Global Warming and Desertification and how you're being given the rope-a-dope

Ok, this thread is a very basic challenge: prove to me (the non-believer) that your resources on Global warming are credible. (gasps!)

Because we have resources that say both things, that its natural and anthropogenic.

But here's the deal:

Scientists who say it is anthropogenic gain research funding...why do you think that there is little research of the Northward migration of Africa as a cause of desertification in the sub-Saharan region?

Because they don't receive funding...liberals and governments pay to find out if humans are causing a climate change, not if nature is causing it.

In Africa the results are inconclusive that desertification is caused by humans.

But the media says it is...and so the money goes to those studying that cause.

And the same is for Global Warming.

Thus: prove your source is not motivated by Grant Money.

the big BIG problem is time we need lots more to know ANYTHING. you are right to question more then just the facs that the media feeds you! and did you know the only maj. CO2 detector is located on top of a active volcano lol crazy

Actually, in Africa the desertification being caused by humans is proven. Goats are the main factor in starting the process.

Ok, say we aren't changing the climate. Our current way of living is not sustainable. Watch Planet Earth on Sunday night and let David Atenborough explain why.

There have never been this many people alive in all of recorded history. Now, I'll point you in the direction of wikipedia, as their writers have much more skill than me. Just search 'Tragedy of the Commons'.

Also, say we aren't causing climate change. It will most certainly affect us eventually. Why don't we start preparing for eventualities, like the rising sea levels, if it is gonna happen soon.

I just think saying that they are natural occurances is weak. Even if man didn't cause them there are issues raised that still need to be dealt with.

For further thoughts go to:
www.abovetopsecret.com...
Where I give this all a better explanation.

[edit on 1/3/06 by byhiniur]

Originally posted by Byrd
Actually, in Africa the desertification being caused by humans is proven. Goats are the main factor in starting the process.

ok goats are not humans how are humans responcable for goats drinking all the water?

though Tragedy of the Commons is a very intresting way of looking at things it is best suited to evalution.
if you inspect the idea it is a balence of good and bad but it is mostly used for suporting unknown clames with unknown fats to support them. if i remeber corectly back in the 1960's they clamed taht the oil we have would not last past the year 2000 intresting..... did you know weve unly been able to test 20-30% of fosil fuiels of the world and we have only harvested a quarter of that. are you sugjesting if it is natural and a warming trend(that we are in and has been proven to be 100% non-human caused) are you sugjesting that we should change our enviroment to suit us???

i do agreee that we should get more in to renewable resorces.

ok goats are not humans how are humans responcable for goats drinking all the water?

That's funny. Goats drinking all the water.

: wipes tear from eye :

No, its the goats eating all the ground cover, which results in increased erosion and most of the moisture being baked from the soil.

Africa was a blighted continent before man was man, if I understand the timeline correctly. But that's not to say man doesn't have an effect on his environment. Whether its Indian peasants burning charcoal or African goat herders destroying great swaths of ground cover, we do have an effect on our environment.

One needs only look at our role as the exterminator of species to know we play the game as nature intended. Just as she removes the unfit, so do we. The birds too large and juicy for their own good. The quadrapeds too slow and trusting for their own good. Anything big and furry, really, for a while there.

But of course cars can't compete with volcanoes when it comes to smog production, Hell, cars can't even compete with trees when it comes to pollution! If nothing else, global warming is a reality that we are going to have to deal with. You don't generally investigate the cause of a structure fire while it rages hot, yaknow?

Let's deal with the situation by insulating our populations against climate change and food shortages, and then figure out the causation from a comfortable position.

I think the tradegy of the commons is interesting because we can be ignorant selfish herdsman or rational human beings. No rational herdsman would look after his own interests to the detriment of future generations IMHO. Consequently we should use what little information we have to make the best plans for the future.

A teacher told me that, around 1960 we were warned forty years. In my other thread I do mention it could all be a conspiricy theory to scare us, but I can't understand why.

There could be loads of deposits we haven't found... but they haven't been found. We have one world and I don't think the real, almost aristocratic, world leaders are responsible enough to handle the issues. Global warming is an accepted phenomena, the cause is questioned... so yeah, I think if all the scientists voted we should take precautionary action then why would they be tryin to mislead us.

