New Policies for Political Bickering on ATS ## MAKE IT STOP! ##

Originally posted by pawnplayer
Take your hate-America rants somewhere else please.

The Symphony of Conspiracies and Why It's Important to be "Anti-American"


Let's be clear and understand the context of these discussions.

The speculation of conspiracy theories, review of known conspiracies, and research into the facts of potential conspiracies is an inherently anti-establishment activity. On a site as large and as popular as ATS, we will encounter a fair percentage of people who will see such activity as anti-American.

Nothing could be further from the truth.

Also, many of these people will immediately politicize conspiracy topics and assume the conspiracist subscribes to a political dogma that is opposed to the seated administration. And likewise, there will be others who immediately assume they may join in on conspiracy topics as a means to bash the sitting administration because it is of an opposing dogma to their own.

This is what we want to attempt to manage, the blame-game politicization of conspiracy and scandal topics.

If we can go a solid 7-days without applying a political warn, the ATS logo will return upright.

Originally posted by Springer

Originally posted by pawnplayer
his own anti-Bush/anti-American/anti-Marines thread and getting punished for being angry at him while he got away with his politically hijacked thread. I trust it won't happen again.

I'm just sick and tired of being dragged into an anti-American discussion by some members' virulent statements.

I'm actually glad that Skeptic Overlord made the right decision with this. No more hijacked threads on political grounds and IGNORANT BIAS by some members. This is a CONSPIRACY forum board. Take your hate-America rants somewhere else please.

Just to be CLEAR...

Anti-Bush, Anti-Clinton, Anti Republican and Anti-Democrat is

NOT ANTI-AMERICAN

That's a BIG part of the problem around here, we are Conspiracy Theorists or at least "buffs". EVERY administration, elected official and appointed Bureaucrat is FAIR GAME and the suspicion of their actions is one of the foundations of conspiracy. It's NOT Anti-American to criticize ANY administration. As S.O. and I have said several times, anyone who was active in this genre PRIOR to 9/11 knows we were ALL OVER Clinton's administration, it was RIFE with rich material and we dug deeply into it.

Okay, fair enough. But virulently attacking and bashing the Marines (or soldiers) or Americans in general is a stern no-no. See my signature: that's the real problem.

Originally posted by pawnplayer
his own anti-Bush/anti-American/anti-Marines thread and getting punished for being angry at him while he got away with his politically hijacked thread. I trust it won't happen again.

I'm just sick and tired of being dragged into an anti-American discussion by some members' virulent statements.

I'm actually glad that Skeptic Overlord made the right decision with this. No more hijacked threads on political grounds and IGNORANT BIAS by some members. This is a CONSPIRACY forum board. Take your hate-America rants somewhere else please.

Just to be CLEAR...

Anti-Bush, Anti-Clinton, Anti Republican and Anti-Democrat is



NOT ANTI-AMERICAN



When it's relevant to a CONSPIRACY! If you can't stand seeing your party accused or critcized then DON'T READ THAT THREAD. Wow there's a concept. If it's nothing but "bush is a nazi neocon" crap it's going away FAST to the trash bin.

BUT if it's "Bush and his administration conspiring with (whoever) to get more control over the world's oil supply (or whatever) and here's why I think so" It's a CONSPIRACY THEORY... AND IT WILL GET DISCUSSED.

That's a BIG part of the problem around here, we are Conspiracy Theorists or at least "buffs". EVERY administration, elected official and appointed Bureaucrat is FAIR GAME and the suspicion of their actions is one of the foundations of conspiracy. It's NOT Anti-American to criticize ANY administration. As S.O. and I have said several times, anyone who was active in this genre PRIOR to 9/11 knows we were ALL OVER Clinton's administration, it was RIFE with rich material and we dug deeply into it.

For crying out loud, WHO but those with the POWER would we concern ourselves with?!

WHY would I care if the clerk at the convenient store was conspiring with the bloody milkman to skin an extra fifty cents on a quart of chocolate?!

Sheesh!

[/blunt rant]

Springer...

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
This is what we want to attempt to manage, the blame-game politicization of conspiracy and scandal topics.

If we can go a solid 7-days without applying a political warn, the ATS logo will return upright.

I kinda doubt it. Why? North Korea and how the US/the world is responding to this crisis. Kim Jong Il wanted to launch more missiles this Saturday in honor of his father's death, which to bring to my conclusion: blame-game polarization is currently all over the Internet and will certainly affect members coming here and post their comments. I guess it's bad timing, eh?

