Do Any or All Of The Predictions For 2012 Have Any Truth To Them?

I have seen references to "The year 2012" in many places. Many of them here. But never was really interested enough to click on any of them, or look it up in Google. The other day, for some reason, I felt compelled to look it up. So, I did, and what I found, was so many different, and some contradicting theories.

Things that, IMO bordered on the ridiculous, such as that Dragons and Unicorns will return, to things that might make sense, such as that there is supposed to be a Poler Shift, in which the North and South Poles are supposed to switch places, messing up the electromagnetic field that now protects the Earth, making it impossible for people/animals to continue to live here, that are currently dependent on the electromagnetic field.

This poler shift, I don't know if it's just a theory that someone came up with, and has spread as truth? Or is it something that astronomers have actually scientificaly researched and is more than a theory? It seems as if something like that, could be confirmed by scientists/astronomers.

Also, I've read stuff on the subject, that probably Dec. 21, 2012 is just a date set because it is the date of the winter solstice of that year, and the last time something like that (but not so devastating - I can't remember exactly what I read, but apparently some other phenomenom is supposed to happen this time, simultaneously that didn't happen on the last one) was on an equinox. But that really, the shift is a gradual thing, and perhaps has already started many years ago and will be finished on or around that date. If so, it could explain why it seems (to me at least) as if most of the world is well on their way to going crazy, if some haven't already done so.

Another version, is that it is to start shifting on or around that date, and will continue on for some amount of time afterward, while in the meantime, we are supposed to be changing from 3D to 4D, in order to be able to survive the change.

And, another version, that the shift will happen all of a sudden on Dec. 21, 2012, such as the "big bang" supposedly happened, wiping out the entire dinosaur population, this time, wiping out something like 99% of the human and animal population, creating a new "age" where new species will develop that can thrive in the changed environment.

Also, I probably sound dumb, but I vaguely remember at one time, long ago hearing something about the Mayans, but don't really remember who they were, or what they represented. However, in researching the year 2012, their calander comes up frequently, that it stops at the end of 2012. Does that have some significance? It seems as if any society could start and/or stop their calander at any given time, as long as everyone agreed.

Another popular one, I kept running into, and has often been discussed on this site, although not necessarily in conjunction with the year 2012, is the coming of the "anti-christ", and/or "the mark of the beast", which would be the biblical theories, I would imagine.

To sum up my research on the subject, no matter what the means, it seems as if everyone who discusses the meaning of the year 2012, the outcome appears to be "the end of life as we know it".

Anyway, I am sort of interested in some of this stuff (not the return of the dragons), now that I finally took the time to look it up, and I have always been curious about different dimentions. I don't believe that just because everything we see is in 3D, that there aren't many more dimentions out there, perhaps paraelell to 3D, or more advanced. I mean, I don't know exactly who or what was/in the first dimention, since it is a straight line, so invisible that we can't see it, however it is the basis for the 2nd dimention, which is also so straight and flat that we can't see it, which is the basis for the 3rd dimention, which we all know what it is.

Any thoughts or knowledge on any of the above?

[edit on 11/18/2005 by CyberKat]

The date is the December 21st 2012 as you rightfully said, and is the end of the mayan and aztec calanders, symbolysing not just a cataclysm (the end of one cycle, as the calanders have cycles), but the end of life altogether.

Polar shift is a valid scientific fact, except scientists think that it will be much longer down the track than 2012, however there is a growing amount of evidence it has already started, infact there's a thread here on it somewhere.


There have been many valid theories, and the most valid I believe is a polar shift, however I believe that there will also be a big religeous event, as well as interference with extra-terrestrials.

Deinfately something big will happen, there is no doubt about it.

There are other theories about huge earthquakes and supervolcanoes, atlantis, and some others.


In any case, make sure you get a good spot to view the fireworks

Manincloak, thanks for your input. You say there's a thread about if the poler shift has already started? I tried to find it, I'm not too good with the ATS search. Do you happen to have a link to it? I wouldn't mind reading it.

I'm gonna say that, although no-one can say yes or no for certain, I'm leaning heavily towards 'no' to the question of belief in the 2012 issue.

