The 7 year tribulation has already began!!!!!!!

For all you bible reading ppl,heres something to consider....the seven seals in the lambs hand are actually the seven years of the tribulation.the first seal was 2001..so if we go along from there we would now be in the 5th seal(2005) and the rapture is to take place in the sixth seal(2006)...the end of the tibulation is 2007 or the 7th seal...notice how in the bible it says the people who were raptured came out of the tribulation...but it doesnt say the tribulation is done yet...theres still one more year/seal in the tribulation..i believe the 7th seal is all the rest of the judgements wrapped in one...in the 7th seal the mystery of god is revealed....if you also believe this,then it will help explain alot of the wierd things happening since 2001(first seal/beginning of tribulations) and yes everysince 2001 the world has gone down hill,since 2001 weve had 9/11,the war on terror,anthrax,and a whole bunch more stuff,the 2nd seal is describing osama bin laden and the affect he had on the world(3When the Lamb opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say, "Come!" 4Then another horse came out, a fiery red one. Its rider was given power to take peace from the earth and to make men slay each other. To him was given a large sword)..ok see how it says take peace from the earth,well thats exactly what he did,also it says he made men slay each other,well yea he did that too,be issuing all the attacks on allies of america(terrorism) as you can see the link is pretty bold and clear..if you dont see it then maybe your are ignorant to the facts

(1st seal)

Rev 6.1 And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and i heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see.

Rev 6.2 And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was givin unto him: and he went forth conquering and to conquer

If what you are stating is true, then who fills this position (according to you it was filled in 2001)?

Originally posted by adigregorio
(1st seal)



Rev 6.2 And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was givin unto him: and he went forth conquering and to conquer

If what you are stating is true, then who fills this position (according to you it was filled in 2001)?

im glad you aksed me that....the man being charcterized here is none other then george w bush...let me explain...."he went forth conquering and to conquer"....since 2001(1st seal) after the 9/11 attacks george bush has become the spokesman for freedom,and war,he is a natural born conquerer,even tho he lied about WMD"S he stille remaind in office,even tho keery should have won,he got re-elected,he doesnt fail at anything he does,thats the meaning of conquerer,well at least to me it is,he went to war in iraq,and afganistan,and he didnt fail,thats because he is a conquerer,and his soul misson is to conquer whatever he can,without failure.even tho it looks like he might be failing he isnt at all....o yea hurricane katrina is another part of his conquerings...ppl blaimed him for his response,but once again he put everyone to shame,and made it all beter..see what im saying..we are in the tribulation right now...and the darkest days are ahead....lol you can think what u want,but nex year when the moon becomes blood and the sun becomes black...you will flee into the moutains and away from the face of he who sits on the throne!

[edit on 18-11-2005 by FarFromDanK]

I have been studying this for quite a while and it has not yet started. The seals are not timed as one per year. We know the sequence, not the timing. The rapture does not occur until 45 days after the end of the 7 year tribulation but before God pours out his wrath to cleans the earth.
The white horse rider is Jesus coming to full fruition in the man-child ministry in certain believers who have truly followed Him in the spirit and they walk in His steps and power. The birth of this ministry is in Rev 12: 1-6 before the believers go into the wilderness.

I can elaborate on all of this a lot more if anyone is interested and I can back it up correctly with scripture. I don't know where the original posting person gets his ideas, but they are not scriptural at all.

(2nd seal (alleged 2002))

Rev 6.3 And when he opened the second seal, I heard the second beast say, Come and see.

Rev 6.4 And there went out another horse that was red: and power was givin to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another: and there was givin unto him a great sword

Now you state that this is Ossama, however Ossama was in power long before Bush. This creates a small problem, at least from my perspective. The seals seem to be out of order in your theory.

Originally posted by managerie


I can elaborate on all of this a lot more if anyone is interested and I can back it up correctly with scripture. I don't know where the original posting person gets his ideas, but they are not scriptural at all.

my ideas are based on scripture as just as much as yours are,since you study the bible then you should know that some things have double or triple meanings for instance...the stars in jesus hand actually represent churches,now are stars churches ,no! of course not but, its just a representation,so as you can see the seals are a representation.think about it,how can you open seals on a book and then pictures of horses and stuff pop out thats because they dont,the seals are more like seven dfferent visions, of course back then they arnt going to say goerge bushes real name ,but its there for you to interpret,and trust me,your interpretation is wrong,but go ahead and back it up,but my proof has already happened and your hasnt!

