what is real?

I don't know if this has been posted before, but i have a theory. I don't know where it would fit in on the board so i posted it under here.

When i look at the world, how do i know it is real?i think it is real because i learnt it from school. But how do we know?

When you feel pain, how do you know it really hurts?. Now i was watching the matrix and it got me onto this theory. What if the world ended and we are hooked up to super computers? When we see a ghost it could be a glich in the system, which is showing from other files. When we sleep, we could be unplugged from this super computer and thats why we sleep.

People say things happen for a reason, this reason could be that it has been programmed into are brain to do certain things. Some of us have disabilities and this could be a problem in our program. The coding could be wrong and contain a error.

God is the person who is meant to created us. What if God programmed the system for us to live. When we change over time, this could be to God changing our code.

I know this theory is very hard to believe, but it makes sense. We don't really know if what we see,feel,taste and hear is real.

-infinite-

if you really want to view things in a neutral point of view, you need to put aside everything that they "learned" you. Or else your judgement is biased from the start. (Just my opinion..) I'm not saying "deny every single fact, proven or not..". I'm just saying keep an open-minded skeptic point of view, at all time, no matter regarding what.

God did write the code and can change it at will.
Our senses are like the a/v cables plugged into a television. Our awareness of reality doesn't make it reality, just a small portion of reality.

I disagree. There is no "god". In order to see through the false reality, you have to be capable of seeing the world from a fresh perspective...as if you just arrived here. Any exposure to this world and it's "education" is corruptive of "reality", including religion.

Real is all based on perspectives. This world is real because we are here, right now, talking on the internet about it. If I ran at a wall, I'd slam into it, that wall is real. When I drink a glass of water from a cup, the cup and water is real. You and I are real, because we are here. So even if we are hooked up to something, both the "false" world that we see, and the "true" world we are in but dont know it, are both, very very real.

Wow, i havent had thoughts like that in a long time, please pass the mushrooms!

And i mean that in the most respectful way, i used to question everything, where did i lose my way?

we're getting into Matrix territory here lol


I keep telling myself that this life is just a dream, any second now I will wake up on my tropical island with a lifetime supply of booze at my disposal *sigh*

Originally posted by Satyr
In order to see through the false reality, you have to be capable of seeing the world from a fresh perspective...as if you just arrived here.

This is why it's better to talk with kids; They're *born* with the "new eyes" that it takes to look at the world with a fresh perspective. When they ask you a question, it's better to ask them what they think about it *before* you answer them...

Matrix always makes me think...
Oh yeh, we do have a code, its called the genes, determine almost everything...

So, here is an interesting story. Scientists have done a very interesting experiment a while ago, I watched it on some science show... I cant remember which country but i still remember the experiment.
Two cars were placed on a busy crossroad, it looked like an accident, cars were crashed, glass everywhere, but no people, so other cars were passing by, just looking. After a while they played the SOUND of the car crash on loudspeakers. People jumped, looked around, cars stoped.
Then they questioned the "witnesses". A large percent of the people ( i cant remember the number) had a MEMORY of SEEING the actual accident happen, which is impossible since the cars were placed there, there was no accident. But after the sound, brain filled the gap according to the previous "conditioning": you hear cars crash, brain fills in the images of it.

Doesnt that freak you out?
These people were 100% convinced that they have SEEN the crash....

It is very easy to manipulate human brain...

You asked the right guy, this is my playground.

Think of it this way, what is real is what you perceive, but what you perceive is only a small part of what is real for you.

get it?

Nobody knows whats real, but I'm fairly sure we aren't hooked up to supercomputers, and if we are, I AM certain that God isn't the programmer.

What benefit could come out of having people hooked up to virtual reality all of their lives? The "real" world would be empty bar the controllers, and I'm assuming that any said "controllers" would not be sucking out our bodily juices to survive

I know many people consider the possibility that they are the ONLY "brain in a jar", and everyone else is part of "the program", kind of like Plato's theory. Well, I can't speak for myself, but I can assure everyone else it isn't true because I have thoughts too, I am real I know that much.

I now see the Matrix as turning into a religion, for some of the over-zealous fans at least, in that many people look to religion because they are scared of dying, now people are hoping the Matrix is true because they are scared of reality, whatever that reality may be, people are begining to expect a blue or red pill to choose from to sort everythi ng out, it's worrying.

chebob,

interesting comments.

I think the matrix is the presentation of a combination of gnosticism/christianity/technology that is quite applicable but of course it does not answer all the questions.

I hope it is not a religion but then again it could be for some people.

difficult to say what religion is sometimes, is it a system of belief or the 'belief' itself?

THENEO, we actually studied the Matrix for a while in Philosophy, and came to the conclusion that it was a modern day update of Platos theory, which is good. It does raise good points, I think it is an excellent way of making young people think past the boundaries, if you know what I mean. May I ask what christianity issues you see in the Matrix, I didn't notice any, I am interested

I think Religion is what a person applies it as. Evangelists and priests all too often use religion as a power tool, but thats not to say that religion can't be good, because many individual people use religion to get through life, not harming anyone else, and I believe that that is how religion should be, not forcing it on people or waging War over it, thats the wrong way.

Infinte- You should seriously research philosphical theories of consciousness. It just so happnes I am now, actually. Check out what others think about reality by browsing through this dictionary and personally researching anything that seems interesting:

www.artsci.wustl.edu...

If I don't eat I will die,if I don't breathe I will die,the rest has no bearing on anything unless you allow it to.
It is all quite meaningless,fear of the unknown is natural,death is unknown to me,I have never died.
I don't fear death,I just don't know what it is.
Nothing else really matters,everything you do on this world has been twisted into a way to profit by the few,give it no thought,it means nothing.

Originally posted by WolfofWar
Real is all based on perspectives. This world is real because we are here, right now, talking on the internet about it. If I ran at a wall, I'd slam into it, that wall is real. When I drink a glass of water from a cup, the cup and water is real. You and I are real, because we are here. So even if we are hooked up to something, both the "false" world that we see, and the "true" world we are in but dont know it, are both, very very real.

Well, not exactly. That wall, cup and water 99.9999999% nothing. And the rest 0.000000001% are "particles" which exist in all possiblities at once, or pop in and out of existence.

All we know of reality, is that which is available to our senses.... For a blind man (born blind), color does not exist in his reality...you can tell him about it, but it resides in the same realm as unicorns and dragons for all he cares....

Interesing joke on this...

College Physics class...the professor states: "I want each of you to prove to me..." and he points to his chair, "that this chair does not exist..."

The students madly scribble, and calculate, etc. and one, rather quickly, hands him a piece of paper. The professor reads it, smiles at the student, and chuckles...

On the paper:

"What chair?"

Well, not exactly. That wall, cup and water 99.9999999% nothing. And the rest 0.000000001% are "particles" which exist in all possiblities at once, or pop in and out of existence.

I think the percentages may be a little off there, but the sentiment is genuine... The only reason something "feels" solid to us, is because of the relationship of the density and vibration between it and our hand and the touched object... Air is also made up of atoms, etc., yet it doesn't feel solid to us...just because of the density of how tightly they're packed....

[Edited on 27-9-2003 by Gazrok]

I now conclude that, in a past life, Gazrock was a Physics teacher Just kidding Gaz