hermaphrodite polar bears - So? What's the fuss?

Hello all,

An article by David Usborne (10 January 2006) titled, Toxic waste creates hermaphrodite Arctic polar bears says that:

Wildlife researchers have found new evidence that Arctic polar bears, already gravely threatened by the melting of their habitat because of global warming, are being poisoned by chemical compounds

Well that's not good! That's for sure!

But then the article goes on to say:

There is also evidence that compounds similar to the PBDEs have contributed to a surprisingly high rate of hermaphroditism in polar bears. About one in 50 female bears on Svalbard has both male and female sex organs

It seems to me that the hermaphrodite is probably a natural state of being. Isn't that after all where we all came from?

If we read Chapter 5 (the Generations of Adam) in Genesis - isn't it kinna clear that the first borns: Adam who begot Seth who begot Enoch who begot Cainan who begot Mahalaleel who begot Jared who begot Methuselah who begot Lamech who begot Noah .. were all hermaphrodites.

Recall that after the first borns - then (and only then) was it that each of the first borns had sons and daughters!

Then it was that in Chapter 6:1 ¶ And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth and daughters were born unto them, that the sons of God saw the daughters of men, that they were fair; and they took for themselves wives of all whom they chose.

And hence us!

Does that make sense?

bc
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Hermaphroditism in mammals is unusual, and in this case its an abberation caused by exposure to toxic compounds. THere's nothing 'wrong' with hermaphroditism itself, but I think that they are trying to say that these chemicals can have dramatic effects on the wildlife, and that therefore, they probably shouldn't be dumped willy nilly.

first borns[...]were all hermaphrodites.

I wouldn't say that its clear. In the garden god makes adam and eve, and only then is it possible to have children.

But whats it matter, the book of genesis is the mythology and folklore of a tribe of nomadic goatherders. Why would you look to it, in particular, for information about the natural world? Wouldn't it make more sense to look at the natural world itself, like the researchers in the article did?

Don't some species of Frogs have this ability also?

Great Find!

Hello Nygdan and all,

Nygdan wrote] But what's it matter, the book of Genesis is the mythology and folklore of a tribe of nomadic goatherder.

bc] I'd not go so far as to say that ..

Nygdan also wrote] Why would you look to (Genesis) ... for information about the natural world?

bc] I recognized a likeness between the stories of hermaphroditic Polar Bears and the Generations of Adam so it seemed the natural thing to do!

bc
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If, and I ask IF, polar bears are heading toward extinction, would this be proof of evolution in the polar bear?

If the bears have fully functioning genitalia of both sexes, then they would be able to propogate without waiting for a "male" or a "female" wandering into each other's territory.

JDub

Originally posted by StarLord
Don't some species of Frogs have this ability also?

Some types of frogs and other amphibians will change their sex. Worms are functional hermaphrodites, they have both organs, this is because, well, worms don't have much of a social life! If they even happen to run into another worm, they've gotta make sure they can breed!

I'd not go so far as to say that

Goats, sheep, maybe some internicene warfare here and there. Same diff.

would this be proof of evolution in the polar bear?

That'd be pretty disturbing for some reason, a population of hermaphroditic polar bears. What would Stephen Colbert think of that bear problem?

The characteristic is in the population, so its subject to evolution (assuming it can be passed on of course).

Does this mean that Polar Bears can reproduce themselves and will not become extinct?

Maybe this is natures way of saving itself... either way we don't want it getting out that this chemical causes this condition or else the weird crowd will want to consume it.

Originally posted by BlueTileSpook
If the bears have fully functioning genitalia of both sexes, then they would be able to propogate without waiting for a "male" or a "female" wandering into each other's territory.

JDub

Most likely not. What they are describing is so rare that only 1% of mammals are this way. It is even more rare for either of the male or female organs to function. Which means no more little polar bears running around.

Hello BlueTileSpook and all,

BlueTileSpook asked] ... If ... polar bears are heading toward extinction, would this be proof of evolution in the polar bear?

bc] My take would be that it's a case against evolution and in favor of catastrophe (for sure] .. and Creation (perhaps). Because one alternative to evolution is catastrophic biological change brought about by some fast acting circumstance that would breed some indigenous trait.

So if chemical exposures can breed hermaphroditic polar bears - why not lightning caused fires producing chemicals that could breed a new kind of dinosaur?

Evolution has a lot of opponents in the natural world.

bc
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Originally posted by beforebc
My take would be that it's a case against evolution and in favor of catastrophe (for sure] .. and Creation (perhaps).

?

Are you saying god designed the polar bears to become hermaphrodites when man's actions started destroying their habitat???

Because one alternative to evolution is catastrophic biological change brought about by some fast acting circumstance that would breed some indigenous trait.

This is a mutation. Catastophism is the idea that dramatic events happened in the past that don't happen in the present, ie, anti-uniformitarianism.

So if chemical exposures can breed hermaphroditic polar bears - why not lightning caused fires producing chemicals that could breed a new kind of dinosaur?

How would that be contra evolution? Its a mutation that, if favourable, will be spread throughout the population. That is evolution.

Hello Nygdan and all,

Nygdan wrote] Catastophism is the idea that dramatic events happened in the past that don't happen in the present.

bc] Where'd you get that? Catastophism is like the crust shifting again and again.

Something has to account for the fact that 10,000 years ago we had sabre toothed cats and now we have lions, tigers and bears.

Bit short for evolution!

bc
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How do you figure its not enough time for some species to go extinct?

Hello Nygdan and all

Nygdan wrote] How do you figure its not enough time for some species to go extinct?

bc] Wrong word! Should be evolve!

[edit on 5-5-2006 by beforebc]

This is due to endocrine disruptors - mainly synthetic aestrogen.

Here's an article that may interest called "boys will be girls":

www.truehealth.org...

Cheers

JS

Bears have been around for more then 10,000 years and so have Saber Tooths

Bears

Bears , Lions and Tigers probably do have a common ancestor but its defiantly not a Saber Tooth

These Polar Bears seem to simply have a mutation and since its in only a tiny part of the population id say its from a chemical they where exposed to while in the womb.

Id like to see the survival rates of these bears.

I think this is coherent im just a tad drunk

Originally posted by beforebc
Wrong word! Should be evolve!

Why? Bears and wolves co-existed with sabre-toothed cats. The big differences between the pleistocene faunas in, say, North America and the modern ones, is largely a result of extinction, of the sabre-toothed cats, the giant ground sloths, camels, horses, the mammoth and mastodons, etc.