Is creation recycling even possible?

"Creation recycling" has GOT to be possible! I mean, we dig up prehistoric metropoli all the time...oh, wait, no we don't...hrmm, maybe the previous civilization had a strict religious stance against any sort of communal living, houses, nonbiodegradable materials, metal objects, plastic objects, fossil fuels, etc.

Oh wait, or maybe this theory doesn't hold water! That could be it.

Ciao
~MFP

Originally posted by bsl4doc
"Creation recycling" has GOT to be possible! I mean, we dig up prehistoric metropoli all the time...oh, wait, no we don't...hrmm, maybe the previous civilization had a strict religious stance against any sort of communal living, houses, nonbiodegradable materials, metal objects, plastic objects, fossil fuels, etc.

Oh wait, or maybe this theory doesn't hold water! That could be it.

Ciao
~MFP

www.answers.com...

Oh, I'm sensing sarcasm... I understand how hard it mat be to wrap your head around the idea of thinking for ones self, but here's one of my thoughts to borrow. Perhaps past civilizations had more forsight than us and had invented the idea of biodegradeable before modernization ruined the Earth? Or perhaps they didn't have the desire to be as complex as our world is and were more simple. The idea that it isn't possible is rubish. You may say improbable, be not impossible. Although considering your still a student, you're still trained to believe the books.

I take offense to your characterization of my beliefs based only on my status as a student. Perhaps you are the one who is a bit closed minded, no? Also, don't you find it a bit odd that there has never been metal jewelry, stone structures, or deep level organic remnants from humanoid cultures discovered other than our own progenitor cultures?

Ciao,
~MFP

Originally posted by bsl4doc
I take offense to your characterization of my beliefs based only on my status as a student. Perhaps you are the one who is a bit closed minded, no? Also, don't you find it a bit odd that there has never been metal jewelry, stone structures, or deep level organic remnants from humanoid cultures discovered other than our own progenitor cultures?

Ciao,
~MFP

I could just as easily ask if your very question is the product of your defense mechanism to not address the issue I first introduced (regergitated book knowledge).

Anyway, I would then have to combat your question by introducing the obvious fact that with our ever so constant geological transformations, and the fact that archeologists have excavated a nano-fraction of what is on the surface and at the bottom of our oceans. Are you familiar of the oceans that were once in UTAH. Perhaps other civilizations from our past are under the Mediteranian sea? All these are only ideas that could've been raised if you would've given the topic of the thread some entertainement, without just shooting it down because it was anti what your brain has yet digested. I'm sorry I like to hang out, outside of the box. I learn more that way.

Peace. AAC

So, even taking into account tectonic movement, ice age, oceans, etc., you think that we wouldn't have found any remnants of a massive earlier culture? I just don't see the logic in that whatsoever. There is no evidence to support it, even if you think outside the box. The only supporting evidence you've offered is your own opinion. I mean, I could just as easily say "Hey, what if deep within the earth's mantle, there are small little gremlins stirring all that molten nickel and steel?!" Obviously, I can't prove this, but it also seems so far removed from the realm of reality that it almost certainly is not true.

Ciao,
~MFP

Originally posted by bsl4doc
So, even taking into account tectonic movement, ice age, oceans, etc., you think that we wouldn't have found any remnants of a massive earlier culture? I just don't see the logic in that whatsoever. There is no evidence to support it, even if you think outside the box. The only supporting evidence you've offered is your own opinion. I mean, I could just as easily say "Hey, what if deep within the earth's mantle, there are small little gremlins stirring all that molten nickel and steel?!" Obviously, I can't prove this, but it also seems so far removed from the realm of reality that it almost certainly is not true.

Ciao,
~MFP

Cool. Then you can get off this thread now. I realized there was no evidence. Yet since I believe there are smart people on this board I threw the subject out there to possibly see if anyone had and evidence to toss in. Not people like you that think a simple sarcastic response can possibly make people feel inferrior for bringing up a QUESTION! (READ THE TITLE OF THREAD)

I'm not saying that there aren't intelligent people on here, and I'm not saying that you shouldn't research such things. I'm simply saying that when you can't find a shred of evidence before posting something, does it really belong? If I can sit here, without doing more than 10 minutes of googling, and use only my common sense to shoot about 100 holes in this theory, does it even seem plausible? I just don't see how it can, sorry.

Originally posted by bsl4doc
I'm not saying that there aren't intelligent people on here, and I'm not saying that you shouldn't research such things. I'm simply saying that when you can't find a shred of evidence before posting something, does it really belong? If I can sit here, without doing more than 10 minutes of googling, and use only my common sense to shoot about 100 holes in this theory, does it even seem plausible? I just don't see how it can, sorry.