I just had an idea... these scientists focus on curing diseases and the government tries to heal people. It would be better to provide them with living conditions and a good diet so they are less likely to succumb to illness. The scientists are finding this disease in the environment, its called global warming. Time will tell if it happens, and as your probably aware I want to be safe rather than extinct, so I think the government should be focusing on prevention... look at the NHS... maybe

i was hopeing some one would find it funny and not try to make fun of me for my pun lol

i totaly agree we shouldent rape plunder pillage and burn. there are much better ways to do things and i hope we as a species will find it out b4 we kill each other off. due to our nature as violent judgemental creatures i think it may be a while till we see goverments actulay looking out for the little guy and i think the first step is to get rid of the curruption of oil it has helped us technologicly but it is time for us to grow up and preserve the earth the best we can

i was hopeing some one would find it funny and not try to make fun of me for my pun lol

I wasn't trying to make fun of you, your comment just really made me laugh.

There are lots of ways to decrease consumption, not the least of which is by increasing efficiency. Homes could easily be 50% more efficient than they are, but construction standards are still ruled by aesthetics instead of good sense.

That's just one of a million ways to reduce our dependence. Ethanol is nice, because it's renewable, but any sort of bio-diesel is good to burn (provided you filter emissions appropriately). I really don't know why they don't bring back hemp as a bumper crop. It's really the best thing for what ails this country.

Hemp butter, hemp clothes, hemp fuel, it's all good. Screw the soybean people, they're shrinking our testicles I tell ya'! Sorry, what were we talking about?

wow thats a bit scarry but then the nation wide munchies would kick in and lord knows we dont need that. but ethanol is AWSOME where farmers out here we make corn and beans so we say BRING IT ON lol

Why is nobody pushing Kelp-biodiesel? Is it really that difficult to set up a kelp farm? I can't think of a better way to create biodiesel.

With kelp you don't need to set aside land to plant the biodiesel crops, seas would do, and the Earth's surface is largely covered with water. Also, kelp farms would provide an ecosystem for fish, which might help replenish depleting fish stocks.

Not to mention certain species of kelp grow really fast. Is it really that difficult to set up

The equation is simple:

Without humans the fossil fuels stay in the ground

With humans the fossil fues come out of the ground; 75 million barrels a day.

What comes out of the ground is BURNED... flames, fire, vrooom vrooom.

burned = heat

heat = warming

75 million barrels a day across the globe = GLOBAL WARMING

Can we be so foolish to believe anything different?

Yours in love and truth,

Sri Oracle

Man only ever deals with things when there on the doorstep, look at the UK's preperation for bird-flu. Throughout my life the problem of global warming has been highlighted. Man thinks he knows everything; "so there is the problem of global warming but we've got it under control and we'll fgiure out an alternative in time". Scientists are discovering new effects of global warming all the time; the glaciers melted faster today, higher temperatures in deserts will add to global warming effect yesterday and the movement of the gulf stream before that. Last century we were told how the lungs of the planet were being destroyed.

So, where do we go? One answer, for you conspiracy theorists, is that its all nonsense, with the media attempting to incite fear into our hearts.

The next path entails that we can, with concerted effort, prevent man's massive ecological footprint from extending into our atmosphere. I point you in the direction of my thread about my idea for a water turbine (please give me your criticisms, it'll help the person that does make it and then we can all have free energy i do my best).

The final direction these ideas lead me is that we are past tipping point. We only have one world, and we haven't been here very long. We used to think God did everything and now we have our own ideas. Well, these ideas might not be up to scratch. This environment we are lucky enough to exist in works on a clock people cannot contemplate. Most people resort to the 24 hour clock... "oh we've only been around for 3 seconds ".

Aren't we great, we, three seconds old, are masters of the universe. We can dig up oil, burn down trees, play with nuclear power, whatever we want. Well, try this thought experiment. Imagine the world was a 24 hour clock. We have changed this enviroment in the most unnatural way in the whole day. Nothing throughout the day will be able to demonstrate what will happen tomorrow, except that the earth is not without its mass-extinctions.

Now imagine a plane. It flys round the world in a day. Throughout that day it has troubles, but nothing it can't handle. Then at the end, human intervention, the pilots hijacked... game over.

I would ask someone to verify what I am now going to explain. A weekly magazine the UK, called THE WEEK, (the clues in the title, oh yeah) in Issue 549, 11 Feb 06, published an article featuring Jasper Gerrard, of Sunday Times acclaim, interviewed James Lovelock, a quoted "respected sciectist". The title was a Lovelock quote, and it sums up the article.

"The earth is doomed - let's make hay while it lasts"

there will never be such a thing as free energy sad to say but thats not the point of this artice.

oracle the fact is easy you couldent be more wrong
heat = infared radiation most of witch goes out in to space the sun make TRILLIONS ot times more heat then humans probaby ever will but yet agian thats not the thred topic.

lol the earth is doomed one day the sun will expand and fry the earth woopty do. the point is what ever we do the earth will survive so dont worry about it.

we have to worry about not killing ourselves before we realy do harm to the earth. the afracan water problem has been increasing far before humans started to industrealise.