Islamic beleifs on the end of time???

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read with caution.....

prophecy can also be given by dark spirits...

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[Edited on 20-9-2002 by helen]

well the prophecy about..

daniel...

"" they shall travel between the clouds, aand shall travel
long distances in short time ""


is a very true statement about airplanes.

and a real prophecy.

but let me spot out the falsehood of the koran.


One key thing you should remember.

Ok, Jesus qouted himself that he was God, the saviour,
the messiah, the lamb.

he said that he was God the messiah in the bible.


Does a prophet call himself God?

If that were true than why would the (koran) call him only a prophet
when he himself said he was God??


Don't you get it?

If hes a prophet only than he would never say he was God or else
would not he be a liar and a false prophet??

But he did say he was God in the bible.

And yet he is a prophet in the koran

A prophet would (never) claim to be the messiah.


This denounces the whole religion. the god of the koran
is a liar.

God cannot lie.

god will give you the means to spot out falsehood.

peace.

..to point to "beleif": being "belief" - but I'd be happy to know what "belief ON - as opposed on IN -" anything is -?
Muslims -as Muslims - like Christians as Christians, and Jews as Jews, have NO beliefs concerning the end of "time" -why would they have?
These are religions not astrophysics.
Have we at ATS become this desperate to fill up space and start a thread?

I'm the right one, he's wrong

Truth

Christianity has just as much bull# as Islam, get down from your high horse.

As for this prophecy... where does it leave people like me who will not have allegance to either side?

Originally posted by Fantastic_Damage

I'm the right one, he's wrong

... where does it leave people like me who will not have allegance to either side?

Your allegance should go to God, not some religion.

I did not say...

"" im the right one hes the wrong one ""

where did that come from?

God will literally give you the means to spot
the lies out that i just wrote.

there allah is a liar calling jesus a prophet.


all seeing eye.

God is religion.

jesus is god, jesus created a church.

the only religion of god is our catholicism that jesus created.

you do not have to believe this but it is true.

theres even a passage in the new testament about the mystery of our religion.

he created one religion, not 30.

Fd, please cut down on the harsh cursing.

peace.

What I've read in the Kuran about the End of the Times was looking almost equal with the Bible.

Of course Kuran came 600 years after the Bible, and the Bible came thousand & thousand years after the Torah. Probably we whave to check first the Torah, the Bible just after and the Kuran at last.

Would sugest that after you do all that U-P. Y,ou find someone who knows enough about the ancient egyptian ways to offer info on how they saw it. As that cultures writings predated the Torah.

And before the Egyptians ? We have to start somewhere, why not with the Torah ?

Not actually disagreeing U-P just pointing out a particular issue. Now before the Egyptians that is a very interesting story.

What kind of logic is that?

Obviously Muslims will call Jesus a prophet because they don't believe he's a messiah or god, regardless of what he claimed.

That's like saying "because there's always a boss of a company, there must be a god."

It's foolish logic with no substantiation.

Originally posted by Toltec
Not actually disagreeing U-P just pointing out a particular issue. Now before the Egyptians that is a very interesting story.

Of course it's interesting, but we are going to far. We can do it, or we will mix religion, archeology, science and may be ET too.

Truth, of course the Bible and Islam contradict each other about Jesus. If people believe that Jesus is just a prophet than He can't be God or their saviour. Notice also there's another religion where Jesus is a prophet which is Mormonism. Also both were started by someone who had an "angel of light" appear to them. Hmmm, I wonder who that could be.
Truth I've been meaning to talk to you about the Catholic Church and it's failings. Since when did Jesus ever start a church that glorifies Mary, has "chaste" priests that are go-betweens for people and God when none is needed, rosaries, hail marys, and a dude called a pope who is voted in office who has "divine power"?!?!?!?

yes it is a great logic.

See, jesus called himself god in the bible.

And in the koran allah calls him a prophet.

Now understand this.

A prophet would never be allowed to lie and call himself God.

since jesus said he was God, then the koran should say he was a false prophet for ccommiting
a huge lie.

But the koran calls him a prophet when it should say what he said. that hes God.


sandman.

jesus set up a church for a place of worship to recieve the new sacrafice.

he gave the keys to the kingdom of heaven to peter, which are the
sacraments of the church. he gave peter dominion over all other apostles.

thats the popes position.

all protestant churches staarted in the 1500s.

it is Gods only church which began with the apostles which has lasted through everything. it haas
outlasted the roman empire. it has been attacked since its beggining and still last.

why??

"" upon this rock i will build my church and the gates
of hell shall not prevail against it ""

he did not say i will build 5000 different protestant denominations. one church.


We do not worship mary. she is blessed. She was the only woman found worthy
of baring jesus. We pray to her through the rosary just like i ask my family to pray for me.

This continues in heaven. We go to mary who jesus does not reject aand ask her to pray for us.


