Maryland and Walmart

I'm not good with the searches here. So if this has been discussed, forgive me.
With what the Maryland legislature has done with reguards to Walmart... The only viable option is for Walmart to close all their stores in Maryland. If Walmart is the evil they say it is, then why do people continue to shop there. It is because they offer the lowest prices. The answer isn't to punish them. (Nothing in the Constitution or LAWS say that an employeer has to provide health care for it's employees.) Continuing on this thought, 100's of people vie for the jobs a new Walmart opens. If other companies feel this is a disadvantage to them, then they should lobby to have the tax laws changed in there favor. Walmart is one of the biggest employers in this country. Thye get 100's of applicants when they open new stores. If a state is willing to use it's political clout to force them to change their business model, then maybe they should pull out of that state. And let the people of that state take their politicians to clout.
Does Walmart under cut their competition, HELL YEAH...but guess what..They are making money doing it, in volume. Walmart should pull out of Maryland. Let the people/shoppers go across the border to VA,WV, PA and save money. When the people, and more importantly, the former employees of Walmart in MD rise up, then those politicians who covet their jobs will know who is in charge. Not the special interest, not the lobbyists, and sure as hell not the UNIONS. It is the PEOPLE. The Constitution says "We the people,by the people" It's time the politians learn and understand this!!

Speaking as Someone who worked briefly for Walmart, Walmart does need to be destroyed. Their unethical business practices has diseased america with ruthless corporate mentality which is more concerned with the bottom dollar than with the people they sell to or the people who serve them.

Walmart's tactics are extensively understood, and they NEVER help the communities they are built in. Their low prices undercut other people in such a way as to drive others out of business completely, including private local stores that had been in business for generations. On top of that, other than what they pay their employees (A small amount), every red cent gets funnelled out of the community to Bentonville, Arkansas.

That means they bleed communities dry, and after they are done, they close down three out of the four stores they've built in a community that normally could never support that many Walmart's, leaving huge lots of possible building space vacant and un-purchasable by practically anyone locally.

They Kill towns, KILL them. They are against Unions, who negotiate fair treatment of employees. Why? Because they don't want to pay their employees more.

They use strongarm tactics... they censor their products, and can actually determine the success of a product by if they refuse to carry it.

There comes a time when a business has TOO much power, and NEEDS to be controlled or eliminated. Walmart passed that point quite a few years ago.

I live in Maryland I the last time I saw a Wal-Mart was over 10 years ago, when I lived in Georgia.

We can always use the South Park technique to get rid of the Walmarts.

I have to say that I agree with the first post. If it's such a bad business, people shouldn't work there. People shouldn't buy from wal-mart. Should government get involved in it? I don't think so. Everything the government touches they # up. The more power we give the government in regulating business, the more likely they are to keep pushing their power more and more into our everyday lives. They're already there more than I'd like it.

It's a very touchy subject, and like anything remotely "political" there is no clear cut solution without any negative consequences. It'll be interesting to see how it all plays out.

definately agree with the original poster and the one above me. Everyone that works at walmart works there by choice. I am very glad they fight unions as well. Unions only cause the very thing they fight. Higher wages, then higher prices, then they want higher wages, and then prices go higher. If people hate walmart and enough of the people want walmart to change, then they will do what we as a people have the choice to do. NOT SHOP THERE. It's a private business which still goes by the same self governance of all private business, customer satisfaction. When customers arn't satisfied, the company loses money and adjust. For walmart to be so big, obviously enough of the people don't have a problem with them. I prefer target though, less people in them usually.

[edit on 22-1-2006 by ajm4481]

Originally posted by CSRules
I'm not good with the searches here. So if this has been discussed, forgive me.
With what the Maryland legislature has done with reguards to Walmart... The only viable option is for Walmart to close all their stores in Maryland. If Walmart is the evil they say it is, then why do people continue to shop there.