Ho hum. Bring it on already.

You know none of this stuff will ever. ever. ever. happen.

Dont hold your breath for a few thousand years now.

And what about the remaning seals

3rd Black horse with a person with balances, to weigh out the wheat for a penny, and 3 barleys for a penny, and make sure you dont hurt the oil and wine

4th Pale horse, death sitting on it, followed by none other than hell, he has power over a 4th of the earth to kill with the sword, hunger, beasts, and death.

.........

Ill continue if i need to but i dont really think i will

Originally posted by adigregorio
(2nd seal (alleged 2002))


Now you state that this is Ossama, however Ossama was in power long before Bush. This creates a small problem, at least from my perspective. The seals seem to be out of order in your theory.

when it says he was given power,that means more of respect,osamma became more respected after 2001 for what ppl believe he did,that respect in turn gave him power,he used the power of his voice/videotapes/news coverage,,,to spread his message of the holy war against america.the large sword he was given represents all the death he caused by his power.so now do you see what im saying....the other seals 3 4 and 5 are alil foggy to me,i have a feeling someone twisted the words alil on those ,but ne way...the seals are still unfolding....but i bet im right...you can say all you want but i bet im right....bushes power came to him in the same manner as osamm thru publicity,there appearances gave them more power so to speak to do as they pleased....osama nd bush were the major ones behind 9/11 anyway,thats why osamma hasnt been found yet,because bush is holding him in safe keeping,osaam also helped bush take dwon saddam and iraq...yea its true,but im not going to tell you how i kno...because all thats going to do is start a bunch of thread drama...all i wanted to do is let you know that the tribulation hsa already begun and is almost nearing a close...all the signs are here you just have to see them for your self...doesnt the bible say ,something like,he who is smart will understand...yea they'r will be a rapture,its noted a few times in the bible...heres a passage i found: 1After this I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth, holding back the four winds of the earth to prevent any wind from blowing on the land or on the sea or on any tree. 2Then I saw another angel coming up from the east, having the seal of the living God. He called out in a loud voice to the four angels who had been given power to harm the land and the sea: 3"Do not harm the land or the sea or the trees until we put a seal on the foreheads of the servants of our God." after the seals are placed thats when the rapture will happen...ya dig1

Im sorry to hear that the rest of the seals are fuzzy, thats usually what every one says to me when i ask them why they think the tribulation has started. If it is going to happen, we will know it is happening (those with to the forsight of it happening) I dont think it will be masked in "it could be's" or "i think's" Keep in minf that the bible i got my quotes from is the "King James" version, now of course when i see someones name on the cover of a book, i tend to assume its the author. (hows that for a what if)

Ok heres something to consider,at the end of revelatiosn it says:I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. 19And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book....ok you already know ppl have violated that very scripture..ppl have added and taken away from it,but how is it possible they will experince the plagues if they are already dead... will god bring them back to life,just to die again...jehovahs witnesse have changed the word god to jehovah..isnt that a violation,will that person be apart of the plague......honestly believe what you want...but the truth is talking all your bs on this site wont save your azz from whats about to happen...logging on to ATS wont save you...only the truth will.and u already know the truth because i told you....the tribulation hsa already begun....jesus told his followers to watch for the signs...and thats what im doind....and i do it welll....the spirit of prophesy is the testimony of christ...so deny me all you want but i know were i stand

Honestly im a bit confused, as for posting alot on this site, i havent made that many posts, maybe 10, in 4 different topics. So technically im a "newbie". As for your beliefs I was not trying to attack them, i was just providing an opposite side of view to consider, and im looking under your name and it says your Mood is Openminded. So i figured you would take it as just a varying opinion, and not try to tell me im wrong.

(if i misunderstood your post i apologize in advance)

i am openminded,but first it has to affect me ina way that i find believable then i will give it consideration.....im not mad at you..i just get alil frustraded because i hate typing so much....but i think the tribulation has begun already....the 7 seals does fit nicely with the 7 years between 2001 and 2007,since 2001 life has felt like a tribulation,with the threat of terrorism everyday,natural disasters,unemployment,and the negativity is signs that the triulation is occuring right now.....im tired...and im going to sleep.....if you want you can keep this thread alive any maybe more ppl will post...srry for coming off like such a jerk

Tis understandable, most people when they feel thier beliefs being "punked" so to say, they get defencive. I take no offence, it is hard to convey anything via text. Just wanted to make sure you knew i was not saying you were outright wrong, just a few minor tweeks (Perhaps the bush family is the horseman Bush Sr. had a war in iraq and i do believe he was in power i bit before Bin Laden (dont quote me on that) so that being the case, he could fit your role as the first horseman, letting Bin Laden be the second.