Notice the hail mary is a perfect prayer for souls. it is not a mary worshipping prayer.

heres what it contains.

"" Hail mary full of grace, the lord is with thee, blessed art thou
amongst women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb jesus ""


the first part is perfect, all this is in the bible. It calls her blessed among women in the
bible.


"" Holy mary mother of God, Pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our
death amen ""

This is a prayer to mary asking her to pray for sinners.


The our father is included as well along with the creed and the glory be.


in no way is the hail mary a worshipping chant or nonsense like that. its a prayer for sinners.


Chaste preist?

come on now. those preist are not true men of god. Our church teaches no such thing. they
are hypocrites of the church and slap god in the face. not all preist are bad.

i myself may enter the preist hood very shortly.

peace.

Originally posted by Truth

yes it is a great logic.

See, jesus called himself god in the bible.

And in the koran allah calls him a prophet.

Now understand this.

A prophet would never be allowed to lie and call himself God.

since jesus said he was God, then the koran should say he was a false prophet for ccommiting
a huge lie.

But the koran calls him a prophet when it should say what he said. that hes God.

Nice remark ! Interresting point of view.I'll keep it in mind.Thanks.

"Upon this rock" Why would Jesus set up His church on a nonperfect man? He was talking about Himself. Jesus is the rock, not Peter. Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith. Also church probably means the church as in the body of Christ which is God's children, the people that believe in Him and are saved.

Now for Mary. Nothing against Mary but she's dead. You can't pray to a dead person.

The pope certainly isn't infallible and doesn't have "divine power" for being voted in office. There's no need to have a priest to talk to first to talk to God. In the Bible it says that God's children are like priests or something like that, I couldn't find where it says that. Also Jesus was the last sacrifice needed. The priests believe that they're actually turning the bread and wine into the body and blood of Christ. Still tastes, smells, looks and feels like bread and wine doesn't it? The concept of Mass as sacrificial is wrong.

Also how about the whole thing about getting a token or something blessed by a priest to reduce your time in "purgatory"? Purgatory isn't even in the Bible.
One more thing about priests, where does it say that to serve God you can't be married? Lots of great men in the Bible were married like Abraham, David, and even Enoch who was the first man to not die and who was taken up by God. Personally, I think if they could get hitched we wouldn't have all these priests preying on kids. Certainly not as many since there's bad apples in every bunch. I bet even Fantastic_Damage would agree with me on that one.........

Nice rebuttal, but ill only answer this once.

""mary's dead you cannot pray to her""

No shes not dead. she is alive after life and continues to help souls
here on earth. She takes up our rosarys and gives them to jesus.


"" jesus is the rock and not peter ""

incorrect. when jesus asked peter who do you think i am?

he answered, you are the messiah the son of god.

Jesus replied, amen, thou art peter, and upon this rock i shall build my church
and the gates of hell shall not prevail aganist it ""

he was clearly calling peter the rock.


"" The church is gods people who believe and are saved ""

The church is an actual place of worship where the masses go. I can
give numerous amounts of passages stating that it is an actual place of worship.

do you want them?


"" Jesus was the last sacrafice needed ""

yea i know, and we renew that sacrafice over and over.

"" For as long as you eat the bread and drink the cup, you **proclaim** the
death of the lord until he come ""

Cor 13....)

How can we proclaim something when we do not renew it as the passage indicates??

We do renew it until he comes (end of the world)


How about Malachias prophecy in the OT.....

"" For his name is great among the gentiles, and in every place their is offered to
his name a *clean* oblation ""

is the mass not the clean oblation as the prophet in the OT speaks of.

these are key passages you have to understand sandman. this is the truth.


""the preist actually believe they are changing the bread into christ body ""


They are, there have been numerous miracles where the cup of wine literally changed into flesh and blood. these
are documented miracles.

also go here to read a few other ones.

www.webcom.com...

Like i said, this is the truth whether you or I believe in it.


"" But it still taste like bread and smells like bread ""

I know, The prophet in the OT calls it the clean oblation. meaning its clean.


"" How can you only serve god by not being married ""

Who in the world taught you that??

many of the saints were married. maarriage is a sacrament instituted by god.

You can be holy and serve god while married. Our doctrines teach the same thing. i haave
a catechism and thats what it teaches.

the reason some preist are not married is because they offer a sacrafice to god, giving up their own will
and live soley for God thus having more concentration on the lord instead of
on his wife.

It is a sacrafice some preist make.


Sandman, look i know this is the truth. God has led me to the church through huge events and miracles.

I literally did not lead myself into the church, me and god know this. But its utter impossible for someone on the internet to
understand this..

peace.

wow

weak

Ive been reading what you are saying Truth and it makes alot of sense. I would like to know what some muslims think about calling Jesus a prophet when Jesus himself called himself God? Is noy that a lie in the muslims religion?........................................Believer