Berlusconi: Russia Should Join The EU

Berlusconi said Russia should join the EU. He said this in a speech in Turkey at an official opening ceremony for the new Blue Stream natural gas pipeline. This pipeline will make Turkey turn the port of Ceyhan into the world's largest international oil and natural gas terminal.


Photo: RIA Novosti


Berlusconi apparently wants Russia to join the EU, but is that even realistic? I don´t think it is, but I don´t have much faith in EU anyway so...

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im not sure if Russia would join the EU, ive had my doubts over them for afew years now. They might see the EU as too west for their liking

I think it'd probably be a good move for Russia's economy. But I am still quite skeptical of Russia's devotion to democracy and free markets. I'd be afraid if this happened, we could see a future of Russian tanks rolling into Western Europe and a revival of the Soviet Union with Western Europe annexed.

Originally posted by djohnsto77
...I'd be afraid if this happened, we could see a future of Russian tanks rolling into Western Europe and a revival of the Soviet Union with Western Europe annexed.

Oh please, how is a potential EU membership connected to potential imperialistic tendencies of Russia? If anything an EU membership would protect western Europe from that, might I say it, backwards idea. The timeframe for an european invasion has passed, the west has never been armed that much since the 2nd WW, and coupled with a great reduction of warmaking capabilities after the fall of the Soviet Union the Russians are very well aware of that.

I think Russia joining the EU would be a good move for Russia but they would never go for it. Russia has too much pride being a semi-super power. To join the EU would for many in Russan Gov. admit defeat. Plus I beleive the Russian like to keep to themselves in terms of Military dev. this might pose porblems for EU membership.

If Russia were to join the EU and I think it very unlikely that they would, the EU would under go major changes.

For example, as of current, the two sides within the EU are France/German vs the UK.
The UK camp currently wishes reform to give the EU a fighting chance economically, where as the French camp wishes to continue its traditional protectionist policy.

Russia could potentially either create a third camp, possibly drawing in old soviet countries or it could join an existing camp which would give that political camp some serious power.

However, I don't believe this situation would ever arise, the current EU member countries would never accept Russia joining, and sadly more importantly the US would never accept Russia joining.
The US Government would lean too heavily on the UK and other countries to oppose any potential Russian movement to join the EU, lets face it the US and Russia aren't exactly best of friends are they.

Maybe it would it be good for Russia to join, maybe it wouldn’t, but either way it won’t happen.

Originally posted by UK Wizard
If Russia were to join the EU and I think it very unlikely that they would, the EU would under go major changes.

- I agree Russian membership would provoke serious change in the EU and I'll agree it looks highly unlikely now but never say never.

as of current, the two sides within the EU are France/German vs the UK.

- That's old and inaccurate; sorry but I think you are leaving a hell of a lot of the reality out to make that kind of claim Wizard.

The UK is often allied with Holland, Spain, Ireland and Portugal for instance. Many of the new central and eastern European countries are very supportive of the UK's economic point of view too.

The UK camp currently wishes reform to give the EU a fighting chance economically, where as the French camp wishes to continue its traditional protectionist policy.

- This is an interesting opinion.
"Fighting chance"!?
Have you any idea of the size and wealth of the EU economy?

The various factions argue over the direction the EU may take in future and even over the probable trends but you are down-playing the European economy to a silly degree with that kind of comment.

Currently the typical complaint is about things like the speed of the rate of growth (not that there is no growth from the existent wealthy position) and levels of unemployment (which have a lot to do with the methods of accountancy as well as that sluggish growth rate).

Implying 'EU Europe' is on her last legs is a gross distortion of the true picture.

Russia could potentially either create a third camp, possibly drawing in old soviet countries or it could join an existing camp which would give that political camp some serious power.

- Well it's true to a point but it is also well worth remembering that Russian involvement and alliances with some of the western European powers are nothing new.

What would be very interesting and new would be the never before seen completely pan-European voluntary and democratic alliance.

Our problems in Europe have always been about dominance of one over the other; the structures of the EU remove this threat making mutually beneficial cooperation and partnership the 'point'.

If Russia were no longer interested in (and in any case incapable of) dominating the western end of Europe, as has always been the fear previously, then why not?

However, I don't believe this situation would ever arise, the current EU member countries would never accept Russia joining

- I wouldn't be so sure.
We in Europe have had interesting, complex and beneficial relations with Russia for many centuries.
I think you are looking at this through the 'prism' of the post WW2 'cold war' situation. Those days are over.
Never say never.

.....after all who'd have predicted the reunification of Germany being permitted or one of Russia's big neighbouring WARPAC country like Poland joining the EU?

sadly more importantly the US would never accept Russia joining.
The US Government would lean too heavily on the UK and other countries to oppose any potential Russian movement to join the EU, lets face it the US and Russia aren't exactly best of friends are they.

- I think you over-estimate the influence the US has in Europe these days. Recent history has done little to 'help' either.

Europe will act in Europe's interests, not the USA's.

Having said that I would also disagree that the US would see things in such a hostile and 'cold war' manner either.
Russia and the USA cooperate together in many areas and are certainly not the adversaries they once were.