Why is porn the biggest money maker on the internet? People are no damn good, and have no problem supporting evil if it a) saves them money, or b) gives them pleasure. Now if money and pleasure are the only yardsticks of ethics and morality, then you're right Wal-Mart can't be evil because so many people shop there.

Originally posted by CSRules
It is because they offer the lowest prices.

Not true. I can buy illegal bootleg Levis at the flea market for $5 a pair. Why don't I? It's illegal. Why do people shop at Wal-Mart. Because it's cheap and it's *legal*. What do you do if something that's "evil" or harmful to the community is legal? You change the laws to make it less evil or less legal.

Originally posted by CSRules
The answer isn't to punish them. (Nothing in the Constitution or LAWS say that an employeer has to provide health care for it's employees.)

You're right. And nothing in the Consitution or Laws say a hospital has to charge $1000 for an ambulance ride either. Can we regulate the medical industry to make it accessible to the average American if we can't regulate health care? Something's gotta give, or else we have a large Medical industry with no one but the rich able to afford it.

Originally posted by CSRules
Continuing on this thought, 100's of people vie for the jobs a new Walmart opens.

Because when a Wal-Mart opens, dozens of other stores close and those 100s of people lose their jobs. Next time you're in Wal-Mart look for that older guy who works in Hardware. He's always there. Real nice guy who smiles and says hey to the kids. Talk to him and you'll find out he used to own his own Hardware store. Or you could call my Uncle. He owned a Hardware store. Wal-Mart openned. He was unemployeed in less than a year. Works in a mail room sorting mail now.

Originally posted by CSRules
If other companies feel this is a disadvantage to them, then they should lobby to have the tax laws changed in there favor. Walmart is one of the biggest employers in this country. Thye get 100's of applicants when they open new stores. If a state is willing to use it's political clout to force them to change their business model, then maybe they should pull out of that state.

Hear! Hear! Can we make it a federal law so they pull out of the whole country? Wal-Mart is symbol of everything that is wrong with America today. It used to be a foregone conlusion that "The End never justifies The Means" but with Wal-Mart they justify all of their market bullying and defiance of Anti-Trust laws with the simple excuse: "We make lots of money."

Originally posted by CSRules
And let the people of that state take their politicians to clout.
Does Walmart under cut their competition, HELL YEAH...but guess what..They are making money doing it, in volume.

Which makes it completely right, huh? That's what I mean. We've gotten to the point in this country where high profits justify any and everything. It's really sickening to see people talk this way.

Originally posted by CSRules
Walmart should pull out of Maryland. Let the people/shoppers go across the border to VA,WV, PA and save money.

Or spend the few extra cents to shop at locally owned stores and get a 100% better shopping experience. Especially with the skyrocketing Gas Prices, it won't save much to drive accross the border, and if people start shopping locally again then maybe they'll realize what a better experience that is. Anyone that drives past a mom and pop to go to a Wal-Mart Supercenter is hurting America.

Originally posted by CSRules
When the people, and more importantly, the former employees of Walmart in MD rise up, then those politicians who covet their jobs will know who is in charge. Not the special interest, not the lobbyists, and sure as hell not the UNIONS. It is the PEOPLE. The Constitution says "We the people,by the people" It's time the politians learn and understand this!!

From your statements you must also think that anti-trust laws are unjust, or child labor laws, or worker's compensation, or anything else that requires a private profit making entity to treat the citizens of this country fairly and with respect. Maybe you should look for a supervisor job in one of those Indonesian sweat shops. They sound like your kind of place. Be careful though, if you get demoted there it's a heckuva drop off.

Anyone who wants to educate themselves on what all the fuss over Wal-Mart is, should check out the following link. It's a PBS Frontline report that illustrates many of the reasons the chain gets the repuation for being evil:

Is Wal-Mart Good for America?

Originally posted by ajm4481
definately agree with the original poster and the one above me. Everyone that works at walmart works there by choice.

