Bremer: Saboteurs 'fighting war they can't win'

BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- As apparent sabotage of water, petroleum and electrical lines continued to hamper U.S.-led efforts to return life in Iraq to normalcy, the U.S. administrator for reconstruction in Iraq expressed confidence Monday that the attackers would be halted.

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You know what? This guy is right....

Yeah you just keep telling yourself that just wait for the IRAQI VERSION OF TET OFFENSIVE..

If you remember.. US was almost over run at vietnam..

Uninen, what you need to remember is that this isn't Vietnam, its Iraq. Perhaps you can explain to me in detail how the spotty Iraqi opposition, with very little, is going to drive thousands of well armed and advanced fighting forces out of their country? And don't forget, we also have an AF and the rest of our forces abroad. This should be good......

I think the Russians were really arrogant when they first arrived in Afganistan too...

[Everything is permissable]

you can call me whatever you want, all I'm asking for is a reasonable explaination. The Russian/Afghan conflict was a little bit different then what�s going on right now in Iraq and the Russian army and strategies are different than ours. I just don't see how spotty Iraqi opposition will drive out one of the best, if not the best armed forces in the world. If anyone can explain this to me maybe I'll reconsider....

why can't the attacks carry on?

the attacks will only stop when life in Iraq returns to normal, and possibly not until the coalition leave.

Some people clearly have nothing to lose, and feel strongly that the attacks are justified, the continued attacks on the oil and water facilities, suggest either former members of the regime, attempting to force the coalition out, so they can return to power, or Islamic extremists attempting to force the coalition out, so they can form an Islamic government in Iraq. Worst case cenario is that these two groups have teamed up.

Either way the attacks will not stop soon, they will probably get worse before they get better.

....are just great for quotes.

MM

We have the greatest military in the history of the world....there's no doubt.

To think we're being engaged within the context of "winning a war" is silly. They're looking to win a battle: one of attrition. Given domestic pressure on a highly suspect military action increasing exponentially, as it does with every services restoration, the $trillion dollar strata will force the US hand and curtail action. As listed in another thread, the jihadists that many of us felt would be given cause, have already started pouring into Iraq. The greed that lead to the war in the guise of crony capitalism will also have the US hold off on sharing the spoils as long as possible and likely past that point - hence, the shared expense by legitimate coalition partners won't defer our costs.
Did I mention US body count? Like the runners of the Kenyan Mountains, these folks know guerilla warfare in that climate - we don't have our personnel born & raised in it.
So to recap:
- Low moral with troops & citizenry
- Anger over unproven reasons to war
- Anger over bold faced lies
- $600B bleeding over into Trillion dollars & counting - that sort of money while municipalities and some states go bankrupt? Can't have that for too long, no?
- Greed that got us there will keep us footing the bill for too long
- High body count
- Energized anti occupation forces the longer it goes on - there'll soon be no such thing as Pro-US Iraqis ...outside of the exiles on our payroll who we're suppose to hand the gov. to. But they won't have any real life expectancy once they're in Iraq proper.
- Too many other hotspots where action is around the corner......N.Korea pops off a missle & you think anyone is going to give a damn about pipelines in Iraq?

As for the reality, no war but a battle of attrition, the odds are no way as greatly in our favor as you suspect.

It's the public at home that matters not the generals: enough bad "press' and America will leave: a few murderous militants drove the US out of Lebanon and Somalia pretty effectively.

And what happens if we do decide to pull out of Iraq? What is going happen to the country? Do you honestly think the UN will take control with its "peace keeping" troops? If we pull out of Iraq the country will fall back the way it was, it would be ran by the same fundamentalists who just killed 20 at the UN HDQTRS. But you know what? Its getting ridiculous now, we should just pull out and leave things be after we set up a temp. government. The UN can take it from there....hopefully....

