Why was the Bible censored?

One fact remains for certain and that is that alot of key scriptures that form the basis for christianity has been obscured from its original meaning through translation. I mean, very few people know Jesus's real name or that the lake of fire is in reference to an incinerator on the outskirts of Jerusalem or that El means god monotheistically and that Eloheem means gods and this pertains to polytheism in the early Hebraic writings.

Originally posted by NEGROPOLIS

Originally posted by Nygdan
Everyone please recall that this thread is about

why the bible was censored, lets not evangelize for the jehovah's witnesses or make statements of faith or discuss what 'atheism' really means, lets try to stick to if the bible was edited, censored, etc, and why this was done, who did, when, how we know they did it, etc etc.

Freedom of speech, right? It makes perfect sense to try to stay on point but if you're in the moment and feel the need to sway somewhat;

I can certainly agree with that and do it often enough myself. But, again, lets really try to dig at whats going on here and not get distracted.

The romans reinvented christianity with catholicism

Please substantiate this claim.

The bulk of the roman populace went orthodox, and thats when the schism actually occured, before that, none of them were catholic. The romans that went catholic were in italy and the more uncivilized provinces. Why would they bother 're-inventing' it? What was added that is out-side of the Orthodox Church at the actual time of the formation?

They made it appear that this was a foretelling of the end of the entire world instead of the end of roman rule.

I could buy that. But I don't think it requires any editing or even a conspiracy on the part of the romans. The roman world was just getting started at the time Revelation was written. It talks about, at latest, Nero as being the end. He was the last Julian, but hardly the last Caesar. Even if one was ok with the idea of the empire ending, once it didn't, you'd have to re-think about what revelation said, or throw it into the scrap heap anyway.

But notice, none of this requires editing of the bible. John's Revelation is cryptic enough as is, it didn't need to be edited for someone to say 'he's talking about the end of the world'.

and that Eloheem means gods and this pertains to polytheism in the early Hebraic writings

I'll agree with you on these things too, however, this isn't really what we are talking about when talking about the bible being edited. These changes are the changes of language and understanding and occur naturally without any need for a directed conspiracy trying to push a particular angle or obscure a 'true' religion to prevent it from becomming powerful.

Although, I think that most people agree that there was a movement with-in judaism, from before the whole of the old testament was written, in which monotheistic reformers edited the old testament and made it such that the monotheistic aspect stands out and the polytheistic aspects are filed down. Or, if not that, then at least that there was a movement of monotheistic reformers that changed the Hebrew religion into a monotheistic one from a polytheistic one.

Does anyone disagree that where religion is now is not where it was meant to be? I hope not. I don't doubt that the messages of the past were clearer, more precise, and of a more believable quality than what is presented in the church today. That is the conspiracy. And what happens when the world goes to crap here in a few years with the climate collapse, economic downfall and everything that comes with it like plagues to curtail the population and whatever? You'll have a bunch of apes thinking they know what's going on, quoting modern scripture, pointing fingers at each other and raising blame, but the original message might of told them something else...

[edit on 31-1-2006 by bigpappadiaz]

Does anyone disagree that where religion is now is not where it was meant to be?

I don't think "religion" was meant to be. People should have faith. As soon as religion is brought into it, you have leaders of that religion telling you what the bible says, how to live, etc. And a good many of them are just out to take your money. i.e. The Benny Hinn kind of Born Again Christian. The Evangelist that has to spread the word of God while spreading open your wallet and taking your money......and living in mansions and living like kings in those mansions. Is this what God wants? NO NO NO!!! This is what greedy mortal men want. Greedy false prophets.

Then you have religions like Catholicism that in the dark ages used to kill people that didn't believe in their church. Doesn't the Bible advocate "Thou shall not kill?" I guess the Ten Commandments aren't part of the Catholic church? And the Catholic church that doesn't allow priests to marry. Doesn't allow mortal men to marry.....and thus, attracts a sketchy bunch of characters to its ranks. You have Pope John Paul I who was murdered because he wanted to make some serious changes in the church. The people that really run the Catholic church were going to have no part of that. Thou shall not kill?