Just as everyone that worked at Enron worked there by choice. That wasn't much of a consolation when their pensions were highjacked. You can't expect an 18 year old below the poverty line employee to know the ins and outs of Wal-Marts corporate practices. That's why we have an elected representative government. I mean some of these people can't even afford CABLE! Without FOXNews, how they supposed to know what to think?

Originally posted by ajm4481
I am very glad they fight unions as well. Unions only cause the very thing they fight. Higher wages, then higher prices, then they want higher wages, and then prices go higher. If people hate walmart and enough of the people want walmart to change, then they will do what we as a people have the choice to do. NOT SHOP THERE. It's a private business which still goes by the same self governance of all private business, customer satisfaction. When customers arn't satisfied, the company loses money and adjust. For walmart to be so big, obviously enough of the people don't have a problem with them. I prefer target though, less people in them usually.

That's all fine and dandy, but when Wal-Mart puts all the competition out of business because they have 10 year olds doing the labor in Asia for two cents and hour then there is no choice where to shop, is there?

Walmart and it's corporate philosophy is a mirror image of the Neocon economic philosophy. Move as much manufacturing offshore, eliminate union presence, reduce the number of tenured workers and leave people without healthcare. When the Neocons die so will Whoremart!

Wow. Al I can say is wow and I am amazed at the emotion involved in this. I shop Wally world because of convenience. It has virtually everything I need in one place. Who wants to drive all over creation just to find 5 items? All businesses are corrupt to a certain degree when they get past the mom and pop size. It is the nature of business and mankind for that matter to exploit each other. As to the neocon stuff, not true, the agenda if you follow is socialism. What better representation of it that the UNION. my .02

Originally posted by TheCrystalSword
Speaking as Someone who worked briefly for Walmart, Walmart does need to be destroyed. Their unethical business practices has diseased america with ruthless corporate mentality which is more concerned with the bottom dollar than with the people they sell to or the people who serve them.

Walmart's tactics are extensively understood, and they NEVER help the communities they are built in. Their low prices undercut other people in such a way as to drive others out of business completely, including private local stores that had been in business for generations. On top of that, other than what they pay their employees (A small amount), every red cent gets funnelled out of the community to Bentonville, Arkansas.

That means they bleed communities dry, and after they are done, they close down three out of the four stores they've built in a community that normally could never support that many Walmart's, leaving huge lots of possible building space vacant and un-purchasable by practically anyone locally.

They Kill towns, KILL them. They are against Unions, who negotiate fair treatment of employees. Why? Because they don't want to pay their employees more.

They use strongarm tactics... they censor their products, and can actually determine the success of a product by if they refuse to carry it.

There comes a time when a business has TOO much power, and NEEDS to be controlled or eliminated. Walmart passed that point quite a few years ago.

[sarcasm]It's plain to see how they "killed" Virginia Beach, VA, Salem, MA, Lynn, MA, Quincy, MA, Danvers, MA, Weymouth, MA, etc...or maybe in the Mid-Atlantic at Virginia Beach, Norfolk, Chesapeake, Suffolk, Hampton, Yorktown, and Newport News, VA...or maybe in.....well, you get the point[/sarcasm]

You can construe Walmart to be anything you want, but its just a plain lie to mark them as evil. They are a competitive store, doing it right. And the masses will continue to flock there and shop there.

I am not a big fan of WalMart, but I do shop there and I can see how the company does provide for some positives.

For exampled, if an upstart company can have their products sold at Walmart, there is a pretty good possibility that it will sell and maybe even sell very well. If nothing else, you are getting your product into many, many communities.

Additionally, WalMart Employs hundreds and hundreds of people. In the Maryland situation, the law targets those employers who have more than 10,000 employees, so we know that Walmart Employs at least that many people in the state. If Walmart were to completely pull out of Maryland, then there would be 10,000+ unemployed people. How would the state handle that?

Wow. Al I can say is wow and I am amazed at the emotion involved in this. I shop Wally world because of convenience. It has virtually everything I need in one place. Who wants to drive all over creation just to find 5 items? All businesses are corrupt to a certain degree when they get past the mom and pop size.

