There are No Atheists

Greetings Fellow Believers,

I am an agnostic, sitting on the theological fence. Something exists out there that I cannot understand. Something that is so huge that the motion of the Universe is the sound of his/hers/its/their breath.

Okay, okay...very "deep thought" and cryptic. Did you know that raw atheism cannot exist if the very concept of god whithers and slithers in the brains of atheists? If their brains can put three letters together, "g---o---d", the concept materializes so rapidly that it is almost an instinctual reaction.

It would be optimum if we could completely escape the thought of a supernatural being existing. But for some reason we keep doing it.

Any thoughts why? (and yes...this is for the atheists too)

Even if you are agnostic you are by default atheist. If you feel that it is impossible to know whether "God" exists, you obviously don't believe he does. This "dis"-belief, no matter how small, still by definition is atheist. Although you might not necessarily go around saying "There is no God", it is still weak atheism.

Atheist from dictionary.com :

One who disbelieves or denies the existence of God or gods

Agnostic

One who believes that it is impossible to know whether there is a God.

I have alot of concepts slithering through my brain, it doesn't mean I believe they are true.

[edit on 22-2-2006 by The Zodiac]

I am an agnostic, sitting on the theological fence. Something exists out there that I cannot understand. Something that is so huge that the motion of the Universe is the sound of his/hers/its/their breath.It would be optimum if we could completely escape the thought of a supernatural being existing. But for some reason we keep doing it.Any thoughts why? (and yes...this is for the atheists too)

It's known as the Matrix. Something exists out there and you know it, but a world has been created to keep you from the truth.

Atheism is a faith itself; it's the faith that there is no god. The reason I say it's a faith is because there is no scientific evidence or proof that God doesn't exist. The problem is that if there is no god, then science will NEVER be able to prove it because you can't prove a negative (if something doesn't exist, it can't leave any evidence of its lack of existence).

As an agnostic, it's difficult for me to have faith in something for which there is no proof of its existence.

The definition for agnostic previously provided is narrow, and incomplete. I don't know whether there is a god; and I don't know if science can ever prove God's existence. But I cannot believe in something that I can't perceive using at least one of my 5 senses AND that can be scientifically explained. So while I acknowledge the possibility that God exists, I'll continue to stand on the fence and watch humans kill each other in God's name and watch people polarize the human race using religion.

There are no athiests because athiests belive in nothing.

Believing in nothing is still believing in something. It is still a belief.


Simple as that.

I will not attempt to say I believe in nothing.

As you stated, Atheists simply do not exist, as a belief that there is no god, is in itself, a belief.

I, myself, to an outsider, would be described as an anti-christ.

Before you jump to conclusions, this title people label me with does not make me a satanist, or an anarchist. I am simply counter-religious.

I have seen more hardship come of religious beliefs than I have seen good. It is for that reason that I denounce all religion. You cannot argue my beliefs on the matter. They cannot be swayed.

I believe it is necessary to fade out religion. Not forcefully, nor by mis-information. I believe the choice to denounce religion must be that of the person themselves. Each person must voluntarily denounce servitude to any higher power, regardless of faith.

Yes, I am called an anti-christ. I do not refer to myself as such though. I am merely a robotics engineer with goals to improve mankind. I also realise I bear the symbol omega as a birthmark, I know this is used in religion to mark the bringing of the end... that is a simple coincidence. Its merely a shape that was caused by foreceps during my birth. As I said, its just a coincedence. One which can be explained scientifically. I can assure you, no matter how much I could try... I would be pretty hard pressed to bring about the end of the world...heh.

The believers in god have every reason to dislike me. I am against their beliefs. If they wish to label me an enemy, that is their choice. I will not judge you for it, and I will not label you an enemy. I am also equally an enemy of satanists, as I denounce their beliefs equally as much for its hand in the religious events that have plagued our race for so long.

Your path through life is your own. Not that of any god, or that of satan. It is yours. Do not permit anyone to convince you otherwise. You cannot truely be free unless you realise this. I do not offer salvation, or damnation. I offer only the freedom to belong to yourself.