I've seen the 2012 date debunked quite convincingly on here, and I don't see any reason to to discount the debunking.

The date comes from the Ancient South American cultures, but as is my understanding, they never said it was going to be 'the end of the world', it was just the end of that particular calendar.

I think all the other 2012 ideas and theories come from this original source, and like Atlantis, there has been a whole host of wacky ideas connected with the date from it being the date of the Alien Invasion, to the date that humans evolve, and the grip the Reptillians have on us would not be able to continue due to our evolution.

To all these I say - where's the evidence? Now I know with conspiracy theory, evidence in thin on the ground, but there has to be SOMETHING to base opinions other than a poorly put-together website on geocities.com with glaring green and pink text.

Regarding an Alien Invasion, I don't see why they would wait until a specific date, especially one prophecised by the Mayans. If they have the tech. to travel across the galaxy, what are they waiting for?

Originally posted by VelvetSplash
[.................]

I've seen the 2012 date debunked quite convincingly on here, and I don't see any reason to to discount the debunking.

Like I said in my original post, I just very recently became interested in the subject, so I'm sure that I have not done as much reading as you and probably others, which is why I made the post - in order to try to learn. So, I'm sure that there are threads "debunking" 2012 theories, although I have yet to run into one. I have run into some written by people who seem to proclaim that they know things that even astronomers and physisists don't know.......hhmmmm I'm more than a little skeptical of those. ie: Survive 2012.

I also haven't found anything absolutely concrete, except for the concept that astronomers/scientists probably have more to go on to confirm a poler shift along with a galacic alignment of the Sun, Venus and the Earth. That could well be true, IMO, however, the results of that are prevalent across the Internet to be "The End Of the World", "A catrostrophic event" but I see no proof of anything other than if there is a poler shift, the world will spin the opposite direction. But, since the Southern Hemisphere and Northern Hemispheres already spin opposite directions, and people seem to thrive while spinning both directions, how could that be so bad?

[.......................]

I think all the other 2012 ideas and theories come from this original source, and like Atlantis, there has been a whole host of wacky ideas connected with the date from it being the date of the Alien Invasion, to the date that humans evolve, and the grip the Reptillians have on us would not be able to continue due to our evolution.

All this talk of alien invasions, UFO's, etc.... I don't know. People write about it as if it is a very strange and scary secret. I personally would think it very odd that out of all the planets in the entire universe, the Earth would be the only planet with Intelligent life. We have already done some space exploration, and if there is life on other planets, why shouldn't they do the same? And, it would be hightly unlikely that they would have a calendar even remotely like the kind we have on Earth, due to the drastic difference in time and space that is out there in other parts of the Universe.

[..................]but there has to be something to base opinions other than a poorly put-together website on geocities.com with glaring green and pink text.

I found many sites, but not the one you speak of. So, in that regard, since I haven't seen it, it's hard for me to draw any sort of conclusion about all the theories being based on that particular site.

I do appreciate your input, though. I hope that with the collaboration of several others also, I might be able to make some sense out of this "2012" deal that I so recently decided to look into.

CyberKat

The Mayans did not think the 2012 date was the end of the world just the end of a cycle. Here is the best site I have seen containing all of the 2012 info. 2012. I personaly dont think anything strange is going to happen but I do plan to be at one of the Mayan sites just for the hell of it, should be fun.

Originally posted by CyberKat
Driven by unfounded fears of phantom prosecutions,

Polar shifts have occured throughout the history of the planet, and have even occured during the course of human evolution. They definitly don't have widespread destructive consequences, and no one can predict them at all.

is just a date set because it is the date of the winter solstice of that year, and the last time something like that[...]was on an equinox

Its called 'precession of the equinoxes' and it occurs on a, I beleive, 19-21ka cycle, it means that the equinoxes and solsti occur on different dates throughout time (such that if the calender was invariant then there'd be a time when the winter solstice, and winter along with it, was occuring in july, etc).

the shift will happen all of a sudden on Dec. 21, 2012, such as the "big bang" supposedly happened, wiping out the entire dinosaur population, this time, wiping out something like 99% of the human and animal population, creating a new "age" where new species will develop that can thrive in the changed environment.