It's obvious that enough people think like that to keep Wally afloat.
People like me are in the minority, I don't shop at Wally's.

But, the temptation is enormous, yet my morals are stronger.

I'm a Zellers and Canadian Tire man!

Originally posted by OneGodJesus
Wow. Al I can say is wow and I am amazed at the emotion involved in this. I shop Wally world because of convenience. It has virtually everything I need in one place. Who wants to drive all over creation just to find 5 items?

What if they had slaves in chains working the check-out. Would you still shop there out of convenience?

Originally posted by OneGodJesus
All businesses are corrupt to a certain degree when they get past the mom and pop size.

That's a pretty broad statement, and I would agree that any business of a certain size has the potential to be corrupt, but that doesn't change the fact that Wal-Mart is about as bad as it gets and as long as they are allowed to continue their business model, it will be harming America.

Originally posted by OneGodJesus
It is the nature of business and mankind for that matter to exploit each other.

So you *are* in favor of slavery. How interesting.

Originally posted by OneGodJesus
As to the neocon stuff, not true, the agenda if you follow is socialism. What better representation of it that the UNION. my .02

I have no idea what you're trying to say here. Please elaborate.

Originally posted by DCFusion
Additionally, WalMart Employs hundreds and hundreds of people. In the Maryland situation, the law targets those employers who have more than 10,000 employees, so we know that Walmart Employs at least that many people in the state. If Walmart were to completely pull out of Maryland, then there would be 10,000+ unemployed people. How would the state handle that?

Again, talk to the people that work at Wal-Mart who are over 30. How manay of them worked somewhere else for more money and benefits before Wal-Mart showed up and put the other places out of business?

How would the state handle 10,000 unemployed? They would get jobs in the stores that fill the void left by Wal-Mart and in almost every instance get paid more and have more benefits.

Another link for those that are "confused" by the anti-Wal-Mart sentiment:

The Man Who Said No To Wal-Mart

Originally posted by BostonBill99
You can construe Walmart to be anything you want, but its just a plain lie to mark them as evil. They are a competitive store, doing it right. And the masses will continue to flock there and shop there.

Doing what right? Destroying communities and controlling wages to the point that they make sure people stay below the poverty level so they'll *have* to buy inferior imported goods produced overseas? Yeah, they do it right!

Read. Learn.

Wal-Mart's decisions influence wages and working conditions across a wide swath of the world economy, from the shopping centers of Las Vegas to the factories of Honduras and South Asia. Its business is so vital to developing countries that some send emissaries to the corporate headquarters in Bentonville, Ark., almost as if Wal-Mart were a sovereign nation.

The company has prospered by elevating one goal above all others: cutting prices relentlessly. U.S. economists say its tightfistedness has not only boosted its own bottom line, but also helped hold down the inflation rate for the entire country. Consumers reap the benefits every time they push a cart through Wal-Mart's checkout lines.

Yet Wal-Mart's astonishing success exacts a heavy price.

By squeezing suppliers to cut wholesale costs, the company has hastened the flight of U.S. manufacturing jobs overseas. By scouring the globe for the cheapest goods, it has driven factory jobs from one poor nation to another.

An Empire Built on Bargains Remakes the World

A November 2004 New York Times article cites a study in Georgia that found 10,000 children of Wal-Mart employees were in the state's healthcare program at a cost to taxpayers of $10 million a year. The same article describes a hospital in North Carolina that found that 31 percent of its 1,900 patients were Wal-Mart employees on Medicaid, and an additional 16 percent were Wal-Mart employees with no insurance at all.

Is Wal-Mart Good For America

So all you Conservatives that defend Wal-Mart, keep in mind how much they are feeding the "welfare state" by forcing their barely paid workers to use Government funded health care. Does it change the argument when you find out YOU are footing the bill Wal-Mart refuses to pay. Keep in mind this is a company that makes more profit every year than Microsoft and General Electric... combined. They make YOU pay for their employees health care.

