Europe Threatens no Visa for Americans

Originally posted by pepsi78
congrats flyersfan

you have turned this thread in your personal wish, what should of been a simple discusion about visas turned in your strong desire of suporting the US administration on everything.

Oh pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeease!
Glass houses.

YOU sat here moaning and groaning and YOU asked why idiot radical
Muslims would attack us on 9/11.

I didn't turn this into anything. And answering YOUR question
with a quote from the koran showing why the whacks attacked
is in no way showing a 'strong desire' to support the 'US administration
on everything'.

You are dreaming.

YOU sat here moaning and groaning and YOU asked why idiot radical
Muslims would attackus on 9/11.

you mean this ones?
www.vpc.org...

WASHINGTON, DC— The U.S. gun industry sold at least twenty-five 50 caliber sniper rifles to Al Qaeda, Osama bin Laden's terror network, a study released by the Violence Policy Center (VPC) today reports. The study, Voting From the Rooftops, details the tremendous power of the Barrett M82A1 50 caliber sniper rifles

I didn't turn this into anything. And answering YOUR question
with a quote from the koran showing why the whacks attacked
is in no way showing a 'strong desire' to support the 'US administration
on everything'.

The real nuts are in palestina and those are not alqaida,their the real thing fatah and other radical and loony organisations.
Alquaida is just a tv show put on by people with intrest.



[edit on 23-6-2006 by pepsi78]

Originally posted by XyZeR
You can't actualy be serious right

It's a fact. Deal with it.
Radical Islamists attacked America. They attacked because it's
part of what they have decided Allah and their Koran tell them to.

you're just a troll

Back at you junior.

you've earned a spot on my ignore list

So what? Like I care?

it's now very clear that it's impossible to have a decent discussion with you

Because I gave a quote from the Koran answering the question as to why
radical Islamists attacked America? Lemme' guess ... decent discussion
only means talking with someone who agrees with you, eh?

I bet you actualy think you're quoting the Koran..

I did. Go look it up.

That's some load off bull# that you CHOOSE to believe.

Nope. It's the truth. Radical Islamists believe it.
Educate yourself sometime.

Flyersfan, how much muslims do you know personally ?
I'll answer that question : NONE.

Wrong again. I know quite a few. The ones I don't know are the
RADICAL Islamists that we are discussing. YOU are lumping all
islamists together .. not me.

you choose to turn it into a Muslim hate-spewing fest 2006,

Grow up. I was asked why radical Islamists attacked America.
I gave the reason, which took up about three sentences and was
about RADICALS - that isn't a 'muslim hate-spewing fest'.
You have serious problems with reality. Go see a doctor. Fast.

you clearly demontrate that you suffer from massive Islamophobia.

Not even close. One Koran quote explaining why RADICALS attack
and you call that 'massive' and 'islamophobia'. Get a grip.
YOU are the one suffering from massive problems... either that or
school is out for the summer and you are just a bored teenager
who really ought to have a summer job to keep yourself out of
grownup discussions.

Originally posted by pepsi78
The real nuts are in palestina ...

True. They are whacked as well.

Alquaida is just a tv show put on by people with intrest.

I don't think the families of those killed on 9/11 would agree with you.
I'm sure they know that Al-qaeda is very real.

I'm sure they know that Al-qaeda is very real.

Yes it's real, made by the CIA

Originally posted by pepsi78

I'm sure they know that Al-qaeda is very real.

Yes it's real, made by the CIA

If you mean that they made it up and it doesn't exist - I disagree.
If you mean that they made it up as in that they helped create it -
sure. We trained UBL and a bunch back in the 80's to fight the
Soviets when they invaded Afghanistan. That's a clear fact.

It started out as a freedom fighting group in the 80s and morphed
into a radical islamic group in the 90s and in the 00's.

But at it's formation - yes - the CIA absolutely was there at the
very beginning 25 years ago.

[edit on 6/23/2006 by FlyersFan]

If you mean that they made it up and it doesn't exist - I disagree.
If you mean that they made it up as in that they helped create it -
sure. We trained UBL and a bunch back in the 80's to fight the
Soviets when they invaded Afghanistan. That's a clear fact.

It started out as a freedom fighting group in the 80s and morphed
into a radical islamic group in the 90s and in the 00's.

But at it's formation - yes - the CIA absolutely was there at the
very beginning 25 years ago.

