Where we are going to get more troops!!!!!!!

I have to concede that the military has gone through many changes, since the first Gulf war, technology was at his best or at least that is what we thought.

But our troops didn’t have fight ground battler like in Iraq we this war.

Even Iraq was a success in the beginning of the invasion, but when it comes with the ground forces fighting the enemy in a conventional way we are having problems, technology is great but these people with lest than anything are doing a lot of damage.

I also agree that the longer we stay in Iraq with casualties, more American families will be adamant to send their sons and daughter to the military or even encourage them.

The enemy of the recruiting are the mothers of America they are the ones that influence their children and guide them to chose and the military is not becoming an option.

The problem with our stretched troops is that the longer we stay in Iraq, and God forbid another conflict arise somewhere else we will be in a lot of trouble if our military doesn’t get fresh troops.

It takes about two years for a recruit to be ready for combat unless it has been a new policy that I am not aware of to shorten that.

Most analysts say the United States’ armed forces are still recovering from the 1990s, when troop levels and budgets were slashed even as they took on peacekeeping missions in countries like Somalia and Bosnia.

Now if the president of the US knew that our military was not ready to take such a long conflict like Iraq due to the downside of the 90’s, why did the present administration when into war.

It could at least wait until the military was more capable to take such a long term conflict. Or perhaps our government underestimated the shortcomings of this war.

Yes I agree that the military has been “accelerated” under Bush technologically but that was not because it was planned but because this war has made imperative to rush this modernization.

Now the comments around the bases this days is that military personnel has been rushed and pushed to the limits to accommodate for this conflict in Iraq, one think is what the “Experts” said and another the reality of life within the military personnel.

I am not an expert on military matters but we can see something is not working out the way it should be.

I guess is room for improvement and lot to learn from mistakes, it is not until wars are fought that countries learn to make it better the next time around.

think of Iraq war as lessons learned marg. wat would have happened if we didnt fight this war? no vast armored humvees. no IED counter technology, etc. Vietnam taught us that massive bombing dont work. u know that stealth technology as well as smart bombs were influenced by the Vietnam war. before Vietnam, America's military had the mentallity where we destroy everything to win. well this Vietnam helped make us aware of many mistakes as well as wat worked like the smart bombs that were introduced for example in the early 70's. the use of Special Forces that were neglected. these are examples of why Iraq is perfect to learn, because our current enemies and future enemies may learn not to fight conventional but to use unconventional warfare against the U.S. even after Vietnam, the U.S. military's policy is to avoid guerilla warfare or at least urban combat. Somalia for example show the need to fight urban warfare for in the future most of the world's population will be in urban settings. the U.S. military leaders still think of Cold War terms where we fight conventional. and our enemies these days prefer to fight guerilla warfare against us. if we are not prepare to fight guerilla warfare, then we pretty much lose the war by default. Iraq is an example of future wars that we may face for the 21st century.

Sorry about the spelling mistakes, I did the post early in the morning and had not time to check the spell now is too late.

Well deltaboy if is something that is going to come out of the Iraqi conflict is a lot of experience for future wars that involve the same type of approach that the one in Iraq.

Also I feel very disappointed that such perfectly planned invasion and goal achieving that was the first face of the conflict in Iraq has turn into such a mess.

People tend to remember not the good of the war but mostly just the bad.

Iraqi invasion militarily was a success, but post war has taken over that victory.

exactly, we may have achieve invading Iraq and overthrow of Saddam and his cronies but managing Iraq was a mess with many religions and different people from different regions. this is perfect. we seen how we lacked translators. we have Iraqi translators but are being targeted for collaborating with the U.S. troops. not to mention the shortage of Arabic speakers among the U.S. forces. there are many lessons we need to learn so we dont make those mistakes like soldiers who are mostly young and are not good ambassadors. we have special ops forces and civil affairs units but its not enough. maybe they can train future troops in Arabic languages and how to be more sensitive to other cultures, etc.

I can only imagine that if we go into Iran next it will be with more prepared personal than we have now.

Militarily US capabilities are undeniable, I am still remembering when US got to the hart of Baghdad, I was glue to the TV the entire time.

It saddens me all the troubles that have come after that.

[edit on 23-8-2005 by marg6043]

Two kinds of people go into the military;
Those with no choice and,
Those who think they are fighting a "just" war/want to protect America.

All the "Left/Right" politics, all the bickering and lies [which there have been a few] will only help to lower numbers of troops joining up. You need to think from an 18 year old guy [or girls] view point.

They can just about afford College or go into work. They see on the news, report after report of the President telling lies about this, that and the other. I myself [and I'm in the age bracket] would not sign up. I won't unless I think the war is right. Why would anyone?

