I Hate To Be A Kill Joy On The Subject Of Masons But...

Originally posted by jimstradamus
I have no argument just a curiosity but since you havent reached that degree your knowledge of it is also lacking.

What are you talking about? I am a 32nd degree mason, like most masons on this forum. I have seen the 29th degree conferred several times. I have even helped to confer the degree myself, taking the part of the Captain of the Guard.

[edit on 31-8-2005 by sebatwerk]

And im sure you will all come on an open forum and admit your belief and worship of a satanic being

Originally posted by jimstradamus
And im sure you will all come on an open forum and admit your belief and worship of a satanic being

What belief and worship of a satanic being? I am catholic, most other masons are Christian. What exactly are you talking about? Have you been reading silly conspiracy propaganda again?

I mean, I just completely refuted every single one of your claims thus far, and this is all you can come up with now? Why don't you just admit that you are mistaken?

Right Right and the worlds elite dont worship satan at Bohemian Grove either..just a bunch of grown men wearing weird costumes doing strange rituals and mock sacrifices for no reason but enjoying the friendship of the brotherhood...hmmmmmmm nothin strange about that

Originally posted by sebatwerk

I believe in a Supreme Being that created me and the universe, but I don't pray to him...



Masons are not required to do any of the above things... only BELIEVE.

Like Intrepid, this one made me stop and think. During his initiation, the candidate is told, "Masons are taught never to commence any great or important undertaking without first invoking the blessing of Deity", at which point a prayer is offered up by the Lodge. Furthermore, all Lodge meetings are opened and closed in prayer. I realize that each Mason has his own personal religious beliefs that have nothing to do with Masonry, but am curious as to how you reconcile your disbelief in prayer with the fact that Masons are always praying when congregated.

Originally posted by jimstradamus
And im sure you will all come on an open forum and admit your belief and worship of a satanic being

Apparently, this guy has mistaken Masonry for Ozzfest.

Originally posted by Masonic Light
Like Intrepid, this one made me stop and think. During his initiation, the candidate is told, "Masons are taught never to commence any great or important undertaking without first invoking the blessing of Deity", at which point a prayer is offered up by the Lodge. Furthermore, all Lodge meetings are opened and closed in prayer. I realize that each Mason has his own personal religious beliefs that have nothing to do with Masonry, but am curious as to how you reconcile your disbelief in prayer with the fact that Masons are always praying when congregated.

Sorry, I should have specified that when I said I dont pray, worship, go to church, etc, I was just being abstract. I personally do pray in lodge and attend church (though not regularly), I was just trying to offer up an example for Intrepid's benefit.

As for reconciling prayer in lodge with a belief that no mason is expected to worship God, I can only say that prayer is a group event to invoke the belssing of God, offer thanks, etc etc. But you and I both know that a mason does not have to join in the prayer if he does not wish to. Just stand there and be silent while the rest of the brethren do. It's a personal choice.

Originally posted by jimstradamus
Right Right and the worlds elite dont worship satan at Bohemian Grove either..just a bunch of grown men wearing weird costumes doing strange rituals and mock sacrifices for no reason but enjoying the friendship of the brotherhood...hmmmmmmm nothin strange about that

We actually had a BG attendee posting here a few months back. What he said about BG was exactly what I had thought before: they are classical themes and plays in which the members participate. What makes you assume that they are satanic?!? You throw that word around a lot without actually stopping to think about what it means.

Mock sacrifices of human beings and you consider that a classic theme...you are right i dont understand satanism as well as you as im not a mason.

Originally posted by jimstradamus
Mock sacrifices of human beings and you consider that a classic theme...you are right i dont understand satanism as well as you as im not a mason.

I guess the Bible would be an inappropriate document to you as well, with that whole Abraham and Isaac misunderstanding... Not to mention the greatest sacrifice of all, and that the visual representation of that sacrifice adorns every Christian edifice in the world.

Maybe there's something to this whole sacrifice thing... a lesson to be learned... Nah, ignorance is so much easier, Satanism indeed. :shk:

Crucifix Monkeys, not just for a friendly little reminder anymore...


[edit on 1/9/2005 by Mirthful Me]

I could probably see your point if they were not mock sacrificing humans to a demonic being.

Originally posted by jimstradamus
Mock sacrifices of human beings and you consider that a classic theme...you are right i dont understand satanism as well as you as im not a mason.

