Let's pop the bubble of Ignorance.........

Originally posted by Hunting Veritas


How do you make people more intelligent?

Lesson #1. STOP the dumbing down of the children.....

Lesson #2. Build small communities that enable the communities to become self sufficient in electricity, water and food.

Lesson #3. Proper education, not just throw a book at them and say read this........

Lesson #4. Remove the Fractional reserve banking system...

Lesson #5. Create a global governance created by the people for the people, which in turn can create and regulate the money......Without the need for banks........Therefore no one makes a vast amount of money and inevitably removes the power from the corrupt.

Veritas: I am with you 100% buddy, merely playing devils advocate for the sake of debate my man..

Lesson #1. STOP the dumbing down of the children.....
- Sounds easier said than done. How do you stop it?

Lesson #2. Build small communities that enable the communities to become self sufficient in electricity, water and food.
- Maybe a bad peice of history but look at whenever anyone tries to, for lack of a better term and in the eyes of the state, suceed from the union the price is generally too high to be paid. Remember Wako? Agreed the dude was a meglomanical nut - but that isn't why the force was there, if it was why the FBI contridictions. Something was rotten in Denmark that day, and because of that I would think anyone trying to do Lesson #2, would be quickly and violently dealt with.

Lesson #3 - Good point, nothing wrong there.

Lesson #4. Remove the Fractional reserve banking system...
- HA!!! Better chance removing gravity. They have the power, you know this. They want the power you know this as well. The government agencies(FBI, CIA, Military, etc) work for "them". What do you suppose will happen when you try and take "their" power from "them"?

Lesson #5. Create a global governance created by the people for the people, which in turn can create and regulate the money......Without the need for banks........Therefore no one makes a vast amount of money and inevitably removes the power from the corrupt.
- I like this, and would be all for it. I fear it would be claimed as an NWO scheme though. I have always thought of the old saying of "power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely" when thinking of any wold governance.

Once again, merely playing Devils Advocate, or showing where I think there might be a price to be paid. I think your right though, and it disturbs me to think that the road we are all on, leads only to confrontation with the powers that be.

I am asontished that people think it is conspiracy theory to think the Federal Reserve was not orchestrated by bankers and wealthy familes. Some of the same people tied to the plot to install a fascist American regime in 1934...even some of the same people to helped to back Hitler.

To my knowlege, JFK was one of the only powerful figures to want to introduce an alternative to the Ederal Reserve system; and well look what happened to him.

Originally posted by the_oleneo
Uh, that's not accurate on Abraham Lincoln. There was no Federal Reserve bank in his time. He was assassinated by the zealot Confederate loyalists who may have ties to the British/French agenda of undermining the Union.

No, but there was a privatley funded central bank. That wanted to loan money to Abe for the war at huge interest.......He then had what people call "greenbacks" made. Whch you should know of very well. The banks and rich families started loosing some serious cash and......well you know the rest.

Or at least thats how it looks.

[edit on 24/6/05 by Hunting Veritas]

[edit on 24/6/05 by Hunting Veritas]

``

scratching my head.....

(Questioning & pondering)

that could mean, after the Federal Reserve was established ?1913-ish?

that the proto-FBI was commissioned to bust up the other (non-bank)
and deemed lawless organizations...which also 'loaned money'
but those people were condemmed as racketeers & loansharks.

a logical move...have yourself deemed legal & your competition illegal,
corner the markets as the sole source to transact & interplay between the
government & the populations.

ok, now-a-days, that kinda control would necessitate a 'cashless society'
to break the back of 'under-the-table' barter & black-market sub-economies
(which are not taxed or $ generating usury models)
viola = atms which effectively charge you for processing your own money!

.............

good grief,
i'm still trying to understand that excellent link to that FedReserv 'dissection' piece by that Chlstn professor...?UofCinLA?

& the post by the person from Canada, who put up that
understandable to this layman, reply,.............. nice work..?AlwaysLearning?


edit for names of posters (my shot-term memory is shot)

[edit on 24-6-2005 by St Udio]

OK all of your solutions about figuring out just how to control the money for the people regulate yada are wrong. The key is to completely destroy the money that a bank has. You have to resist the urge to rob the bank and instead destroy the bank. Hey look it doesnt sound pretty and many would be scared to die, but if our founding fathers were scared to die we wouldnt even have had an America to live in!