They exist but not in the way you understand it to be.
The CIA and the US weapons industry suplied them with weapons till 1998.
Binladen was in direct talks with the CIA.
Binladen is a CIA asset.
something that you do not accept, hey you know, the official explenation of everything of 911, and the passed involvement with binladen stinks.
Not to mention that the present president of afganistan is a former unical employ.
I'm sorry to ask but who has a radical view? who looks strait and passes facts that are simply there?
I can bring you up countrys that has comunist status or countrys which has war lords and that are suported by the curent president of united states, why? because of intrest.

China comunist nation which commit crimes against it's people is curently suported by US administration.

Somalia war lords that starve the local population, confiscating UN suplies of food and making the rules by the gun while poor somalians die of hunger, the US administration is suporting them with founds.

Countrys like pakistan saudy arabia which have a radical view on how it's people should act , and how woman should act, total radical inviorment, if you are gay there you will go to jail at least for 5 years, just for beying gay, if your a woman and show up with out your vall on your head you can kiss liberty goodbye, also united states administration is suporting the curent saudy arabian dictators.

Where is the justice?????
Where is all that??

Since September 11, CIA officials have been claiming they had no direct link to bin Laden. These denials lack credibility. Earlier this year, the trial of defendants accused of the 1998 U.S. embassy bombing in Kenya disclosed that the CIA shipped high-powered sniper rifles directly to bin Laden's operation in 1989. Even the Tennessee-based manufacturer of the rifles confirmed this. According to the Boston Globe,

www.vpc.org...

U.S. Gun Industry Armed Osama bin Laden's Terror Network: Al Qaeda Bought 25 Barrett 50 Caliber Sniper Rifles

"Super Guns" Can Down Helicopters, Defeat Armored Limousines, Destroy Aircraft at Terminals, Ignite Fuel Tanks, All From 1,800 yards

Violence Policy Center Report Documents Sale, Details Terror Potential

WASHINGTON, DC— The U.S. gun industry sold at least twenty-five 50 caliber sniper rifles to Al Qaeda, Osama bin Laden's terror network, a study released by the Violence Policy Center (VPC) today reports. The study, Voting From the Rooftops, details the tremendous power of the Barrett M82A1 50 caliber sniper rifles— which U.S. Marines used in the Gulf War to knock out Iraqi armored vehicles from 1,750 yards away—and the gun's potential use to commit terror acts that could cause enormous casualties. The Barrett sniper rifle has spawned a bourgeoning market for these types of weapons that are becoming cheaper, lighter and more widely available. There are known to be at least fifteen 50 caliber sniper rifle manufacturers—nearly double the number of companies that were manufacturing and marketing 50 calibers to civilians in1999.

"We can be shocked, but not surprised that the gun industry would sell these dangerous military weapons to Al Qaeda," said the study's author, Tom Diaz, VPC's senior policy analyst. "These 50 caliber sniper rifles are ideal tools for terror and assassination."

SOme people just dont like facts/


[edit on 23-6-2006 by pepsi78]

If you look under the sole's of all the terrorist's shoes, you'll find a sticker that says "Made in the USA".

Oh the irony, we help them just for them to come back at us.

Shattered OUT...

Originally posted by kipman725
This is mearly a retalitory step against the ever greater amount of personal information the US govenment is requiring when traveling to the US. I live in Europe and I don't hate Americans... people make so many broad genralisations just becuse the policys of the US govenment are so despised.

Are the policies despised or is it the media owners that pump the populace to despise them? After all 89% of the major MSM in the US is foreign owned.. many of which are Europeans? Is some game being played here for world domination with the Euro crowd pretending to be the good guys while demonizing the US? You got to wonder.

Originally posted by denythestatusquo
Is some game being played here for world domination with the Euro crowd pretending to be the good guys while demonizing the US? You got to wonder.

We are not the ones declaring war right and left champ.

Originally posted by seattlelaw

Originally posted by jbondo
When weaker countries have their backs against the wall or they need aid, who do they call?

For example?

Who has to police the world and keep nuts from developing WMD's which they would use at the drop of a hat?

Like North Korea? Like Israel? The US is the only country to have ever used nukes against another people.

If America minded its own business and didn't stick its nose into other countries affairs you can bet most of the world would be in udder chaos. You think it's not safe now? Imagine if America just let the leaders of some of these countries do whatever they wanted!

You mean "utter" chaos unless you're referring to dairy cows rising up. Most of the chaos is blowback from our failed foreign interventions. See, e.g., the Shah of Iran and the militant religious backlash group that followed him headed by the Ayatollah; also see Augusto Pinochet, our puppet dictator who murdered many thousands; also see Argentina, which went belly up thanks to the dictates of the World Bank and economic "reform" which destituted that nation; reference also Salvador Allende, Chile's democratically elected president who was assasinated at our CIA's behest and a repressive dictator installed.

