Russia/US Deal to store our Nuclear Waste in Russia

Kiss Yucca Mountain goodbye.

Bush wants to spend millions to upgrade Russian storage facilities to hold tons of our Nuclear Waste

U.S., Russia Explore Deal to Store Nuclear Waste

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Talk of the Nation, July 10, 2006 · The Bush administration says it is ready to begin formal negotiations with Russia over a civilian nuclear agreement. A potential deal would clear the way for Russia to import and store thousands of tons of spent nuclear fuel.

Guests:

David Sanger, New York Times White House correspondent

George Perkovich, vice president of the Carnegie Endowment

Henry Sokolski, executive director of the Nonproliferation Policy Education Center

KNPR STORY

It is odd, but why is it such a huge deal? Nuclear waste doesn't have any purpose. The only thing that pisses me off is once again our government is using other countries when it will be better for them to use OUR country. It is more stable that way. I really don't understand this whole agreement especially with the unfriendly terms we are on with Russia.

Nuclear waste is not only a burden, but can be VERY dangerous if it falls into the wrong hands. The fact that Russia might agree to store nuclear waste is very good, as they have a lot of space up there, and a fair bit of it is already irradiated, so that you could store radioactive gunk there without any real consequences.

My biggest beef with nuclear energy is that all we really do at our power plants is boil water to turn steam turbines, which leaves a whole lot of messy waste. I would rather they wait until we can develop a collector, similar to a solar cell, that can use all the radiation effectively and directly, leaving no waste.

As to it being junk, even the Russians realize that there may be some way to recover energy from it, and the broadcast even mentions that weapons grade plutonium is a possible substance to be extracted.

I like the Russians personally... but I would feel better if we stuck it in my "back yard" at Yucca Mountain

I agree with you. We certainly need to develop fusion other than fission. And I may like Russian people, but I don't trust the government. Not that I trust MINE, lol. But this just doesn't feel "good". The G8 summit will be interesting this weekend.

Russia might have some use for this nuclear waste. After all one man's waste is another man's treasure. However Russia has a load of its own nuclear waste.

But I wouldn't be too worried about it getting in the wrong hands. Believe me if the terrorists or freedom fighter or whoever wanted to do some serious damage they would seek out an actual nuke or two from somewhere. Using nuclear waste as weapon is alot like trying to knock somebody out with an empty bullet casing, instead of shooting them with an actual bullet. Plus I'd like to see them go to these radioactive dumps and dig through the trash there. Russia has isolated areas in the far far north where the radioactive waste is dumped. It is so far from any population, or even any substantial live environment (in the far north even grass can't grow), that it cannot do any damage. It is the same as dumping it on the moon.

[edit on 12-7-2006 by maloy]

Originally posted by maloy
But I wouldn't be too worried about it getting in the wrong hands.

Not worried really. The Russians don't hesitate shooting before asking questions. But it seems we are sending them a LOT of money these days.

The millionaire space flights 20 million a pop...

Space Tourist

The Pizza Hut Lego and other contracts.

Pizza Hut Delivers in Space

And just tonight I heard on NBC local Las Vegas news that Bigalow Aerospace is using Russian launch vehicles for their project.

Bigalow Aerospace

Is Bush planning to move to Russia after his term?

[edit on 12-7-2006 by zorgon]

Face it Cold War is over (for now at least), and Russia is Capitalist all of the sudden. It joined the Global market from which it was locked for most of the century.

Well just like US and Japan and China specialize in certain industries, Russia specializes in certain things. Things like military equipment, space technology, mechanical engineering, and similar fields of expertise are very developed in Russia. This expertise is of high quality, and far cheaper than in Western countries. Thus even old enemies will do business with Russia, if they know the value of money (and believe me they do). Money is the king- past enemies and alliances take a back seat. If Western countries see money making, or money saving opportunity in Russia (or China or India for that matter), that is where they will go. American space technology is very very expensive, and even Western nations cannot always afford it. Russia offers nearly the same quality (even higher in some instances), but for mere fractions of what it costs in US.

Originally posted by maloy and Russia is Capitalist all of the sudden.

Yep I agree with that> Capitalism won...

Now if Russia and China make a deal, they can use Capitalism to beat us at our own game. And our own big business will be right there with them.
After all when the president of China visited here a little while ago his first stop was Bill Gates house..THEN Bush

Finish Yucca mountain and keep where WE can keep an eye on it. Russia still has its political troubles. But its nearly impossible to store it here since everyone has NIMBY.

Nuke waste is extremely dangerous and I dont want anyone getting any of it, ours or someone elses.

If I'm not mistaken, Russias govt. has about as much control as Lebanons, leaving the entire country in the hands of the Russian mafia. Putin may not like the prospect of starting a war on America, but the mafia is already at war with free market states. The waste could be used by their mafia to make a dirty bomb to call attention to their cause, like osama did on 9/11.

You are mistaken. The government, the FSB, and the Feds are very much in control of Russia. The only mafia allowed to carry on their activities, are the ones that got covert approval from someone in politics. But if some organized Crime faction gets out of hand they are dealt with. There is an unspoken code of conduct between Russian politicians and mafiosos- mafia does not get into political matters (that includes aiding international terrorists), and politicians turn a blind eye.

And why in the name of all thats holy, will the Red Mafia declare war on free markets??? It exists because of free markets. It came into existance in the 90's, after the fall of communism. Russian mafia are capitalists to the max, and hate everything about communism and totalitarianism. They are not fighting for some idealogy like the Islamic Extremists. All they want to do is make money, and not be touched by the government. The last thing Russian organized crime wants to do, is start an international war, because then the Russian governments and FSB will terminate them. That is the rule for mafia- don't get between international politics.