Then you have these Muslims that go around car bombing and lopping off heads and flying airplanes into buildings and basically committing genocide for their "religion."

etc. etc. etc.............

[edit on 1-2-2006 by Excitable_Boy]

Concerning the above post, sure people haved died over religion. But once again I have to ask, how many more people have died or killed throughout history for purely secular reasons? Not as a soldier dying or killing for a belief, but as a thug dying or killing for somebody's wallet, or more sex, or "hood" respect...

There are worse ways to go than dying for your beliefs.

Originally posted by Toelint
I have to ask, how many more people have died or killed throughout history for purely secular reasons?
There are worse ways to go than dying for your beliefs.

Is there a better way to die, though, than for ones beliefs?
'Verilly I say unto you, there is no greater gift than this, that a man may lay down his life for his friends.' Jesus
‘I submit to you that if a man hasn't discovered something he will die for, he isn’t fit to live.’
Martin Luther King Jr., June 23, 1963

Concerning the above post, sure people haved died over religion. But once again I have to ask, how many more people have died or killed throughout history for purely secular reasons? Not as a soldier dying or killing for a belief, but as a thug dying or killing for somebody's wallet, or more sex, or "hood" respect...

There are worse ways to go than dying for your beliefs.

You missed my point. If someone is a Christian and believes in the Bible, then how can they justify killing? i.e. the Catholic church in the dark ages or the assassination of Pope John Paul I. How can Christians find this to be acceptable behavior?

Dying for ones beliefs is fine, but if you believe "Thou shall not kill," then how do you justify killing?

[edit on 1-2-2006 by Excitable_Boy]

Originally posted by Excitable_Boy

You missed my point. If someone is a Christian and believes in the Bible, then how can they justify killing? i.e. the Catholic church in the dark ages or the assassination of Pope John Paul I. How can Christians find this to be acceptable behavior?

Dying for ones beliefs is fine, but if you believe "Thou shall not kill," then how do you justify killing?

[edit on 1-2-2006 by Excitable_Boy]

God created the law that men shall not kill; yet he himself led armies into bloody battles where men killed endlessly. Murder is a very bad part of nature but it is still a natural occurring phenomenon.

ExitableBoy very well put and Blackguard

As far as the thread topic, i do agree thats its some what important to discuss validity,but all the talking and study in the world will not do you any good if you dont believe.

For myself to go off topic as much as i have or might is simply because of Gods will be done not anyone elses or even ATS`s.Conflict of interest.I hope i dont get banned because of this conflict of interest because i hold ATS in high regard,But God`s authority supersedes all,and i`m no lone ranger in this regard its not for the purpose of disruption,its for the purpose of Truth.

If the discussion is irrelevant to knowing like this thread"the Truth"of a said matter,Truth=God a Christians duty is to point out how one comes to the Truth.Then the parts of the Bible make sense,not all of them certainly not to me,but more than enough to know its Gods word.Though you have to know and believe in God to begin with.

The Truth is unchanging, you can argue about how many times the Bible was translated and by whom from what language to another and watered down so`s to cover or murky the Truth which i also believe has happened on many instances of Bibles and of different beliefs and in some cases try and replace the Truth,so on and on it goes for the very purpose people miss completly what its is these things are all about,Its about personal expierience with God and the forces that try and prevent you from having them.The KJV Bible is more than enough to back up a Christians personal belief to know its Gods Word.It has nothing to do with religion thats the hoax.

Originally posted by Toelint
Concerning the above post, sure people haved died over religion. But once again I have to ask, how many more people have died or killed throughout history for purely secular reasons? Not as a soldier dying or killing for a belief, but as a thug dying or killing for somebody's wallet, or more sex, or "hood" respect...

There are worse ways to go than dying for your beliefs.