After reading this all I could think to respond was RE-READ post. I think I gave just as solid explanations to your "so-called" hole shooting of the theory. Are you sure you've visited outside the box.

Thinking outside the box does not mean disregarding the actual theory of tectonic motion, applying a different concept of physics, ignoring a lack of evidence, and literally fabricating a situation in your mind and acting as if research has been done on the topic.

Just a nice little reminder, this place is to debate each others ideas and to not insult one another. Play nice children.

Originally posted by bsl4doc
Thinking outside the box does not mean disregarding the actual theory of tectonic motion, applying a different concept of physics, ignoring a lack of evidence, and literally fabricating a situation in your mind and acting as if research has been done on the topic.

I thought about just forgetting about you last thread and moving on. But then I thought about adding...

Tectonic motion has nothing to do with this question.

Different concepts of physics? Nice try!

Ignoring lack of evidence? That's what cynics say right before their theory is debunked.

Fabricating a situation in your mind and acting as if research has been done on the topic? I was studying the history of biodegradable compounds using organic dissimilation. And many products including some soft metals can breakdown molecularly in reletively soft heat over a long period of time. So I had a thought, Atlantis, who were thought to be highly intelligent, perhaps had the Earth in mind first hand and didn't modernize to the point where it is in great abundance now.

Marine Biologists say that we've researched and analyzed approximately .3% of the ocean floor. That is a large area to just disreaguard.

Are you one of the guys that sits in front of his computer when a new scientific breakthrough surfaces and says, "Damn, I didn't see that happening!"

[edit on 29-1-2006 by AnAbsoluteCreation]

I thought about just forgetting about you last thread and moving on. But then I thought about adding...

Tectonic motion has nothing to do with this question.

Different concepts of physics? Nice try!

Ignoring lack of evidence? That's what cynics say right before their theory is debunked.

Fabricating a situation in your mind and acting as if research has been done on the topic? I was studying the history of biodegradable compounds using organic dissimilation. And many products including some soft metals can breakdown molecularly in reletively soft heat over a long period of time. So I had a thought, Atlantis, who were thought to be highly intelligent, perhaps had the Earth in mind first hand and didn't modernize to the point where it is in great abundance now.

Marine Biologists say that we've researched and analyzed approximately .3% of the ocean floor. That is a large area to just disreaguard.

I brought up tectonics because either you mentioned geological transformation, oceans in Utah, and civilizations under the Mediterranean, all of which are supposed to have happened due to the ice age and tectonic motion. However, the idea that these events could wipe out all traces of entire civilizations is just scientifically ireesponsible.

As to you ignoring the laws of physics, yes, I know SOME metals will eventually reduce to atmoic levels due to pressure and heat. However, are you suggesting ALL metal used by ALL people in previous civilizations have done this? That's right up there with the simple answer "God did it", which I just don't buy. As for the biodegradable issue, sure, a civilization may have been more environmentally sound than today's cultures, however, there are certain things in the world, such as steel, which are not harmful, nor are they biodegradable. And are you also suggesting they never wore gold, silver, platinum, etc jewelry? That's an awfully illogical stance to take, assuming the people never used metals in large quantities for anything. I highly doubt an entire world would ignore deposits of strange, very hard and malleable materials they found in nature around them.

Finally, I don't get the point you're trying to make about my statement regaring your lack of evidence. How is it that may theory is about to b e debunked? If anything, your theory is backed into a corner and you need to provide something, anything, to prove it is even 0.00001% plausible. So far, all you've done is ridicule my ideas and spout off personal opinion.

Ciao,
~MFP

Originally posted by bsl4doc

I thought about just forgetting about you last thread and moving on. But then I thought about adding...

Tectonic motion has nothing to do with this question.

Different concepts of physics? Nice try!

Ignoring lack of evidence? That's what cynics say right before their theory is debunked.

Fabricating a situation in your mind and acting as if research has been done on the topic? I was studying the history of biodegradable compounds using organic dissimilation. And many products including some soft metals can breakdown molecularly in reletively soft heat over a long period of time. So I had a thought, Atlantis, who were thought to be highly intelligent, perhaps had the Earth in mind first hand and didn't modernize to the point where it is in great abundance now.

Marine Biologists say that we've researched and analyzed approximately .3% of the ocean floor. That is a large area to just disreaguard.

I brought up tectonics because either you mentioned geological transformation, oceans in Utah, and civilizations under the Mediterranean, all of which are supposed to have happened due to the ice age and tectonic motion. However, the idea that these events could wipe out all traces of entire civilizations is just scientifically ireesponsible.

