Blackstar XOV: Wind tunnel model photos?

still looks like a boat. Do I have to post pictures of boats to show how the story could go one way or the other ?

The guy does seem to be linking a site selling models... credibility has nose-dived. I am unconvinced by the WS-118P as well - either he's a moron or he's double playing us talking so vaguely about his models by saying what it says on the box like it's some sort of detective work.

I now give this about 0.5/10.

Originally posted by imbalanced
still looks like a boat. Do I have to post pictures of boats to show how the story could go one way or the other ?

If you could find a photo of a boat that looks just like this one, then that would not only settle this specific issue, it'd also torpedo the whole Blackstar thing. However, it would seem to be an odd boat that would have a cockpit like this one and an (admittedly odd) vertical stabilizer.

Compare these views:
The "Lockheed X-151"

The "XOV"


Note the extreme similarity of the vertical tail, the round spine, and even the two top-surface flaps (how often do boats have flaps like these?) The aerospike engines on the XOV don't look much like the grillwork on the aft face of the "X-151," but the aerospikes are just what Av week interpretted witness descriptions of "grill like the front of a car" (or words to that effect) as being.

Originally posted by planeman
The guy does seem to be linking a site selling models...

Really? How do you figure?

And you ignore the aerospace history research documentation.

But I must say, I find this quite entertaining. Had I been flacking Nazi flying saucers, CIA mind control rays or alien abductions, I'd get more respect than I do as a guy who has been publishing information on classified aircraft and spacecraft projects for *years*.

Thanks for the chuckle!

It still looks like a boat to me.
If you have any proof other then rendered 3d imagaes please provide it.

It's not a boat... as such...

Originally posted by planeman
I am unconvinced by the WS-118P as well - either he's a moron or he's double playing us talking so vaguely about his models by saying what it says on the box like it's some sort of detective work.

It says this:




Not really a whole lot to glean from that. It's Secret, it's from Bell Aircraft, it's System 118 P, and it is of some scale I can't make out. That is all I have at present on WS 118P. A great deal of the early studies leading to the Dyna Soar are still classified. Some is available in some detail, such as the Bell SR-126...



The somewhat later Bell WS-464L...




and even the slightly later Convair RoBo...




But for WS-118P, that one photo and some description is the sum total of my data. If that makes me a "moron," then, by all means, let's see what *you* have on these projects.

Originally posted by imbalanced

If you have any proof other then rendered 3d imagaes please provide it.

I have no "rendered 3-D images." I just have some photos of questional provenance showing what appears to be a wind tunnel model.

If I had the skill to do good CG rendering, I wouldn't waste time doinking around cobbling together wind tunnel models, I'd go for the "real thing." The CG render shown was Av Weeks rendering... don't like it, take it up with them.

Orionblamblam, joking aside, your story appears suspicious.

Blackstar is the latest fad, funny how your sensationalised discovery suddenly pops up.

Your "evidence" pictures are all hosted at a site selling models (www.up-ship.com...). You say that someone sent you the pictures yesterday. Therefore, there are three clear possibilities:
1. You are involved in the up-ship website and uploaded the pictures. If so then why are you being so sensational about it all???? marketting???
2. The sender is involved in up-ship and uploaded the pictures. -this doesn't make sense since whoever runs up-ship doesn't need your advice on what they are. We should be talking to up-ship direct.
3. The sender doesn't exist, you are involved in up-ship or otherwise found the pictures there and are trying for attention.

Which is it? straight answer or credibility will slip further.


[edit on 26-3-2006 by planeman]

There are rendered images. I didnt say I didnt like them I just said if you have any other proof other then pictures we would be interested in hearing it.

Originally posted by planeman

Blackstar is the latest fad, funny how your sensationalised discovery suddenly pops up.

Sensationalized?

Originally posted by planeman
1. You are involved in the up-ship website and uploaded the pictures.

Yes, I own that site. So? Why is that an issue? I also uploaded most of the other images I've recently posted. Lots of peopel own websites. It's all the fad these days.

Originally posted by planeman If so then why are you being so sensational about it all???? marketting???

What exactly do you see me marketting?I'm not selling the photos, my magazine "Aerospace Projects Review" is no longer published and is out of print, and I have no Blackstar or X-151 or motorboat models for sale.

From:control-alt-delete.ca...

Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 3:10 pm Post subject: Project Tobacco? What exactly is it?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote:

(link at end)

Project Tobacco? What exactly is it?
By: John Greenewald, Jr.

Running an internet web site, I get many pranksters, jokers, and liars
write me and tell me they are from the government, they are going to
kill me, or other rediculous claims, but there have been a few where
it made me think, "Maybe this one is for real." I got a letter, and
by request, I will call him Benjamin". Now, "Benjamin" wrote me in
regards to my web site, telling me about the Snowbird Aircraft
photograph I have on my web site. For those who are not familiar with
this photograph, it is a supposed alien aircraf, and the picture is
the craft mounted on top of a pylon, possibly at a Lockheed plant or
even Area 51. Now, "Benjamin" told me that this was an X-151 aircraft
from Project Torridor. "Benjamin" went on to say that you would never
get a picture of an alien aircraft in the daylight.

This was "Benjamin"'s first letter to me, and being taken back by his
knowledge about the craft, I still was not convinced of his claims. I
made a FOIA request to the United States Air Force, requesting a
picture of the X-151, unfortunately, I have been given no answer as of
yet.