You have some EXTREMELY warped ideas as to what Freemasonry is, and I suggest that you do a bit of research before you go ahead and possibly offend myself or any of the masons on this forum. Most masons are extremely religious individuals, and won't take kindly to you calling them satanists. Would you like it if I called your mother a whore? If not, then I suggest you keep your beak shut next time.

I could probably see your point if they were not mock sacrificing humans to a demonic being.

I have a question for you: do you call everything you don't understand "staanic" or "demonic"? Why don't you try denying ignorance and attempt to UNDERSTAND the things that you so easily condemn?

Your mentality is straight out of the dark ages.

[edit on 1-9-2005 by sebatwerk]

Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by jimstradamus
And im sure you will all come on an open forum and admit your belief and worship of a satanic being

Apparently, this guy has mistaken Masonry for Ozzfest.

Seriously though, Jimbo, you need to probably have a look at these sites:

www.masonicinfo.com...

freemasonry.bcy.ca... (follow the links in parintheses)

One word: R-E-S-E-A-R-C-H. Do some.

[edit on 9/1/05 by The Axeman]

Originally posted by jimstradamus
I have no argument just a curiosity

Yes, it all begins with being curious.

Curiosity ought to make you reject all that is untrue.

Curioisity is using your imagination to arrive at the treasure.

It takes a brave man to imagine.





[edit on 1-9-2005 by mr conspiracy]

ALWAYS learn as much as you can about something before passing judgement. If you don't fully understand something you are arguing about, you don't have a leg to stand on. The members posting to this thread who are Masons have said they are either Christian, or Catholic. So when you call them Satanists not only are they taking offence on the Masonic level, but also on a personal level.

Originally posted by mr conspiracy
Curioisity is using your imagination to arrive at the treasure.

Imagination should not be used to arrive at a conclusion. That's the problem with conspiracy theory, it's ALL based on using imagination to think of what could be possible, and then assume that it is so. Conspiracy theory severely lacks concrete proof, evidence and facts, and instead relies on imagination, assumption, circumstance and supposition to arrive at a conslusion. A very dangerous prospect...

Originally posted by mr conspiracy

Originally posted by jimstradamus
I have no argument just a curiosity

Yes, it all begins with being curious.

Curiosity ought to make you reject all that is untrue.

Curioisity is using your imagination to arrive at the treasure.

It takes a brave man to imagine.

Well, I imagine that I am still curious as to the answers to my questions which were directed squarely at you. I'll post them again for your benefit; please, if you are going to make accusations and assumptions, at least have the sack to back up what you say in some way or another, as opposed to ignoring the questions completely.

Originally posted by The Axeman

Originally posted by mr conspiracy

people cant just line up and join the grand masters.

Well, not exactly, but any Mason can be a Grand Master if he chooses to persue that honor.

They pick you.

Yes, by universal suffrage of the brethren.

you cant make an application and hope for an interview.

Well, I'm not sure of the exact procedure, and I'm sure it's a little more complicated than this, but I would say (I'm guessing) that you would have to be a Past Master, and perhaps even work your way up the Grand Chairs just like you would in your home lodge. It's an elected office, and when your term is up you just go back to being a plain old Mason, only you get a nifty "PGM" title to add to your name.

only true believers are selected.

Here we go... True believers in what, exactly? Hmmm?

when they are convinced that you will never break their sacred constitution, you might get the call.

Their "sacred constitution" huh?

And who are they? You minght "get the call," eh? And what call is that?

[edit on 8/30/05 by The Axeman]

If you call my mother a whore i dont take offense because it's not true so why do you take offense to my comments that you point out are not well researched.For a group with nothing to hide you sure are defensive.

With all the research that i havent done ive never seen or met a black mason,with my mother being a whore i dont get out much so this must be a lack of knowledge on my part..im sure you'll let me know how wrong i am but if there is a black mason out there..shout out brutha.

[edit on 1-9-2005 by jimstradamus]

Originally posted by jimstradamus
im sure you'll let me know how wrong i am but if there is a black mason out there..shout out brutha.

You are VERY wrong, there are tens of thousands of black masons. There is a whole organization of Freemasonry called Prince Hall Freemasonry that is exclusively for Black males. We have several african-americans in my lodge, I am very good friends with them.

Originally posted by sebatwerk
There is a whole organization of Freemasonry called Prince Hall Freemasonry that is exclusively for Black males.

I wouldn't say that's quite accurate; though it did start out that way. While Prince Hall Masons might be predominantly black, whites or any other race can join too; the requirements are the same as mainstream Masonry.

I think some states still have recognition issues, but if memory serves it is very few.

www.bessel.org...

[edit on 9/1/05 by The Axeman]