Originally posted by pawnplayer

I kinda doubt it. Why? North Korea and how the US/the world is responding to this crisis. Kim Jong Il wanted to launch more missiles this Saturday in honor of his father's death, which to bring to my conclusion: blame-game polarization is currently all over the Internet and will certainly affect members coming here and post their comments. I guess it's bad timing, eh?

and they will get there 2 day PTS only ban if they do. I have faith the mods supermods and owners will enforce this. That I can finally not have to worry about having an aneurysm when I open a thread, because had been discussing objectively then some random person came on and decided to derail the topic by posting how stupid I am for being a liberal (for toying with the possibility bush did something wrong) even though I am a libertarian.

little rant there but w/e

Originally posted by pawnplayer
I kinda doubt it. Why? North Korea and how the US/the world is responding to this crisis. Kim Jong Il wanted to launch more missiles this Saturday in honor of his father's death, which to bring to my conclusion: blame-game polarization is currently all over the Internet and will certainly affect members coming here and post their comments. I guess it's bad timing, eh?

Again I fail to see why political parties come into play. No matter how the US responds, it will be the US responding ... not the Republican or Democratic party. And in threads discussing the topic there should be no "well a right wing does this and a left wing does this". We have all sort of economic, social, etc. problems with other parts of the world and yet we bicker over these two shades of gray. If you say everthing is REALLY red and blue you really ARE furthering ignorance anyways.

EDIT: remove nested quote

[edit on 5-7-2006 by Fiverz]

Originally posted by Fiverz

Originally posted by pawnplayer
I kinda doubt it. Why? North Korea and how the US/the world is responding to this crisis. Kim Jong Il wanted to launch more missiles this Saturday in honor of his father's death, which to bring to my conclusion: blame-game polarization is currently all over the Internet and will certainly affect members coming here and post their comments. I guess it's bad timing, eh?

Again I fail to see why political parties come into play. No matter how the US responds, it will be the US responding ... not the Republican or Democratic party. And in threads discussing the topic there should be no "well a right wing does this and a left wing does this". We have all sort of economic, social, etc. problems with other parts of the world and yet we bicker over these two shades of gray. If you say everthing is REALLY red and blue you really ARE furthering ignorance anyways.

EDIT: remove nested quote

[edit on 5-7-2006 by Fiverz]

You misunderstood me. I did not suggest any political party. Just people in general, reading the current news and being affected by such crisis or whatever major, getting themselves so worked up over it, they post their thoughts in various forum boards or BBS, including the ATS. I still remembered the days before the 9/11 attacks and how the major political discussions were being exchanged over irreverent issues. After that, the whole political/conspiracy discussion equation was fundamentally transformed and the blame-game polarization was really taking off.

[edit on 7/5/2006 by pawnplayer]

What i always find mindblowing is the latest cliche- One that makes me sick because there is no need for it. And that is when those opposed to those not happy with the current administration calls us "ANTI-AMERICAN

This to me, is the single most insult dished out here every day, day and night. This little phrase should be abolished from ATS. It may work for Limbaugh, but its old and tired and very offensive.

To let you know how offended i get, i tell you what. I would rather be called an idiot- than Anti-American.

We should concentrate on this very offensive statement. Its idiotic, irrational, and most of all, not true.

Originally posted by dgtempe
What i always find mindblowing is the latest cliche- One that makes me sick because there is no need for it. And that is when those opposed to those not happy with the current administration calls us "ANTI-AMERICAN

This to me, is the single most insult dished out here every day, day and night. This little phrase should be abolished from ATS. It may work for Limbaugh, but its old and tired and very offensive.

To let you know how offended i get, i tell you what. I would rather be called an idiot- than Anti-American.

We should concentrate on this very offensive statement. Its idiotic, irrational, and most of all, not true.

Its Not anti american, its anti government.

www.abovetopsecret.com...
Like I said, it is most important you are a threat to the government. That is your duty, to be a threat to the government. This is for the best of the country. I think it is relevent to post that link here because anti government is the correct term for those of us wishing to preverse freedom and our rights.

I agree though, anti american is very insulting for me as well.

I am glad there will be no more arguments and trolling. Discussions should be kept civil.

A very important and timely reminder--especially with midterm elections coming up.

I would like civility to return to discussions again. But I have a question to ask.

But what is the criteria for someone having an agenda and someone who doesn't have one? Could someone spell this out so the terminology will be very clear?

The accusation of "having an agenda" happens all the time around here in the midst of political discussions even though that might not be the case. I think that there ought to be some clear guidelines about that.

Thanks very much for your time.

Take care,

Ceci

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
In addition, nearly all of our staff is currently convinced there are a few "paid political posters" among us who are actively seeking to disrupt valid topics in an effort to benefit a political agenda.

***packs up gear and leaves***

They're on to me

I like this new policy, simple and effective.

I trust the MODS will use their best judgement when putting a temp ATS ban on a member.....because sometimes politics plays a role in a bigger scheme (ie: Oil, WOT, etc...) and a member may have to make post directed at a certain poliical party (not at the member).