$245 BILLION in sales, and yet YOU are paying for their employees health care. Yeah. Wal-Mart does it right!

Just as everyone that worked at Enron worked there by choice. That wasn't much of a consolation when their pensions were highjacked.

Yes they did work there by choice. But the scandal of Enron is not the the success at Wal-Mart.

You can't expect an 18 year old below the poverty line employee to know the ins and outs of Wal-Marts corporate practices.

Yes, well hopefully they are not planning on working at Wal-Mart their entire life. Hopefully they will go to school, and get a job somewhere else.

That's all fine and dandy, but when Wal-Mart puts all the competition out of business because they have 10 year olds doing the labor in Asia for two cents and hour then there is no choice where to shop, is there?

Haha..this one i will probably take some heat on. But look, who are we to impost our "ethical" standards on another country? When we were a young (non-advanced) country, were the youth not working there buts off out in the field? Were they not doing everything they could to help out around the fields? Were they not working aside a father or someone to learn a trade? Now where would we be as a country if that never happend? Did they work in prestine conditions? NO!!!!! So now here we are above most of the world, and we expect all countries, even ones worse off then we were back then...but here we still expect them to offer some kind of prestine working environment? Where would we be today, if some country commanded us to do that back then? What would we have thought about it? Our standards are not the worlds. Just because it is right here, it doesn't make it right everywhere. I would fight to death to stop kids from working here that young, because it isn't needed. Lots of these families depend on the money their kids bring in, lots of these kids depend on that money...just like kids were depended upon to do work back in the days in are great country. If i remember correctly there is even organizations of these young workers that are fighting back against the people who "know whats best for the world".

Originally posted by SKMDC1
What if they had slaves in chains working the check-out. Would you still shop there out of convenience?

Sure I would, see below.

Originally posted by SKMDC1
That's a pretty broad statement, and I would agree that any business of a certain size has the potential to be corrupt, but that doesn't change the fact that Wal-Mart is about as bad as it gets and as long as they are allowed to continue their business model, it will be harming America.

Your take on things not mine. Walmart Ruuuulz!!

Originally posted by SKMDC1
So you *are* in favor of slavery. How interesting.

Sure, Jesus wasn't against slavery so why should I be. In fact He made statements that in effect said you should be the best slave you can be if you are one already, just like if you are a master you should treat your slaves as God would treat you, by taking care of them and the old testament has rules for how to treat slaves if you have them. Most people forget that about the Word, all those socially uncomfortable verses.

Originally posted by SKMDC1
I have no idea what you're trying to say here. Please elaborate.

Just that if the neocons were trying to do away with Unions they are shooting themselves in the foot, unions are by traditional definition a socialist group and as such part and parcel to the socialist movement of wealth redistrobution.

Originally posted by OneGodJesus
Originally posted by SKMDC1
What if they had slaves in chains working the check-out. Would you still shop there out of convenience?

Sure I would, see below.

...

So, your compassion for your fellow man is not as important as the convenience of your life. Somewhere in heaven, Christ is shaking his head at this sentiment.

Originally posted by SKMDC1
That's a pretty broad statement, and I would agree that any business of a certain size has the potential to be corrupt, but that doesn't change the fact that Wal-Mart is about as bad as it gets and as long as they are allowed to continue their business model, it will be harming America.

Your take on things not mine. Walmart Ruuuulz!!

Yes, Like an internment camp it rules.

Originally posted by SKMDC1
So you *are* in favor of slavery. How interesting.

Sure, Jesus wasn't against slavery so why should I be. In fact He made statements that in effect said you should be the best slave you can be if you are one already, just like if you are a master you should treat your slaves as God would treat you, by taking care of them and the old testament has rules for how to treat slaves if you have them. Most people forget that about the Word, all those socially uncomfortable verses.

Excuse me? Jesus wasn't against slavery? Jesus was about compassion for your fellow man. Admittedly the bible references slaves during that time period, it was one of the major ways they did work back then. Doesn't make it right.

