A genuine case....would it be ignored by people here?

Wow, when I asked the same question my thread was moved to the "Rambling" forum. *Gosh* someone who dares to want proof from de-bunkers! It is too easy to debunk here; no proof for debunking is needed. Any educated person knows that to dis-proof someting you need the "proof" to do so; that is why it is called "dis-proof" and not something else.

Thanks for the replies everyone, they provided me with good info and a way of looking at the debunkers as something other than just "negative hope dashers". I do appreciate that whilst it would be lovely to have a true sighting on a daily basis, in reality that just does'nt happen, and subsequently we have to investigate what is a genuine sighting and what is not.
I think i, like a lot of people here, get dissapointed by the ones that dismiss sightings in a rude and unnecessary manner. Maybe thats why i started this thread, more out of annoyance at the ones that treat people with stories like idiots! Apologies to those who do not fall into this catagory.

*Note to self....only take notice of the polite informative ones in future".

Thanks again,

CX.

Does anybody know where to find footage of that Concorde flight in the late 70's which reveals the "alien probe" encircling the plane? Looked but can't find.

Hey Guy,theres a compilation video at this thread called open your eyes,posted by iamian,its a great video..quite long but the one your looking for is near the beginning but i do think the whole thing is worth a look.open your eyes

Enjoy!!!

[edit on 26-10-2005 by jimstradamus]

Yeah I feel your pain I am really surprised someone has not prooved I do not exsist yet lol however it imagine something exists beyond what we know is hard for people to belive plus when the best files I ever seen turn out to be some sort of cgi bit or commerical it seems there is a huge lack of proof...

Oh with that said the USA is would not be the only place that would have alien visits and I would imagine some 3rd world countries if ever visited the gov would care less if it was public yet I have yet to see any media from much any other countries. Has anyone
?

[edit on 27-10-2005 by japike]

Originally posted by CX
I asking this purely out of curiosity. I have been a member here for a few months now and have enjoyed the wealth of information that is shared on this site. I have especially enjoyed learning about UFO cases,the seemingly genuine cases as well as the fakes.
Having viewed many of the replies to peoples posts though, i do wonder if a genuine case would be wasted or rubbished by people here should it arise. Maybe it already has?CX.

What constitutes a "genuine" case to you?

"i do wonder if a genuine case would be wasted or rubbished by people here should it arise" ==CX

"What constitutes a "genuine" case to you?" == Tomastro

Been waiting for an answer to that myself. Since it looks like you aint getting a bite, I will kick it off with
an opinion of my own. But before I forget, Guy Kawasaki, those first two paragraphs in your page one post
are very accurate insites. Not many deduce the nature of "advanced technology", and the implications thereof.

I believe that whoever first discovers life other than terrestrial will go down in history like the first man on the moon.
It is that profound. I believe that any sane person, when presented with such a possibility, will risk everything, job,
reputation, family, friends, to make that kind of discovery known. I believe that, in a strange sort of way, that it is
kind of a survival instinct we have. I also think such a case would not appear first on a place like ATS. Somehow,
someway, if it were me, I would get it into the mainstream if I had to risk my life doing so. That would be the distinctive
characteristics to look for. Thus, if a genuine case "appeared" on ATS, it could NOT be recognized as any different
than the other stuff here. And it would NOT be. The snake swallowing its own tail. See ?

There are genuine cases on here as we speak and I am NOT talking of my own.
I have been watching these for about a week, and they are either not seen or posters make an inane comment..it is so amusing...
You folks who are real, know that someone knows it..do not feel overlooked...[*_*]

[edit on 16-11-2005 by siriuslyone]

Originally posted by nightwing
I believe that whoever first discovers life other than terrestrial will go down in history like the first man on the moon.

Unless it's already been "discovered" numerous times over.

I believe that any sane person, when presented with such a possibility, will risk everything, job,
reputation, family, friends, to make that kind of discovery known. I believe that, in a strange sort of way, that it is
kind of a survival instinct we have.

The very fact that it would put your job,reputation,family,and friends at risk in the first place shows that there is a force preventing it from being revealed. Otherwise there'd be no risk to reveal it. It would be no risk to your job,family,or friends to discover a new species of bird or a new element. In fact it would be nothing but a plus for you.

I also think such a case would not appear first on a place like ATS. Somehow,
someway, if it were me, I would get it into the mainstream if I had to risk my life doing so.