As to you ignoring the laws of physics, yes, I know SOME metals will eventually reduce to atmoic levels due to pressure and heat. However, are you suggesting ALL metal used by ALL people in previous civilizations have done this? That's right up there with the simple answer "God did it", which I just don't buy. As for the biodegradable issue, sure, a civilization may have been more environmentally sound than today's cultures, however, there are certain things in the world, such as steel, which are not harmful, nor are they biodegradable. And are you also suggesting they never wore gold, silver, platinum, etc jewelry? That's an awfully illogical stance to take, assuming the people never used metals in large quantities for anything. I highly doubt an entire world would ignore deposits of strange, very hard and malleable materials they found in nature around them.

Finally, I don't get the point you're trying to make about my statement regaring your lack of evidence. How is it that may theory is about to b e debunked? If anything, your theory is backed into a corner and you need to provide something, anything, to prove it is even 0.00001% plausible. So far, all you've done is ridicule my ideas and spout off personal opinion.

Ciao,
~MFP

I now know you're crazy. It is not a theory, AGAIN it was a question. I just thought your first response was not thinking outside the box, and a tab bit insulting. Now I don't have to reiterate the fact that metal freezes in cold conditions and is know to even shattered at extreme conditions. I just find it laughable that you think you know what "so-called" civilizations worked with if they did exist 100 million years ago. That is as fruitless as this thread actually being a theory (your words not mine). Anyway, I would like to add, .3% of the bottom of the ocean has been scowered. This leaves room for discovery, right? It was just a simple thought that got bastardsized and I am now regretful that you responded.

thanks, and don't worry, I won't ignore your user, I actually liked the responses. I just don't like the unneccesary sarcasm. Peace AAC

[edit on 29-1-2006 by AnAbsoluteCreation]

So you think I'm off center to think that previous civilizations most likely used naturally occuring metals and alloys? You think they survived for a long length of time without any sorts of metals? Even isolated tribes have been noted to use some basic metals. Also, where is your source for the .3% figure? While I'm sure very little of the ocean floor has been visited by MAN, a great deal of it has been explored via robots, sonar, and subs.

Ciao,
~MFP

Oh, and if you can't deal with sarcasm, stay in your little box. People out here in the real world tend to be cynical.

Originally posted by bsl4doc
So you think I'm off center to think that previous civilizations most likely used naturally occuring metals and alloys? You think they survived for a long length of time without any sorts of metals? Even isolated tribes have been noted to use some basic metals. Also, where is your source for the .3% figure? While I'm sure very little of the ocean floor has been visited by MAN, a great deal of it has been explored via robots, sonar, and subs.

Ciao,
~MFP

Oh, and if you can't deal with sarcasm, stay in your little box. People out here in the real world tend to be cynical.

www.crystalinks.com...


I also like sarcasm, but expect a reaction. If you take the time to read, you will see that the Hopi Indians believed that the world had seen four great civilizations. And a great purification was going to happen to ready the world for the fifth great civilization. This coincides with many prophets visions of the end of the world as we know it. Have you ever heard of Atlantis? Anyway, these facts alone would be enough to back up a question (as the title of the thread). Thank you...

PS. I also found it funny that you think civilizations can't survive without metal (yet another example of an "in-box" thinker).


AAC

[edit on 30-1-2006 by AnAbsoluteCreation]

I also like sarcasm, but expect a reaction. If you take the time to read, you will see that the Hopi Indians believed that the world had seen four great civilizations. And a great purification was going to happen to ready the world for the fifth great civilization. This coincides with many prophets visions of the end of the world as we know it. Have you ever heard of Atlantis? Anyway, these facts alone would be enough to back up a question (as the title of the thread). Thank you...

PS. I also found it funny that you think civilizations can't survive without metal (yet another example of an "in-box" thinker).


AAC

Emphasis mine.

Let me get this straight. You're saying that myths about a magical city, the stories of Native Americans, and your own personal BELIEFS, amount to FACTS now? You do realize that that makes you sound like a tad bit of a loon, right?

Also, can you provide me with any info on a civilization that has survived without metals? I doubt you can considering most of the earth's crust and geological formations are metals.

Originally posted by bsl4doc

I also like sarcasm, but expect a reaction. If you take the time to read, you will see that the Hopi Indians believed that the world had seen four great civilizations. And a great purification was going to happen to ready the world for the fifth great civilization. This coincides with many prophets visions of the end of the world as we know it. Have you ever heard of Atlantis? Anyway, these facts alone would be enough to back up a question (as the title of the thread). Thank you...