Originally posted by FarFromDanK
For all you bible reading ppl,heres something to consider....the seven seals in the lambs hand are actually the seven years of the tribulation.the first seal was 2001..so if we go along from there we would now be in the 5th seal(2005) and the rapture is to take place in the sixth seal(2006)...the end of the tibulation is 2007 or the 7th seal...notice how in the bible it says the people who were raptured came out of the tribulation...but it doesnt say the tribulation is done yet...theres still one more year/seal in the tribulation..i believe the 7th seal is all the rest of the judgements wrapped in one...in the 7th seal the mystery of god is revealed....if you also believe this,then it will help explain alot of the wierd things happening since 2001(first seal/beginning of tribulations) and yes everysince 2001 the world has gone down hill,since 2001 weve had 9/11,the war on terror,anthrax,and a whole bunch more stuff,the 2nd seal is describing osama bin laden and the affect he had on the world(3When the Lamb opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say, "Come!" 4Then another horse came out, a fiery red one. Its rider was given power to take peace from the earth and to make men slay each other. To him was given a large sword)..ok see how it says take peace from the earth,well thats exactly what he did,also it says he made men slay each other,well yea he did that too,be issuing all the attacks on allies of america(terrorism) as you can see the link is pretty bold and clear..if you dont see it then maybe your are ignorant to the facts

Interesting perspective. I don't agree with it but that is my choice. I tend to think that when a third of mankind dies by an act of aggression from a nation that has a two hundred million man army and the third temple gets built, then we will know for sure. Until then follow the sig and live Holy.

BTW I found an interesting site www.endtime.com...

It has a timeline already started too. Makes a few assumption I can't agree completely on (like Gorbachev is the anti-christ and Germany is the Leopard in the beasts) but he makes a good case.

Cheers

It'll start after the Great Restrainer (the Holy Spirit) leaves. That happens before the Great Tribulation.
If He leaves, the Christians must leave as well, or Christ lied.

You tread on very dangerous, and supid ground when you say that if we don't see it your way we must be ignorant.

Speaking of ignorance, is it me or do people have a lot of trouble separating Theology from Conspiracy? The thread is being moveed to BTS at this time.

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
It'll start after the Great Restrainer (the Holy Spirit) leaves.

Interesting how this parrallels Ophiuchus. In some purported mythologies Ophiuchus (The forgotten house, 13th warrior) is not only the snake bearer, but also the snake restrainer. Just curious, not to deminish the spirit at all, but recognizing the spirit may have been interpretted in a different way prior to more in depth understandings of it.

You tread on very dangerous, and supid ground when you say that if we don't see it your way we must be ignorant.

T.C. is making a good point here. You'd be demonstrating non-ignorance by re-evaluating your conclusions. There are many paths. All stem from the truth, or they would not exist. Finding the truth in the path you are on is dependant upon the individual's intentions, not beliefs alone. To say this way is the only way is to confine God's will, and define God's intentions. Faiths teach tolerance, understanding, and the quest for truth. But, first a place must exist within that serves as a prerequisite for truth. There are as many ways to interpret the passages in revelations as there are souls. Our perceptions and intentions dictate how we consciously choose to integrate the information. We can only recognize what it is we know to look for. I say we, because I am one of us. How we choose to see the message is what we can associate incoming stimulus to. We only recognize what it is we know. And what we accept as true is dependant on what best educated guesses we had to fit into the equasion when we perceived a decision had to be made. Once we decided upon what best fit, we created an automatic and conditioned response for similiar situations, knowing we survived the situation in the past. But, now a person may have new information, and has never delved into their subconscious to remove the opinion we plugged in and replace it with the experiences we have collected. Point is, how can you be sure all that you have been introduced to through your interactions with others, and your deductive reasoning have supplied you with the only possible way of percieving it.

We only be ignorant if we made no attempt to empathize and understand the point of view, we'd be more ignorant to accept as what we know as absolute. All logically deductive reasoning that gives us ideas are equally counterable using the logical deductive reasoning of the observer providing said ideas. That is all but the 1 that promotes unity, instead of division.