The numbers for recruitment might be down now but in the future they will start to rise. Why you ask? The economy is terrible. Let’s face it what options does a young person have now a days? Go get a college education and then become a waiter or waitress maybe bartender or work at wal-mart. The engineering jobs are leaving for the shores of India hell even call centers are. What’s left? Service jobs. That’s it. We are steadily loosing ground in almost all facets of scientific research also. We are not the technological or scientific geniuses our politicians would have us believe or even very good innovators anymore. A young person’s future is bleak in America plain and simple. So go join the military it’s what keeps us from having health care and America from being competitive in the world market. But freedom isn’t free even thou no war we have fought since world war 2 has been about freedom but if you want to believe in that catch line you have a future in the armed service you have one there whether you like it or not.
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[edit on 24-8-2005 by DiRtYDeViL]

The military doesn't want a draft. REmember when Rummy drew hisses from the VFW crowd? He said that drafted troops were almost always lacking in commitment, even in WWII . . . He said that America's conflicts will take determination and excessive training, which is antithetical to the draft.

Hagel is "going soft" as a way to court political power. I did this at one point in office politics. If you are known as a hardliner, no one wants to even negotiate. But if you show signs of wavering, the opposition rushes forwards with all kinds of rewards if you will "cut a deal." And the GOP can't afford to actively punish him, because that gives him even MORE clout, and teaches by negative example.

I say, close our borders and offer citizenship to those who survive our military adventures!

Hey, it kept Roma going for another 300 years. It would probably buy us at least a couple of decades of empire-building.

Well it seems that 15 hundred troops will be going to Iraq by october to help with security.

So I guess we are still short of troops in Iraq after all.

Originally posted by DiRtYDeViL

But freedom isn’t free even thou no war we have fought since world war 2 has been about freedom but if you want to believe in that catch line you have a future in the armed service you have one there whether you like it or not.
Sign up now.


[edit on 24-8-2005 by DiRtYDeViL]

so wat was the war in Vietnam and Korea about? bags of rice? we were desperate for rice? u think we always fight for oil eh?

A draft is coming I can feel it from under the door.. It's cold, and it makes me bitter.. Iran, China, or North Korea are on the list of things to do, there is a shortage of troops, so that's the next logical answer.

Did you know Illegal immigrants that fight for this country get automatic status of a citizen??

Perhaps all those pesky mexicans that american's bitch about on a daily basis are more american then them...


Which reminds me of what chris rock said about americans...

You just came out of your mother's * thats the only reason why your american.

People who come to america are more american then american themselves..
They want to work hard, they appreciate things american's dont, and by god look, they are fighting for this country.


[edit on 27-8-2005 by TrueLies]

*circumventing censors

[edit on 27-8-2005 by DontTreadOnMe]

Originally posted by TrueLies
A draft is coming . . . and it makes me bitter..

People who come to america are more american then american themselves..

I see on your avartar that you consider yourself a "homesick Canadian."

I'm sorry that you feel so trapped in a nation that you clearly feel is inferior to your true home. I'm not trying to be smug or snide either. I've been stuck overseas when I needed to be home and couldn't afford to return.

I do feel compelled to point out that many liberal Canadians complain that Americans are "convinced of their own superiority."

Certainly the same could be said of anyone who voluntarily enters another nation/state/province, and then complains about everything they see and hear as being inferior to THEIR home.

Also they got in trouble for getting druggies past drug tests. Thats great, guy with tracks on his arms, smoking a joint in front of the recruiter, "Here's a gun and a ticket, go kill some brown kids and old people.".

I like that, can't meet your standards, lower your standards.

Also saying they "met" the quotas because the Navy did.... strange. The only military group getting people is the Navy, and how many ME countries have a Navy? See where I am going..... Thankfully my fat *** and bad knee(damn football) keeps me safe at home. Sure go troops, they are people with no choice, boo war/people who order them.

Originally posted by dr_strangecraft
I see on your avartar that you consider yourself a "homesick Canadian."
I'm sorry that you feel so trapped in a nation that you clearly feel is inferior to your true home.

Actually no, I don't feel trapped at all..I'm talking about the mexican's that you people berate on a daily basis for wanting to leave their mother land and come here to feed their families and themselves, and will fight as an american in a war to get legal status.

Canada and American have their flaws, in different areas, one country is better then the other and vice versa.

I'm not trying to be smug or snide either. I've been stuck overseas when I needed to be home and couldn't afford to return.

I'm homesick because I miss my friend's and family and legally cannot go back until I get my papers.. that is why i'm homesick.

I do feel compelled to point out that many liberal Canadians complain that Americans are "convinced of their own superiority."

I'm not a liberal canadian but I do believe that 'some' american's are smug with their outlook on the world because they have been fed the notion that they are thebest country in the world, when clearly there are just as many problems within this country as anywhere else, and what's smug about it is that people here are silent when it comes to political injustices that affect society ona large scale.

