Impeach Bush!!! Now !!!

A website isn't going to accomplish anything....

Surely you can see that?

(This is why online petitions aren't worth the trouble it takes to sign 'em, either)

What is a website going to change?

Can you ensure you're not going to get spammed/trolled by a zillion opposers to your ideas?

Originally posted by Tinkleflower
Who would you suggest replace Bush?

I nominate Arianna Huffington. She rocks.

A website where all the people have a voice could change things. We just dont have a voice now. It could be a bunch of websites. Secure. Little local ones for local problems in your town, then bigger for county, then state, then federal. You can vote on the issues that concern you and not vote on the ones that dont. Jeeze we spend so much time here on these sites just talking about the friggin problems, why not on another site getting actual votes, where real opinions from real people are taken into consideration. Once we have all the people registered we could get rid of the government in the form it is in now, if the majority says so. It is true democracy, every vote counts. I couldnt tell you the specifics of how the site would be set up ie. tech or security. I dont know enough about them. We have to comprimise a little so of course we all wouldnt get our way all the time, but atleast it wouldnt be a few that decided things for us.

If you cant see how this concept could possibly work, then I will stop posting for lack of intelligence and move to some foreign country.

Originally posted by gottr
A website where all the people have a voice could change things. We just dont have a voice now. It could be a bunch of websites. Secure.

Herein lying an incredibly large problem.

Website security.

If government and private sites can be hacked, then what measures could you take to prevent it?

I'm not aware of anything that guarantees "no hacking" capability.

That and it's very easy to provide false information in terms of voting records...we know this.

So how would we even know that the people "voting" are who they say they are?

(Again, this is why generally, online petitions don't count for jack)

So how would we even know that the people "voting" are who they say they are?

This is the part I am having problems with, just because I dont know enough about internet security.

Already shopping around!

www.escapeartist.com...

Originally posted by gottr
We need to stop expecting the government, congress, senate and legislature to fix all of our problems for us and take control back.

What you are talking about is a militant revolution against the government.

We need to stop expecting the government, congress, senate and legislature to fix all of our problems for us and take control back.

This is called 'mobocracy'. Its precisely what the consitution is setup to prevent.

They came up with new radical ideas, independence and democracy

What was radical was that they were talking about freedom thru governmnet, not in the absence of government.

It saddens me that so many of you are just willing to give up.

Your proposal not a good solution, it wasn't any kind of solution at all.

A website where all the people have a voice could change things

It has no binding authority, its just people talking. Thats what we have here, and all over the internet. If you want to impeach bush, you need to have him charged in congress with an impeachble offense, and then the elected representatives of the people and states in congress will deliberate and make a decision. What you suggest is at best merely a popular referendum. If you think that thre is too much politics in the system now, it'd be a thousand times worse then.

I know I made a vow to research this issue and come up with a list of criminal actions warranting impeachment of many members of this administration, but I realized that someone else has already done that work. Read the proposed articles of impeachment

here.

And if you advocate starting a website for this noble cause, why not put your efforts behind the folks who have already organized a massive protest in Washington DC, scheduled to take place in just 6 days?

Obviously, many of you fail to realize that there have only been a couple US presidents that have actually been impeached, and none of them were removed from office...they finished their terms. Nixon would have been the exception if he had not resigned. He knew it, hence his resignation.

You impeach Bush and he will still finish out his term. So all your noble causes crap for impeachment did what exactly, have the word "impeached" placed on his resume?






seekerof

[edit on 18-9-2005 by Seekerof]

Originally posted by Tinkleflower
I appreciate your answer, Amethyst, but if the movement to impeach Bush is serious, there needs to be a candidate ready who can do the job (and who'd have a chance!)...

Do any of those constitutional candidates stand a chance (keeping it theoretical, I suppose)?

Well, there you go, Tinkle, might as well keep Dubya in the office. If we don't change from the owned parties, why change the owned horse?

Furthermore, we'll need to change Congress as well, as a Constitutional prez won't be ruling by exec-order, so the only way it'd be prudent to change Bush would be to change a good chunk of the pork-munchers, too.

I say if you can, everyone vote third-party in 2006, for mid-term elections. Then in 2008 (provided we haven't been nuked by [put Middle Eastern country here]), everyone vote third-party for President. Any vote fraud perpetrated by any of the "major" parties would be glaringly obvious.

Originally posted by Amethyst
I say if you can, everyone vote third-party in 2006, for mid-term elections. Then in 2008 (provided we haven't been nuked by [put Middle Eastern country here]), everyone vote third-party for President. Any vote fraud perpetrated by any of the "major" parties would be glaringly obvious.

Did "everyone" hear that?!

An America devoid of its traditional two-party system I fear is a glaring impossibility...

The average Joe doesn't even know there's a political world that exists beyond the elephants and asses....Maybe a few are "in on" Nader....

The LOOKS I got from having a Badnarik sticker on my car last year man....People thought I was promoting a character from Willow or something

Impeaching Bush isn't the answer...Preventing him from creating some new Presidential Job-Security Office that keeps him in for third term is what's important now...

I still have my Peroutka bumper stickers on my van...in fact, look at my signature and you'll know what one of them says.

I have my Peroutka 2004 sticker on as well. Couple that with my Choose Life license plates....

Intresting posts here on this topic line of impeachment. I must agree with some of the more logical and reasonable posters on this board. Bush has done nothing over which to be impeached.
Note before the histronics and emotions take over..I have not said I agree with all his administration has done.

