The Shooting of John Lennon

Greeting all , i hope u are all well .
" Do you remember when you heard the news?" ( lyrics from the beatles )
The assassination of John Lennon comes next only to the shooting of JFK and has the similer sort of government conspiracy feeling as that of 9/11 .
I would imagine that if you were alive when the killing of John Lennon took place on the December 8 , 1980 , there is a very high possibiility that you will no doubt remember it .
As the horryfiing news broke out around the globe about this unfortunate event everyone was in a state of shock and disbelief. Noone could understand why someone would want to kill a member of the most beloved band of all time , The Beatles .
An Ex Beatle , Musical Genius and a very influential campaigner for peace , why would someone do this? I ask you people what would drive someone to something this foul and distastefull??

The medias answer to this was that Mark David Chapman - was convinced that Lennon was in league with the devil along with being both a obssessed man over lennon and a disturbed loner finally snapped and killed John Lennon.
After a sixty say turned into a year and sixty day psych evalutation of absolute silence Mark Chapman pleaded guilty to the said crime just hours before his trial was to start .
Soon after conspiracy theorists were supplementing the presses version of events with there own interpretations of what happens the night the world was robbed of this cultural giant . Some people believe that this ghastly work was not only that of a mad man but part of a huge pollitical plot.
This is the bbc newsflash of that tragic day . news.bbc.co.uk...
Could the FBI be responsible for this ?
It is known that the late FBI director J Edgar Hoover had a pathologiocal hate for John Lennon and had tried to get President Nixons chief of staff to bust the musician and have him thrown out of the country. The
FBI is said to have kept Lennon under close survelience ans scrutiny throughout the 70s and tried to mangle his attempts to get US citizenship.
The FBI files on John Lennon to this day remain classified apparently due to the fact that they are linked to british intel info on lennon .
Conclusion is if there was a plot to kill the singer it is not unreasonable to think that the FBI was responsible. This page is an interesting one i found on Google.
www.lennonfbifiles.com...
There are also odd things that have to do with the CIA , such as Chapman had worked for several deffence companies with close ties to the CIA .
Apparently it is said that he had some symptoms of those whom have been hynotised . MK ULTRA perhaps??
This could possibly be the answer to the reason Chapman murdered his former hero.
www.mackwhite.com... I also found this webpage on Google.
The strange part of all this is that one of the reasons people kill celebs is for a certain degree of media popularity in turn to become famous themselves HOWEVER in all the time jailed Chapman turned down more then 60 interviews and only spoke to someone once to ask for his release after he failed to get parolll in October 2003.
It is said that his calmness was very odd after his arrest (could this possibly be a sighn of MKULTRA??)
HOWEVER it is odd that he mnaged to evade matal detectors and searches when transporting the weapn from Hawai to New York.

It is also strange that given the strength of the public to gain the FBIs files on lennon using the freedom of infomation act . The FBI would not let these files out......How odd.that the FBI answer to this was that relesing the files would cripple national security......Hmmmmm.?
IT is also strage the in the beatles record Majical mystery tour there is a picture of Lennon near a sighn that sais "THE BEST WAY TO GO IS BY MD&C"
Could he have known???? or was he sighposting the conspiracy???
This is all very interesting to me and i would like to hear your thoughts on the matter.

Here are some more interesting links to things about lennon .
www.carpenoctem.tv...
www.shout.net...
dmoz.org...
I found these on Google but there are many more out there.
Let me know what u think guys and gals.

Thank u

Omega


[edit on 18-4-2006 by Omega85]

In my view, I searched hard for a conspiracy behind Lennon's death. I even went to the extent of reading Catcher in the Rye. It was a bad book, about nothing. Perhaps to Chapman, it meant something coy or whatever, but it's to my belief that Lennon got killed by a madman. Whether this madman got turned onto Lennon, I don't know, but there isn't much evidence to support the idea that Chapman was brainwashed by evil folk to do their dirty work for them. It's strange really. FBI and the CIA were keeping tabs on him, so who knows? I for one, feel he may have just fallen victim to an idiot who wanted to get famous. There was intent though. You can claim he was deranged and all, but that's shifting the blame away from Chapman. What he was hoping to achieve, I don't know.

