Break through in talks at the UN!

www.haaretz.com...

It souhnds like this may go through....that and the fact that israel has held off on the major offensive to wait for this resolution is good. On the Israeli side anyway...now just gotta see if Hezbo will agree to it.

You cant be too sure when it comes to things like this. One side likes it, the other doesn't . . . blah blah blah Im sure we've all seen it before. I guess all we can do is cross our fingers and hope that this works, and a 'progressive' withdrawal doesnt take too long.

No way would I expose myself to an armed invading force , by disarming and leaving them in the area with no guaranteed ceasefire. Bolton is custom tailoring it to Israels advantage. Doubt they would accept it unless it was a mutual ceasefire and mutual withdrawal.

As long as it can get both sides to stop firing even for a little bit, it would be great. Once the momentum stops and they can start slowing down, this thing can come to an end. I think both sides want to stop, but they want to stop by being able to save face and not admit defeat. It will take a gradual winding down but thats the only way. Its like dealing with kids...make them both feel like they've won so they can keep their ego's and not be embarassed, give them a lollipop and send them on their way.

Originally posted by princeofpeace
As long as it can get both sides to stop firing even for a little bit, it would be great. Once the momentum stops and they can start slowing down, this thing can come to an end. I think both sides want to stop, but they want to stop by being able to save face and not admit defeat. It will take a gradual winding down but thats the only way. Its like dealing with kids...make them both feel like they've won so they can keep their ego's and not be embarassed, give them a lollipop and send them on their way.

That proposal does not call for a ceasefire on Israels part only Hizbollah as well as a pull-out past the Litani river, so if Israel were to say someone shot a soldier they could just easily walk in and take the place without a hassle. It should be a mutual pullout and mutual ceasefire.

Originally posted by ThePieMaN
No way would I expose myself to an armed invading force , by disarming and leaving them

Sorry if im slow on the up take but the cease fire will permit Israel to keep the IDF within Lebanon ?.

Yeah its sounds like the cease fire will allow IDF in Lebabon and a gradual replacement will happen. As IDF leave, UN forces will come in, but it will be a steady gradual process. You wont see IDF leave all at once then have the UN come in all at once. There can be no power vacuum....it will be more like a 1000 IDF leave, 1000 UN come in...anojther 1000 IDF leave, another 1000 UN come in and so on. And yes, if they both agree to a cease fire, IDF will still retain the right to respond if provoked.

But if Hezbo is the great, responsible organization and the real victims here that everyone says, then this shouldnt be a problem anyway as they will respect the resolution and not wreck a chance at peace by trying to shoot at IDF as it leaves.

The revised draft calls for a "progressive" Israeli withdrawal,

Hezbollah clearly won't accept this and will continue to fire into israel, regardless of whether the UN Sec. Resolution passes or not. Hezbollah isn't a state, its not bound by UN resolutions anyway.

Originally posted by ThePieMaN
Bolton is custom tailoring it to Israels advantage.

Since Israel is clearly the greater power in the war, indeed, the war started on israels terms, the terms of the ceasefire have to be favourable to Israel, not neutral. Why would isreal accept a quick withdrawl? They're not being turned back by hezbollah, they know that hezbollah will merely hit them again once they leave, there really isn't any reason for them to accept a neutral resolution.

so if Israel were to say someone shot a soldier they could just easily walk in and take the place without a hassle.

...
And this is different from any other day how?

Either way whatever the US and France agree on, it has to be the parties on the ground and i doubt either one is really sick of fighting yet.

Originally posted by ThePieMaN

Originally posted by princeofpeace
As long as it can get both sides to stop firing even for a little bit, it would be great. Once the momentum stops and they can start slowing down, this thing can come to an end. I think both sides want to stop, but they want to stop by being able to save face and not admit defeat. It will take a gradual winding down but thats the only way. Its like dealing with kids...make them both feel like they've won so they can keep their ego's and not be embarassed, give them a lollipop and send them on their way.

That proposal does not call for a ceasefire on Israels part only Hizbollah as well as a pull-out past the Litani river, so if Israel were to say someone shot a soldier they could just easily walk in and take the place without a hassle. It should be a mutual pullout and mutual ceasefire.

That is a nice idea, but it won't work pieman. Before Israel leaves it needs a "Strong" military force to walk in 5 feet behind the leaving IDF-and I mean NON-Hezbollah and I don't really even think the Lebanese army is up to the task.

That is to prevent a power vacuum from being filled with Hezbollah again.

I agree both sides need to ceasefire, HOWEVER, if Hezbollah breaks the ceasefire-if they stop-Israel would be perfectly within its rights to takeout whatever was fired at them with whatever force is necessary.

We also need to learn from the Korean War, every ceasefire was used to get more men and equipment to the enemy-this must not be allowed to happen.

To prevent that, I propose IDF forces along with UN troops inspect everything being carried in trucks and such. I mean search all food and other aid `for weapons and such. Furthermore, I propose that video cameras be watching the whole thing-several redundant camera’s.

This way aid can come in and no weapons. That IS what we all want, isn't it?

Latest from the Jerusalem Post:

www.jpost.com.../JPArticle/ShowFull

"A new obstacle was raised in the approval of the proposed cease-fire agreement between Israel and Lebanon on Thursday night, when the latter was refusing to allow French forces to enforce its mandate by force, if necessary, as allowed by the UN's chapter VII regulations.

Israel Radio reported that attempts were being made to convince Lebanon to agree to the proposal.

If both Lebanon and Israel agree to the proposal, it is expected to brought before the UN Security Council for ratification within 24 hours."

So Lebanon is halting the action that can stop bombs from falling on its cities? WOW, either they want to give Israel more time or their nuts!

No thats just the way this war has gone. If this was 3 weeks ago Lebanon would have said yes to whatever was gonna stop the firing. Now, a month into it, they are emboldened at least a little to now be able to make some demands.

Originally posted by helium3
Sorry if im slow on the up take but the cease fire will permit Israel to keep the IDF within Lebanon ?.

Yes its progressive so it will be in spurts, but I doubt that would be acceptable to Hizbollah or the Lebanese government. I think that leaves too many chances for problems to occur and cause friction. All it takes is one peed off guy whos daughter or son was killed to start taking pot shots at IDF and its back to fighting.

I am not sure, but I do not understand how this has anything to do with Europe.