If you have "hood respect" in a violent neighborhood then noone will act violently toward you, but it's something that you have to have the heart to earn and it's worth earning if you're stuck in that environment due to impoverishment. A "thug" stealing a wallet is a typical response for someone who is trapped in poverty. These things are not worse than dying for beliefs for they are dying in a poor man's attempt to survive in a world full of harsh realities. Even a junky, who is the wretch of society, is only trying to escape these realities; instead of facing them head on. Did you know that poor people are not the blame for them being poor? These are the ones that our great system of society has failed. These are the ones that the politicians beg for votes and then ignore once they get elected, and once they get elected they build prisons and help set societal prison traps such as the crack boom to imprison the poor man. The working man is only one paycheck away from such an existence because he is only paid enough for him to continue working... These are the issues that the bible "should be" edited to deal with. It seems as if our president and military are holding the whole world at gun point and it's no wonder that we're under constant terror alert. Maybe these are the last days...

Originally posted by NEGROPOLIS
If you have "hood respect" in a violent neighborhood then noone will act violently toward you, but it's something that you have to have the heart to earn and it's worth earning if you're stuck in that environment due to impoverishment.

What if those hoods respect you because you have no respect in the proper way for the hoodlums?

A "thug" stealing a wallet is a typical response for someone who is trapped in poverty.

Though if one has faith in God stealing is stealing.There are other ways of survival than stealing.Faith is one good way.

Even a junky, who is the wretch of society, is only trying to escape these realities; instead of facing them head on.

Little correction,people in general not just junkies try and escape reality,and more important they are trying to escape their realities not these.

Did you know that poor people are not the blame for them being poor? These are the ones that our great system of society has failed.

Why do you look down on poor people?God see`s them as blessed because they see Him easier.What in your opinion have they failed?

The working man is only one paycheck away from such an existence because he is only paid enough for him to continue working... These are the issues that the bible "should be" edited to deal with.

Sorry i strongly disagree here.The Bible is more than enough as it is.

Maybe these are the last days...

I think your correct,should it matter? maybe only as proof to those that dont believe in the Bible,you could die at any time though,thats what should concern people that dont believe.

[edit on 2-2-2006 by gps777]

Oh man... The only reason why anybody nowadays believes is because a whole lot of people around them also believe. So what the hell compelled these other religions to believe in something that sounds so alien and ridiculous to you? They saw something with their very own eyes that they could not explain, and the creator of these awesome manifistations had something up on them. But because this is the most recent one, it's in popular demand. And because we're starting to find out things the Bible can't explain and because God hasn't come back in a long time, faith is beginning to dwindle, as it always will.

I mean what the hell compelled these ancient south americans to believe in some gods with a lizard or bird's head? I can't imagine somebody just up and praying to this dude, nor can I imagine somebody starting a religion, declaring themselves high preists and everybody buying it up. We're a curious race, and the masses always take these things with a grain of salt. They had to have been showed something they could not explain, whether technology or these miracles. And when things get desperate and wars are waged, Gods flee, spread plagues on their enemy's power base the people they watch over, tell their people they'll be back and wait for some quetzacoatles, plant their followers among their enemies populace to sway faith, and somebody always wins.

Every religion is created and molded for the people of that particular time. It's just the way things are run.

[edit on 2-2-2006 by bigpappadiaz]

Or perhaps it's the people of the times that mold the reality that creates the religions. Yet... even more... possibly it's all true... I'd suggest doing some research on the Mayans and what their calendar dates did in the past.. and do in the future... predict.

[edit on 2-2-2006 by dgoodpasture]

Originally posted by NEGROPOLIS
Did you know that poor people are not the blame for them being poor? These are the ones that our great system of society has failed.

Originally posted by gps777
Why do you look down on poor people?God see`s them as blessed because they see Him easier.What in your opinion have they failed?