There are many, many examples of our failed foreign policies. Most of those policies are driven not by what weapons which madman possesses, but by whether the leaders of those nations cow-tow to our economic interests which mean allowing foreign corps to rape them of their resource and capital wealth in exchange for loans with exhorbitant interest rates which drive their economies into the toilet.

Nobody is perfect including America but thanks to The USA and GB and a small handful of others, at least aggressors are controlled, many GNP's are kept afloat and lots of starving people are being fed.

It is what they would have you believe.

Our government makes lots of mistakes and I am not a fan of anyone that taxes the crap out of me but I am proud to be an American.

That is sad to me. It shouldn't be about what nation you happened to be birthed in IMO. It should be about the greater good. America has forsaken that idealogy for one which exalts only money, power and control. It will be our undoing.

I'm short on time here so I'll make this quick.

The American military used nukes some 60 odd years ago which has nothing to do with today. However, that is just an example of what I was referring to and I think you knew that.

If you had given more attention to my spelling you would realize that when I use the word "udder" it's for effect. Of course you had to attack me below the belt somewhere didn't you? I could pick and choose successful foreign policy but my examples would most likely be from the "what they would have me believe" pile. By the way, I do not believe everything my government tells me. If that is the "they" to which you refer.

You can spin it all you want but being proud of the country (I didn’t say government) you were born in and are a citizen of does not mean you are against the greater good of the world.

Why no comment about my last para? Did I start to look a bit liberal there?

Now I am out of time and have to go but I can tell you one thing.

You are free to go at any time.

I am new to this web site and I haven't even introduced myself yet but I had to reply to this thread. I understand how non-Americans may feel about our gov't but I am tired of people saying hateful things about Americans under the guise of "We don't hate the people we hate the administration." Folks we elected the administration! That argument makes no sense to me. Frankly it was slim pickins!

Our country is in a period of reaction to the events of 9/11. Hey the Spanish were so freaked out that they elected a communist! The French have no reason to say a word, they elected Chirac. The Russians are ruled by ex-KGB. Let's face it, the one thing we have in common is that across the board the best guy/gal for the job doesn't even run for the job and we are all stuck with what we perceive to be the least offensive choice.

As far as the visas go? Let's all require visas! Why not know who is crossing your borders? I'd like to see hundreds of border agents at our northern and southern borders, at our airports and harbors, checking databases to see who's who. Maybe finally we'd get a handle on immigration and make it easier for those who deserve and impossible for those who don't.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
[...] They
think it's their Allah-given duty to kill us all. It's stupid and ignorant,
but it's what they (the radicals) believe.

Bold emphasis added to get to the point.


Off topic here, but I thought I'd just make it known that it's not necessary to make a distinction between the terms, "Allah," "God," "Lord," or whatever it is you prefer to address The Creator as. Anyway, on the term "Allah," its just an Arabic version of "The God". It's roots are illahi meaning "God" and the suffix al- which means "the."

Just thought I'd share this info because many people seem to think that the term "Allah" is the name used for "the muslim god" when it actually is just plain Arab for "The God".

Uh, anyway, it's not that important. I'm sleep-deprived, I tend to rant when in this state.

Haha it sounds like this has turned into another 'Let's see what America has done wrong' thread.

As for the claims that Europeans are all anti-america, that's not true. I am European and I like America, so do a lot of people who I know. Obviously there are the few people who believe everything they see and hear, so they go around saying they hate Bush and Americans when they don't even know why.

The reason why people dislike the Bush Admin. is because most of the large things that they do affect the world in some way e.g. U.S reacting strongly to 9/11 meaning that now we have armed police shooting our train stations up because they're paranoid.

People get angry at the U.S gov. because they are seen as the main leader in world events, and have a lot of responsibilities around the world. So when they do something wrong people shake their heads because U.S has f****d up again. Though I give U.S credit for taking responsibilities, they do seem to f**k up quite a lot lol

It's just a shame that people's views on the U.S gov spread into their views or the U.S citizens, so the American people get bashed for it, which in turn makes them defensive and go on to bash Europeans. It always just turns into a US v Europe argument as we can see here.

P.S. Don't worry about the French lol they seem arrogant to everyone, they don't mean any harm by it it's just the way they are...

Originally posted by Beachcoma
it's not that important. I'm sleep-deprived, I tend to rant when in this state.

No ... please do tell us these things. That's all good information.
Thank you.

More polarization, oh well some will never see how the sheep are eating out of the wolves hands. That is how things are though is it not, leaders and followers...