Furthermore ...for those of us who have more than a emotional/ provincial memory of history...the scandels of which so many emote here were going on back as far as U. S. Grant. Contracts to friends and family members..etc etc. This is nothing new. Continue on to the history of Tammany Hall and on to the Teapot Dome buisness . Mayor Daily and the Chicago political machine ...etc etc etc. et al.
Do I think this is the worst president we have ever had...no I dont. Dont worry ..we will have far worse in the future.

On the topic of revolution ...first off "knowlege is power" no doubt.
Your problem Gottr is that the mentality and attention span of the average American is not much more than a sound bite in length. This is not accidental. It is carefully cultivated.
A revolution by the people in most countrys only happens as a matter of simple economics. When a people by and large determine that it is cheaper to overthrow a government than it is to live under it anymore..you will have a revolution.
Governments by thier very nature must constantly convince people that it is expensive to overthrow them ...cheaper to live with them in power. Many mechanisms have been devised to accomplish this from pubic education to the media, to religion.
Once again ..when the public by and large determine it is to expensive to live under any government and cheaper to overthrow them ...then you will have a revolution.

The problem Gottr..comes when the revolution is over ..what is the gaurantee that the replacing government will be any better than the one replaced.?? Chances of this happening are very slim...historically.

By the way ..Gottr..one thing historically recorded is that in England..in the 1640s there was a civil war...in which the ruler Charles 1st was executed. This marks the first time in history that a people had ever executed thier king. Very bad for the king buisness. Now mind you Gottr..kings had been killed and executed by other royalty in schemes and plots but never by ordinary people. This movement had its origins in religion.
Ironically the kings stance was that of religion too.. Divine Right of Kings. A concept no longer taught in public schools. To dangerous ...even one person catching on would be to many.
Under Divine Right of Kings a king could not be held to the same standards as others since his crown was put on his head by the religious authority which came from God. The King was untouchable. To revolt against the king was to revolt against God. This was the power of the Roman Catholic nations and why such a revolution, civil war never sucessfully took over.
Cromwell and others proved this was untrue.
Our founders continued on in this knowlege. When the king had broken the law the king is accountable and the people have a right to oppose such a king. The precident of accountability of a king was known to them.
Also the concept of Divine Right of Kings and what it implied.

The execution of King Charles and the American Revolution are the two main times in Western history where a people have ever taken the reigns of power. Only one of them lasted very long and it has been subverted from within. After Cromwell died the Kings moved back in and restored the olde system minus the concept of Divine Right of Kings. Since Cromwell no King of England has dared declare themselves Divine Right. Ironic that you seldome ever hear about this in a history class next to its significance to us as Americans.

Tinkleflower. your point about SS numbers is well said. I know personally of five people who dont have SS numbers. This status of citizenship is not often spoken about. Just like Divine Right of Kings and the English Civil war it is knowlege not desired to be in the hands of the American public.
Those people of the Vietnam era burning their draft cards..burned the wrong card..they needed to drop out of the SS system . This is the system that locks Americans into the whole system including the draft.
Most of these people are self employed. Some have bank accounts. What you say about the banks is correct. They are reluctant to give a account number without a SS number too but they cannot discriminate. They do not want this publically known. They are under the Authority of Title 12 and Title 31 of the USCA. I have known about this for many years now.
People would be very shocked to know even a little about what the banking system does not want the public to know.

Knowlege is power. How to keep the public ignorant and on the puppet string. This is what it means to me to deal with professionals...all of them no .but alot of them. Professional often means to keep people ignorant giving people just enough to function in a system professionals control. If you dont understand this... it is a definition of Feudalism.

The only way to keep a bunch of professional politicians in check is to keep them broke. Pennyless. This way they cannot finance their way into your buissness and protect their real masters.

Sorry for the length of this post but I desired to get in this view.

One more thing Gottr..out of curiosity ...are you a nuc????

Thanks,
Orangetom

NUC???

Guess not, dont know what it is.

NO problem..I understand if you dont know what nuc is..Thanks.

Orangetom

Ok, it's killing me....what is NUC?

Does it have something ot do with Canada?!

I believe orangetom was referring to the American slang for a (French) Canadian...

Nuc = Canuck

en.wikipedia.org...

The term Nuc in the manner used by me in my previous post refered to the concept of performing nuclear work. I was asking Gottr if they did nuclear work for a living. A nuclear worker is often called a Nuc.

Thanks,
Orangetom

Bush hasn't done anything wrong guys. Though I despise him. All he has done is pulled a few strings to get him a Republican bias congress and senate. Now every law he wants is automatically written. Heck, I bet you that he could make an unconstitutional law, oh, wait, he already has. Patriot act violates one of the bill of rights. Its the one about search and seizure. No, seriously look it up.

In fact the congress is so republican they didn't even read the patriot act.

Originally posted by Conspiracy Theorist06
Bush hasn't done anything wrong guys. Though I despise him. All he has done is pulled a few strings to get him a Republican bias congress and senate. Now every law he wants is automatically written. Heck, I bet you that he could make an unconstitutional law, oh, wait, he already has. Patriot act violates one of the bill of rights. Its the one about search and seizure. No, seriously look it up.

In fact the congress is so republican they didn't even read the patriot act.

He made anUNCONSTITUTIONAL Law, but he hasn't done anything wrong? You do realizes the flaw in that thinking, don't you? The Constitution is a set of rules for making US laws.

George W. Bush is power hungry! He ignors the rules he dosen't like. Hell, he A LOT WORSE then Clinton or even Nixon.

Tim