Originally posted by maloy

There is an unspoken code of conduct between Russian politicians and mafiosos- mafia does not get into political matters (that includes aiding international terrorists), and politicians turn a blind eye.

I believe that the politicians turn a blind eye, but the part about the mafia not aiding international terrorists I don't believe it's true.

All they want to do is make money, and not be touched by the government.

Yes. International terrorists got lots of money in their pockets. And the mafia got the expertise on certain interesting areas, and they got stuff which terrorists like Al Qaeda and Hezbollah wants to buy. I don't believe the Russian government or the FSB can terminate the mafia even if they wanted to.

Originally posted by Hellmutt
Yes. International terrorists got lots of money in their pockets. And the mafia got the expertise on certain interesting areas, and they got stuff which terrorists like Al Qaeda and Hezbollah wants to buy. I don't believe the Russian government or the FSB can terminate the mafia even if they wanted to.

The thing is- Russian politicians do not care much about the mafia being rich. Money laundering, smuggling, etc. are typical businesses of the mafia, and thats alright with the Feds. Sometimes they bust large operations to make it seem like they are fighting crime, and sometimes they bust them because somebody up top (politician) have some beef with the mob. But the only way the mafia will risk dealing with international terrorists- is if they got approval from sources in power. The thing is large dealings with factions such as Al Quida, will attract the attention of Mossad or CIA, and then the FSB and the feds will also be forced to intervene. The mafia is not that hungry for money, that they will risk dealing with CIA or similar agencies. They are more interested in long term survival- and that means laying low and sticking to common activities.

The Russian mob is very much organized. It is controlled by a group of "thieves in law" (name carried on from the late 1800's)- very conservative and businesslike opportunists (they cant even be classified as criminals). These people do not want any attention of foreign spy agencies, and know better than dealing with world's 'most wanted' terrorists. The mobs that might sell WMD or something similar to the terrorists- are not the mafia but small independent and reckless factions. And then they would have the feds on their back, because they dont have ties with the top.

Russian mafia is not some ragtag faction. Just like a nation, they have foreign affairs to be concerned about, especially the WOT. And the last thing they want is beef with the US.

Certain mobs do seem to have ties with the top. Do you say that Mogilevich's Red Mafiya is not "the mafia" but just a "small independent and reckless faction"?

ZIONIST MAFIA,NUKES AND BIN LADEN

Feb 25 2005


And why haven't security troops stormed Mogilevich's fortified compound in Budapest - the capital of a NATO country? It seems that Hungary is a NATO country in name but not in reality. To be sure, there is something amiss in this picture. The post Cold War version of reality offered by the six o'clock news doesn't explain what we're seeing. The idea that a police state (Russia) run by a police statesman (Putin) cannot cope with gangsters who steal nuclear, biological and chemical materials is not credible. Vladimir Putin is perfectly comfortable using gangster methods against his political opponents, including "oligarchs" and journalists. Why can't he use these methods against criminals who steal WMDs from Russia's vast arsenal of mass destruction?

Is it possible that "thefts" of Russian WMD materials are somehow useful to Vladimir Putin? After all, the stolen weapons are smuggled by Russian gangsters and "former" intelligence operatives for use against Western countries. If you think about it, Russia's WMDs were built with Western countries in mind.

There is another set of questions we also need to ask ourselves. Why should a criminal syndicate - Russian or otherwise - be motivated to help Islamists? Are American gangsters stealing WMDs and buying arms plants, setting up compounds in neighboring countries and arming terrorists? The case of the Red Mafiya is not a case of mere organized crime. Here we have an army of Russian criminals with doctorates, with intelligence and military training, who are facilitating terrorism aimed at the West. Has there ever been a criminal formation like this before? Yet the West suspects nothing. The West takes everything at face value.

Yes it is true that a large part of the Red Mafia is composed of professionals, including ex soldiers, ex spetznaz, and even ex KGB. Islamic terrorists very much want a partnership with these 'veterans', but its not all that easy. Red mafia is not run by the Russian government- Russian Federation simply facilitates its continuing existance. But to Russia right now, relations (especially economic) with Western Europe and US are very vital. They are far more important than the ties some politicians have the the mafia. If the mafia stands between Russiana and US/NATO's foreign relations- you can bet Russia is going to react.

So if US wants to deal with these mafia factions throughout eastern Europe it can. As long as it is not in Russia itself, US is free to do it. In fact the Russian government will only be glad.

About the idealogy of Russian mafia- it is certainly anti-US, but in no way extreme like Islamizm. Their main concern is money. They approve of capitalism. For the most part they got no beef with the West. So far there is nothing concrete linking any of them to Al Quida. But with criminal organizations you have to expect partnerships naturally. IRA and Basque had ties to HAMAS and PLO and maybe Hezbolah. Al Quida certainly has ties to someone like that. Cartels have ties to certain separatist groups. Para military organization always look for allies when facing a much tougher opponent. But you can believe one thing- If US goes after Red mafia factions, their partnership with Al Quida will only increase, and then it would be a whole different matter.

Originally posted by maloy
It exists because of free markets. It came into existance in the 90's, after the fall of communism. Russian mafia are capitalists to the max, and hate everything about communism and totalitarianism.

If they're so procapitalism, then why did they wait until the fall of communism to start to exist?