Somehow someway. If the powers that be really wanted extraterrestrial life to be revealed you wouldn't have to find somehow or someway. You'd simply have to say "Look what I found." and try not to get trampled by the camera crews. But if the numerous accounts are any indication that's the exact opposite of what would happen.

Good to see some understanding.
When I posted my first and only post I was ridiculed and harrased, though I hoped people here would be open minded.
WE ( the observers) usually have no evidence, I have none, I don't give a damn if I ever have any, because I KNOW.
As it is stated before in this thread, unless they are there themselves no one will believe you.
We inhabit an island of ignorance, let it be so, but it would be a pleasure, at least here to express our adventures.
Wren

"There are genuine cases on here as we speak" == siriuslyone

As implied by CX, directly asked by Tomastro, and repeated again by me, what constitutes a "genuine" case to you?
Surely if you are aware such cases are here, you would be in a very good position to answer that.

"I was ridiculed and harrased" == Wren
A shame and I hope not from the deep grounded skeptical types. I have found that the best "food" fights
tend to occur among believers. Randle and Schmitt come immediately to mind.

"Unless it's already been "discovered" numerous times over. " == Loungerist
Where ? When ? While I am aware that this is a place that doubts many realities such as the Moon landings,
etc., the realities accepted without proof here continue to fascinate me. Whats right is wrong and whats wrong
is right. Never really understood that till I started comming here.

"The very fact that it would put your job,reputation,family,and friends at risk in the first place shows that there is a force preventing it from being revealed." == Loungerist
Yep, and that force is called "credibility". When you do something that is obviously foolish, you lose that and other things, so you gotta have a great reason to
risk it. Like you said, a new species or a new element discovered probably wont result in problems, but an anti-gravity device maybe, or a perpetual motion device,
or Mork from Ork will certainly cause problems. I think you missed my point. If I really knew that Mork was from Ork, was really convinced, somehow, someway
(meaning I am creative) I would find a way to get that info to the mainstream. I would not come here to post it cause this is Ork. They already know about Mork.

nightwing--if I pointed them out to you, they would be torn apart by all the debunk experts we have here..so, I say, it is for me to know you to to HUNT it.. I try NOT to disbunk anyone, as I have not walked in their moccasins..

Wren--Thank you, missed you being here..

siriuslyone, although I would be curious along those lines, I am not asking you to say this or that is genuine.
I am really really curious to know about the filter you use.

What are the characteristics of these cases ?

I laid my own opinion out and aint afraid of the incomming spit balls. I know of a case or two that is close to my own criteria
but I aint saying. What I am asking is your criteria. What is your litmus test ?

Good question,,I have been in the field for decades and have read/ seen more claims than perhaps many of the poster here..As close to the grays as I have been, there is a 'sort of' signal that goes off kinda like light bulb that stops me in my tracks and says 'read this again, examine'
The only way I can describe it is 'empathy or soul feel' that cannot be denied.
Also, there comes through the screen that 'feels, ignore, lie, pass on.'
Does this make sense..I hope it does..What do you do?


mod edit: removed quote of previous post

[edit on 17-11-2005 by sanctum]

What is a Genuine Case? UFOs

I think I can identify one of the problems with cases being presented. It's the Chicken Little effect. "The Sky is Falling, The Sky is Falling". Too many of those kinds of posts by any one individual and they will start to get passed over. Maintaining some assemblance of objectivety is key to keeping peoples interest in the subject matter.

When something is unidentified it doesn't have to be of extra terrestrial origin. There are only so many times people can post something as "proof" or "evidence" of extra terrestrial sightings especially when the source or material provided are very limited or of suspect origin.

What is a Genuine Case? Aliens

Aliens are another subject altogether. How do you make a case for or against Lion or Reptile aliens? I almost want to ask where do I aplpy to add a new up and coming race of aliens.

[edit on 17-11-2005 by nullster]

Originally posted by nightwing

Where ? When ? While I am aware that this is a place that doubts many realities such as the Moon landings,
etc., the realities accepted without proof here continue to fascinate me. Whats right is wrong and whats wrong
is right. Never really understood that till I started comming here.

