I Once Dreamed of Liberty (Op/Ed)

semperfortis:

I do agree with you that our soldiers should be cherished for the huge burdens we put on their shoulders. However, I think that maybe we put too much on them sometimes. You think we don't need to leave Iraq because the job isn't done. When will it be done? Or is there even a goal set that's foreseeable? I don't know what it is that our forces are trying to set up over there that's so important as to require our constant guard, but maybe you could enlighten me?

I find it unsettling that there are soldiers that are so eager to go off and do what they've been taught to do. Something like that should not be enjoyed. Maybe I've misconstrued your views, and if so, I'm sorry. I just see these past few posts as being biased towards the soldiers and what they're doing. People are ALL fallible, no matter who they think they are. Soldiers are just doing what they're told, despite whatever anyone says. It's a simple fact that they do what they do because they have to do it. They contracted into the military for various reasons, but I bet most of them pre-9/11 weren't planning on going to war. No normal person wants war. Anyone that does shouldn't be a soldier. To be a soldier should be a humbling experience, not an ego-boosting one. They're the last bastion of hope that stands between we the people and the enemy.

Yes, we need to support our troops, but to what end? Do we support them for what they're doing? Or do we support them because we want them to come home safe? I think it's one in the same really. Like I've already said, no one wants to see people die, but there need to be people skilled in the arts to be able to handle it when the time comes.

It's my opinion that we should bring them home because there's not much more we can do there, and if there is, why is it taking so long? When this country was founded, we only had France's and Spain's help in setting up our country. It took a few years yes, but we did the majority of that on our own, as a group. Why is it so impossible for the people of Iraq to do the same? Can't they figure out what to do by themselves? Why do they need to be coddled like little babes? I fail to see the need for the soldier to be ever-present in every facet of their existence. All that Iraq is being used for right now is a staging ground for the War on Terror so that they don't come over here. Or so that's what they're telling us anyway.

All I ask is for everyone to use a little more reason when they think about why we're REALLY there, and don't listen to all the hype that the government spits out. Listen to what the soldiers themselves say, as that's where the truth lies. Semper, I want you and Maud to know that I understand where you get the deep feelings for our troops from. I myself feel the same way for the most part. We just choose to take a slightly different side on the issue of Iraq is all. I hope you can at least understand why it is that some of us ask for our troops to come home. I think the war's been over for a long time now, and the only reason that it's been drug out for this long is because there's something that we're not being told.

I only wish I could put into words what I see.

TheBorg

You do not have to be a pacifist to be opposed to war, or niave. There is most certianly a time and a place to defend yourself (and your nation) but it should be an act of last resort, not first choice. We chose to attack Iraq, we did not have to and despite all the protestations to the contrary Bush was itching to attack, he never gave diplomacy or the inspectors a real chance because he didn't want to he was dissing the inspectors from the moment they stepped foot on the ground and was impatient with them every step of the way. Only Muaddib now believes Saddam still had WMD so regardless of how you cut it, an unprovked war makes us the aggressor and as such, wrong.

Borg, Thank you for that and for expressing it as your opinion.

Yet it is not my opinion, for this is the real world and my opinion stands.
To say that the soldiers should not feel eager to do their duty is perfectly OK on my part, yet here I sit a much more mature man then the 20 year old college graduate who had just entered the Marines and could not wait to throw my hand up to volunteer for any mission that came "down the pike."

"The greatest gift a man can give is to place his body between wars desolation and his beloved home."

I can never fault them for their patriotic fervor. It is by nature a young mans duty and they are out there doing it. Gone are the days when each man felt obligated to devote a significant portion of their lives to the service of the military. When rousing songs of patriotic energy sprang from every speaker on the block. Gone even are the streets of the city lined with American flags in memory of 9/11. Now all that is left are the questioners, doubters and a few brave and young men and women. Patriotism and pride in the power of ones country has become non-vogue and unpopular. Much like the flat-top and penny loafers.
Still I remember when it was with a sense of pride that we talked about our military might and how quickly we crushed the Hun and Hitler. There was a momentary surge when Reagan defeated communism, but it too was short lived and quick became unpopular.
I fear only one thing. That we eventually become so enamored with our own ability to accept this, while the rest of the world revels in the power of their nations, that we are quickly and completely over-run. Some on here would make unqualified statements about Americans being able to defend themselves. Oh how very naive that is. Check out Colonel Dave Grossman's book titled "On Killing" to see how very absurd that is and not even worthy of my return comment.
The modern military has learned many many things in it's history. One of which is how to create and excellent soldier and killing machine. To even imagine a civilian population could stand against them is completely laughable. The only resort would be to follow the Islam-o-fasists with their homicide bombers and IED's and car bombs. I have personally known men that make Rambo look like a sissy. But that is neither here nor there.
A feeling of pride in anyone's craft is as natural as sunshine and I can not deny them that.
Again Borg, I appreciate your opinion, I in many ways agree and still in many do not. But hey, that is what ATS is all about right?

First I would like to say that you don't have to go to war to love what your country was about (or now what it is suppose to be about). Also I personally know soliders who are over there fighting for the people of Iraq and thats why they are over there. I am glad to see that they care, but that doesn't change the fact that they are trying to save freedom by killing. Then I know solider who aren't over there to fight for freedom, they are just there because they were told "free education" when they were done, and to them I don't look down on them cause "ya gotta get by".
But then I know a couple soliders that aren't there for either. They are there to kill people. I quote one of them "I have, and always will vote republican, they are more likely to start wars. That means I get to kill people." I tried to ask him why, or better understand, and all I got was him wanting to kill and torture people.

There is simply no need to fight a war that never needed to be fought. You need to remember who deserves freedom and who doesnt. These people didn't fight for their freedom, we did. It is not our job to make nations free. In order for a people to appriciate freedom, they have to be willing to fight for it. Rise up when it may seem the hardest. We fought one of the most powerful nations on the planet, back when we were just a bunch of colony farmers. We were more then willing to die for it.

You want to defend home, then wait till the battle is at us. You cant predict who will attack, or why. All you can do is defend yourself when defending is called for. 9/11 was in no way an excuse to invade two countries half way around the world. You want to defend us, keep our borders secure, regardless of attack. Stop them from coming in. I have no problem with taking every last soldier in iraq out of iraq and putting them on the entire border of the US (after an iraqi government is established). Every air port, every port, every piece of connected land. Defend that. We have 12 million illegal immigrants that prove your not protecting our boreders.

Now I dont necessarily have a problem with self defense, because thats the only true way you can call it defending yourself. But what we are doing is not defending our country, its murder.

Originally posted by Muaddib
Anyways, I apologize for going off topic, but i hate it when people exagerate and lie.

If you're refering to me, I'm not aware of any point when I exagerated or lied. If you could point it out, I'd much appreciate it.

As for an American insurgency, would you be an insurgent? When there are armed soldiers at every street corner? When you are shot for being out past curfew? Or would you be content because there is cleaner water in your town, or less crime on the streets?