My opinion is that Chapman was a part of MK-Ultra. Him having "Catcher in the Rye" (multiple copies) and all. Didn't the guy who killed Robert Kennedy also have multiple copies of that book? I believe he was part of the MK-Ultra experiments also. MK-Ultra was real people. There is even a transcript out there about a congressional inquiry into it headed by Ted Kennedy (I don't think that that is a coincidence either). Heck, the CIA had president Kennedy killed, you don't think they'd kill some rock star?

I don't go for the conspiracy death of Lennon.
Why can't it just be possible he was killed by an obsessed, insane fan? A nutjob?
You can pin the "six degrees" theory on anyone.
If the FBI/CIA had been tracking Lennon it was because he had a massive influence on a whole generation of people; namely the hippies, freaks, druggies, lunatic fringe types. In the governments eyes these people were undesirables, whether they were harmless or not. Remember at one point Lennon declared the Beatles "more popular than Jesus". This made lots of folks angry and suspicious of the Lennon's motives in the music world.

My opinion is that Chapman was a part of MK-Ultra.

I lean toward this being true. The government had many reasons for wanting Lennon taken out. Hell, it could have just been a practice assassination by the people behind MKULTRA.

Remember at one point Lennon declared the Beatles "more popular than Jesus". This made lots of folks angry and suspicious of the Lennon's motives in the music world.

John Lennon was just being flip. He was really kidding and Born Agains and other Christians took him seriously. He said over and over again afterwards, that he didn't mean it the way everyone took it. He actually felt it was crazy the way people were crazed over the Beatles. This is why they had to stop touring, because people were too wacked out over them. They couldn't perform over all the noise at their shows and people and the Beatles themselves were in danger due to the mob hysteria brought on by these crazed fans. Lennon felt it was wrong for people to be this way....he didn't think it was cool.

Oh, for crying out loud... I can name 50 people who probably have multiple copies of C.I.T.R. laying around. It's a hugely popular book and one of the few good ones I was required to read in high-school english. I think it's a great book.

Originally posted by Excitable_Boy
John Lennon was just being flip. He was really kidding and Born Agains and other Christians took him seriously.

Well he wasn't really kidding. What he meant was that it's a bad thing that the Beatles were more popular than Jesus, religion, church, faith etc...He only said Beatles for obvious reasons, he could have said TV, alcohol, anything really that is popular in the culture.
John especialy was embarrased about their incredible fame, a working class man living in guilt of having such huge wealth and power. He was actualy putting himself down with that statement, like how dare we be more popular than Jesus.
He was trying to tell us something wasn't right with that situation.

But as we all know, ppl like to attack those we put on pedastalls, even though they attacked the messenger (John) they agreed with him really, even though they misunderstood the message.

Even though I'm a big Beatles fan, no one should be given that much admeration for just entertaining us.

I believe it's possible he was assasinated by the FBI, he was a big threat in the 70's, involved with some high up anti-government types and of course he had a huge influence over ppl. But he was just acting on his wealth guilt, playing the working class hero whilst staying rich. He even moved into a shaby basement apartment, trying to shed the strappings of wealth, didn't last long did it?

Anyway he wouldn't be the first to have recieved judement by the state for being too outspoken.

Here is a link to a previous thread on the Lennon murder:

Happiness is a Warm Gun

ANOK and Excitable Boy, both of you guys had good points.
I too am a huge Beatle fan. I was born in '63, so the older sisters played them relentlessly from the moment they hit our shores. They were kinda the early background soundtrack to my life (them and the Rolling Stones). It was a rock'n'roll household. I'm glad I was around to witness that era somewhat, even though I was young. I remember when everybody started growing there hair really long (the emergence of the hippies). I remember when the Beatle albums were coming out. I remember when they broke up. I ended up getting into Paul only after they broke, and years later into John's solo work. George did some nice stuff too.

ANOK you're right about John. He was getting bigtime political there for awhile, with his bed-in/sit-in, his protesting, his conversations on talk shows. At the time he died he had kinda shyed away slightly from the anti-establishment, rebel, image. And, well, I saw him as getting middle-aged and blending into the establishment (at that time). So in that respect it's really hard for me to believe the Feds would be involved in it. Lennon had mellowed by that point and was hanging w/Yoko and raising Sean. He wasn't making trouble at that point. I truly think Chapman was warped and he offed John Lennon. I mean if you're world famous, anything is plausible. That's why so many stars have bodyguards (especially now).