There was no big bang that wiped out the dinosaurs, however there was a meteor impact at around the end of the cretaceous period at the end of the dinosaur age. There is no reason to say that this is going to happen on Dec 12, 2012.

However, in researching the year 2012, their calander comes up frequently, that it stops at the end of 2012

Technically, it doesn't stop, from what I understand one Cycle ends and another begins. I don't see why their religion should be taken as objective truth.
The mayan calender is the reason why 2012 is so prominent, it probablyh wouldn't have any conspiracy theory surrounding it if it weren't for the mayan calender infact. Its the source of all the stories.

more to go on to confirm a poler shift along with a galacic alignment of the Sun, Venus and the Earth. That could well be true,

Scientists cannot predict when there will be another magnetic shift.
The bit about an alignment of the planets isn't galactic, and its a seperate issue. THe idea there is that there are points where Earth is at one position, and the sun, along with all the other planets, are lined up in a line and opposite the earth, the 'fear' there being that the tidal forces of this alignment will be so strong that rather than just the oceans being pulled (a tide), that the planet's crust or the planet itself will be pulled nad havoc will ensue.

I have heard 12 12 2012 as a date when this occurs, but also 5 5 2005. I think that its just that people are being silly and taking the repetition of the numbers, 555 or 121212, as 'siginificant'. Its not. People invented those numbers, they have no 'objective' reality, and aren't even used by everyone.

[edit on 18-11-2005 by Nygdan]

that 2012 date, is basically only an interesting alignment
of our Sun-Earth-MilkyWay horizon

it only has real or mythic meaning to those people and cultures
who follow the cycles of nature, the Solstices & Equinoxes et al...
those people who relate their customs & cultures to the
mystical or metaphysical world and to longer-grander-cycles of time.

_in 2012 winter solstice sun will rise directly in line ON the galaxy horizon_

!!at least that was what was supposed to happen!!

... i'm not sure if anyone has carefully recalibrated the position/tilt/spin of Earth, after that 26 December 2004 Earthquake/Tsunami, that moved islands and wobbled the planet.
... There just might have been enough wobble so that (7 years later) in 2012
the winter solstice sun might be seen rising from a smidgeon of a degree above! the galactic horizon line instead of on the horizon-line.

(and there goes the poetic, metaphorical, story, of the 2012 alignment.
because this cyclical rising of the winter sun
from the dark rift of the milkyway horizon,
is supposed to represent the 'birth' and the 'rising' of planet earth into the heavenly band of life(stars) we see across the night sky, the milkyway.

and that 'rising', has morphed into these wild tales of humanity rising to a higher vibration or dimension, or other wild notions.)
see, the allorgorical/metaphorical worlds of reality do not mesh too well with the scientific, practical, worlds of ordinary reality.
a lot gets mixed up in the translations.

i do not see this fairly rare, but cyclic alignment as being a cause for earthquakes or sunspots or globalwarming or magnetic reversal...these things happen in their own cycles and their own causes.
Year 2012 might be thought of as a reference point,
around which, any 'serene' or 'cataclysmic' events can be compartmented into...so that Humanities' endless story may continue to evolve & morph.

see ya around,

Dec. 12, 2012 is a big deal but it can be so with out it having to be the biggest deal. The end of the world is an allegory. The reason the Mayan calendar end point is held in such high regard is because their system is so amazingly accurate. If I recall correctly it involves something like five interacting wheels or cycles and is infallible at predicting eclipses and the like. Under some people's calculations this date coincides with the precessional equinox shift from Pisces to Aquarius. I'm not sure exactly what Nygdan's saying about Christmas in July, but as simply as I can put it, the precession relates to the fact that the apparently fixed stars are actually in a very slow apparent retrograde motion. The zodiacal sign that the sun rises in on the spring equinox shifts about one degree every 72 years due to the tilt of the earth's axis. For a full shift from one zodiac sign to the next it takes c. 2,150 years. To go full circle around the zodiac takes c. 26,000 years. If you divide that period into four you get an association with the classical four ages, the golden, silver, bronze and iron ages. Some argue that 12/21/2012 marks the end of the current Iron Age, and as it is cyclical, a new Golden Age. There are all sorts of concepts and connotations regarding what happens at that time but separating the symbol from the message it conveys has always been difficult, so naturally people have all sorts of strange ideas. All of this is an expression of profound astronomical observations used to measure cycles of time over exceedingly long periods of time. Here are some ATS threads dealing with the topic:

The Ecliptic Plane, 2012 and the Dawn of a New Age Thread

Ragnarok As Celestial Allegory

Originally posted by savagecupid
The Mayans did not think the 2012 date was the end of the world just the end of a cycle.