It's not that hard to understand since it's done everywhere all the time. Every person on the planet accepts numerous realities every day without seeing half the level of proof they demand for extraterrestrial contact. I doubt you've ever seen a paramecium but I'm sure you accept them as existing. I would bet the heavy majority of our beliefs at any given time come from being told something by an eyewitness. And in science it's not uncommon to accept things with even less proof than that. Anthropologists accept macroevolution as a reality despite not finding a single example of it and numerous examples against it. Archeologists accept as reality that the 70 ton stones in the Great Pyramid were brought there by a handful of Egyptians pulling them with brute strength even though that weight has proven too heavy to be moved in such a way. We readily believe things much more fantastic yet much less evidenced than extraterrestrial visitation all the time. The existence of extraterrestrials doesn't violate any law of physics and has been recorded since the inception of history. By rights it should be more accepted than many of the things we conventionally subscribe to without even thinking about it.

"The very fact that it would put your job,reputation,family,and friends at risk in the first place shows that there is a force preventing it from being revealed." == Loungerist
Yep, and that force is called "credibility". When you do something that is obviously foolish, you lose that and other things, so you gotta have a great reason to
risk it.

But again,the very fact that it's a risk in the first place shows a force behind it. It would not be a risk to your job,friends,and family to propose evidence of other matters.

Like you said, a new species or a new element discovered probably wont result in problems, but an anti-gravity device maybe, or a perpetual motion device,
or Mork from Ork will certainly cause problems.

Right. But there's no reason for this difference unless there were people who actively didn't want Mork discovered. Otherwise Mork could be revealed to the public as easy as a new species of bird.

I think you missed my point. If I really knew that Mork was from Ork, was really convinced, somehow, someway
(meaning I am creative) I would find a way to get that info to the mainstream. I would not come here to post it cause this is Ork. They already know about Mork.

Well I don't doubt that you'd try to get into the mainstream. The success of that attempt is another story. But I think that people post their experiences on ATS because they feel they can do so without getting the conditioned attacks you'd get for speaking about them elsewhere. Though after having seen the responses to people who do post such experiences I'm not really sure why people think that.

]]]]Well I don't doubt that you'd try to get into the mainstream. The success of that attempt is another story. But I think that people post their experiences on ATS because they feel they can do so without getting the conditioned attacks you'd get for speaking about them elsewhere. Though after having seen the responses to people who do post such experiences I'm not really sure why people think that.[[[[

Such a profound statement..If folks cannot bare their souls from experiences or just 'needing to know' and they get bashed here as they would on a fundies forum, where are they to go? They are more lost....
Wish these 'illuminated' souls on this forum would just be kind each other, especially newbies, as confusion and egoism accomplishes less than nothing.

It would seem that Loungerist and siriuslyone are provoking my idea light bulb a bit but
not real sure where it is going. Both of you have brought up lines of thought I would like
to get you to pontificate a little more on.

For Longerist, I would like you to speak more on the topic of "acceptability" for society.
If I find a new bird species, that might be a pleasurable experience. If I say I have a source
of limitless energy, I will be laughed at or worse. If I say I am in contact with Mork from Ork,
I am (to the mainstream) a fruitcake. Leaving the government MIB or whatever out of the discussion,
what is this force we are speaking about and how does it work ?

For siriuslyone, you sorta said that your criteria for a genuine case is a feeling you get.
Why is your criteria so vastly different from mine, and if you do not think it is different,
then how would you define your criteria so "anyone" could use it ?

A think for a genuine case to be genuine it should have sufficient reliable information surrounding it (witnesses, testimony, news report, ect).
Cases that may indeed be genuine but happen to lack some reliable info on it should be left in 'limbo', and simply leave "as is" and not label it a fake or a real case. Leave the uncertain cases in a neutral bin somewhere.
So, if a genuine case happens to come along but lacks the reliable info to back it up and convince people, there is nothing we can do about it. All we can do is take the proven cases and work with what we have for now.

"So, if a genuine case happens to come along but lacks the reliable info to back it up and convince people, there is nothing we can do about it." == Unplugged

That almost says accept defeat before the battle even starts. Or you are implying something about the meaning of a genuine case ?
Lets be clear. To have a universally acceptable genuine case, the result would be that anywhere in society, extraterrestrial life would be as
firm a fact as the Moon Landings and ATS would be full of conspiracies as to why there is no-such thing as aliens. Since that situation
does not exist, then neither does the universally acceptable genuine case.

So what would be the next best thing ? A universally acceptable case that has been overlooked ? If such exists, then how and why
has it been overlooked ? What are the characteristics it would have ? I am more interested in the nature of the hunt than in the
conclusion.