Again, I am not an anti-christ, as much as I fit the description. My goal in life, the one I chose, is to attemt to better mankind through technology, information, and freedom to choose.

[edit on 23-2-2006 by johnsky]

johnsky,

Can we worship you? Your sounding better then god or satan!

Originally posted by johnsky
I have seen more hardship come of religious beliefs than I have seen good. It is for that reason that I denounce all religion. .

You cant lump all religions as one in that account some of the non-creator god religions like Buddhism have a much better track record then all the big three creator god ones.

Religion need not have any higher power


[edit on 23-2-2006 by ShadowXIX]

Originally posted by omega1
There are no athiests because athiests belive in nothing.

Believing in nothing is still believing in something. It is still a belief.


Simple as that.

That would only be true if the definition of atheist was "One who is without belief" which it is not, as Zodiac pointed out above.

Originally posted by johnsky

As you stated, Atheists simply do not exist, as a belief that there is no god, is in itself, a belief.

The definition of atheist is " One who disbelieves or denies the existence of God or gods".

I personally believe that it may snow here next week. So I have a belief. Doesn't mean I'm not an atheist though



Edit: I think that means I agree with Zodiac !


[edit on 23-2-2006 by Essan]

Originally posted by omega1
There are no athiests because athiests belive in nothing.

Believing in nothing is still believing in something. It is still a belief.


Simple as that.

Yeah, I have got to agree with the other posters - this is just semantic nonsense at every level.

I am an atheist, here are some things I believe:

I have 2 legs and 1 head
When punched in the face it hurts
I'm sat a computer writing futile comments
I have a brother who lives in China
George W Bush is a fool
I work in a hospital

Here are some things I don't believe:

George W Bush is made of cheese
The tooth fairy
That there is a God
The earth is flat
I can fly without the aid of mechanical devices
I am the Queen of England

The lists of things I believe and don't believe are endless. That there is a god gets into my "don't believe" list making me, by definition, and atheist.

I can understand the concept of a god, and I believe that other people believe in a god; does this stop me being an atheist? Of course not.

religion is the WORST creation of man.

the evil things done in the name of religion prove that man cannot handle religion in any form.

If there is a God......hes nothing more than a absentee landlord.

Religion.....what a joke !

I'm an Athiest.

So the title of this thread is incorrect.

Gods were invented because individuals can't cope with the loneliness of their own thoughts. Mankind is instinctively superstitious.

Agnostism is a cop out.

A person who believes nothing is a Nihilist.

I believe in science. Religion and science are incompatable.

Religion stops people from fully appreciating the significance of their lives.

Without religion good men would still do good things and evil men would still do evil things. Only religion can make a good man do evil things.

"Without religion good men would still do good things and evil men would still do evil things. Only religion can make a good man do evil things."


Wow, I really like that quote. I'll have to remember that one.

Youre beliefs fall in line with mine. Science, not religion.
The problem is getting the rest of the world to see it that way as well... without forcing them, or hiding/destroying their bibles.

Like I said.
I offer the right to have the information to make an educated decision, the freedom to choose, and the right not to be judged for the choice you make.

I do not believe in a god. As much as I have a marking on me that others would consider a "sign"... I consider it pure coincedence.
The difference is, I look at things in a more analytical manner than most religious people. I never jump to the conclusion "god did it"...instead, I seek to place a label on exactly what force caused the event.
In the case of my birthmark... the force was forceps.

I have found alot of religious people saying things like "Oh yeah, then explain THIS!"... to which I analyse their "sign" and provide many explanations for whatever 'evidence' they thought they had.

If one of them were to provide me with actual proof that god existed, then I would accept that proof... I cannot expect them to accept proof he doesnt exist, unless I am open to the possibility he might.

So its not that I refuse to believe a god exists... its just there simply is no evidence of it. There is however, plenty of scientific evidence that punches enough holes in the bible it would look something like confetti afterward.