Not just any cycle, but the last cycle.

Also, at the end of each cycle, a cataclysm occurs.

Originally posted by CyberKat
You say there's a thread about if the poler shift has already started? I tried to find it, I'm not too good with the ATS search. Do you happen to have a link to it? I wouldn't mind reading it.

Check out these threads:
www.belowtopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

. But, since the Southern Hemisphere and Northern Hemispheres already spin opposite directions, and people seem to thrive while spinning both directions, how could that be so bad?


i liked this post and the topic is interesting but then i saw this and it made me wonder if maybe you mistyped or what. i would love to see the proof for the two hemispheres spinning in opposite directions. this is very intrigueing. it would mean that were one to drive to south america you'd have to pause at the equator and wait for the continents to line up to finish your drive. and i dont think it is possible for the world to suddenly reverse direction. least not from the science classes i remember. but then i'm no rocket scientist.

[edit on 19-11-2005 by longhaircowboy]

Originally posted by Manincloak

Originally posted by savagecupid
The Mayans did not think the 2012 date was the end of the world just the end of a cycle.

Not just any cycle, but the last cycle.

i submit that your meaning of 'last' is a 'qualified' last cycle, no?

in-as-much, the Mayan cycle/calendar "Age of the Jaguar" ends in 2012,
but the 5th Age starts right away at that winter solstice.

the Mayan cycle for 'Solar Year' (25,920 yr precession) ends in 2012
but the next 'Year' begins immediately, at that winter solstice.

the Mayan cycle "Long Count" (~5125 Solar Years) ends in 2012
but the next Long-Count is begun at noon-day sun on solstice.

at least thats what i retained from "John Major'' writings on Maya & 2012

Cicada is right, theres' several cycles/calanders the Maya used,
and its because several Mayan calendar/cycles which have different durations....
And all 3 are ending on that 2012 date
is the reason that makes that particular solstice compelling & mysterious.

This present "Long Count' which is ending in 2012, actually began on
11 August 3114 BC.....................................so............................................
if you are inclined to think history repeats itself, forage thru the known historical records, and you can deduce or infer what type of calamaties or events might happen after the start of the 5th Age,
the new LongCount, and the new SolarYear cycle...

The Solar Year(25,920 year precession) is called something Mayan(I donno)
and somewhere about ~13,453 years ago when the winter solstice sun
was crossing the galactic plane in a downward travel....there was likely
some events occurring in prehistory that might foretell what might happen in 2012 (when the solstice sun crosses the galactic plane on a upward travel).........................................................so.............................................

some scientists report that the earths polar magnetism did a 180 degree flipflop, the dates vary from 10,400 BC -10,800 BC -11,200 BC,
any of which just might have been linked somehow to that winter-solstice
alignment...there is a 100 to 600 year window from the ~dates & the ~dating accuracies, ok

Originally posted by longhaircowboy
. But, since the Southern Hemisphere and Northern Hemispheres already spin opposite directions, and people seem to thrive while spinning both directions, how could that be so bad?


i liked this post and the topic is interesting but then i saw this and it made me wonder if maybe you mistyped or what. i would love to see the proof for the two hemispheres spinning in opposite directions. this is very intrigueing. it would mean that were one to drive to south america you'd have to pause at the equator and wait for the continents to line up to finish your drive. and i dont think it is possible for the world to suddenly reverse direction. least not from the science classes i remember. but then i'm no rocket scientist.