Keep it up
Sporty

Apolitical Agenda

Originally posted by ceci2006
But what is the criteria for someone having an agenda and someone who doesn't have one? Could someone spell this out so the terminology will be very clear?

There's nothing wrong with having an agenda.

Most members have some sort of agenda. That's not necessarily a bad thing.

The key in this case is actually what most members already do anyway: stay on topic.

The problem the measures outlined in this thread are intended to address is the phenomenon of a small percentage of members habitually driving discussions off-topic by injecting political rhetoric where it doesn't belong.

Examples:

Topic: Bush knew about 9/11 before it happened

Troll says: "You liberals blame Bush for everything."

Topic: Martian pyramids

Troll says: "Halliburton!"

Topic: The meaning of John 3:16

Troll says: "Forget about Jesus, why don't you just worship Bush."

Just to name a few.

Team ATS

Of course, it's often more subtle than this, which is why ATS maintains a first-rate team of highly-skilled, enthusiastic and extraordinarily attractive moderators to deal with problems like these.

We are specially trained to identify off-topic digressions and steer threads back where they belong.

As with any modern field of combat, though we take great pride in our marksmanship, friendly fire casualties are possible if members don't take care to avoid resembling enemies.

Thus when a moderator makes a request to stay on topic, it's important to recognize and respect the importance of doing so, even if you just wanted to get that one last zinger in.

We are sensitive to the needs of members to be able to speak candidly and discuss topics with minimal encumbrance, but when a moderator request is ignored or met by derisive comments, we are clear to go "weapons hot" and bring an otherwise renegade thread back into T&C compliance -- and ship would-be ATS terrorists off to Gitmo or rendition to countries legendary for their methods of torture.

All this is generally transparent to most members -- or at least as much as we can make it -- to reduce disruption of the topics members come here to discuss.

But the objective in all cases is the same: to help make ATS the kind of community the members want it to be.

It's not just staff who do this, but all members who care about ATS.

We are all a team, and Denying Ignorance is the goal.





Of course, I'm being somewhat tongue-in-cheek, and we don't ship (most) troublesome members off to Gitmo, but I hope the point is clear: it doesn't have to be hard, doesn't have to be dramatic and doesn't have to be a fight. We can do this.

That's fair what you said, Majic. And I thank you for the clear explanation. I will use it as a guideline when I make future posts.


Take care,

Ceci


[edit on 6-7-2006 by ceci2006]

Originally posted by dgtempe
What i always find mindblowing is the latest cliche- One that makes me sick because there is no need for it. And that is when those opposed to those not happy with the current administration calls us "ANTI-AMERICAN

I agree, dg. But by the same token, I'm tired of the proclamation that anti-Bush, anti-Republican, anti-administration somehow equates to THE ONLY TRUE PATRIOTS.

I hope both are enforced equally.

Man, you don't know how over dew this is! I'm so sick of politics for it's own sake that I avoid it when I can. I personally don't use PTS for that reason. Finally, we are getting ATS back from the political trolls! Thank You! Thank You!

Tim

Hey SkepticOverlord

Seems reasonable to me. Most all of us, including me, have pushed the limits with Political ranting and in-field fighting. Hopefully your thoughts and sounded rules will slow it all down to the acceptable here at ATS.

Dallas

Hooray! No more mud-slinging at the Australian Liberal party, or Labour party bashing by those who...oh...ahhh...hmmmm. Guess Australians just don't afford our collective political parties with the combined intelligence or competency to run a conspiracy!

I think the burden lies on those who post. If you take a little care in your posts, read through, and (heaven forbid!) put yourself in the alternate camp for a moment and how they may view your post, and if you still think the post doesn't breach the T&C, then post it. I actually find putting myself in the opposing viewpoint's shoes improves my writing, because it forces me to be clearer, more specific, and above all considerate in my posting. And at the end of the day, like Steve Waugh being given out LBW by the umpire for 99 at the SCG (cricket reference for the 87% of you who are wondering), the umpires decision, even if incorrect on occasions, is final. If you don't like it, then cricket might not be for you...

Originally posted by pawnplayer
The problem with political baiting here is that half of the members are devoted to Bush-bashing diatribes, a quarter of them being defensive of Bush, another quarter getting caught in the middle and the remaining quarter not care a whit of political debates.

Where do you stand on?

I stand confused, I knew ATS was good but we have 125% membership? Thats outstanding!

Originally posted by jsobecky

Originally posted by dgtempe
What i always find mindblowing is the latest cliche- One that makes me sick because there is no need for it. And that is when those opposed to those not happy with the current administration calls us "ANTI-AMERICAN

I agree, dg. But by the same token, I'm tired of the proclamation that anti-Bush, anti-Republican, anti-administration somehow equates to THE ONLY TRUE PATRIOTS.

I hope both are enforced equally.

Respectfully agreed. Lets face it, we all have one thing in common. We love our country.

Can we all agree on that one???