a good point that could point all crop circles in the direction of a hoax...

on larry king tonight (7/6/05), a guy said something along the lines of: "why would aliens travel millions of miles just to put designs in the grass?"...

as funny as this is, this is a great point...

i, an "alien believer", couldn't think of a "com-back" to this guy's words...

can you???

i think this is a good point, that could point all crop circles in the direction of a hoax...




[edit on 6-7-2005 by they see ALL]

'they' could be mapping something out for future use..

I know many think the two are related, but I don't think they are. From what I've read on crop circles, very few are real. Not the elaborate ones, but simple circles which were reported in the 70's. I think they were formed by a natural phenomenon. Then the hoaxers turned it into a circus, and everyone writes off the whole subject, or turn it into something it's not.

it was a bunch of uni students that did the cro pcircles. I saw a group of them in Glasgow city centre dressed up in grass skirts and Hawaii shirts puting a blockade of bin bags across the road to stop the traffic.

Originally posted by they see ALL
on larry king tonight (7/6/05), a guy said something along the lines of: "why would aliens travel millions of miles just to put designs in the grass?"...

That is actually a good question "why".

To me it doesn't mean that the idea of Aliens making crop circles is silly.

Also in my opinion crop circles don't have to be made by Aliens or Hoaxers.

The "authentic" circles, where there's just one circle or multiple circles in no aparent pattern, if caused by aliens might just be a side effect of their craft, or natural phenomena. However the more eleaborate artistic ones are most definately man made.

There was one interesting video i saw of an illuminated orb floating around a crop at night, and then all of a sudden a circle appeared there, really got me thinking maybe some are real after all.

Originally posted by Knubie
There was one interesting video i saw of an illuminated orb floating around a crop at night, and then all of a sudden a circle appeared there, really got me thinking maybe some are real after all.

I bet it was it the video shown to be a hoax in this clip I made from a National Geographic documentary about creating balls of light. It is from a series called “Is it Real? Crop Circles”.

Creating Balls of Light 8.2MB

They See All,

Here is a counter question: Why do humans think they should be able to understand the behavior of beings about whom we know nothing? Beings that may in fact share nothing in common with us except some form of self-awareness, or intelligence to use a more common term.

The reason you have no answer to your question is that you have no knowledge on which to base a decision.

There are in fact plenty of possible reasons, but which, or how many, might be true we have no basis to judge.

Communication for one. We would not try to talk to another Race in this fashion but perhaps to another Race it makes perfect sense.

The idea that the circles are formed by a natural process that we simply do not understand is a possibility as is the side effect mentioned above.

Maybe it is just something they do, we spray words on walls, they make crop circles. There are all sorts of possibilities in the area of visual markers, for themselves or others, a Brand-like concept perhaps.


Hal9000,

If if is the same show I saw they did not in any way prove the film a hoax, they simply accepted the word of a man who said 'I did it'. Amazing really, no more basis for believeing him than any UFO witness. Now perhaps they were shown proof that this guy really did create the video, but if so they did not mention it.



A.T
(-)

[edit on 7/6/05 by Alexander Tau]

i would like to point out one interesting ufo / crop circle event that happened in my area.


i wrote in detail, with accounts of both the ufo and crop circle (3rd party)

this happened in my area where i live, very remote.

www.abovetopsecret.com...


Anyways, what is interesting about the story is this:

1-A ufo was spotted before the circle and going in the direction of the circle to be

2-this happened before a killer frost hurt all the crops in the area. in fact the ufo was seen during the night of the frost (circles found days later, but actually occured sometime in the past few days)

could they have been studying the crops and weather?

3-the circles were not fancy and they were in a remote area.

plus who hoaxes a crop circle on a cold freezing night?


4-the very notion of a ufo sighting and crop circle connection IS something.

Originally posted by KnubieThere was one interesting video i saw of an illuminated orb floating around a crop at night, and then all of a sudden a circle appeared there, really got me thinking maybe some are real after all.

Known hoax.

Yes, that video, if i remember correctly, was presented by some guy who was a very well known digital artist. It's supposedly just a project he did on his computer, very nice though.

Crop circles (CCs) are made by higher level entities that have no physical presense as we would know it. They create the circles by thought. The circles are no more than a science lesson for humanity.

Just as we draw 3d things on 2d surfaces, the CCs are meant to be viewed as 3d schematics for scientific phenomenon (both macro and micro).

====

Just so we are clear, the above would be my "come-back" and is not an invitation for people to ask for "proof".

I once saw a movie where they blew a guy up sitting in his chair eating lunch. The device they used was some sort of precision device from space. They got the coordinates and just blew him up, it did not hurt anything around him just destroyed him totally though. I've often wondered if the crop circles might be some kind of testing done with some type of satellite and some guy somewhere is sitting at a computer using a program to design these crop circles, its teaching him to be precise, and it is like woodburning only, the object is not to get a detailed picture just to learn to use the weapon in a precise way.