"Benjamin" worked for the National Reconnaisance Office. All "Black
Projects" are compartmentalizerd, that way no agency can really know
what the other is doing. He went on to tell me a bit about a base in
New Mexico, in a mountain called Baldy. The base is 200 feet deep, and
30 acres square. There are 1,500 from another world working there.
They come from a dead planet in the Cygnus Ra Star System. "Benjamin"
worked there, and gave me the exact coordinates: 21hours 13minutes
52seconds D33degrees 10'. The aliens, in exchange for us giving them
a place to live, they will help us advance to join some kind of an
alliance of planets. They hope that we will be ready by the year
2025. This is where Project Tobacco comes in. Project Tobacco is a
project to get the public ready for this event. It is done through
movies, media, books, television, and magazines. Project Tobacco was
given it's name because if anybody else would find out about it, it
would burn up like Tobacco. So, on December 09, 1997, I wrote a
Freedom of Information Act request to the United States Air Force, and
also to Wright Patterson Air Force Base, which "Benjamin" told me was
part of the project. I received 2 letters back, both dated December
29, 1997. The first was just an aknowledgment receipt. The second,
was a letter starting off saying "This office is not a repository for
UFO information." It went on to give me informartion on UFOs and
Project Blue Book, and they attached a Fact Sheet on UFOs, a page I
have been given many times. Confused, I checked back to my letter, not
1 mention of UFOs, aliens, anything for them to spark a response like
that, NOTHING. Was this a goof-up? "Benjamin" was very surprised I
got this response, and he told me it was definately a mistake. Wright
Patterson is still to respond, but what will I get, if anything, from
them? Now I am getting very interested, possibly "Benjamin" is
telling the turh. Or maybe the Air Force did goof-up, but maybe they
just figured I was tallking about UFOs? Highly unlikely, because not
all my requests to them deal with UFOs.

Now, I am going to do an excerpt out of one of "Benjamin"'s letters,
because I figure if I paraphrase it, I will just get the information
mixed up. So here it is: "I worked on the Gravity Catapult. Einstein
General Theory has a number of similarites to the Maxwell theory of
electromagmetism. In electromagnetism, the basic source of all the
forces is the charge in the electron. The charge generates an
electric field. If you move the charge to form an electric current,
the current generates a magnetic field. If you increase or decrease a
magnetic field, that hanging magnetic field in turn generates an
electric field. The same thing happens in gravity. The basic source of
all the forces is the mass of whatever particles you are using. The
mass generates a gravity field. If you move the particles to form a
mass current, the current generates a new field that is the
gravitational equivalent of the magnetic field. (an anti-gravity
engine). We have it, have had it for several years now and I worked on
it. Why do you think NASA is slowly trying to down-size. They keep
calling for smaller cheaper engines and so forth. They know that the
present form of space-flight as well as transportation here on Earth
is about to change. They don't want to waste the money...but they have
to or everyone will wonder why. The use millions of dollars of
tax-payer money on useless stuff! This engine uses no fuel, has no
sound and can never break. Since it uses gravitational fields for
motion...as long as you have gravity, the engine will work."

Is this infformation real? Did the United States Air Force make a huge
mistake by referencing UFOs on a Project Tobacco FOIA request? You
decide, here is the information, and the United States Air Force
letter can be seen on my web site, at
www.blackvault.com...

The same post, word for word, was made 8 years ago here: www.ufomind.com...

I have no Blackstar or X-151 or motorboat models for sale

true but some other models.

Originally posted by Orionblamblam



Note the extreme similarity of the vertical tail, the round spine, and even the two top-surface flaps (how often do boats have flaps like these?) The aerospike engines on the XOV don't look much like the grillwork on the aft face of the "X-151," but the aerospikes are just what Av week interpretted witness descriptions of "grill like the front of a car" (or words to that effect) as being.

Powerboats often have something called trim tabs that look something like that and are used to set the fore-aft trim of the boat, especialy when at speed. Another thing to look into.

Originally posted by imbalanced
true but some other models.

So? Do you see me advertising them? No, those "advertising" them are people who are whining that *I* am advertising them.

Something I find curious: I post these "X-151" pics, and peopel think I made them up to sell... something. I post pics of the SR-126, the WS-464L, the Convair RoBo, the Convair Super Hustler and all the rest... and silence. Strange, that.

Originally posted by planeman
From:control-alt-delete.ca...

It was interesting right up to the point that "Benjamin" mentioned aliens. And then... right off the deep end.

Originally posted by Nacnud

Powerboats often have something called trim tabs that look something like that and are used to set the fore-aft trim of the boat, especialy when at speed. Another thing to look into.

A bief Google search seems to indicate that those tabs are on either the rear underside or the aft face of the boat, not on the top.

Orionblam blam, I notice on your site mention of a book in preparation. Is this anything to do with the Midland Counties series and Tony Buttler?

Originally posted by waynos
anything to do with the Midland Counties series and Tony Buttler?

*Sort of*. I was contacted by their American publishing arm back in '03 (I was actually on vacation at the time... raiding the Boeing archives) with the idea of books on US Fighter Projects and US Bomber Projects, as their first choice, Dennis Jenkins, was too busy with other projects. I worked up a proposal for them, which they eventually declined on. So I've been forging ahead anyway. However, Buttler is now working on those books projects, so he and I have been co-ordinating our efforts so that we are not too redundant, and of course are also trading data. My bomber projects book will cover the more obscure projects, as well as go into some directiosn Buttler is not tackling... such as a big chapter on nuclear powered bombers, one on space bombers (manned bombardment vehicles that either operate from space or pass through space), hypersonic bombers, that sort of thing. Buttler is going to focus in detail on the big projects, I'm going after the wackier stuff.