Any 9\11 conspiracy debunk topics should be closed and the author banned

Originally posted by warthog911
Any 9\11 conspiracy debunk topics should be closed and the author banned

1. Not gonna happen.

2. Rational debate regarding conspiracy theories (note, I said rational) is what makes ATS great and separates it from some other forums which shall remain unnamed. It is the opposition to and dissection of a theory which encourages further research and refinement or even dismissal of that theory, which demands intellectual honesty, and which allows us to separate the wheat from the chaff from the crow-poop, instead of swallowing the whole crop without so much as a belch. If ATS instituted what you are suggesting, holographic planes and mini-nukes would be the reigning hypotheses of the day, and ATS would no longer be...ATS.

3. See 1.






[edit on 2006-6-30 by wecomeinpeace]

Deny free speech?

The reason this site is so unique is because we allow people to start threads on pretty much anything they desire, as long as its not being blatently offensive/rude. 'Debunking threads' actually help collect evidence because we often stumble across new information when people begin to argue with real intent! Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I can see some people can be quite persistent in their debunking efforts, and often display arrogance and ignorance because they're so set in their beliefs, but we shouldn't simply throw these members in to the trash can! Show them hard evidence and beat them at their own game

Get real Get a life..

YOU KNOW???

You know jack..

You may think you know, but that don't make it fact, and by no means does that mean that no one can post against your theory or debunk it.. Besides if your right then it can't be debunked... Guess what I have a classmate that was at arlington cemetary and saw the plane crash into the pentagon...

Who are you to censor anyone?

Whatever happened to the theory that planes were hijacked by Islamofacists that flew them into the WTC and Pentagon? Do we not have videotape of them getting on the planes, phone calles from the cell phones of passengers?? Why does there always have to be a conspiracy theory?? Believe it or not, there are terrorists in this world who's sole mission is to kill us, even if it means taking their own lives and the lives of innocents in the process..

Oh, it's raining out, must be either Bush's fault or it's a conspiracy.....

Originally posted by sendillegalshome
Whatever happened to the theory that planes were hijacked by Islamofacists that flew them into the WTC and Pentagon? Do we not have videotape of them getting on the planes, phone calles from the cell phones of passengers?? Why does there always have to be a conspiracy theory?? Believe it or not, there are terrorists in this world who's sole mission is to kill us, even if it means taking their own lives and the lives of innocents in the process..

Oh, it's raining out, must be either Bush's fault or it's a conspiracy.....

Lmao

no no no

rain isn't bush's fault its that damn polluting sun and its nuclear waste THATS Bush's fault... Why can't it just stop shining and giving me cancer every day... 8 )

I think we should ban people who post outrageously silly conspiricies that involve galatic federations, hyperdimensional lizards, bases on Jupiter and the dulce files - and that read like 5th rate airport sci-fi.

I wonder who I could be talking about......?


EDIT: to say I have just looked at my new avatar properly. Check out his right hand, it's pretty weird - I think he may be a reptoid vicar! This is all Bush's fault.....

[edit on 30/6/06 by FatherLukeDuke]

well,
considering that much of the 9-11 conspiracy stuff is disinfo, to discredit the rest...
I think an even handed research angle is called for, rather than just object out of hand, all the evidence that is presented on both sides...

such as...
a ufo had nothing to do with 9-11 (instead of beleive the "conspiracy")
pentagon plane is still up in the air, much of the "evidence presented to show it was a missle, is disinfo... and shows it under light scrutiny...
but that doesn't mean that a big commercial jet hit the pentagon...
so what did? We have to be open to both sides of the debate, to analyze the true data...

What we do know is that there are several layers of "gray areas" surround 9/11, just like there are any conspiracy throughout history.

Originally posted by warthog911
What i mean is that even after 4 years we still see members say that the islamic terrorists did it.