Another possibility, and one that I really can see, is that we, humanity, are creating some of them. Perhaps we have evolved to the point where we have the collective abilty to make crop circles form. Strange to think that we would be doing something like this behind our backs, but possible.

It seems a fact to me that one major result from the formation of the circles is a strong nudge to a whole lot of people towards thinking about UfOish subjects. Certainly plenty of people who do not see anything beyond human art but that does not invalidate this effect.

And since the circles are causing a lot of people to open their minds to certain possibilities could we not be doing it for ourselves. I submit that with the size of the Universe we must eventually come to grips with other life, maybe we are trying to get ourselves ready, despite ourselves.

Another results of the forming of crop circles is the desire, some might say, the passion of humans to create them by hand. It really is kinda nuts to give up a night of sleep to make one of these things. And by even the most conservative of counts the number of people who have done just that is really amazing.

Could this passion come from the fact that the circles are indeed important? Or are those who manually create circles driven instead by a resistance to these UFO-type ideas? If that is so then their actions have not worked out as well as they probably would have wanted.



A.T
(-)

on larry king tonight (7/6/05), a guy said something along the lines of: "why would aliens travel millions of miles just to put designs in the grass?"...

This is sooo stupid comment. Extraterrestrials are in earth suburb since so long, they are installed here and probably somewhere in our solar system. The remark of this guy has no sense and just shows how basic humans can be and react.

Some crop circles are genuine (i mean not man-made), and are created by balls of light. We have numerous evidences of that. Now it's time to move on and try to understand them.

Once i saw a documentary on TV, a disinfo doc.
The guy was trying to prove that ALL CCs were fake....It was so ridiculous that i couldnt watch till the end.
He made one example in some field.
Of course, its not impossible to reproduce some patterns and he did.
BUT, it was so badly done that you could see it wasnt the same as some CCs out there.
In the real CCs the plants are bend perfectly and not broken, and there is some levels of radioactivity.

Think that all CCs were man made is insane and it just show the human stupidity.
We are always trying to explain things we do not understand with senseless theories.

Originally posted by Krpano
Think that all CCs were man made is insane and it just show the human stupidity.

Given the nature of human psychology I have come to the conclusion that it is not human stupidity. The stupidity observed is merely an effect. The root cause is basic fear. Fear of the unknown. Fear that there is something that is not understood. Instead of facing the idea that something can not be explained there will be all manner of explanation. Each individual will be comfortable with different explanations. Most are comfortable with the idea that it's only a human phenomenon. This ensures that nothing breaks their personal reality bubbles. This same fear can be seen everywhere once you recognize it as such. But in order to recognize the fear in others you must first face the fear in yourself.

Disinfo, a lot of times, is merely "comfortable explanations" given for public consumption.

Originally posted by Alexander Tau
Hal9000,

If if is the same show I saw they did not in any way prove the film a hoax, they simply accepted the word of a man who said 'I did it'. Amazing really, no more basis for believeing him than any UFO witness. Now perhaps they were shown proof that this guy really did create the video, but if so they did not mention it.

I will look into it again to double check, but I think there were two guys involved, one that shot the video, and the digital artist both saying they created it.

But I think that some CC's are real but without first hand research, it's hard to tell which ones. Colin Andrews has researched CC's for 30 years, and says they can tell them apart, and approx. 20% are real, 80% are fake. Several anomalies occur with the real ones as stated before.

I blame the confusion on the Hoaxers that have muddied the waters, and do it for kicks. They interviewed a few on the same program, and they talk as though they are inspired to do them. It will be impossible to do scientific work in this area with this going on. They should be put in jail.

Thanks Hal, be good to hear what you find.

I am not trying to pick nits here, but the level of 'proof' required for someone who claims to have hoaxed something is quite often very low. So just as we look hard at the claims of people with pictures or stories I think we should do the same in the reverse direction.

We can duplicate a whole lot of reality with a good digital system. What I would consider proof of the claim that these guys created this video would be things like regular system back-ups with the code in reasonable stages of development. It would take a well trained expert to even look at computer code and decide if it was created before or after the fact.

We do not always have the ability to prove a specifics video or pic is real but if it was man-made then it should be possible to prove that in a way that would beat 'reasonable doubt' in a Court of Law.

Before people go claiming 'proven hoax' it would be nice if it really was proven that this was the truth to the reasonable exclusion of any other explaination.


A.T
(-)

Alexander, actually I took it for granted that it was a hoax, because I never saw the video when it came out, I think around 1996. Have you seen it before where they claim it is real? I'm not even sure about the name of the video or location, any help would be appretiated. I will do a research later tonight, but don't you think it would be unlikely that the formation appears in perfect frame of the video camera which is setup on a tripod? I think it was done just as they say. He found the formation, filmed a few minutes and added the effects later. Maybe I will ask Jritzman if he has seen it before.