PS. I also found it funny that you think civilizations can't survive without metal (yet another example of an "in-box" thinker).



AAC

Emphasis mine.

Let me get this straight. You're saying that myths about a magical city, the stories of Native Americans, and your own personal BELIEFS, amount to FACTS now? You do realize that that makes you sound like a tad bit of a loon, right?

Also, can you provide me with any info on a civilization that has survived without metals? I doubt you can considering most of the earth's crust and geological formations are metals.

I hate to be the first to break this to you, but the LAW OF PHYSICS are not FACTS! They represent the world as we try to understand it. OUTSIDE OF THE box thinking requires the individual (You) to fend for himself. Again you falsely characterize my Thread (Bolded above). It was a question!


Though here is an example of non-metal using civilizations...The Mayans! Maybe you should do research before making bold assertions.

AAC

Deep within the jungles of Mexico and Guatemala and extending into the limestone shelf of the Yucatan peninsula lie the mysterious temples and pyramids of the Maya. While Europe was still in the midst of the Dark Ages, these amazing people had mapped the heavens, evolved the only true writing system native to the Americas and were masters of mathematics. They invented the calendars we use today. Without metal tools, beasts of burden or even the wheel they were able to construct vast cities across a huge jungle landscape with an amazing degree of architectural perfection and variety. Their legacy in stone, which has survived in a spectacular fashion at places such as Palenque, Tikal, Tulum, Chichén Itzá, Copan and Uxmal, lives on as do the seven million descendants of the classic Maya civilization

The Maya are probably the best-known of the classical civilizations of Mesoamerica. Originating in the Yucatan around 2600 B.C., they rose to prominence around A.D. 250 in present-day southern Mexico, Guatemala, northern Belize and western Honduras. Building on the inherited inventions and ideas of earlier civilizations such as the Olmec, the Maya developed astronomy, calendrical systems and hieroglyphic writing. The Maya were noted as well for elaborate and highly decorated ceremonial architecture, including temple-pyramids, palaces and observatories, all built without metal tools. They were also skilled farmers, clearing large sections of tropical rain forest and, where groundwater was scarce, building sizable underground reservoirs for the storage of rainwater. The Maya were equally skilled as weavers and potters, and cleared routes through jungles and swamps to foster extensive trade networks with distant peoples.

www.mysteriousplaces.com...

Fixing quote.

[edit on 1-2-2006 by parrhesia]

The volcanic highlands, however, were the source of obsidian, jade, and other precious metals like cinnabar and hematite that the Mayans used to develop a lively trade.

The technical process of metal working was also highly developed

www.indians.org...

Sorry, you're wrong again. Seems you have no leg to stand on.

Ciao
~MFP

[edit on 1/30/2006 by bsl4doc]

Well you two are starting to get really bitchy. As it was a question I will respond to the post as best I can (I'm a student, 15 in fact so I must be completly retarded adn everything I say I got form television.)

Firstly yes metal can be degraded but not an entire civilizations wihtout any single trace although yes the ocean floor could hold something I really highly doubt it ( along with many others.)

Atlantis was not technologically advanced as is portrayed in Stargate: Atlantis or any other sci-fi. Theyre main advance was chariots for starters(made of bronze I think) and they got defeated by the Atheneans which at the time Atlantis was thought to exist the army of Greece, no europe amounted to (this is a quote from another thread by the way) 2 cavemen and a goat.

As for a civilization existing 100million years ago, well to my knowledge the dinosaurs lacked poseable thumbs.

And if a past civilization were advanced enough to mass produce bio-degradable materials for a massive civilization there isnt much short of complete nuclear holocaust that could have wipped them out. And the survivors would have been able to rebuild (I know most say a mechanic cant build a car and the like) but they would have been able to at least build simpler things from wrekage and the like.

Not if someone else detroyed them, then killed the survivors and any knowledge they had of the past world. The tribes and everyone who were kept stupid and forced to worship and offer tribute were freed and finally allowed to come up in the world, and eventually these previously held beliefs waned when their Gods never returned to rule over them.

A misconception about super advanced civilizations is that they'll be peaceful. But this only makes for even more powerful, absolute power, in the form of Godliness, and this is fiercely protected and fought over.

If there was an Atlantis, it was ruled over by those who opposed the Gods and wished to be Gods themselves, and they were completely destroyed for it. The knowledge they had was passed on to their survivors, but they were killed off wherever they may be, as is evident by the suppression of knowledge and technology worldwide. The Gods fled, to protect their purity and since they had no more followers here, and are mad.