"Greetings from Scotland.
There may be, however, a disliking of your ignorance of other cultures outside the US, and your US-centric view of the world. What did piss me off is when I told people where I was from I got questions like "Do you live in thatched cottages?" and "Do you even get television over there?"

Typical know-it-all European moron. Look Scotty, Europeans don't have a clue as to what Americans know about the world or their views of it. I don't know anyone who thinks Scots live in thatched huts or don't have tv. Most Americans have been to Europe and we get UK tv shows over here. I'm from Texas and when I was in Europe, ran into people who thought it was just like the TV show "Dallas" or we are "cowboys." ROFLMAO.

"Most Europeans don't hate the American people. We just hate Bush. He is a twat, and his Orwellian policies are ridiculous. We had no problem with Clinton. In fact, during the Lewinsky affair we just laughed and said "What a character, eh?" "

Who cares what you think about Bush or Clinton. Do the words none of your business mean anything? Unless you're a US citizen it IS none of your business. We don't like your socialism but that's your business.

"I have to say to the earlier poster who made the point about the US going in to sort out evil murdering Saddam Hussein and his slaughter of innocent Iraqis: "

a) Where did Saddam get the weapons to enact these atrocities?

He created some and some the US gave him to fight Iran which was a bigger enemy.

") If said atrocities were so terrible, why was the invasion of Iraq not Bush's top priority after taking office? "

Iraq wasn't invaded because of atrocities like some have said.

"c) Why hasn't the US done the same thing in other places that have no oil but where similar atrocities are commited daily, such as Zimbabwe?"

Why hasn't Scotland or the UN? Atrocities weren't the main reason. As far as oil, it costs the US far more to invade than to buy all the oil in Iraq and we got very little oil from Iraq. We get far more from Canada so if we were to invade for oil, it would be a lot cheaper and easier to invade Canada.

"d) Why hasn't the US done the same thing in North Korea where again, atrocities are taking place but there is an alliance with Russia and China? "

The US can't and shouldn't have to do everything. Why don't YOU deal with N. Korea since you, being from Europe know everything. Oh wait, why should you when America will do the dirty work.

You could say the same about the UN but then they don't claim to be the world's policemen, do they? Iraq has nothing to do with "Liberating the people" or "WMD". Iraq is about oil and the positioning of troops near Iran for your next...liberation.

Yes, actually they do. Of couse if Muslim fanatics in Iran get nuclear weapons, that's no threat at all. Typical naive European. Haven't changed since the time you though you could appease Hitler have you. Having caused the deaths of so many Americans in wars during the last century because of your failed policies, Europe should shut up for the next century. You have NO right whatsover to lecture us on anything.















"

I never realised there were so many america haters here.

I live in the U.S. and I am proud to be an American. There I said it.
Sure I dont like a lot of things the US does like..
the over rated war on drugs, ban on stem cell research, no universal health care, capitalism, democracy...

Honestly I think the U.S. would of been better off it made George Washington a King instead of a president. Why you ask?

If we had hereditary rule then we would of had a tighter leash on the corporations by now. Also we may even be communist by now... how can that be good you ask?

Well if we were communist instead of a democracy then guess what...
Germany would be ours! Japan would be ours! South Korea would be ours!

Instead of claiming these territories in the shadows they would be a state and the world would be much closer to being united!

I believe the only way to unite this damn world is to conquer it... someone has to.

I embrace the day America announces itself as an Empire.
Maybe then we would stop giving into petty demands and rule the world.

Boohoo. I didn't want to go to Europe ever anyway. I can find local boorish snobs without globetrotting overseas.

We should just close trade deals with every other country. We can make anything we need here. Piss on 'em

Originally posted by Techsnow
I never realised there were so many america haters here.

I live in the U.S. and I am proud to be an American. There I said it.
Sure I dont like a lot of things the US does like..
the over rated war on drugs, ban on stem cell research, no universal health care, capitalism, democracy...

Honestly I think the U.S. would of been better off it made George Washington a King instead of a president. Why you ask?

If we had hereditary rule then we would of had a tighter leash on the corporations by now. Also we may even be communist by now... how can that be good you ask?

Well if we were communist instead of a democracy then guess what...
Germany would be ours! Japan would be ours! South Korea would be ours!

Instead of claiming these territories in the shadows they would be a state and the world would be much closer to being united!

I believe the only way to unite this damn world is to conquer it... someone has to.

I embrace the day America announces itself as an Empire.
Maybe then we would stop giving into petty demands and rule the world.

Okay then...