We would have to get together a very intelligent team. It is reccommended to have a few people with military backgrounds in order to train the groups better. You need experienced chemists that could make explosives powerful enough to blow upen the vault doors on the bank. We quickly throw as much cash as we can on the vault floor and set it ablaze. Do not kill anyone. Instead leave printed copies of the very articles we are discussing in as many places as possible.

As far as trying to stop the dumbing down of our children and the masses. We would need those same teams to seek out and destroy the television broadcasting stations that reside in your area. Destroying the ultimate propoganda machine in the history of mankind, temporarily anyways, will bring out alot of citizens into the streets to wonder what has happened. Do not let them be blindly subjected quickly by the authorities. Quickly leave printed documents scattered in all neighborhoods and gathering centers like malls and flea markets. They must know why we are doing the things we do.

Let me tell you this now and get it through all of your minds. The founding fathers had no internet to discuss anything with their neighbors or fellow citizens in the new land about the tyranny of the English King. They did not sit around waiting for other people to take action for them. They took up arms and fought for the future of their people, knowing full well they may die. This is the mentality we all must adopt in order to bring about true significant changes.

Do not be fooled into believeing this is why we have a democratic process and that we should vote the right leaders, because as you should know by now votes can be obviously tampered with. Our political leaders are already working against us. If you read yesterdays headlines in the news network the Supreme Court justices have given the authority for cities to seize citizens homes for private development for the benefit of increased tax earnings for the city. Read about it here

I say again do not wait to take action at this point. If we do we will simply be waiting forever.We have ATS as the information hub. Now we just need individuals to support a cause and take action. It starts with us.

Originally posted by DYepes

I say again do not wait to take action at this point. If we do we will simply be waiting forever.We have ATS as the information hub. Now we just need individuals to support a cause and take action. It starts with us.

I think a campaign of spreading knowledge to a greater amount of the populace is a required first step. Any attempt at 'action' you speak of should be used only when all other means are tried and failed.

What frieghtens me is that you may be correct, but until enough people see how far we've strayed from the intents of the Founders, and until they are willing to take action, we will remain content to debate and complain all day without lifting more than a finger on the keyboard/tv remote.

Truth & Love,
DC

Just out of curiosity, has anyone here taken a university-level course in macro-economics?

And if so, would that scholar please provide me with his or her recommendation as to how and with what we should replace a fractional-reserve banking system?

Thank you.

Originally posted by 8bitagent
I am asontished that people think it is conspiracy theory to think the Federal Reserve was not orchestrated by bankers and wealthy familes. Some of the same people tied to the plot to install a fascist American regime in 1934...even some of the same people to helped to back Hitler.

To my knowlege, JFK was one of the only powerful figures to want to introduce an alternative to the Ederal Reserve system; and well look what happened to him.

Interesting you should mention this. Did you know that prior to WWII there were 3 countries coining and printing their own money: Japan, Germany and Italy!!

Make you think?

Originally posted by Off_The_Street
Just out of curiosity, has anyone here taken a university-level course in macro-economics?

And if so, would that scholar please provide me with his or her recommendation as to how and with what we should replace a fractional-reserve banking system?

Thank you.

Hello,
Well I don't know much about macroeconomics but what I do not is its OVERLY complicated......Have ya ever heard of (K.I.S.S) Keep It Simple Stupid.

as for replacing the fractional reserve system well......how about a system with a little less secrecy and alot less greed.

Originally posted by Hunting Veritas

You have voted AlwaysLearning for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have used all of your votes for this month.

The problem is....you try to discuss it but they don't wanna know because then it upsets there happy lifestyle.

Hey, just noticed! Thanks, amigo... that's a first for me.

You know what, even though people don't want to believe it, on some level they must know its true. So, we trod on...hoping to make a dent here and there. I look at just about everything differently now.

You are correct although many attempts at doing so have failed I think there may be an idea. What if we printed out certain article, for instance the one about the decision for the supreme court justices giving cities the right to seize homes and about the corrupt congresman that hooked up that weapons company with contracts for a nice new house, and mass mailed them to peoples homes.

To save money on postage we could set up volunteer outposts to just make thousands of copies and start dropping them off throught out neighborhoods. I may just be inclined to do this. Single copies at staples are only 5 cents a print. Thats $50 for 1,000 copies. Lets also print out these articles about the banks. We need to hand these all in together. Lets start counting costs people. I feel I can sacrafice 50$-150$ to copy and dispurse these things into neighborhoods.