That is my two copper/zinc flat round worths.

Speculation does not always provide us with the truth.

Speaking of ignorance, is it me or do people have a lot of trouble separating Theology from Conspiracy?

I've been guilty of that myself. Sometimes people view other peoples' accepted theological beliefs as a conspiracy, because it threatens them, perhaps?

Originally posted by FarFromDanK
and yes everysince 2001 the world has gone down hill,since 2001 weve had 9/11,the war on terror,anthrax,and a whole bunch more stuff

It hasn't been any worse than other bad time periods in history, certainly not on the scale that one would expect of the biblical apocalypse.

the 2nd seal is describing osama bin laden and the affect he had on the world(3When the Lamb opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say, "Come!" 4Then another horse came out, a fiery red one. Its rider was given power to take peace from the earth and to make men slay each other. To him was given a large sword)..

This can describe a lot of people tho no?

if you dont see it then maybe your are ignorant to the facts

Mabye you are ignorant of the facts.

you can think what u want,but nex year when the moon becomes blood and the sun becomes black...

When this doesn't happen, then what?

now are stars churches ,no! of course not but, its just a representation

So you agree that this is interpretation and subjective feelings on the
subject, not actual "facts"
doesnt the bible say ,something like,he who is smart will understand
I think you are thinking of the part that says having blind faith isn't enough and you need actual knowledge of the world around you.

If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book.

So pious acceptance of christ as personal saviour and even emmulation of his human character will not lead to slavation because of editorializing?

but how is it possible they will experince the plagues if they are already dead

It was almost certainly written refering to the people at the time of its writting, its direct audience.

2001 life has felt like a tribulation,with the threat of terrorism everyday,natural disasters,unemployment,and the negativity is signs that the triulation is occuring right now

There is nothing unusual about any of this. Certainly there've been wars, terrorism, plague, death, and destruction before, and certainly in the past it was on a far far greater scale.

menagerieThe white horse rider is Jesus coming to full fruition in the man-child ministry in certain believers

Is this to say that only some beleivers are saved?

E.T.
Interesting how this parrallels Ophiuchus. In some purported mythologies Ophiuchus (The forgotten house, 13th warrior) is not only the snake bearer, but also the snake restrainer

The snake, in mythology so i have read, is synonymous with the dragon, and they are 'autochthonic' monsters, and the slayer of the serpent represents man acting out against beign literally arisen from the ground, its an attempt, according to some, to jive the idea that men origianlly arose from the ground, but now have two parents. Thus Jason had to fight the snake/dragon in order to get the golden fleece (sometimes synonymoized with the olympian aegis, the magic-super-huntingbag with knowledge in it), St. George had to slay the Dragon, Hercules had to wrestle serprents in his crib, Odepous had to destroy the sphinx (another 'authochthonic monster), and especially Cadmus had to get ride of the dragon. Often, as in the Cadmus story nad Oedipous story there is the strong connotations with family relations too. Perhaps Ophiucus is doing the same sort of thing.

Not sure if one can draw a parallel there with the Holy Ghost/Paraclete. Tho, in conspiracy theory, the holy ghost, interesting, represents Shakina/shekinah, the female consort of the pre-monotheistic hebrew god 'yhwh' (usually siting the usage of a dove as the symbol).

So that makes for an intersting parrallel, going from one parent (autochthonoic earth) to two (human reporduction), but in the reverse.

So if the Great Restrainer (thinkign of it as the destroyer of the dragon) leaves is the Holy Spirit widely recognized as being the consort of God the Father?

you put an awful lot of faith into the rantings of a deranged preacher living in exile in a cave and eating psychadelic mushrooms...not to mention the numerous and bizarre translations and interpretations of such drug-induced rantings.

I had a friend who once took '___' and swore that the 7th Seal would be opened by his '53 Buick on the 7th hour of the 7th day of the 7th month on 7th Avenue. I told him that he would need a 1977 Buick for that to work.

I'm not going to say that the 7 year tribulation has not begun...

But I know we are NOT this far into it... we are not even half-way until we see the abomiation of desolation manifests as spoken of in Matt and Daniel

**EDIT: this is not to say that the Great Tribulation is not soon.
It IS infact ONLY a breath away...
This is a dream a sister in YAHSHUA (aka Jesus) had recently. My interpretation is at the bottom of the page...

amightywind.com...

[edit on 18-11-2005 by seawater999]