Hmmmm. Very perceptive. You caught me in something that now that you pointed it out, also confuses me. No, I didn't make a typo, it was more like I took something: the idea that tornados, bathtub drainings, hurricanes, etc...things that rotate do so in opposite directions depending on which hemisphere you are in. Such as, I was always under the belief that (and I forget which was supposed to be clockwise and which counterclockwise) say a tornado in the northern hemisphere rotates counterclockwise, a tornado in the southern hemisphere would then rotate clockwise.

It was something that I guess I always believed to be true from as far back as I can remember, therefore automatically assumed that everyone else believed that to be a fact also. Now, after reading your post, I had to laugh, imagining watching the Earth from far away and seeing half of it spinning one way, and the other half spinning the other way. No, that's not exactly what I meant to convey. Sorry, it sure sounds silly.

But also, when you said you wanted to see sources to back that up, well, I knew that it would be highly unlikely that I would find any. However, I did think that I would find plenty of sources to back up the idea of opposite directions of rotation on each hemisphere. However, I couldn't really even find much to support that concept.

Admittedly, I didn't spend a whole lot of time looking, but I will give you a link to something to that effect, although it isn't a very good one by any means.

Sooooooo, I'm now more confused than ever. Thank you for bringing that to my attention.

yeah i too was caught thinkin that maybe it would be a good concept for a movie...least better than what they come up with these days... i mean their remakein remakes.....sheesh.....any how...the spin of toilets and the flow of rivers do indeed vary across the hemispheres and the continents....try straightdope.com they may have the answers
i seem to remember from school leaning that rivers in the US flow in different directions but this could be due to the fact that i was perpetually stoned or not
i also remember hearing that the toilets Down Under spin opposite ours...if i can find it i'll post it....

[edit on 20-11-2005 by longhaircowboy]

Originally posted by Manincloak

Not just any cycle, but the last cycle.

Also, at the end of each cycle, a cataclysm occurs.

Where did you read that the Mayans thought this was the "last" cycle. That is simply not true. I would like to see where you got your information that a cataclysm occurs. Unless my definition cataclysm is different than yours.

Okay well we all know that people theorize, man people will parish in 2012, and other theorize many will transcend to the 4th dimension.

Well I kinda made a connection to both theory, and formed a third one. Is it possible that yes Earth will be destroyed in 2012, and many lives will be parish. If you go on the Paranormal Board alot, many people claim that the 4th Dimension is where some of us would go when we die. So in a sense both theorize would be correct, in 2012 many people will parish but these people will transcend to the 4th dimension. While the people left behind or on earth will live in misery for a while.


I don't like this theory though, so I want to disclose it....I like the more positive and cheery possibility of the future.

Well, I just may be more confused than I was before asking, but some things have been brought to light.........

Posted originally by Nygdan
Polar shifts have occured throughout the history of the planet, and have even occured during the course of human evolution. They definitly don't have widespread destructive consequences, and no one can predict them at all.

Well, it was just my own belief that they could be predicted, however, upon researching this particular subject, I found nothing to back this up at all. So, I have to assume that you are correct, and they can't be predicted after all............except for.......

Originally posted by Nygdan
Technically, it doesn't stop, from what I understand one Cycle ends and another begins. I don't see why their religion should be taken as objective truth. The mayan calender is the reason why 2012 is so prominent, it probablyh wouldn't have any conspiracy theory surrounding it if it weren't for the mayan calender infact. Its the source of all the stories.

This post I read further down, giving more explaination that makes a lot of sense at to why the Mayan calander has had so much impact, which, if true, has nothing to do with their religion.

Originally posted by Cicada
Dec. 12, 2012 is a big deal but it can be so with out it having to be the biggest deal. The end of the world is an allegory. The reason the Mayan calendar end point is held in such high regard is because their system is so amazingly accurate. If I recall correctly it involves something like five interacting wheels or cycles and is infallible at predicting eclipses and the like. Under some people's calculations this date coincides with the precessional equinox shift from Pisces to Aquarius. [...................] as simply as I can put it, the precession relates to the fact that the apparently fixed stars are actually in a very slow apparent retrograde motion. The zodiacal sign that the sun rises in on the spring equinox shifts about one degree every 72 years due to the tilt of the earth's axis. For a full shift from one zodiac sign to the next it takes c. 2,150 years. To go full circle around the zodiac takes c. 26,000 years. If you divide that period into four you get an association with the classical four ages, the golden, silver, bronze and iron ages. Some argue that 12/21/2012 marks the end of the current Iron Age, and as it is cyclical, a new Golden Age. There are all sorts of concepts and connotations regarding what happens at that time but separating the symbol from the message it conveys has always been difficult, so naturally people have all sorts of strange ideas. All of this is an expression of profound astronomical observations used to measure cycles of time over exceedingly long periods of time.

