Raytheon's Trillion Dollar Gamble

Originally posted by darksided
That isn't true at all, when Israel was testing long range missile systems they tested their missile systems off Sri Lanka in the Indian Ocean to insure they wouldn't accidentally fly a missile over another sovereign nation. That is an example of what responsible nations do.

Please tell me from what nation, that likes to invoke the US wrath upon itself, North Korea would test from?

Originally posted by darksided
Under international law, the US or any other country is well within its rights to shoot down a missile launched on a threatening flight pattern towards the US, or in this case for Japan or South Korea if given their permission to act.

Let's be honest and admit that the missile itself doesn't pose a threat - no country is going to attack another one with a single missile - but the missile capability.

Originally posted by darksided
But in this specific case, under International Law, the US could shoot down any missile test in North Korea regardless of the flight path. In fact, it would be 100% legal under international law for the US to bomb the missile on the missile launcher if the US chooses to do so. You see, there has never been a surrender or formal truce agreement officially ending the Korean War in spite of years of negotiation.

That would be breaking the cease fire.

Originally posted by Simon666
Please tell me from what nation, that likes to invoke the US wrath upon itself, North Korea would test from?

Iran, they launch ballistic missiles, but do so by telling the international community, which btw the media has ignored to highlight the difference.

Let's be honest and admit that the missile itself doesn't pose a threat - no country is going to attack another one with a single missile - but the missile capability.

I tend to agree with you.

That would be breaking the cease fire.

Uh, so what? North Korea has broken the cease fire over 44,000+ documented times by the State Dept resulting in the death of hundreds of US military personal and even more South Korean civilian and military personal since the cease fire was signed. Give me a break, that reason holds no bearing to the discussion.

In the end, it comes down to consequences, both political and otherwise, that have to be measured by actions. What action is worth what consequences? With China and Russia supporting the South Korean, Japanese, and US position on this subject, nothing is likely to happen.

Originally posted by darksided
Uh, so what? North Korea has broken the cease fire over 44,000+ documented times by the State Dept resulting in the death of hundreds of US military personal and even more South Korean civilian and military personal since the cease fire was signed.

Care to provide an official source for that figure?

Originally posted by Simon666
Care to provide an official source for that figure?

Yep. Korea Defense Veterans of America Newsletter published the information in their December 2002 newsletter. During Congressional Hearings regarding the National Defense Authorization for FY03, testimony before The House Armed Services Committee was given by the US Army that noted the information.

The National Defense Authorization for FY03 included the Korea Defense Service Medal to be awarded to all armed forces members who served from 28 July 1954 to a date to be determined by the Secretary of Defense. The House and Senate passed the bill in November. This will affect many thousands of former and current servicemen and women. Korea service is the only U.S. military deployment standing the line face-to-face with an enemy without a service medal award.

The Secretary of Defense, Donald Rumsfeld, has declined setting a date citing the war has not ended.

So much for all the fuss about North Korea's Taepodong-2 missile...They launched it at night (probably hoping the world wouldn't see it) and shortly after the launch the first stage rocket motor had problems and the missile went splash in the Sea of Japan.

So it seems they didn't give any country a chance to blow it outta da sky.

Originally posted by Murcielago
So it seems they didn't give any country a chance to blow it outta da sky.

I totally disagree, I'll be watching the New York Times to see if we shot it down, they appear to uncover all secrets.

Did you read the Intel analysis?

You should, because if you do you would realize the missile suddenly blew up at about the same altitude it would have if it was intercepted by the Navy at launch or by a platform like the ABL. The Navy reportedly had 4 ships in the area that could 'potentially' shoot it down, and also reportedly had plenty of notice the launch was impending when they detected additional truck activity at the launch site over the weekend, meaning the US had plenty of time to plan, and thanks to the launches of the other missile types they had good warning it was about to happen.

If you read the analysis, it blew up before completing its stage 1 booster burn, that seems strange to me, because you would assume it would blow up at some point during first or second stage ignition, not in the middle of a stage 1 booster burn that just so happens to be the same altitude a shoot down would occur.

The report also points out satellite imagry over the weekend shows the missile was far more advanced than the US expected, and the stage 1 booster was based on newer Russian ICBM technology. It also shows the missile was a satellite launch, not a missile launch, due to the 41 degree angle to the east and equator trajectory. That means when it blew up, only 1 minute after launch, the debris field would be very close to the launch site, and if shot down during nighttime from a ship within 50km of the launch site, would unlikely detect an interceptor due to the enormous signiture it would hold on radar.

I'd say the chances of it being shot down were higher than we thought. It may not have happened, but the evidence would certainly give credibility to people who think it could have been.

Originally posted by darksided


You should, because if you do you would realize the missile suddenly blew up at about the same altitude it would have if it was intercepted by the Navy at launch or by a platform like the ABL.

Thats true the ABL is designed to hit missiles early on in their boost stage.

Looks like N Korea is getting more missiles ready which I suspect would if this one splashes down they are either getting shot down or N Korea is building some junk missiles

Originally posted by darksided
Yep. Korea Defense Veterans of America Newsletter published the information in their December 2002 newsletter.

Now there's an unbiased source. Here's a list of chronological events that actually happened, instead of some nice fiction figures:

www.imjinscout.com...

I notice only 1 incident since 1984 wounding a US soldier and prior to that 1976 for US soldiers killed with North Korea to blame. Tell me about those North Korean cease fire violations again? Just admit you're just looking for an excuse for war.

[edit on 6-7-2006 by Simon666]

Originally posted by Simon666
Tell me about those North Korean cease fire violations again? Just admit you're just looking for an excuse for war.

I'm sorry, I didn't realize you are an amature political hack with the ability to read the minds of others.

Like I said sir, they are quoting US Law from 2002. It may very well again be Law in 2006 as well. This is bill S. 2914, also known as the DMZ War Veterans Recognition Act of 2006 as introduced in the Senate.

SEC. 2. FINDINGS.

Congress finds that--

...

(5) since the Armistice was signed, over 40,000 Armistice violations have occurred, many of which involved troops of the United States who were stationed in and around Korea;

(6) some of those violations, like the capture of the USS Pueblo, caught the attention of the media, although most have not;

(7) since the end of the Korean War, many soldiers of the United States have died or been wounded in Korea as a result of hostile fire;

Now is the government of the United States a good enough source, or do you need a tin hat with a propeller at the top to get in touch with your inner psychic.

Just because it isn't reported on TV doesn't mean it doesn't happen. After all, this isn't a right wing/left wing political garbage where everyone wants either peace or war thing, this is simply reporting the facts as facts without judgement. The information has been out there for years, it just doesn't get the attention of the MSM.

I already the major incidents in my previous posts and is far more credible than the unexplained and highly suspicious 40,000 figure.