People seen in the wreckage holes of the WTC

Originally posted by tom goose


can thermite explosives be used to pulverise concrete? YES

Maybe I missed something.

What exactly is a thermite explosive?

I thought that Thermite was used to quietly cut the columns, not pulverize concrete?

[edit on 5-6-2006 by LeftBehind]

Thermite isn't an explosive. It's used to cause an extreme thermal reaction. There is no "thermite explosive".

I know that there were pools of molten metal in the crater of the WTC. Many of my friends who worked cleanup saw it. The site was smoking for weeks after. I also saw pics of the molten metal in the local papers here in NYC and on the local news channels afterwards.



Pie

Here's a conspiracy site explaining why someone is seen standing in the impact holes.

911review.com...

This photo of a person standing in the North Tower's impact hole was apparently taken rather early in the interval of time between jet impact and collapse.

Unfortunately for us, the whack job conspiracy nuts have put out enough bad info that a lot of people are believing them.

WTC 7- Look up the comments from the members of NYFD that survived that day, they say that WTC 1 HIT WTC 7 on its way down and carved a 20 story tall chunk out of it. In addtion, look for photos of it (they are out there) the conspiracy nuts show a photo from the side of the building away from the towers. Of course if you find the photos from the tower side, you will see that WTC 7 had major fires on the majority of its floors. Lets see...missing a HUGE chunk of the building and what is left is on fire and the owner of the building tells NYFD to pull its fire crew out (where the conspiracy nuts allege that Silverstein had said the building was rigged with explosives), so, major damage, major fires and no one fighting those fires.....Gee I wonder why it fell.......NOT.

Originally posted by LeftBehind

Originally posted by tom goose


can thermite explosives be used to pulverise concrete? YES

Maybe I missed something.

What exactly is a thermite explosive?

I thought that Thermite was used to quietly cut the columns, not pulverize concrete?

[edit on 5-6-2006 by LeftBehind]

thermal explosive, my bad, noticed it after it was too late to change it. thermal explosive with properties similer to that of a volcano, thats debri is consistant with the debri left at the wtc collapse.

im not an explosive's expert, so maybe someone can tell me what kind of man made substance has the explosive power to match a volcano??

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999
Unfortunately for us, the whack job conspiracy nuts have put out enough bad info that a lot of people are believing them.

WTC 7- Look up the comments from the members of NYFD that survived that day, they say that WTC 1 HIT WTC 7 on its way down and carved a 20 story tall chunk out of it. In addtion, look for photos of it (they are out there) the conspiracy nuts show a photo from the side of the building away from the towers. Of course if you find the photos from the tower side, you will see that WTC 7 had major fires on the majority of its floors. Lets see...missing a HUGE chunk of the building and what is left is on fire and the owner of the building tells NYFD to pull its fire crew out (where the conspiracy nuts allege that Silverstein had said the building was rigged with explosives), so, major damage, major fires and no one fighting those fires.....Gee I wonder why it fell.......NOT.

Here's the video of WTC7 collapsing, I don't see any 20 story tall chunk carved out of it on this side,
WTC7 collapse video (click pic on left)

And if it happened on one of the other sides, and that led to the collapse, why did the bldg fall symmetrically?

Then there's the problem of the 6.5 sec collapse time of WTC7. A math professor friend of Prof Steven Jones came up with a min collapse time of 8.5-9.0 seconds using the principle of conservation of momentum only,
Prof Steven Jones interview (14-19 mins into audio)

I wrote a simple 19 line program that verifies the result, and which I posted on the thread "East Penthouse atop WTC 7 imploded too!". The following table illustrates the collapse time problem,

5.96 free fall in vacuum
0.00 air resistance
2.54 conservation of momentum (assumes 47 stories suspended in mid-air)
0.00 building resistance
=====
8.50 total

so assuming no building and air resistance, WTC7 still collapsed 24% too fast. Of course there should have been building and air resistance so the number should be much larger. The only logical conclusion is that the lower floors and steel columns of WTC7 were already removed by the time the collapsing upper floors would have hit them.

IMO the supporters of the official gov't conspiracy theory should switch tactics and try to show that Osama planted explosives in the buildings. LMAO

[edit on 6-6-2006 by guest100]

here is a thought, have read so many sides to this argument but not seen this idea before.

What if these building were designed to fall on their own footprint, just think of the total destruction if these buildings were to topple over, they would take out many more buildings and lives????

just a thought.





[edit on 6-6-2006 by ringyramjet]

it doesnt matter how you think the fires were coz NIST already admited that the steel wasnt hotter than 250 degrees. they admitted it and no one cares!!

Originally posted by tom goose

thermal explosive, my bad, noticed it after it was too late to change it. thermal explosive with properties similer to that of a volcano, thats debri is consistant with the debri left at the wtc collapse.

im not an explosive's expert, so maybe someone can tell me what kind of man made substance has the explosive power to match a volcano??

Which properties were similar to a volcano? How does thermite transfer volcano-like properties?

I didn't see any lava that day, but I think any burning building will fill the air with ash, fitting one volcano like property.


Are you claiming it was a pyroclastic cloud?

I think the people who were close to the buildings during the collapse and weren't burned to ash would disagree with you.

