Elemental Inhabitants

This is not another "who are the Rosicrucians?" post. I asked a question specifically about the subjects of Elemental Inhabitants are mentioned ONCE in ONE Rosicrucian manifesto.

Please do not attemt to limit my right to communicate on this board because you are on a power-trip and couldn't take the time to read my post.


[edited all caps, please, no one use all caps, especially in title - nygdan]

[edit on 22-6-2005 by Nygdan]

Originally posted by Modulok
This is not another "who are the Rosicrucians?" post. I asked a question specifically about the subjects of ELEMENTAL INHABJITANTS who are mentioned ONCE in ONE Rosicrucian manifesto.

Please do not attemt to limit my right to communicate on this board because you are on a power-trip and couldn't take the time to read my post.

Wow, insulting a moderator like that isn't a very smart thing to do. He was just trying to help you out, as well as do his job. Did you do a search for what you are asking? What does it have to do with secret societies anyways?

Originally posted by Modulok
Please do not attemt to limit my right to communicate on this board because you are on a power-trip and couldn't take the time to read my post.

Your right to post on this board is limited by your ability to follow the Terms and Conditions of Use and staff direction. If you had a thread closed I’m sure there was a good reason. If you wish to discuss it further simply send a u2u message to the mod that took the action or use the “gripe/help” function to file a formal complaint. Calling people out in forums and puffing your chest out will likely work against you.

I think Moduluk is referring to the broadside that was posted on the street-corners of paris in March 1623:

"We, the deputies of the principal College of the Brethren of the Rose-cross, have taken up our abode, visible and invisible, in this city, by the grace of the Most High, towards whom are turned the hearts of the just. We show and teach without books or signs, and speak all sorts of languages in the countries where we dwell, to draw mankind, our fellows, from error and from death."

The above version of the post is the most common cited today, and was quoted authoritatively by Mackay in his "Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds."

However, other versions of the broadside have the deputies referring to themselves as the invisible college, the elemental inhabitants of this land & etc. I think several of the tracts published by Robert Fludd in defense of the Rosicrucians give the language Modulok is looking for.


It's all about how you ask the question, dude.

Btw, I did several searches on google before posting this, and didn't find any worthwhile hits, other than Mackay's (doubtful) version of the placard. I only have a dim memory of the other version in Fludd and maybe some of Harvey's writings. So Modulok may have already done a lot of net searching before posting this.

I cannot find Fludd's version anywhere on the net after 10 minutes of search. It is only that I have an exemplary memory, and a superlative collection of Fludd's writings. Which, incedentally is under lock and key and guarded by my dogs, in case any of you gets any funny ideas . . .

[edit on 22-6-2005 by dr_strangecraft]

I was actually referring to the Fama Fraternitais, where it says the during the time Christian Rosenkreuz spent in Damascus and Fez in the 14th centuary he (to paraphrase) "became aquanited with the Elementary Inhabhitants, and learned their secrets".

I found one brief mention on the internet, not on a Rosicrucian site, claiming they are astral beings created by the desires and passions of human beings.

That sounds like the "Dion Fortune" school of thought. She used 'elemental' to mean any synthetically created spiritual being; what Tibetan Buddhism would call a "tulpa."

The original concept of elemental (the understanding that would have been common in the 17th cent, by the way) is that an elemental is a vital being that arises spontaneously from the midst of the element, and embodies the essence of one of the four prime substances (elements). Dione fortune and the occultists of the Romantic period kind of hijacked a lot of medieval language and redefined it according to their own whims.

I wonder whether the Fama Fr. documents use "elemental" to mean "aboriginies" or natives; this would mean that CR learned magic from the original (pre-muslim?) inhabitants of the Marakesh. Hmm..



[edit on 22-6-2005 by dr_strangecraft]

definition of Elemental
Pertaining to the elements, first principles, and primary ingredients, or to the four supposed elements of the material world; as, elemental air.

Pertaining to rudiments or first principles; rudimentary; elementary.

Definition of elementary Elementary
Having only one principle or constituent part; consisting of a single element; simple; uncompounded; as, an elementary substance.

Pertaining to, or treating of, the elements, rudiments, or first principles of anything; initial; rudimental; introductory; as, an elementary treatise.

Pertaining to one of the four elements, air, water, earth, fire.

Hate to bring everyone down but by "Elementary Inhabitants" he could very well have been speaking about the native or principal peoples of the region couldn't he? Learning their ways and such?

He could also in a back handed way be insulting them by calling them elementary or simple.

Just a thought.

Spiderj

What is the precise notation? Is it "I learned from the elemental inhabitants of syria" or "I learned from The Elemental Inhabitants of that country"?

Just speculating on some of the 'themes' in rosicurianism that I've noticed on this board, it seems that the language of alchemy and the like are important, and 'elements' is, well, fundamental, atomic. Chemical Wedding, Elemental Inhabitants, seems a way to refer to things in a certain style. Question is, perhaps, does the Style distract from the message?

does the Style distract from the message?

Perhaps the style is the message, phrases or words used in specific certain ways and places that other initiated rosicrusians can follow that lead them to some piece of alchemical knowledge.

Though I'm on tight deadlines this week and have had lots and lots of coffee in the past forty eight hours.

Spiderj

[edit on 6/22/2005 by Spiderj]

I think that thats a definite possibility, but that the problem with rosicurianism is that, apparently, it never existed before those 'adventures of rosenkrantz' stories were published. And that the various rosicurian groups didn't 'pop up' until after those works were published and publically available.