There is an exceptionally high probability that Islamic terrorists are indeed very much involved in the events of 9/11. However, believing this does not automatically exclude you from conspiracy speculation. Any real student of conspiracy theory from before 9/11 understands that nearly all of history's conspiracies involve 3rd parties doing the dirty work. Why would the play book change for 9/11?

Watch alex jones martial law 911:road to police state.

You need to realize that Mr. Jones is deep in the category of "conspiracy profiteer", creating a sensationalized story line for the purpose of selling materials. Much of his material is indeed based on traditional and well-accepted theories, but his approach leans too far into the realm of alarmist sensationalism.

It foolishes to even make these zombies wake up.

That kind of rhetoric is typical of the shouting and yelling of Mr. Jones, and will do nothing to help people understand the deeper issues at play.

They have been brainqwahed by media soo much that they belive in anything the media say.

Because, "the media" comes across with better credibility than "conspiracy theorists". How many conspiracy theory websites have an overall presentation that competes in the credibility department with even a small local newspaper's website?

If we can work hard at creating credible theories that are well-written with a calm and authoritative tone, then present them in a manner that portrays credibility, then we have a chance of getting our "alternative message" to a level of higher awareness.


Part of portraying ourselves with improved credibility is to refrain from insulting and degrading remarks toward people who have not yet gained the degree of critical thought we have.

ATS members should strive to lead the way by example. We should be helpful and understanding to people that have been hoodwinked by mass media. We must speak with calm confidence, not shout with enraged paranoia.

So with all that in mind, our goal should be to embrace the debunkers with compassion and patient understanding. Let them speak their mind. Listen to their concerns. Hear their confusion. Then, calmly show them what we've learned... the art of denying ignorance.

Originally posted by Christophera

Originally posted by LeftBehind
Pity me all you want, pal. But just because you believe everything written by Mr. Jones, doens't mean the rest of us have to.

How about we ban everyone who insists that their opinion is the only possible answer, and that any one who disagrees with them is brainwashed.

If they can produce reason and evidence their position has ascended past opinion.

I can produce evidence and reasonable substantiation for brainwahing, can you do that against it?

Originally posted by eaglewingz
When can we expect to see this evidence? I would really like to know how I've been brainwashed by reading ATS.

Your position is not clearly stated. At this point you are supposed to be producing evidence against brainwashing if you are reasonable.

I feel this thread will do serpo.Mods plz lock it.

well said SO

warthog, please read everyones replys on this thread and consider our point of view about this subject

hopefully you will change your mind

its understandable your upset and frustrated about things, but dont let it get to you man

so, what do u say warthog? changed your mind yet?


edit - just saw warthogs request to lock the thread
i would request it not be locked, so that everyone can see that ATS tolerates all points of view, even warthogs ... lol

but do whatever u think is best mods, just making a suggestion here

[edit on 30-6-2006 by muzzleflash]

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
Because, "the media" comes across with better credibility than "conspiracy theorists". How many conspiracy theory websites have an overall presentation that competes in the credibility department with even a small local newspaper's website?

Here is a web site that puts all the conspiracy web sites to shame and it does not even get into demolition. It just corrects all the other sites, conspiracy, newspaper origin or not, regarding the design and construction of the WTC towers. It does it with completely unbiased information of raw photographs and impartial engineering reports etc. from history and elsewhere.

concretecore.741.com...

[edit on 30-6-2006 by Christophera]

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Watch alex jones martial law 911:road to police state.

You need to realize that Mr. Jones is deep in the category of "conspiracy profiteer", creating a sensationalized story line for the purpose of selling materials. Much of his material is indeed based on traditional and well-accepted theories, but his approach leans too far into the realm of alarmist sensationalism.

You can't really call Alex Jones a sensational alarmist, then turn around and defend the mainstream media in the same post. The mainstream media puts out more fear, and alarmist sensationalism, than Alex Jones ever could. I do know what you mean about Jones, though, he can be a bit too over the top, sometimes, but he certainly isn't always that way.