I'm not sure.....some things definitely look like conspiracy, but this one didn't hit me that way.
At the time Lennon was making a comeback (w/Double Fantasy) and it was a really romantic album about love, relationships, growing older....not political.

It's funny everyone sees John as the political rebel but really that period lasted at most 2 yrs of his life.

In reality he was a thug, he mugged German sailors in Hamburg. He beat his wife and ignored his kids.
More guilt he tried to deal with by joining the 'peace' bandwagon.

The bed-ins were in reality about showing the world he was still in control of his own life, more of a shove off to the music industry that owned him, than to the establishment. He was very restricted as a Beatle, John was too selfish to allow himself to be overshadowed by anything, including his band, he was John Lennon not John Beatle. He had to do something radical, and along comes Yoko.
Couldn't say F off to the Beatles, the fans and the music industry better than marrying an oriental (this is the 60's folks). The bed-ins and baggism were all Yoko's ideas and weren't nothing new. She had done the same thing before, I forget who with now. It was all part of her avant garde art scene.

He dropped the peace scene as soon as he realized those he was following were just after his money.

He was actualy putting himself down with that statement, like how dare we be more popular than Jesus.

He didn't think they were more popular than Jesus....or thought to be more popular than Jesus. Although, Jesus probably would have reacted the same way!

Well, no he didn't think they were more popular in the bragging sense.
He was reacting to a statement, by a reporter in a private off-record conversation, that church attendance was going down and most kids were more interested in the Beatles than going to church.

What he said was true, but it was taken out of context. His meaning of the statement was taken the wrong way by a group hell bent on knocking ppl off their pedestals, and the sheeple followed along.

IMHO i think it was his wife that got him shot, i heard yoko ono actually thought that she could sing, and she was influencing johns choices in the music they were writing as a band. she was driving the band apart and john was a thinking about divorcing her before he was shot. sounds like a motive. i heard an uncle go off about it when i was a kid, it stuck and thats the way i always thought it was. whats more likely though, an fbi cover up or a crazy soon to be ex wife that is about to lose all her undeserved wealth and power?

Well the 'band' broke up 10 yrs before he was shot, and John had no intention of devorcing Yoko at the time he was shot.

In fact he had been in seclusion with Yoko for about 5 yrs after his 'long weekend' which was actually a yr in LA with May Pang getting stoned.
The idea was Yoko's because John was getting disillusioned with her and she thought a break and an affair would fix the problem. It also left her free to do her own thing, using John wealth and influence of course (Which is why she married him in the first place). You don't hear this much but she would have married any of the Beatles, she didn't care who, she just wanted one and she got John. She has claimed she could have got Paul.

Anyway he couldn't divorce Yoko, he needed her. He figured that out during the 'weekend'.

ANOK, I will say you know your Lennon very well. I've read a couple Lennon biographies and you nailed everything fairly acurately. Good job, man! ANOK knows what he's saying.

Thanx Zerotolerance!

Just a lot of reading and understanding of human nature. Been a Beatles fan since high school, they're a fasinating study, more so than any other band I think.

People don't realise for a band to be really successful it has to be a very carefully balanced mix of personalities, rarely does this happen naturaly. When it does you get bands like The Beatles. Even though they pretty much wrote their songs individualy after '64, they still were far better than anything they produced as solo artists. None of them were outstanding musicians (maybe Paul), but as a whole they produced magic. There's been nothing like them since. And I include George Martin in that mix, without him they would have been nothing. Anyway sry for going off topic.

Greetings all
your posts are all amazing and interesting , i thank u
Personally i am really convinced that chapman was indeed hypnotised or under some kind of MKULTRA project . there are to many odd occurencess and i think the only way that he could have transported his weapons through two high tech security termnials is if there were more powerfull interests in it then were originally thought .
once again great looking thread people , keep up the good work
many thanks

Omega85

He should have moved to Japan..

Would have been a much cooler place to hang-out and not get killed by the schizo-gnostic zombie army.

[edit on 22-4-2006 by Edelweiss Pirate]

John was killed because he had a object that he was givin by an alien.,as seen here

www.ufocasebook.com...

Now that was a really interesting link Timoothy. I wish I could hold that egg, maybe you could sense something from it it you had it in your hand. You know it's funny, but I feel this connection to Lennon and it's not his music but all the things I read about him that interest me. He seemed like such a marvelous flawed man, I just feel this love for him. Thanks for the post, I liked reading the article.