Perhaps you should be a slave in some third world country and see how much you like people using you like a commodity. You are part of the problem, and need to be removed. May you never breed, and if you have, then god have mercy on us.

Originally posted by SKMDC1
I have no idea what you're trying to say here. Please elaborate.

Just that if the neocons were trying to do away with Unions they are shooting themselves in the foot, unions are by traditional definition a socialist group and as such part and parcel to the socialist movement of wealth redistrobution.

"For Love of Money is the root of all Man's Sins".

[edit on 1/23/2006 by TheCrystalSword]

Originally posted by TheCrystalSword
Speaking as Someone who worked briefly for Walmart, Walmart does need to be destroyed. Their unethical business practices has diseased america with ruthless corporate mentality which is more concerned with the bottom dollar than with the people they sell to or the people who serve them.

Walmart's tactics are extensively understood, and they NEVER help the communities they are built in. Their low prices undercut other people in such a way as to drive others out of business completely, including private local stores that had been in business for generations. On top of that, other than what they pay their employees (A small amount), every red cent gets funnelled out of the community to Bentonville, Arkansas.

That means they bleed communities dry, and after they are done, they close down three out of the four stores they've built in a community that normally could never support that many Walmart's, leaving huge lots of possible building space vacant and un-purchasable by practically anyone locally.

They Kill towns, KILL them. They are against Unions, who negotiate fair treatment of employees. Why? Because they don't want to pay their employees more.

They use strongarm tactics... they censor their products, and can actually determine the success of a product by if they refuse to carry it.

There comes a time when a business has TOO much power, and NEEDS to be controlled or eliminated. Walmart passed that point quite a few years ago.

Well lets start today with FORD! They are laying off 30,000 people. Why? Because of UNIONS!! But guess what, they'll all go into a job bank and earn the same money...Why? UNIONS!!! When unions were created, they were needed, I don't dispute that. But today in the age of instant communication, THEY ARE NOT! Ford pays $40 to a union worker, while Hyandi, Toyaota, and others pay half that. Instead of paying a fair market value, the have to layoff people. These people may be family members, friends, etc... But to compete they have got to go. I had a UNION job once...Except for the healthcare benefits, IT SUCKED!!! I didn't make SH*T! Now I pay part of my benefits...(Yes this sucks, compared to before), but the net and gross money I make, far more than makes up for it. While I'm not happy with my job, THAT IS MY FAULT. I have 2 college Degrees, but like the rest of America, I'm questioning, giving that up for something better....

The American dream was always taking a CHANCE to make yourself better. I know that am looking TEPIDLY! But until we tell the people and they understand, that they can make a better life for themselves...I think most will stick with the status quo. Fortunatley, for me...I have friends who have taken that chance and it has paid off. So now my search has been expanded. Does that mean I will succeed, only time will tell.

But I have learned, from personal experience...that unions do more harm than good. What the H*LL does a bagger at a grocery store need to earn $15 an hour. HELL NO! That is a first job for anyone. If that is your lifes career, then maybe you need to be taken out of the gene pool. That is a job for high school students and retired people, who want to supplement their income. To expect to raise a family, bagging groceries is ridiculious. As a second job, maybe. These jobs are to train the young in the ares of working, not to make a living off of. Go out and better yourself, if you can't afford it, I'm willing to let my tax dollars help you. But you have to be willing to help yourself first. The American dream is not about a free ride from the Govt. (Although, these days some would be hard pressed to believe that...) It's about bettering yourself to make you indispencible.

Wal-Mart gives that oppertunity. The first job, the retirie looking to suppliment their income, but unless you have the forethought to become a manager, or go to the corporate side...It is an entry level position. They are not resonsible for supporting your @$$, they are to give you an idea of the real world. If you don't wish to learn, then you should be...what does DARWIN say (It;s the big deal these days, No creator, just us from apes) That the survival of the fittest shall prevail. THINK ON THIS!!