Equipping The New Iraqi Air Force Inventory

Just thinkin about the New Iraqi Air Force, What do they use?

ALSO: Imagine they are a new member of NATO(Which they already may be) and what planes could we equip them?

They would have to be NATO aircraft, Preferably Ex US Planes as long as they are good and airworthy and at least from the 3rd generation of fighters

www.amarcexperience.com...

I would give them F-5s, F-4 Phantoms, F-16s, F/A-18s, Maybe Old F-15s?, F-111s or the remaining A-5 Vigilantes.

Reasons

F-5s: Cheap to run and maintain but would only be used as part of the IAFs foundation
F-4s: Decent medium fighter but only good nowerdays as 'Bomb Trucks'

F-16: Decent standard fighter and will be replaced in the USAF by the F-35 JSF
F/A-18: Good service record and easy to fly and maintain, Also is a multirole fighter

F-15: Not sure if i would sell it to them but would only if the IAF foundation is complete?
F-111 Aardvark: Long range strike aircraft and would suit long hour/desert operations

RA/A-5 Vigilantes: Ex USN State of the art aircraft that uses F-4 Phantom engines, Could be a Long range Recon Platform?

How about A-4 Skyhawks/A-7 Corsairs/A-6 Intruders? Could sell them abandoned US fighter projects to give the Iraqis jobs(EG The F-20 Tigershark)


[edit on 21-5-2006 by Browno]

I googled it quick and came up with SB7L Seabird... not a fighter diretly but still... I still have a memory of reading about F/A-18 in the Iraqi air-force... not totally sure though...

All they need at the moment is helicopters, and lots of them.


They have absolutely no need for a collection of useless white elephants at this moment in time.

[edit on 21-5-2006 by kilcoo316]

the us need to concentrate on getting rid of the rebels before they start providing iraq with planes.

When the us do pull outwhat planes they will give/sell iraq will depend on how friendly they think that the iraqi government will be towards them. if they think that it will be hostile then they wont give them as good planes. but if they have a very strong relationship then they will get better planes.

justin

already one about the new Iraqi air force old topic

ALSO: Imagine they are a new member of NATO(Which they already may be) and what planes could we equip them?

Browno no offense pal , but what is it with you and signing up nations to NATO ? thats two threads ive been on tonight where youve claimed that countries are already in or are going to be in NATO do you know somthing we all don't? Iraq are not in NATO and neither are Australia, do you know what NATO is ?
(see link)

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I include for you a link on NATO also .

www.nato.int...

As to your question kilcoo316 summed it up brilliantly what they need is helicopters and plenty of them , im sure one day the IAF will be ready for fast jets again and probably yes they will go for US aircraft , but frigging vigilantes ?Corsairs? sky hawks? F-111s come on be serious man.

maybe the best suggestion you made was F-16s they will be plenty knocking about for years , but I don't see a need just yet what with the coalition presance in there back yard.

[edit on 21-5-2006 by buckaroo]

I think they should use Migs. 21's or 23's. They probably still have guys with time on them. Easy to maintain. Very important right now. Not state of the art but you have to take them seriously when they are coming at you. Probably oodles of parts lying around and available. Lots of help could be obtained from other countries beside USA. A squadron of Frogfoots wouldn't hurt either. These would obviously operate under an American umbrella but would give these poor guys back some national dignity flying a non-US type. Mig-23 can get you somewhere pretty fast too!

Good thinking, but I have my doubts about the F-111 for only one reason: Nuclear Capibility! The F-111 was built to be nuclear capable and I'm not sure if Giving the new Iraqi air force nuclear capable aircraft would fly (No pun Intended). Right now, the US and many western nations have an issue with nuclear polifiration and rogue nations. I doubt they would be willing to chance turning over control of a nuclear capable aircraft such as the F-111 to Iraq, expecially since the country is so unstable and dangerous at the moment.

Tim

Originally posted by Browno
ALSO: Imagine they are a new member of NATO(Which they already may be) and what planes could we equip them?

Browno,

NATO = North Atlantic Treaty Orgnization

Iraq is boardering on the Indain Ocean, not the Atlantic. Iraq in the UN, that works, but NOT NATO. You might want to learn a bit about NATO and what it is.

Here, check this link out: NATO

This is their Frequently Asked Questions page. It expains what NATO is. Please take a look. People will be more excepting of your ideas, if you know what your talking about. When in doubt, check before you comment!

Tim

Originally posted by bodrul
already one about the new Iraqi air force old topic

heres an even older one , even older thread

please carry on with this thread -- but read mine and bodrul`s - and dont simply re plough the same ground -- lets have new ideas here that reflect what has happened in the last 6 months

like are the NZ a-4s still up for sale ??

and such questions as should iraq provide some sort of deterence force to counter iranian build ups

lets have just current / new ideas here

carry on chaps

Originally posted by ghost
Good thinking, but I have my doubts about the F-111 for only one reason: Nuclear Capibility! The F-111 was built to be nuclear capable

That would have absolutely no bearing on things.


The problem is not a delivery system (assuming they have other jets), it is obtaining the materials, knowledge and facilities to build 'the bomb'.

For example, Iran has aircraft that in soviet hands were able to deliver nuclear packages... never caused a problem until they started selling oil in eur.... ehh, I mean researching and building up facilities capable of building 'the bomb'.




How hard do you think it would be for a bunch of engineers to do a quick fix on an airframe to hang (and release) a dumb nuclear bomb from? 2 days... maybe 3??

Originally posted by kilcoo316
That would have absolutely no bearing on things.

The problem is not a delivery system (assuming they have other jets), it is obtaining the materials, knowledge and facilities to build 'the bomb'.

My point was I'm not sure if the US or others would be willing to turn that capibliity over to another nation. It might not be the main issue, but it's still an important secret.