I think that thats a definite possibility, but that the problem with rosicurianism is that, apparently, it never existed before those 'adventures of rosenkrantz' stories were published. And that the various rosicurian groups didn't 'pop up' until after those works were published and publically available.

AMORC one of many claiming to be true rosicrucianism used to advertise in OMNI all the time promising some sort of test and nonsense.

While I enjoyed OMNI alot and still have a ton of issues on my shelves, I don't know that recruiting in the hot dog of science magazines instills the confidence they were hoping for.

Actually is AMORC even around anymore?

SPiderj

Originally posted by Spiderj
Actually is AMORC even around anymore?

Yes, they are actually the most popular organization claiming to be rosicrucian. Although I assume that they are probably having the same membership woes as many other esoteric organizations.

Yes, they are actually the most popular organization claiming to be rosicrucian. Although I assume that they are probably having the same membership woes as many other esoteric organizations

Thanks for clearing that up for me.

I have to assume that recruiting for secret societies has to be an uphill battle.

Though the real secret societies if there are true secret scoieties probably don' t recruit at all.

Spiderj

Originally posted by Spiderj

Yes, they are actually the most popular organization claiming to be rosicrucian. Although I assume that they are probably having the same membership woes as many other esoteric organizations

Thanks for clearing that up for me.

I have to assume that recruiting for secret societies has to be an uphill battle.

Though the real secret societies if there are true secret scoieties probably don' t recruit at all.

Spiderj

Freemasons are absolutely forbidden to recruit or otherwise invite someone to join. A man must ASK a mason to be in the fraternity. This is done to ensure that the candidate is joining of his own free will and accord. He is asked 4 times, in each degree, is this is of his own free will and accord.

Freemasonry assumes that if a man is in need of its lessons, he will search until he finds himself at our door.

But can free masons at this point really be considered a true secret society.

You can buy mason rings on specific websites, you don't even have to be a mason.

Wouldn't Masonry be more of a mystical or philisophical society than a secret one.

Plus, I hear after the meetings there's brownies and coffee, I love a good snack.

Spiderj

Originally posted by Spiderj
But can free masons at this point really be considered a true secret society.

You can buy mason rings on specific websites, you don't even have to be a mason.

Wouldn't Masonry be more of a mystical or philisophical society than a secret one.

Plus, I hear after the meetings there's brownies and coffee, I love a good snack.

You are absolutely correct, Freemasonry is NOT a secret society. We are listed in phone books, our buildings are clearly marked, most of our members make no secret of their membership, and, yes, we have dinner or snacks after meetings Rather, we are a society with secrets. I know that sounds a bit lame, but if you think about it then it makes sense. Our society is not what is secret, but rather our society has some things that it considers to be secret.

I'm surprised that esoteric groups have trouble getting members, since kabbala is all the rage these days.

Originally posted by Nygdan
I'm surprised that esoteric groups have trouble getting members, since kabbala is all the rage these days.

Hahaha yeah but kabbalah is popular because Madonna does it, not because of its esoteric teachings. Admit it, nobody wants to join an organization to which they have to invest their time in to actually get something out of it

Originally posted by Nygdan
I think that thats a definite possibility, but that the problem with rosicurianism is that, apparently, it never existed before those 'adventures of rosenkrantz' stories were published. And that the various rosicurian groups didn't 'pop up' until after those works were published and publically available.

Why is that a problem? It has to start somewhere.

I'm surprised that esoteric groups have trouble getting members, since kabbala is all the rage these days.

The stuff from the Kabbala Center really isn't an esoteric group, it's really more of a New Age thing. The New Age stuff is still growing quite fast.

As far as I can tell the Golden Dawn types groups, and the O.T.O. are still growing pretty well. But they are small groups the O.T.O. has about 4000 members worldwide. I think Freemasonry’s problem might be that they have an "old guy's club" reputation to many of the general public they need to overcome (the same with the Elks, Moose, Eagles, etc..).

Originally posted by sebatwerk
Hahaha yeah but kabbalah is popular because Madonna does it, not because of its esoteric teachings.

Ya Think? I dunno, I was one of many Kabbalists when Madonna was still singing "like a virigin", I actually see less books on the subject in regular stores these days than I did then...you know...the 80's.

from Wikipedia

Modern forms
A recent modern revival has been initiated by the controversial Kabbalah Center founded by Philip Berg in Los Angeles in 1984, and run by him and his sons Yehuda and Michael. With a number of branches worldwide, the group has attracted many non-Jews, including entertainment celebrities such as Madonna, Demi Moore, Mick Jagger and Britney Spears. Reactions from organized Jewish groups have been almost uniformly negative.

Kabbalah Centre
The growth of the modern international Kabbalah Centre, with its fascination for non-Jewish devotees such as Madonna the famous female singer and others, continues to be a source of serious discussion within many Jewish communities today. There are those, Jews and non-Jews alike, who are drawn to its teachings absolutely convinced that they are indeed studying and practicing the Kabbalah, but all the main Jewish denominations find the Kabbalah Centre's actvities to be controversial and do not encourage their members to participate in any way.

Scientology 2.0?

Funny when I was into this stuff 20 years ago, none of the Jews I knew ever heard of the Kabalah.


Oh back on topic: "Elementary Inhabitants", most probably means natives.
But you know, if one was studying occult practices and read that line, elemental spirits could
very easily be interepreted. Such is the language..