Come now lets share ideas. Seeing as it would be beyond our financial means to get to every home in a city, we need to pick the people we want to view at first. Then we can gather support from those who decide to help out of that lot and begin to spread it to more of the city. I say if at least 5 of us started in 5 different cities across the States, we alone could reach a broad auddiance in almost eveyr part of the states. And you know people pass knowledge on to friends and relatives.

I will continue to check up on this and see whats up. In the meantime I will beign to print out articles and calculate my copies cost. Eventually we will reach such a high volume of people wanting to help we will need some toll free number or email for people to reach us and help out.

Turning apples into Electricity
Surplus cider fruit in Herefordshire could soon be used to generate "green" electricity. Plans have been unveiled to build a plant that will turn the apples into pure alcohol or "bio-ethanol". The company behind the project, Coressence Ltd, has the support of the Herefordshire Cider Fruit Growers Association and believes it could save 360,000 trees from being chopped down.

The plant could also process other sugar-producing crops such as blackberries and plums, ensuring production throughout the year. Company director Katie Eastaugh said other countries used ethanol from sugar for electricity. But she added: "As far as we know, nothing like this has been done with apples in this country." Exact details of where the plant will be located have not been finalised but the facility is expected to be unobtrusive and about the size of a small agricultural building.

The bio-ethanol will be combusted in a gas turbine heat and power unit with the electricity produced then exported to the grid via a connection point. The amount of "green" energy would be used locally with enough power generated for a town the size of Ledbury. And because the electricity is deemed to be "green" or "renewable", it will attract a £30/MWh subsidy plus the wholesale price of firm renewable power, making the process economically viable.

BBC.co.uk
The good news - you do not have to live in a palace built of solar panels and crowned with wind turbines to generate enough power to boil an egg.
The bad news - at least according to government figures - is that a scheme to make you self-sufficient in energy could take decades to pay off.

Many householders, says the government, could be self-sufficient in power from renewable sources and still have enough to sell on to public utility firms.

Hemp for Fuel

Biomass conversion to fuel has been proven economically feasible, first in laboratory tests and by continuous operation of pilot plants in field tests since 1973. When the energy crop is growing it takes CO2 from the air, so when it is burned the CO2 is released, creating a balanced system.

Biomass is the term used to describe all biologically produced matter. World production of biomass is estimated at 146 billion metric tons a year, mostly wild plant growth. . Some farm crops and trees can produce up to 20 metric tons per acre of biomass a year. Types of algae and grasses may produce 50 metric tons per year.

This biomass has a heating value of 5000-8000 BTU/lb, with virtually no ash or sulfur produced during combustion. About 6% of contiguous United States land area put into cultivation for biomass could supply all current demands for oil and gas.

Tidal Energy

Tidal energy uses the natural ebb and flow of coastal tidal waters. Coastal water levels change twice a day, filling and emptying natural basins along the shoreline. The currents flowing in and out of these basins can turn mechanical devices to produce electricity.

One kind of tidal energy can be harnessed by tidal stream (or marine current) technology. Tidal streams are fast sea currents created by the tides, often increased by features such as headlands, inlets and straits or by the shape of the seabed when water is forced through narrow channels.

Ok there is more than enough proof to show that communities in small numbers could potentially create green, interest and war free energy for everyone to use and possibly more left over to use electric vehicles. Well this is what we go to work for right??

So we can have heat, electricity, food and water.............plus other luxeries....

We have solar, wind, water and Bio-mass fuels.......More than enough energy to cure any peak oil problems.........There is only one problem..

THE CORPORATIONS AND BANKS!

If this technology became widely used and uncontrolled EVERYONE could potentially have free energy and no poverty.....Therefore no need for debt. And no need for banks, hey presto EVERYONES happy....Except the corporate greedy SOB's. That are losing out on some serious money making. Oh well never mind eh.

Peace

[edit on 28/6/05 by Hunting Veritas]

.
I have a theory that wealth is transdimensional.
ie. it comes in many forms.

To be most secure you want diversify your wealth in as many areas as possible.
By that i do not mean only in various financial markets.
Probably all financial markets are subject to political events and tides.

Do you have some amount of food if suddenly there is some interuption in local supply chains? Seems like a small store is a good idea. You might find it unexpectedly valuable.
What about water? Do you have a few gallons of that around?
Do you have a bike, for occasional oil price spikes or the inevitable Peak Oil?
Philosophically - do you do things in your life that keep you engaged, interested and stimulated?