I'd say it is presently unlikely for some years but in 20 - 30?
It wouldn't surprise me.
Russia is a part of Europe after all.
Always has been and always will be.

Originally posted by sminkeypinkey

sadly more importantly the US would never accept Russia joining.
The US Government would lean too heavily on the UK and other countries to oppose any potential Russian movement to join the EU, lets face it the US and Russia aren't exactly best of friends are they.

- I think you over-estimate the influence the US has in Europe these days. Recent history has done little to 'help' either.

Europe will act in Europe's interests, not the USA's.

I think it is too soon to dismiss the "US-interest" card in intra-EU decisions. Although there are a lot of examples where the EU chose the "european way" in disregard to american suggestions and desires (this has happened since the EU was founded, and not only since the importance of US protection decreased). The US´ POV still is and will continue to be one of the major influential factors in european international politics for the foreseeable future - and especially so because the USA tried hard and did manage to gain supporters among the newer member states.

Having said that I would also disagree that the US would see things in such a hostile and 'cold war' manner either.
Russia and the USA cooperate together in many areas and are certainly not the adversaries they once were.

Contrary to that the USA is known for underlying long-term strategies in handling other countries. I find it not believable to say that Russia dropped off the "To-do" list, the only clear development in US-Russian ties is that Russia dropped from Grade-A threat to Grade-A contender. The US global politics since the 50s always evolved around heading the global direction, and I dont say this in vain. Although they encouraged development in other regions there are clear signs that the USA is VERY sensitive about challenging their supreme power, clear signs are the rethorics against the EU, Russian and Chinese development that go beyond objective analysis.

I'd say it is presently unlikely for some years but in 20 - 30?
It wouldn't surprise me.
Russia is a part of Europe after all.
Always has been and always will be.

I agree, it would take at least 20 more years for such a development as "Russia joining the EU" (if it still exists in this form then). The question is if the EU wouldnt act against its own interests doing so. the EU is not only founded on economic principles (which would promote a russian join), but also on the principle of "securing the european interests". Set aside that I count both Russia and Turkey to the Asian continent becuase of the location of their main landmasses, I already think that the joining of Turkey is a bad idea because it would put the EU in direct neighbourhood to a Middle East which is in turmoil for years to come.
Having a member in direct proximity to China whose course of development remains unclear and "possibly hostile", North Korea and the former soviet republics is an uneasy thought and I think this would dominate many decisions in EU global politics to a point where it would be immobilized from opposing goals and startegies.

Russia, join the EU? HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLL NO.

Russia for one, is very nationalistic and independant. Such a move would not be tolerated by the people there.

Plus, Russia does not need the EU. Russia is wealthy in natural resources and a highly educated population. All they need to do is get their birth rate up, and get a more stable, less corrupt government, and they could easily rise and become the biggest economic power in the world.

Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
Russia, join the EU? HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLL NO.

Russia for one, is very nationalistic and independant. Such a move would not be tolerated by the people there.

I agree.

Plus, Russia does not need the EU. Russia is wealthy in natural resources and a highly educated population. All they need to do is get their birth rate up, and get a more stable, less corrupt government, and they could easily rise and become the biggest economic power in the world.

I don't agree. Russia would love to trade more with EU to pump up its economy. Also, Russia would love to have its citizens travel freely within EU. Many aspects of european culture is appealing to russians. Russia does not look at the USA, Middle East or China for cultural connection but it surely wants that in its relationship with Europe.

Originally posted by Marbusse
I don't agree. Russia would love to trade more with EU to pump up its economy.

Then they should sign a ETA agreement, like Switzerland and Norway.

Also, Russia would love to have its citizens travel freely within EU. Many aspects of european culture is appealing to russians.

LOL. Being in the EU does not enable people to travel more "freely," it's a myth, just ask my dad.
He's traveled lots before we joined the EU, like once or twice a month he'd go down to Spain, France, Germany, the UK etc., and now after, he's still traveling like before and everything is still as "hard" as it used to be, you still need your passport etc.

So should Russia join the EU? No, they have no real reason to do so and it's getting a bit too crowded in here anyway.
Let's not take 1000 people in a lifeboat that can only hold 100 people.

Originally posted by SwearBear

Originally posted by Marbusse
...Also, Russia would love to have its citizens travel freely within EU. Many aspects of european culture is appealing to russians.

LOL. Being in the EU does not enable people to travel more "freely," it's a myth, just ask my dad.
He's traveled lots before we joined the EU, like once or twice a month he'd go down to Spain, France, Germany, the UK etc., and now after, he's still traveling like before and everything is still as "hard" as it used to be, you still need your passport etc. ...

You are mixing things up. Being a member of an EU country allows you to travel to and stay in any else established EU country (the newer member states partly are still in a transition to this stage). The agreement to stop GENERAL border controls is the Schengen treaty which is not an EU treaty, it is seperate. That doesnt say there are no controls at all, there can be controls in doubt.

And neither being a member of an EU country nor being a member of a Schengen participating country erases the need to carry identifying documentation everywhere you travel. Also, a single experience by your father does not question the whole process - I for one have never been stopped travelling abroad since Schengen was established, and I also leave my country at least twice a year.