I don't look down on poor people. You must've misread that line. You're trying to make it look as if I'm calling poor people failures when it's perfectly clear that I'm saying that society has failed them. I stand to represent the poor in their defense when they go out and do something criminal, because I know it's only a natural reaction to poverty. I also think that "nonviolent" criminals who seek profit in order to escape poverty should be given a college or technical education and be put in work programs instead of prison. And drug addiction should be viewed as a sickness instead of a crime. Also, If violent offenders and sexual offenders were heavily sedated and put in psyche wards until deemed healed then our streets would be much safer. We'd finally have more people in college than in prison and sickos wouldn't re-enter society by just servin' out their time...

And it's a fact that most of the working class are just one paycheck away from losing it all.

[edit on 2-2-2006 by NEGROPOLIS]

Originally posted by NEGROPOLIS
I don't look down on poor people.

I do and did realise that from the way you view it,actually you care so much about them you`re angry society does`nt help them.That say`s a lot more about you than a lot of people imo.

You must've misread that line.

No i understood you,just letting you know how God see`s them,and no matter how hard society trys we will always have poor people.

You're trying to make it look as if I'm calling poor people failures when it's perfectly clear that I'm saying that society has failed them.

I`m not trying to make you look bad to anyone,I`m trying to make you look.

And it's a fact that most of the working class are just one paycheck away from losing it all.

This also i never denied,I denied your comments on editing the Bible to include these people in their current situation.

Have a nice day or night.

God created the law that men shall not kill; yet he himself led armies into bloody battles where men killed endlessly. Murder is a very bad part of nature but it is still a natural occurring phenomenon.

God led armies into bloody battles? Did I miss this in the history books? The leaders may have said they were doing "God's work" or doing what God told them, but that is far from the truth. Did God decide that this group of people was better than that and therefore, one group should kill the other? If God wanted them dead, why didn't He just strike them down himself? Does God need others to do His dirty work?

i.e. Joan of Arc.....she said she was just God's "messenger." etc and He told her to fight whoever.......she was also quite insane!

Murder is a phenomenon? No, it's human nature to hate others and to kill. It's no phenomenon. BTW, God isn't human.

God led armies into bloody battles? Did I miss this in the history books?

It wasn't in the history books due to the separation of church and state but it was in the old testament.

The leaders may have said they were doing "God's work" or doing what God told them, but that is far from the truth.

Maybe these stories were made up or the heroes of the old testament are really people who have used god to serve their own purposes. Moses was one of the greatest and he's even killed without being punished by god but instead he was chosen to free Israel from bondage.

Did God decide that this group of people was better than that and therefore, one group should kill the other? If God wanted them dead, why didn't He just strike them down himself? Does God need others to do His dirty work?

According to the bible, the Hebrews were the chosen ones and god did kill people for them. For instance, when the red sea was split open and they passed thru to the other side; the army chased them and the water closed up on them and killed them.

i.e. Joan of Arc.....she said she was just God's "messenger." etc and He told her to fight whoever.......she was also quite insane!

All prophecies lead up to Jesus, supposedly, and none are supposed to come after him. So how could anyone believe that she was a prophet? She "was" quite insane.

Murder is a phenomenon? No, it's human nature to hate others and to kill. It's no phenomenon. BTW, God isn't human.

Here is a definition of the word phenomenon:
en.wikipedia.org...

Murder is an observable event that takes place all throughout nature; not just human nature (look at the animal kingdom) and I never said god is human even though we were made in his image.

For instance, when the red sea was split open and they passed thru to the other side; the army chased them and the water closed up on them and killed them.

Yes...I too saw that movie with Charlton Heston.

Originally posted by Excitable_Boy

For instance, when the red sea was split open and they passed thru to the other side; the army chased them and the water closed up on them and killed them.

Yes...I too saw that movie with Charlton Heston.

Yeah, it was pretty good wasn't it...

The history channel is airing a show tonight (February 5th) at 8pm called "Who Wrote The Bible". The preview explains that some of the text was left out and that they'll delve deeper into the subject when the show plays. I know I'mma watch it. How 'bout you?

[edit on 5-2-2006 by NEGROPOLIS]