Genuine working knowlege of basic chemistry and physical principles are wonderfully light, can be kept in a book or even in your head.

Certainly health is almost a necessity for happiness.

Don't let someone else dictate your value system.
don't become programmed by some value system.
Neither corporate advertising or counter-culture ideas should be accepted wholesale, without testing them and picking and choosing those things that actually do make sense for you.

Wealth is personal, the more personal the more interesting it is.
Your personality is what you are in the Universe.

For some people long term goals are where they will want to focus,
for others, more immediate happiness may seem more appropriate.

While intellectual knowlege is probably good, exercising and working with it is much better, but don't discount instinct and plain old dumb good luck.

If some people want to persue one-dimensional wealth, it is likely they are building their own logic prison. Certainly you should guard against these mono-minds, but a good portion of the time they are their own punishment.

It is possible that the mind is infinitely deep. Therefore is is possible that it is in a sense an infinite mine of wealth and enjoyment. Sometimes it is tricky getting it operationally accessible though.
.

Originally posted by centurion1211

Originally posted by Hunting Veritas
Lesson #5. Create a global governance created by the people for the people, which in turn can create and regulate the money......Without the need for banks........Therefore no one makes a vast amount of money and inevitably removes the power from the corrupt.

Lesson #5 = marxism sugar coated to make it sound oh so sweet. Until you remember how many people have died in the world due to others chasing that "utopian dream".

Duh, and just where would your new dream world government create, regulate and store it's money? Hint: starts with a 'b' and ends with a 'k'.

Regarding the 'Guernsey experiment', it is not possible to increase the money supply, keep all other things equal and not have inflation. More money = cheaper money = takes more money to purchase the same amount of goods and services than it did before the money supply was increased=inflation.

Ridiculous thread ...

[edit on 6/22/2005 by centurion1211]

almost. if the same exact amount of all goods and services inflated at the exact same rate (or near) as the money supply increased then the value of the currency would stay constant.

besides, the key cause of inflation is fractionalized intrest rates.

You actually used the words "Fractional Reserve Banking" WOW!!



Big up man, now let me have a read of your post properly!

Originally posted by Corinthas

You actually used the words "Fractional Reserve Banking" WOW!!
Big up man, now let me have a read of your post properly!

Strap on your seat belt buddy. Hunting and I are passionate on this subject! Look forward to your participation as well!

Originally posted by Hunting Veritas
Ok there is more than enough proof to show that communities in small numbers could potentially create green, interest and war free energy for everyone to use and possibly more left over to use electric vehicles. Well this is what we go to work for right??

So we can have heat, electricity, food and water.............plus other luxeries....

We have solar, wind, water and Bio-mass fuels.......More than enough energy to cure any peak oil problems.........

Excellent information HV, will read through carefully. Here's a fun little animation to illustrate the seriousness of the problem with our dependency on oil Declare Indpendence from Oil

Here's something else to think about P.E.I. efforts to harness the Wind. It starts with baby steps... Think I'm gonna move there!

Some more documentaries,

Comprehensive Annual Financial Reports Exposed - *.wmv 80mb

The Capitalist Conspiracy - *.wmv 50mb

___________________________________________________________

Audio links,

Sydney White - Banking cartels pt1 - *.mp3

Sydney White - Banking Cartels pt2 - *.mp3

peace

Sydney White - The Assassinations mp3 file

Eustace Mullins - Author of Secrets of the Federal Reserve mp3 file

Always learning says:

Strap on your seat belt buddy. Hunting and I are passionate on this subject! Look forward to your participation as well!

Yet Hunting Veritas admits he doesn't know enough about the fractional reserve concept to even define it or to say what he'd replace it with.

There's nothing wrong with being passionate about a subject, but it helps to at least understand the concepts which you are either for or against.

I will ask you the same questions, because I think we could benefit from a serious discussion here:

* How can you create wealth without a fractional reserve?
* What exactly is wrong with a fractional reserve?
* What would you replace a fractional reserve banking system with -- even if you could somehow get rid of it?

And please, no comments about "something a little less secret..." (there's nothing secret about a fractional reserve) "...and less greedy..." (if you're going to outlaw profits, why would anyone even want to get into the banking business?)

There are a lot of things I am not thrilled about with the banking system, including deficit financing -- but that's fiscal policy, not monetary policy.