree.
.

edit: I have to add that the whole "Reagan won the cold war with an arms race" story is bovine feces. Next you'll be telling us the Berlin wall fell just because Reagan uttered that scripted photo-op phrase. Things were a lot more complicated than that and no it was not "basically" what happened, it's the MSM's Disneyland version of history.


[edit on 8/12/2006 by Gools]

Originally posted by XphilesPhan

I do not believe even if by some miracle the law was overturned hed have a chance in hell of being re-elected. Not becuase I would not support him but his approval rating is through the floor and his spending through the roof.

HE was dealt a very bad hand.....9/11 would of been tough for any president and then katrina made matters worse.

I'm sorry, but you sound as though you don't have a solid grasp of high-level politics. It's been proven beyond a reasonable doubt that the 19 cave dwelling "terrorists" who so luckily made the twin towers fall perfectly into their own footprints had some help along the way from your beloved federal government, even if that help was simply knowledge of and inaction towards stopping the attacks. Continue your research, your gut instincts will lead you the rest of the way.

Some things you should read about:

Final Secret of Pearl Harbor
JFK Assassination
USS Liberty
Flight 800
Flight 587

Originally posted by War_Monger
Bush will not seek another term. Its against the law. And why would he want he want to be president any longer with so many wackos out there spreading lies and hatred against him....for no reason. I'm stll looking forward to Cheney/Rove 08

LMFAO. Your post is a joke, right? Cheney/Rove? Are you serious? I'm a republican and I'd probably move to canada if that happened. Ok, I'm just joking, I'll never leave the USA. Your screenname is making me think perhaps you weren't joking. If you really think Cheney/Rove would be good for this country, I suggest setting the budweiser down, turning off the nascar, and picking up a few books.

Originally posted by Gools
edit: I have to add that the whole "Reagan won the cold war with an arms race" story is bovine feces. Next you'll be telling us the Berlin wall fell just because Reagan uttered that scripted photo-op phrase. Things were a lot more complicated than that and no it was not "basically" what happened, it's the MSM's Disneyland version of history.

those of us who have lived through it and seen the "disneyland version of history" firsthand and not just read it from a history book might disagree with that statement. so, just what exactly is your version of these events?

Those of us who witnessed it firsthand or those of us who had the media/political leaders tell us what was happening? Many of Reagan's policies and actions get swept under the rug when the media speaks of how "great" of a president he was and how he single handly destroyed the evil empire known as the USSR. People forget or are misinformed on many of the inhumane policies Reagan used to "stop the spread of evil communism" and lets not forget his lack of awarness about the enviroment and HIV/AIDS.

Anyway, I don't think that Bush will attempt any sort of change to constitution to allow him to run again as it is incredibly unlikely that he will win another election(short of another "major terrorist threat" of some sort). Although I know it is unlikely I do have a bad feeling that he might try something like this.

The plan is moving along nicely. Dictatorship for the "sake of terrorism"!!!

We're all going to be saved by George. What a warm and fuzzy feeling i get just thinking about it!!!

God Bless George W. Bush. What other president could you find out there who would do this for the people???

Instead of moving on, as all the other presidents, this man wants to stay in power to protect us. Ahhhhhh.....what luck. These are the best days for the USA.

I think things cant get any better......

Whence The Topic?

Originally posted by CyberSEAL
If you really think Cheney/Rove would be good for this country, I suggest setting the budweiser down, turning off the nascar, and picking up a few books.

Let's please refrain from the off-topic personal commentary.

Your comments on the topic are welcome, but the assessments of other members are not.

Courtesy Is Mandatory