Originally posted by guest100

Here's the video of WTC7 collapsing, I don't see any 20 story tall chunk carved out of it on this side,

You won't find many pictures of it, but you can find pictures like this one that show the entire south side of the building burning.



[edit on 6-6-2006 by LeftBehind]

Originally posted by LeftBehind


I think the people who were close to the buildings during the collapse and weren't burned to ash would disagree with you.

Not to mention in the northern tower some people survived the collapse right in the building core.

Originally posted by guest100
Here's the video of WTC7 collapsing, I don't see any 20 story tall chunk carved out of it on this side,

Originally posted by LeftBehind
You won't find many pictures of it,

You won't find any pictures of it because there are none. The ridiculously long-overdue NIST report is the "Last Debunkers Hope" for this one.

...but you can find pictures like this one that show the entire south side of the building burning.

I don't see the entire south side burning. I see it smouldering. Diesel fuel which was in pipes throughout sections of the building creates a lot of smoke when it burns, but it is not as volatile as petroleum. Where are the building-destroying raging infernos that were allegedly required to fell the twin towers? Where are the huge truss spans that were allegedly the only reason the twin towers crumbled into pick-up sticks and dust. WTC7 had none of these, and yet it fell in a perfect, free fall implosion; faster even than the twin towers.

And even if an amazing picture of a huge gash in the side of WTC7 is produced by NIST, it will still pathetically fail to explain that perfect collapse.

Piss-weak fires + feeble damage = free fall implosion of 47-storey steel-frame building, i.e The Foot of God Theory.

Never before seen footage =>


Whodathunkit?!




[edit on 2006-6-6 by wecomeinpeace]

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999Lets see...missing a HUGE chunk of the building and what is left is on fire and the owner of the building tells NYFD to pull its fire crew out (where the conspiracy nuts allege that Silverstein had said the building was rigged with explosives), so, major damage, major fires and no one fighting those fires.....Gee I wonder why it fell.......NOT.

How would the owner of the building knw it was going to collapse? I would imagine firefighters have soem training on when the structural integrity of a buiding is questionable. So how did the owner know before they did? hmmm

Originally posted by tom goose

does jet fuel have the explosive power to turn concrete to powder? NO

can the force of air turn concrete to powder? NO

can thermite explosives be used to pulverise concrete? YES

Does light aggrigate concrete have any strength against stress and strain? No only against compression. If you drop a piece of light aggrigate concrete will it shatter? Yes.


By the way thermite doesn't explode. IT BURNS. CONCRETE DOESN'T BURN.

Originally posted by scoobdude
How would the owner of the building knw it was going to collapse? I would imagine firefighters have soem training on when the structural integrity of a buiding is questionable. So how did the owner know before they did? hmmm

Did he know? Or did the firefighters inform him there is a risk the building will collapse and that they'll pull out of it and he just acknowledged the fact? "Okay, pull it if you have to"?

Originally posted by Zaphod58
Thermite isn't an explosive. It's used to cause an extreme thermal reaction. There is no "thermite explosive".

*SNIP*

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[edit on 6/6/2006 by Mirthful Me]

Originally posted by scoobdude

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999Lets see...missing a HUGE chunk of the building and what is left is on fire and the owner of the building tells NYFD to pull its fire crew out (where the conspiracy nuts allege that Silverstein had said the building was rigged with explosives), so, major damage, major fires and no one fighting those fires.....Gee I wonder why it fell.......NOT.

Problem wiht your story is that the firemen had been pulled accoring to fire commander and fire chief before 3:30.,, the building did not come down untill after 5:00.

Why would the fire commander call Silverstien to ask what to do with the the firemen when 1 they were already pulled out and 2 Silverstien does not have any authority to tell the commander what to do with his men only the building.

SO the only reason why the commander called was to ask Silverstein what to do with the building. The building came down right after the phone call.

Originally posted by wecomeinpeace
Never before seen footage =>

Whodathunkit?!

Good one.

Originally posted by JIMC5499


Does light aggrigate concrete have any strength against stress and strain? No only against compression. If you drop a piece of light aggrigate concrete will it shatter? Yes.

Wrong. Light aggregate concrete (lightweight concrete) can be as strong as regular concrete. You do know that even heavy concrete has different ratings right? There are 2000 psi, 3000 psi, 4000 psi etc. concrete. The water to cement ratio is what is the major controlling point here...not the aggregate. I've had to specify lightweight concrete before that was spec'd to be 4000 psi. BTW, 4000 psi concrete is the normal rating for concrete in most cases.

I used to work in Pittsburgh as a geotechnical engineer. Some places in PA have coal and slate. Sometimes these have sulfur in them that when they get wet, they expand. This is a problem when you want to place the buildings footings. What we would do is excavate down another foot or two (depending on how much sulfur was in the foundation material) and place lightweight concrete. Now, if lightweight concrete is so brittle, why would we place that as a foundation?

[edit on 6/6/2006 by Griff]

Yeah, and look Howard:

Piss-weak fires + feeble damage = free fall implosion of 47-storey steel-frame building, i.e The Foot of God Theory.

It matches what you think!

So did anybody ever manage a photo of those raging infernos in WTC7, or do we just have the photos showing the piss-weak fires that WCIP is talking about?

Seems like infernos would be easier to find and photograph, doesn't it? Yet all we have are the photos of the piss-weak ones. Hmmmmmmm......