[Edited on 20-8-2003 by Midnight Mutilator]

Iraq is Iraq, Vietnam was Vietnam. But should we be so quick to forget the past. Those who turn there back on history will be destined to relive it. Yes we were pulling out of Vietnam and the North was behaven (We thought) until they were ready, Then all hell broke out. Do we want to forget the north's military strategy in the Vietnam? Maybe this could be the case in Iraq. It takes a while to regroup and rearm. The iraqi fighter utilizes the same as the vietnamese; farmer by day, fighter by night. in Iraq the are john Q by day fighter by night. I agree we have the mightest military in the world. but we can be beat, not on the battlegrounds. not in war rooms, but in our attitude. remember david and this big bad guy named goliath. bullets do not win wars, attitudes do.

in my opinion the attackers are only making things worse for the people of iraq. blowing up that water pipe sure is a good plan, a place with enough trouble with water and those punks blow up a pipe... thats stupid.

and anyone care to explain how you can compare iraq with vietnam? because i think the situations are so different.

Midnight,

Pulleeze.

just don't see how spotty Iraqi opposition will drive out one of the best, if not the best armed forces in the world. If anyone can explain this to me maybe I'll reconsider

Reconsider quickly:

Rome had the best army in the world at its time, and got thier asses kicked by uncivilized, barbaric germnaic tribes and driven out of Germania centuries before Rome fell.

Politicians dont care about the troops. Thier own stupidity and the determination of the opposition can do it.

I would like nothing better than to pull out of Iraq and leave it on its own. Our soldiers have better things to be doing, rather than die for oil and Israel.

There are no WMD in Iraq. Why are we still there?

Peering over (made in USA Rose Colored Glasses) are 2 posts by;
Bout Time & Skadi
~~~~~~~~

myself, I like to hear/read what the other guy says...

www.ummah.com...

(Arab news for example)
sabotage is a nobel endeavor!!
whereas, cruise missles & bombers are cowardice- - -

the Goad, goes on, on, on
~~~~~

more stuff, from islam/arab/asias viewpoints - - ->

www.ummahnews.com...
~~~~

Not having to filter events thru the 'american view'
is not un-patriotic or anti-USA,
it's just a way of seeing the forest AND the trees!!



[Edited on 21-8-2003 by riffraffalunas]

US independence

- war of attrition
- against the greastest militarty power of the time ( though the decline had started)
- far off land that the Readcoats didn't want to be in
- Brit Merchants bled profits in that foreign land
- Brit monarchy faced endless investment in maintaining the status quo
- religion
- Brits had other hot spots to contend with



Know histrory....damned to repeat.....how does that go again?

"I would like nothing better than to pull out of Iraq and leave it on its own. Our soldiers have better things to be doing, rather than die for oil and Israel."

Skadi, I feel what your saying but that's just it, we can't just pull out of there, we created this mess and we have to at least setup some kind of temporary government before we start packing our bags. People are saying we need more troops in there, Hell no! We need to get the job done over there ASAP and get the hell out!

Midnight,

we are NEVER going to clean up this mess, Bush doesnt care, he wants the oil. We could clean up the mess, but those in power dont want to see it cleaned up, they want to bleed and suck the oil out of the country. they dont care how many troops die. if they did, they would have begun cleaning the mess up. they havent even started, taking much of the work out of military hands and putting it into civilian contractors.

For the quote was from the Mighty E ( so excuse the paraphrase ) :
" Nothing controls as absolutely as poverty"

- it benefits those in control ( CEO's, Feds) to keep people broke/worried about their future

- chaos also benefits them in Iraq

So why change? Don't you think that even the most simple minded Economist ( and they are; first White House to not have PhD of Economics on their econo team in ages) could have mapped some sort of solution by now?
Don't you think that, militarily, it was overkill to take out the nations complete phone system? And cronyism to award the rebuild contract, no bid , to the thieves at WorldCom?


They'll take the heat on no ground gains on the world stage or national, because they're not getting any. Plans going fine.