Tim

I would give them the very best possible. F-15E's for a "gap" filler until JSF's are ready for deployment and as many F-16’s as they can stand.

The logic is simple enough: Load Iraq with state of the art weapons to help stabilize the region. As a caveat they agree to operate them from American ran bases within Iraq, with American ground crews and maintenance staff. This all but guarantee’s the "appropriate" use of the top of the line aircrafts while letting Iraq dominate its skies. I would sell them to Iraq at half price too.

Iraq would maintain the right of course to operate other types of aircraft as it sees fit from Iraqi ran bases.

But allowing a joint Iraqi/Coalition F-35 program would do a great deal to solidify Iraq's relationship with the west and stabilize the region.

Why spend hundreds of billions of dollars and thousands of lives creating a democracy in the Middle East only to set it up with dated tech to defend itself?

Give them the best.



[edit on 30-5-2006 by skippytjc]

Before I try to answer this question, I'd like you all to consider this. Do we really want to arm Iraq at all?

Keep in mind that in the 1970s, President Nixon allowed Iran to purchase just about anything they could afford from the U.S. Then Iran became our worst enemy.

Iraq could very well go down that road in the future. Now, do we really want to be stupid Americans (again) and arm another country to the teeth?

So, my answer to the question? Give them P-51s.

As to your question kilcoo316 summed it up brilliantly what they need is helicopters and plenty of them , im sure one day the IAF will be ready for fast jets again and probably yes they will go for US aircraft , but frigging vigilantes ?Corsairs? sky hawks? F-111s come on be serious man.

maybe the best suggestion you made was F-16s they will be plenty knocking about for years , but I don't see a need just yet what with the coalition presance in there back yard.

[edit on 21-5-2006 by buckaroo] Ok rid the Corsairs, Skyhawks could just be trainers or light attackers or maybe still rid them.

Dont think i would give them F/A-18s F-15s F-111s yet , Theyre too good so the last F-4 Phantoms from AMARC could fulfill thier Medium/Heavy Fighter role.

The remaining A-5 Vigilantes i mentioned before could be kept becouse they were a good aircraft and use F-4 Phantom engines so it may be cheaper to run/maintain than the F-111, Maybe it could be modded with F-16 Engines?
sb.balancer.ru...
www.nebna.org...

Could maybe be thier interceptor if a Vulcan/Avenger gun was fitted in it? Dont think it is Nuclear capable since it once had a faulty bomb bay

Not sure with the F-111 Aardvarks since someone mentioned they are Nuclear Capable? Who else could we sell them to apart from Australia?. Although they are old, I still wouldnt scrap them off.

Howabout A-6 Intruders, EA-6 Prowlers? They could be useful for the new IAF since they are in foundation. At least they wont touch the USAF/RAF.

[edit on 31-5-2006 by Browno]

Originally posted by ghost
Good thinking, but I have my doubts about the F-111 for only one reason: Nuclear Capibility! The F-111 was built to be nuclear capable and I'm not sure if Giving the new Iraqi air force nuclear capable aircraft would fly (No pun Intended). Right now, the US and many western nations have an issue with nuclear polifiration and rogue nations. I doubt they would be willing to chance turning over control of a nuclear capable aircraft such as the F-111 to Iraq, expecially since the country is so unstable and dangerous at the moment.

Tim

If they would have F-111 they could transport nuclear weapons... But they still have to create the weapons before using them... And that would be pretty ahrd since they are under supervision by USA... And it's not the army of Iraq that is the problem anymore... it's the rebells...

nuclear capability ??? if you want to scare monger , a piper cherokee has a stated payload of 342kg . you can build a crude bomb to fit that spec - if you are prepared to go the " suicide strike " route

so please lay of the nuke paranoia please ,

as i said in earlier threads , should not the rebuilt iraq AF be based on defensive interceptors , air defences [ guns / missile ] batteries and SAR , coast guards etc etc BEFORE any attack / strike capacity is even discussed

look @ the japan self defence force -- they are STILL banned from owning A2A refueling capacity , specifically to limite ther abiities to strike over seas targets

yeah... Iraq isn't building an army... it's building a defense force... totally different things... and bombers only go for attack...

Id say a few hundred F-16 supplemented with 25-50 F-35’s. Iraq needs to be more capable than its neighbors.

And as I mentioned before: The F-35’s would only be owned and piloted by the Iraq’s, the entire maintenance program and their bases of operation would be American.

I nice contingent of Apache’s would round out their force nicely.

Originally posted by ignorant_ape
nuclear capability ??? if you want to scare monger , a piper cherokee has a stated payload of 342kg . you can build a crude bomb to fit that spec - if you are prepared to go the " suicide strike " route

so please lay of the nuke paranoia please ,

Hold on,

I never said I had a problem with the Iraqis flying F-111's! What I was saying is that the "Powers In Charge" wouldn't allow it! The US has a strict Non-palifiration policy. I was trying to address the issue realistically based on what I know about US government policy reguarding military thecnology and hardware!

Would letting a new Iraq, who is supposely an alli of ours buy F-111 be a good idea? Personally, I think so! Will the Pentagon let it happen? Not over their dead bodies! Also, my eariler refernce to Iraq being unstable wasn't intended as a judgment, I was referring the the insurgency that is killing US, UK, and Iraqi soldures almost daily.

Please understand, there is a difference between my personal oppinions on things, and my honest assesment of US Foriegin Policy! I was only pointing out that I don't think the US is willing to let it happen.

What were you looking for in this thread? Personal oppinions about Iraq getting F-111's and other things, or a realistic assesment? If I misunderstood what you intended this thead to be about, I'm sorry! I was trying to give an honest objective assessment.

Tim