I'd also just like to point out that there are no copywrite restrictions on any of Alex Jones' films, and all of them are available to view for free on Google video, with the full permission of the man himself. You are also permitted to copy the films and distribute them for free. Alex Jones is obviously making some money, and his family are probably eating and sleeping off this, but come on, let's be fair here, and not one sided.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

It foolishes to even make these zombies wake up.

That kind of rhetoric is typical of the shouting and yelling of Mr. Jones, and will do nothing to help people understand the deeper issues at play.

No Sir, no Sir it is not. He might fly off the handle and call George Bush a 'limp wristed fairy,' or shout abuse at people sometimes, but he would never say it is 'foolishes to even make these zombies wake up,' that's quite against his message. Jones does a great deal to help people understand the deeper issues at play, that's why he has speakers like Dr. Fetzer (A guest speaker even you here at ATS have scheduled) on his show, multiple times. There are a wealth of experts who frequent the phone lines on the Alex Jones show, again, let's be fair here.

Originally posted by warthog911
This website's motto is deny ignoranace and making topics which debunk 9\11 attacks are just plain desperation

I am stunned that a person who's been on this site for a while could out and out call for complete censorship of an idea merely because they disagree with it, AND cite the DENY IGNORANCE directive to justify it.

Night of the Long Nights, springs to mind ......

Still, whilst we're on the subject, can we also get rid of anyone who belives in Atlantis, Earth Crust Displacement, Chemtrails, Weather Manipulation, or that Aliens built the Pyramids?

Mind you, it would make the place a whole lot less interesting ......

Fact is, if you want to strengthen a theory you need someone to poke about at it and wheedle out the inconsistencies and flaws. Sometimes that means the theory falls. Well, then so be it. We are, after all, all in search of the truth.

Of you're afraid someone may succeed in debunking your theory then clearly you need more evidence yourself. And if not, then what's the probem with someone trying (and failing)? Surely it only makes your theory look the stronger and more persuasive?

Originally posted by warthog911
This newbies think that they know everyting.

Son we did months and months of research and most if not all of the senior members like me know what really happened on 9\11.

lol, he's only been here a year and is calling people newbies.

I propose to ban all members/threads as they are nothing but dis info agents.This website's motto is deny ignoranace and making topics which debunk 9\11 attacks are just plain desperation by these neo cons cuz they know that thier NWO will fail.

It's absolutely hillarious. People always claim that whoever doesn't believe the official story is a Bush lover or neo con.
lol, is it possible to get more ridiculous than that? What does politics have to do with anything? What about the tons of us who don't like Bush but have yet to see a reason to believe any of the unofficial stories (or whatever you want to call them) as there are more full of holes and/or easier to debunk than the official story.

Originally posted by warthog911
This newbies think that they know everyting.This website has been attacked soo many times by forumites who think and will make you forcibly think that 9\11 was not an inside job.Threads like"screw loose change",9\11 consipracy is nonsense" makes me puke.Son we did months and months of research and most if not all of the senior members like me know what really happened on 9\11.I propose to ban all members/threads as they are nothing but dis info agents.This website's motto is deny ignoranace and making topics which debunk 9\11 attacks are just plain desperation by these neo cons cuz they know that thier NWO will fail.

The dragon will be slayed

[edit on 29-6-2006 by warthog911]

[edit on 30-6-2006 by warthog911]

How balanced! How senior member! Throw the 'freedom of speech' rights the heck out for everyone but those "know what really happened on 9\11"!

Yeah!

Alone, talking to yourself...

I don't know about you, but I usually learn a whole lot more when I engage others in conversation. Especially people who have a differing perspective.

I won't comment on the Alex Jones reference, my partner, SkepticOverlord, has explained it well enough.

Many have correctly identified the ATS concept on this thread. Ours is a venue of collaborative research, debate and civil discussion of all sides of an issue. To silence one side or the other because it ruffles feathers is the height of embracing ignorance rather than denying it.

