Big Thaw Could Unleash Ancient Plague

Originally posted by edwardteach

An instant horror classic.

I wonder what new viruses will be unleashed....

Me too. Maybe even some vira we haven't seen yet? And with these asteroids crashing over antarctica, maybe some of them will come from space?

But of course, a virus-carrying asteroid may have hit even thousands of years ago, and that virus could be waiting to be unleashed. If a virus can survive being frozen for 140,000 years...


edit: 140, not 400...

[edit on 2008/2/7 by Hellmutt]

One of the dangers of global warming is that it increases the likelihood of bigger and badder diseases simply because the warmer environment is more hospitable to growing them.

In general, the colder the area on Earth, the less deadly viruses are running rampant unless they have a host to keep them warm and toasty - and alive.

So, while big diseases could emerge from the ice, I'm also concerned about what might emerge just because the world is getting warmer.

Diseases are already migrating into areas where they've never been before due to warming, so even if you were safe from tropical diseases before, you might not be down the road.

Hello, Ebola.

To be honest I find this scenario fairly unlikely. For one, what are viruses and bacteria that infect lower latitude life forms doing in the arctic?

For two, why does the discovery of a single plan-borne virus unthawing and activating confirm that we will be killed off by freezer bugs?

For three, what do warmer conditions have to do with propagating a particle that is not clearly alive? Sure, they allow certain carrier animals into higher latitudes, but am I wrong in saying that those things could have been sufficiently established by human travel and infection into native, as an example, mosquitoes?

For four, is there any reason that the freezer bacteria cannot be killed by antibiotics, or better yet, enzyme inhibitors currently in development?

For five - and this is the big one - if this is such a danger, why isn't every glacial recession in the Pleistocene/Holocene marked by large extinctions?

reply to post by Hellmutt


That is exactly what I was thinking when I first began to read this thread! What if an asteriod or meteor has landed there long ago and the remains contain some type of extraterestrial virus or organism that we have no knowledge to control! A lot of scenarios to envision with this information! Not many of them good either!

Originally posted by DontTreadOnMe

how do we know the ice caps will continue to melt?

This picture is interesting...


Image: National Snow and Ice Data Center


...from this thread:

Expert: Arctic polar cap may disappear this summer

More than 10,000 different viruses found in Antarctica, including some previously unidentified.


Frigid Antarctica is loaded with viruses

Nov. 5, 2009


Antarctica's icy lakes are home to a surprisingly diverse community of viruses, including some that were previously unidentified.

[---]

They found nearly 10,000 species, including some small DNA viruses that had never before been identified. In total, the viruses were from 12 different families, some of which may be completely new to science, the researchers suggest.

It should become real interesting when the dinosaur viruses thaw out.
I'll bet they are pretty hungry by now.

reply to post by intrepid

Salt water doesn't freeze, therefore all the ice is freshwater..so..if these so called viruses and what not thaw out..they might be able to re-animate in the fresh water that they are froze in..hmmmm

"As global warming melts the world's ice sheets, rising sea levels are not the only danger. Viruses hidden for thousands of years may thaw and escape - and we will have no resistance to them."

I'm sure our loving leaders will create a vaccine to "save us". I sure hope that nasty virus doesn't make it's way here from Antarctica...

Can you smell what's cooking?

Maybe the melting icecaps will reveal new wonders and the salvation of the world.

OK, this is wishful thinking but I am so tired of hearing about all these horrors that we cannot control.

Before someone tells me to leave ATS, I have to say that while it is depressing to learn about things like this, it is also inspiring to learn about a lot of positive things (well, a few...).

I mentioned this same scenario on several different flu and virus threads, it is a much more likley scenario than governments out to kill off everyone's population at once! Noting that article is dated 2005, imagine what has been let loose since then. Rapidly melting ice is allowing the viruses into the open seas, and as Hellmutt suggested, carried by birds fish and mosquitos.

reply to post by Hellmutt


Bump to S&F.

Another oldie but goodie. ...No doubt this is happening. Maybe more interesting, what's gonna happen when old bugs meet new bugs and start cross-breeding?

reply to post by soficrow


Here's a thought.

Since the old bugs were around the time of the last big thaw, maybe they are necessary for the new bugs to pick up that something special to survive this round of thawing...

Interesting, no?

reply to post by Hellmutt


Now consider the 14 million old lake they are about to open??

Maybe this all happened before....in 1348


The Plague
Scroll down to the weather section.

Another contributing factor in the outbreak of plague was the weather. The weather in Europe began to change in the 1200's.
...............................

However, as the climate gradually cooled, it became impossible to grow grapes in England. Also, the weather grew wetter and the combination of cold and wet made growing wheat and many other grains much more difficult (which, coupled with overpopulation created the reoccurring famines).

................................

The weather seems to have also played a role in the transmission of the plague. 1348 and 1349 had warmer and drier summers than most anyone alive at the time could remember; it was almost like the weather that had been enjoyed prior to the global cooling.

Another connection perhaps to the animals dieing off?

there were a series of murrains-plagues-among sheep and cattle. It is not known what sort of disease or diseases these were, but they were commonly occurring for a decade or more before the outbreak of the plague and so decimated livestock populations

It was assumed that this was the bubonic plague, but if I understand correctly, there are plenty in the medical community that believe that it was a different strain, one that had never been recorded before. There were enough differences to question if it was infact the bubonic plague.

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13


What are you talking about? Facinating. I have not heard of this.


There was also a big climate change in the 6th century that was followed by the Yellow plague.

It appears any time there is a big climate change, a new nasty bug feels it necessary to wipe out a good part of the worlds population.

Maybe now that science can find these viruses they can find a cure befor they thaw. BUT would that be a good thing? I know that sounds aweful but.....

While it is true that an endospore can remain "alive" indefinitely, once it starts to metabolize and breaks its shell they are typically highly susceptible to their environment. Even to begin metabolic activity it needs to have the correct conditions, but even more so after they pop.

I agree that it is something to keep an eye on, but I'm not too concerned about it.

Please keep in mind that although we will have no immunity to these viruses/bacteria.

They will have NO IMMUNITY from our drugs either.

Bwahahahahahaha!

reply to post by peck420


Perhaps we should play it safe and just use those popular chemtrials to spread a healthy dose of antibiotics over the area. I mean we might as well use the technology for something beneficial right?