Information on Freemasons

Yet again we all seem to be falling foul of the difference between secret and private. And don't forget that there is European legislation in place forbidding the disclosure of personal information without that individuals permission.

Combine that with a less-than-slick PR process (more evidence that masonry isn't global, but actually very local) and a fear of media bias and I'm not surprised that little information is forthcoming.

This issue, amongst others, is being watched by many freemasons and you can rest assured that I'll let you all know the outcome when/if I hear it.

Originally posted by Nygdan
Fair enough, but then masonry can't claim that its easy to find out what lodge a person belongs too. Its claimed that the organization is just a 'society with secrets'. If there si no way to find out who is in what lodge, then thats untrue, its an out and out secret society.

Nygdan,

Based on that logic the church is a "secret society" as well. There's no open publication of church rolls that I know of. My own church doesn't list it's official membership on the internet (although we do publish a Parish Directory once a year with all contact info in it) Many Lodges (including one of my two Lodges) prints a membership directory with contact information, but it's not available to the general public like a telephone directory is. It's distrubuted among the members.

Why is it important to know "WHICH" Lodge a person belongs (or belonged) to? Not publishing that info does not qualify the Lodge as a "secret society" It's been discussed from time to time, I'm sure, but a "secret society" is a society that is "secret" in other words, the general public doesn't know of it's existence or at least of it's meeting places/times, &c. That's a round hole and Masonry is a square peg in this instance.

I have seen many times in this forum where its been stated that this kind of information should be easily attainable. Its not. Obviously, they don't have to tell me crap. But there is sometimes an impression that they are open, when, infact, its not true.

Not exactly true. If a person had a legitimate reason (goodness knows what it might be) to know if another individual was a member in good standing (dues paid) of a particular Lodge, it would be only a matter of contacting the Lodge Secretary who, generally speaking, would be quite cooperative. Many Lodges have websites with Lodge addresses, phone numbers, officer contact info, etc. Those that do not are often listed on their respective Grand Lodges' website and if that fails, contact the Grand Secretary of the jurisdiction the subordinate Lodge is in and ask for a: the name/contact info of the secretary, or b: the information regarding the membership of the individual you're curious about. Grand Lodges generally receive membership lists from subordinate Lodges each year.

It's not that it's 'secret' who is a member of what Lodge, it's just that it doesn't ordinarily concern the profane world at large, but when it does (perhaps in a legal case, &c.) then the info is readily available.

THe sorts of things that I asked were 'Mr. X has been arrested for pedophilia, to which lodge did he belong" "Is there an internatl investigation" "has you 'branch' received directives on how to deal with these sorts of questions, have you been told to cooperate fully, etc', and the like.

I guess I can't grasp why one would even CARE what Lodge this hypothetical pedophile belonged to. What would being a member of a Lodge have to do with that? Would one investigate what Kindergarten he attended as well? Or what barber he used? Or how much money he spent at Wal-Mart? His Lodge didn't (or certainly SHOULDN'T) make him a pedophile, so what difference would it make?

That being said, if he were CONVICTED of that sort of thing, I would hope that Masonic Charges would be brought up against him and he be expelled from Masonry. I'd see to it that it did, were that to happen in my Lodge.

Not 'When are you evil masonariests going to flambe this unamed and unknown member, you damned reptiloids."

I wish you wouldn't post such things. People aren't supposed to know that!

[edit on 30-6-2006 by Appak]

I was under the impression that Reagan was made and honorary 33 degree (without going through...just honorary)...wrong info then?

Originally posted by BasementAddix
I was under the impression that Reagan was made and honorary 33 degree (without going through...just honorary)...wrong info then?

www.bessel.org...

thanx...that cleared up ALOT...

Originally posted by Trinityman

Originally posted by Vaportrails

Originally posted by Trinityman
I, for example, am a Christian.

Trinity -Are you saying that you are a mason and a christian ?

Cripes! What gave me away?

I did'nt realize that a mason could be a christian due to the fact that the universal god of the masons, is not the same god of christianity

Originally posted by Vaportrails
I did'nt realize that a mason could be a christian due to the fact that the universal god of the masons, is not the same god of christianity

Well, I guess you learn something new every day

Originally posted by Vaportrails

Originally posted by Trinityman

Originally posted by Vaportrails

Originally posted by Trinityman
I, for example, am a Christian.

Trinity -Are you saying that you are a mason and a christian ?

Cripes! What gave me away?

I did'nt realize that a mason could be a christian due to the fact that the universal god of the masons, is not the same god of christianity

The problem here is a misinterpretation. Freemasonry doesn't have a "God" of its own. Each person is expected to believe in God in their own way. So Christians are Freemasons, Jews are Freemasons, etc. Each believing in their respective religion. The requirement for a belief in one All-Powerful God isn't one that requires a belief in the "masonic god"... That is a constant misconception throughout much of the anti-masonic literature. I have never been asked to change my religion and am as faithful as I have always been to my beliefs regardless of my standing as a Freemason.

Im only still in my first degree (until sept)..but I was told the same...they dont have a specific god...as long as you believe in immortality of the soul (ie ANY god)...Im lutheran...my two brothers who went in with me are Catholic...making us all Christians...and its NOT an issue...

Originally posted by yin_yang
i find it funny that people would listen to someone who is not a freemason whos spent countless hours studying "them".

but ignore the real freemasons on the board

people are funny.

I find it funny that someone would listen to someone who is not a nazi.......