Certainly the same could be said of anyone who voluntarily enters another nation/state/province, and then complains about everything they see and hear as being inferior to THEIR home.

Yes I agree... if your trying to tell me thats what I meant, your clearly mistaken.

Originally posted by TrueLies
A draft is coming I can feel it from under the door.. It's cold, and it makes me bitter.. Iran, China, or North Korea are on the list of things to do, there is a shortage of troops, so that's the next logical answer.

I draft is not coming. Bush has stated numerous times that he's not going to impliment a draft. There's no need for one, and there's not going to be. People try to play it out as if we're short of troops and are soon going to be stuck, but it's just completely untrue. Draft? I think not. (Check out "The Official Bunk Counter". I find it amusing )

Did you know Illegal immigrants that fight for this country get automatic status of a citizen??

Where's your source? I can't speak for the other branches, and maybe there's a loop hole, but this seems to contradict your statement. Scroll down to the bottom, under "General Qualifications". You'll see, after the very first bullet, "U.S. citizen or permanent resident alien".

Interesting...

You just came out of your mother's * thats the only reason why your american.

Haha, and that's actually true. But I think most people (Other than immigrants) aren't necessarily proud that they achieved something to be an American, but simply proud of the fact that they get to live here, and are apart of a country they consider to be great.

People who come to america are more american then american themselves..
They want to work hard, they appreciate things american's dont, and by god look, they are fighting for this country.

Are you saying that the majority of people in the Army are immigrants and illegals? Source?

Well it seems that with the devastation of the south with the Hurricane we are not short with our national guard that is mostly in Iraq.

What is going to happen?

We have an Emergency in our soil and now we need our national guard that is the one to call for this kind of emergencies.

Are we ready for to supplied the needed gards?

US national guard accounts for 50 percent of the troops in Iraq.

Originally posted by marg6043
Well it seems that with the devastation of the south with the Hurricane we are not short with our national guard that is mostly in Iraq.

What is going to happen?

We have an Emergency in our soil and now we need our national guard that is the one to call for this kind of emergencies.

Are we ready for to supplied the needed gards?

US national guard accounts for 50 percent of the troops in Iraq.

Another misconception. We have plenty of national guard soldiers here in the U.S. to deal with this issue. Do some research.

Yes we have about 300 thousand national guard in US soil but you are forgeting that they are also needed for the rotation of the ones already in Iraq.

Well I guess with the low quotas in the national guard that will tell you how much stress these people are.

Americans are willing to help people in case of disaster but that is why we have a national guard for.

Not to be used as active duty ground combat troops like is happening with them in Iraq.

Right now with the devastation in the south and the possibility of tent cities to be build for the hundreds of thousands of displaced people from two most hit states time will tell if we are short of not.

Another thing with such a catastrophic natural disaster I wonder where the money is going to come from.

I guess the government is waiting to see how generous the American people are.

As usual we all going to be paying one way or another.

My husband thinks that some will come from the defense budget after all troops that are going to be utilized to work with the victims and to help with clean up are part of the defense budget.

Originally posted by marg6043

Americans are willing to help people in case of disaster but that is why we have a national guard for.

Not to be used as active duty ground combat troops like is happening with them in Iraq.

I have to disagree with you, Marge.

"Fighting Wars" is what the national guard is for. They grew out of the Bill of Rights' provision for each state having a "well-regulated militia," which became the state guards. They were nationalized by Eisenhower during the Civil Rights protests of the late 50's. Before that, they were "at the command" of each state governor.

As for what they are "for," The Army national guard are trained just like the US Army, to drive tanks, blow things up, kill people and break things. The air national guard is trained to kill people and break things by dropping bombs on them or shooting missles at them.

The only reason we use them for disaster relief is because they are outstanding soldiers trained to improvise in emergencies.

That, plus the fact that they are trained in riot/loot suppression.

Originally posted by dr_strangecraft

I have to disagree with you, Marge.

"Fighting Wars" is what the national guard is for. They grew out of the Bill of Rights' provision for each state having a "well-regulated militia," which became the state guards. They were nationalized by Eisenhower during the Civil Rights protests of the late 50's. Before that, they were "at the command" of each state governor.

Well but you have to remember that the reason we had problems in Iraq with them is that the training been given to them is not suitable for ground combat like active military troops are.

In the last few decades their jobs has been relegated to help more on natural disasters than ground urban fighting like they are doing in Iraq.

Mr. Bush is the one that has put them in the front lines with his invasion in Iraq.

Right now is problems that will arise from the abandoned areas of the devastated states, even police has gone on looting now we need them to step in an take the role of guarding these areas.

The disaster in the south is more that our nation has ever gone before, we are going to experience as a nation something that we only experience before when it happens to other countries.

National guard is going to be needed here when the reality of what happen to the people in the south starts to sink in and unrest will follow next.