I haven't researched the validity of it, but apparently this person more than likely has.

However what I have gotten is that everone has a theory. Some might have more supporting evidence than others, but I guess, either 2012 will come and go and life will go on as usual - or it won't. We won't know for sure until then.

This whole subject though, brought something else to my attention. Remember when there was that "Y2K" scare? All sorts of things were supposed to happen, our computers would all crash, we would wake up without water or electricity, and I think a whole bunch of other catrostophies were to occur.

Well, obviously when we woke up on 1/01/2000, none of that had happened. But think about it. (BTW please don't take this as any reflection of my opinion of the POTUS, simply as fact we are all aware of)

Soon after the first of the year, the new President was inaugurated. Shortly following that, there was unrest. Heated debates about whether he really won, general distrust in many. Then came 9/11, sparking much controversy, fear and the Patriot Act, shortly followed by war. And from there, more and more world wide destruction, people behaving more and more wildly and throwing caution to the wind. It seems as if the world has been on a downward spiral ever since. And, some country(s) have been and still are without electricity or water, to speak of.

So, when it seemed as if Y2K had turned out to be nothing, maybe the rumors and myths surrounding it weren't really so far off after all.

Just something else to think about.

Originally posted by Manincloak
The date is the December 21st 2012 as you rightfully said, and is the end of the mayan and aztec calanders, symbolysing not just a cataclysm (the end of one cycle, as the calanders have cycles), but the end of life altogether.

yeh i reckon they just got lazy and forgot to finish it or when they were in the process of making it they got wiped out by columbia but yes the year 2012 does has reference to the end of time

and the 2012 biblical theorys is rubbish it was also supposed to happen in y2k but never did.

bottom line just the year of the rugby world cup or the after it

Well the Earth rotates in one direction, but the Atmosphere rotates in two directions. That is caused by the uneven heating of the Atmosphere by the Sun, and the location of the poles in relation to the opposing hemispheres.

Also water drains as you mentioned in different directions in the Hemispheres because of the slight gravitational tug of the Sun. We can't feel it , but it causes the water spin in different directions depending on what hemisphere you are draining water in.

The Mayan Calender does not end , but the Long Count repeats Names for Days for the first time in its history after Dec. 21 , 2012. As mentioned it would be the begining of a new age as recorded by the Mayans.

The Magnetic Poles have shifted many times in the Past.
As Molten Rock and magma cool the metals in the rock align with the poles, and this gives us a permanent record of Pole Shifts throughout Earth History. The poles typically shift every 200,000 years and it has not happened in about 600,000 years so we are way overdue for a Pole Shift.

Pole Shifts however, do not cause mass destruction, but you may have a higher than normal chance of developing Melanoma as more Solar Radiation will make its way through the atmosphere. You also will be able to see Auroras in places near the Equator and other places that typically would not have visible Auroras. And you need to buy a new Compass with the N and S in reversed positions, or turn your old one upside down.

The aztecs and the mayans believed that in the past there had been ages on earth. in each age there was a cataclysmic event and everything was destroyed. i only know because i just took a history class on them and wrote a few reports on the subject. From what i remember each age was destroyed by some kind of natural event. I dont rember them all but they followed a very eerie order. i dont rember the order but i remember one age died from "fire from the sky" (dinosaurs). another from a "great flood"(noah). and i honostly i forgot the rest but they all fell in the correct order. the last age which we are in was supposed to be destroyed by earthquakes. And if your familiar with whats going on right now in the world they could be right. Maybe 2012 was when it was supposed to happen? But i never read them mentioning any specific date for the earthquakes to happen. The fact they knew this many earthquakes would be happening is intriqueing in itself.

Have a good day