Originally posted by BasementAddix
Im only still in my first degree (until sept)..but I was told the same...they dont have a specific god...as long as you believe in immortality of the soul (ie ANY god)...Im lutheran...my two brothers who went in with me are Catholic...making us all Christians...and its NOT an issue...

In response, The universal God of Freemasonry is called the GAOTU which means "Great Architect of the Universe" And is not the same God of the Lutheran or Catholic Faith. There is a direct conflict in this belief.

Originally posted by Vaportrails
In response, The universal God of Freemasonry is called the GAOTU which means "Great Architect of the Universe" And is not the same God of the Lutheran or Catholic Faith. There is a direct conflict in this belief.

There is no universal God of freemasonry. Each freemason, on admittance, must profess to a pre-existing faith, and the continuance of that faith is a condition of ongoing membership.

The phrase GAOTU is one of a number of similar terms employed by freemasonry to describe 'God'. Whilst it is true that different freemasons may have a different understanding of what that entity is, at no point do any of them believe it is a 'masonic god'.

How do you possibly think so many Christians, and even clergy, could remain part of an organization that requests they deny their own faith? The simplest (and in this case most accurate answer) is that it doesn't.

[edit on 7-7-2006 by Trinityman]

Originally posted by Vaportrails


In response, The universal God of Freemasonry is called the GAOTU which means "Great Architect of the Universe" And is not the same God of the Lutheran or Catholic Faith. There is a direct conflict in this belief.

There isn't a "universal God of Freemasonry" any more than there's a "universal God of Boy Scouts". A Mason's religious beliefs are a private matter between him and his Creator, and the specifics are his religion are irrelevant in regards to his membership in a fraternity, provided they do not violate the moral prerequisites.

"The Great Architect of the Universe" is not a separate God from the God of Lutherans or Catholics: it's only a title. In fact, the term was coined and first used by John Calvin, the famous Reformer (and non-Mason). It was first used in Masonry in the 1720's by Rev. James Anderson, a Calvinist Presbyterian minister, who was Grand Chaplain of the Grand Lodge of England.

[edit on 7-7-2006 by Masonic Light]

you guys really know your stuff it seems...im finding the 1st step interesting as to the amount of memorization it has...

What happened to "Forefathers" and why did he dissapear?

I read about Masonry all day long to try to educate myself but I do not by any means consider myself to be an expert. I wonder what is the point where you could be considered to be very knoweldgeable in something that is supposed to take a lifetime to understand. One day I would like to be at that point of knowing something to be considered an expert subject matter but that day is long time away.

Originally posted by corsig
I wonder what is the point where you could be considered to be very knoweldgeable in something that is supposed to take a lifetime to understand. One day I would like to be at that point of knowing something to be considered an expert subject matter but that day is long time away.

Knowledgeable is a very subjective term. Wisdom is easier. You will attain a certain wisdom when you appreciate just how little knowledge you are ever likely to have.

About anything.

Originally posted by Trinityman

Originally posted by Vaportrails
In response, The universal God of Freemasonry is called the GAOTU which means "Great Architect of the Universe" And is not the same God of the Lutheran or Catholic Faith. There is a direct conflict in this belief.

There is no universal God of freemasonry. Each freemason, on admittance, must profess to a pre-existing faith, and the continuance of that faith is a condition of ongoing membership.

The phrase GAOTU is one of a number of similar terms employed by freemasonry to describe 'God'. Whilst it is true that different freemasons may have a different understanding of what that entity is, at no point do any of them believe it is a 'masonic god'.

How do you possibly think so many Christians, and even clergy, could remain part of an organization that requests they deny their own faith? The simplest (and in this case most accurate answer) is that it doesn't.

[edit on 7-7-2006 by Trinityman]

Are you saying that " Freemasonry teaches that there is one God and men of all religions worship that one God using a variety of different names ?

yes vapor trails that's exactly what they are saying.

To become a mason you must admit that you believe in a supreme being, whoever that is is up to you, other then satan we really dont like devil whorshipers in our group. in order to give that supreme being a name so as not to offend anyone, and to use the name as a universal name we call him/her the supreme arcitect of the universe. Since masonry is essentually about building (life not structors) it seems only fit for them to be an arcitect, as he/she was the one who designed the universe as we believe it today.

Originally posted by Vaportrails
Are you saying that " Freemasonry teaches that there is one God and men of all religions worship that one God using a variety of different names ?

That's an ambiguous statement which could be misinterpreted.

Freemasonry doesn't 'teach' that God exists, it 'assumes' it. All the morality tales found in freemasonry are from the Bible, and wouldn't make any sense to someone who didn't believe in God. The whole excercise would be pointless to an atheist. As it is assumed all members worship (their understanding of) God before they join there would be no need to 'teach' this.

Also, I would contend that there is no 'worshipping' taking place in a lodge room, just opening and closing prayers and periodic invocations for the Lord to guide us and look over us and keep us safe.

Many people appear to have become confused about what freemasons believe and who they worship. From what I can gather this is due to some people misunderstanding freemasonry (deliberately or otherwise) and then disseminating that incorrect information in such a way that it is more readily available than the truth. I've outlined above and before what freemasons believe; but here's a summary:

(a) there is no masonic god
(b) freemasons must have a pre-existing belief before they join freemasonry
(c) they must maintain that belief as a condition of membership
(d) the only place freemasons worship God is in their church/synagogue/mosque/etc