The people who started these religions were amazing strategists though... "the point to religion is blind faith"... wow... if you believe in that, then there really is no point in arguing with you.

Access to all information, and the freedom to chose.

Originally posted by Jack of Scythes
Okay, okay...very "deep thought" and cryptic. Did you know that raw atheism cannot exist if the very concept of god whithers and slithers in the brains of atheists? If their brains can put three letters together, "g---o---d", the concept materializes so rapidly that it is almost an instinctual reaction.

It would be optimum if we could completely escape the thought of a supernatural being existing. But for some reason we keep doing it.

This is strikingly close to St. Anselm’s Ontological Argument for the existence of God. It is a famous philosophical argument, with which most Philosphy 101 students should be familiar. A boiled down version of the a priori argument is as follows:

St. Anselm first starts with the supposition that God does not exist in reality, but because we can conceive of God, God exists in our understanding.

St. Anselm posits that a good working definition of God is: a being than which nothing greater can be conceived. That is, God is a being that is understood to be perfect; God is a being that cannot conceivably be bettered.

Next, St. Anselm makes an important distinction between things that exist in the understanding and things that we understand to exist. An example of the former would be a leprechaun. Since we can conceive of the leprechaun, it exists in our understanding (which Anselm takes to be akin to a physical place). Since a leprechaun doesn’t exist in reality, we can say that while it exists in our understanding, we don’t understand it to exist. Ah, there’s the rub!

St. Anselm goes on to conclude that since we can conceive of this perfect being (than which NOTHING greater can be conceived), this being then exists in our understanding. But, as we know, for something to exist in reality is better than to just exist in our understanding. Therefore, this perfect being would be made more perfect if it existed in reality, and not just in our understanding. But, the idea of a perfect being becoming better is absurd. Therefore, according to St. Anselm, it would not be possible for a being than which nothing greater can be conceived to exist in the understanding alone. Thus, God must also exist in reality.

It’s a pretty argument, but I’m sure all the philosophy buffs here know the counter arguments.

Here’s a good link for a longer, better explanation of the Ontological Argument.

www.princeton.edu...

I think we can all see the similarities.

Hamburglar,

uhhh... huh? o.0

Originally posted by John bull 1
Agnostism is a cop out.

I prefer to see agnosticism as keeping an open mind. You have to be free of any system of thought otherwise you are no better than someone who believes in religion.

I believe in science. Religion and science are incompatable.

Science has still not disproved the existence of god and until it does I remain agnostic.



[edit on 23-2-2006 by johnnyutah]

Originally posted by Jack of Scythes
Greetings Fellow Believers,

I am an agnostic, sitting on the theological fence. Something exists out there that I cannot understand. Something that is so huge that the motion of the Universe is the sound of his/hers/its/their breath.

Okay, okay...very "deep thought" and cryptic. Did you know that raw atheism cannot exist if the very concept of god whithers and slithers in the brains of atheists? If their brains can put three letters together, "g---o---d", the concept materializes so rapidly that it is almost an instinctual reaction.

It would be optimum if we could completely escape the thought of a supernatural being existing. But for some reason we keep doing it.

Any thoughts why? (and yes...this is for the atheists too)

Buddy, sorry to burst your bubble, but youre completely wrong. Just because you can concieve something, does not mean that it exists, or that you believe in it. I can imagine a bridge across a river that is not there. However, that does not mean that I believe it is there, or that it is.

jack

i was in the same situation you're in not very long ago.

my suggestion is too look at all the various theological views you can. go talk to as many different theologians and religious leaders of all religions as you can. research every religion that piques your interest.

for someone who's an agnostic a more loosly doctrinaly based, nonauthoritative religion would probably be the best fit.

Pretty much like Zodiac and JB1 have said, there is such a thing as an atheist, an atheist is one who does not believe in a god(dess0 or god's(esses).

By definition, I'm an atheist, I don't believe in a higher power, so it's a bit insulting when someone tells me I don't exist.