One Member named a few sites that joyfully participate in that activity, go have a look and see the chaos, meaningless drek that passes for posts, and take in the pure noise of the places. There is little if anything to gained from such a mess other than a shallow boost the D-Ego.

Anyone who has been interested in conspiracy theory prior to 9/11 knows there is always several layers to the onion. The covert operations of any competent government or terrorist group employs several parties in an effort to deflect direct connection to themselves should the cat get out of the bag. To deny the possibility that "Extremist Muslims" were involved and hi-jacked the airliners is to deny the historical record of similar operations planned in the past.

There are no absolutes, there are very few, if any coincidences, when the Governments and their contractors expect us to believe in several quirky coincidences it's time to start thinking critically. Thinking critically requires looking at all possibilities including the possibilities that disagree with what we think we know.


Springer...

I turn on the TV last nite and all that seems to be on TV is shows about terrorists attacking places in the states. Totally pethetic im sickened by all lies and fear spewing from media and tv its SICK so let me show you some truth behind it all and you leave me with your opinion. ok.. thanks

lets start of with the facts of the media Al Quiada they claim is a terrorist cell network
Al Quaida" is not really a terrorist group but a database of international mujaheddin and arms smugglers used by the CIA and Saudis to funnel guerrillas, arms, and money into Soviet-occupied Afghanistan.
[url]http://www.bilderberg.org/hell.htm#base[\url]


Now for starters bin ladins family is one of the USA biggest money backers in the world Well Saudi Arabia is I should say but the ladins are a mojor part of it why do you think all ladin were flown out of teh country sept 12 123 family members were the only people allowed to fly in the world at that time what priveledge. Then all of a sudden They state in the media and papers IRAQ has WMD and will use them against america. Well i was under the impression that in 1995 when the un inspected iraq one of saddam's sons was there and showed them all the facilties and all the weapons that were disposed of plus antrax and chem qeapons dont have long shelf life and they deplete in time so it was a big false staement saying they had WMD and they still havent found any... sickens me


then all of a sudden they say that al quaida operatives hijacked planes well funny thing is the head of the Pakistan ISI Authorized a $100 000 wire transfer to Mohammed Atta the same day the planes hit the world trader center bank account just incase you don't know Mohammed Atta is hes the Alleged Ring leader of the 911 hijackings watch the buddy.swf in your web broswer to see more about this info.

Also in britain im not sure if anyone has any idea of the magnitude of lies behind the 7/7 bombing of there subway system but if you want to learn more watch this video [url]http://www.officialconfusion.com/Videos/77release6.wmv[\url]

the whole problem behind all the terrorist # is that it is all made up by the people who want to control you and if you would take the time to inform yourself of all the lil misinformed information that gets spewed by the media which by the way is run by Elite people (just do some research on FOX news and see who runs it that is another lil misinformed things people tend to not see things like this [url]http://www.moveon.org/foxad-QT.html[\url] ) in high places which mean in lamens terms can munipulate any scenerio they want and the population of TV viewers that are so mind numbed believe anything that they are told at least thats the way it seems to me what is your opinion ?
my opinion is that all this is is one big orchastrated development to control and dwindle down the masses of people.

and now i hear that britain and the USA is turning into a police state due to the fact the they traumatized brainwashe dthe mass population with terror and fear do you see this or are u ignorant to it all and treat it like a conspiracy ?

Saudi Arabia and there relationship with the U.S.A
[url]http://meria.idc.ac.il/journal/2002/issue3/jv6n3a7.html[\url] here is the history
The U.S.-Saudi relationship is one of America�s most important, enduring, and complex bilateral connections in the Middle East.

P.S ?Have you heard of The Bilderberger Group ??? [url]http://www.bilderberg.org/2005.htm#final[\url]

I agree people can't be banned for anti-truth 9/11 statements or threads... everyone, even stupid people, have freedom of speech. Noone has a right in America to limit free speech. However, I think 911 truth posters on the threads should choose to simply not respond to bogus 911 threads- that's the only way bogus 911 threads can die.