Prayer for our Schools

Originally posted by riley
I would have a big problem with someone preventing a kid from reading a bible- I admit I'd much rather see him playing with a footy with the other kids though but if that is what he is interested in it shouldn't be repressed.

You are reassured that religion is not being forced onto the play ground. I am concerned it may be forced off of it. Something similar happened to Luke Whitson. While the details are spun in both directions, the obfuscated truth is likely somewhere in between.

I do not believe that anyone should have to "check their religious (or non-religous) beliefs at the door". Neither the teaching of evolution nor "intelligent design" are required knowledge. A person would be quite capable of surviving or prospering in life if neither were taught in public schools.

As I said in my first post: If the first amendment protects the right of people to have non-religious beliefs, it should also protect people from non-religious beliefs.

Originally posted by TheApocalypse

That is a big lie. My friend who has parents that are Christians and he is an atheist so you can't really prove that just because the parents are a certain religion doesnt mean the child will be that religion.

Your friend made a choice but he had a religious background at home.

Show me what public school in the US is teaching atheism to children.

Also I came from a Christian home I made the decision as an adult to be a none religious follower.

School didn't have any influence on my desicion.

Deny ignorance don't spread it.

accidently posted twice.

[edit on 3-6-2005 by TheApocalypse]

They are teaching atheism in school by teaching evolution,big bang theory, and while they are able to teach al this you can't bring a bible to school or read it. Some of my friends and myself were trying to make a youth group kind of thing and my biology teacher kept complaining and we werent able to make one because of him.

accidentally posted twice.

Originally posted by TheApocalypse
They are teaching atheism in school by teaching evolution,big bang theory,

That is science- not atheism.

and while they are able to teach al this you can't bring a bible to school or read it.

So did you try read the bible during a science class?

Some of my friends and myself were trying to make a youth group kind of thing and my biology teacher kept complaining and we werent able to make one because of him.

Let me guess.. you were trying to form a christian [?] youth group while distrupting his BIOLOGY class? If you weren't.. wtf has it got to do with him and why would he care if it's not in his teaching time?

[edit on 3-6-2005 by riley]

Originally posted by Raphael_UO
You are reassured that religion is not being forced onto the play ground. I am concerned it may be forced off of it. Something similar happened to Luke Whitson.

Okay- I thought you were being hypathetical for a while.. I remember that case and RANT actually rang the school.. the kid got in trouble, not for him 'innocently' reading a bible on his lonesome in a school yard.. apparently [though my memory is vague] it was adults trying to have an organised prayer group in a public school and pretending it was the kids idea.. they put their foot down so the group hoared the situation for some free press.

I do not believe that anyone should have to "check their religious (or non-religous) beliefs at the door". Neither the teaching of evolution nor "intelligent design" are required knowledge.

Evolution and the big bang theory are supported by facts.

A person would be quite capable of surviving or prospering in life if neither were taught in public schools.

So we'll just skip dinousaurs and all of the planets history? The point of school is to learn facts.. if parents want their kids to learn mythology they should send them to schools that teach it.. if you are going to exclude REAL scientific facts from science.. where does it stop? I hear that the sex ed program bush set up thats in line with his beliefs.. [yep thats freedome of religion] teaches that masturbation causes pregnancy [i thought it was blindness] and that most gay kids are HIV+.. where would it stop?

As I said in my first post: If the first amendment protects the right of people to have non-religious beliefs, it should also protect people from non-religious beliefs.

Ie. Knowledge.:shk:

Originally posted by riley

I beg to differ. You did not start a post condemning massacres in schools.. you started one condemning atheism.. how many atheist kids have massacred? How many pulled the trigger saying 'god told them to do it'? Don't pretend you were just wanting to 'pray'.. if you really wanted to do that you would be praying for kids to be loved [as what what was suppose to have been Jesus' message].. not praying for their conversion or promoting hate against atheism. You put all that effort into your original post promoting christianity.. yet don't even bother promoting tollerence as you are meant to and have the gall to call me a hypcrite.

Besides, why do you try so hard to deny us, while still saying you should be tolerant of other religions? You are a hypocrite. I wonder why you try so hard to deny Christianity and Judaism, even Islam, but tell about your religion and about tolerance......

Throwing stones now? I doubt very much you would be at all tolerent of of your children praying with ones who consider mother nature to be their god.
This is what you were 'praying' for:

'Lord, please help the schools.You told us that it is not Your will that any should perish, but that all should come to You. Please carry out your will in our schools, and save the children from the temptation to become atheist as the schools teach. In the name of Jesus Christ, amen.

I pray for the schools because I am in them, and almost all of my friends are atheist because of the curriculum of evolution and other BS.'

Did you pray for love? No. You pray that kids are taught to believe in YOUR god. Did you 'pray' against hate? No. Did you pray against the 'temptation' to join gangs? No. Against child abuse? No. Against the temptations of drug addiction? No. Poverty? No. Did you pray against biggotry and division? No.. clearly you want to create it.


[edit on 2-6-2005 by riley]

Coming to God helps to keep kids from all of those temptations, forgiveness, addictions, abuse, hate, division. That's what I prayed for. Christians help the poor, they love people, and they forgive. And yes, you are a hypocrite. You want tolerance right? But you dont want Judaism/Christianity/Islam. You cant say your tolerant of religion, then go and condemn mine. About the mother nature thing, I wouldnt want my kids praying to mother nature. On the other hand, I wouldnt mind them trying to help those kids. Once you get to know God, you want to bring everyone to see how wonderful He really is.

This thread was not supposed to be a religious discussion. I only wanted to get likeminded Christians to join me in prayer. Leave us alone, there are plenty of religious argument threads for you to debate religion in.

Originally posted by DanD9
Coming to God helps to keep kids from all of those temptations, forgiveness, addictions, abuse, hate, division. That's what I prayed for.

Thats not what your post said.. you 'prayed' against atheism.

Christians help the poor, they love people, and they forgive.

Correction.. christians are suppose to do all those things.. and you've failed at doing some of those things yourself anyway.

And yes, you are a hypocrite.

Have I called you names? You've also called atheists satanists.. and while I know nothing of satanism I'm sure I know what your defintion of it is. BTW. Perhaps you should read the regulations of this place.

You want tolerance right? But you dont want Judaism/Christianity/Islam.

I do not want it taught to my own children in a public school. If I wanted them to be taught that I would send them to Judaism/Christianity/Islam schools. If you have a problem with that.. talk to your parents and ask them to send you to a christian school.

You cant say your tolerant of religion, then go and condemn mine.

I never condemned yours.. I just don't want it being forced onto those who do not wish to follow that religion.

About the mother nature thing, I wouldnt want my kids praying to mother nature. On the other hand, I wouldnt mind them trying to help those kids.

Wow.. you want freedom of religion but don't want pagenism taught at public schools.

Once you get to know God, you want to bring everyone to see how wonderful He really is.

So we can turn out like you? You don't make the best poster child.

This thread was not supposed to be a religious discussion.

No.. it was meant to be a bitch about those who won't follow.

I only wanted to get likeminded Christians to join me in prayer.

Go to a church or an actual christian forum then.

Leave us alone, there are plenty of religious argument threads for you to debate religion in.

Do as I say not as I do? If you're going to sling mud.. be prepared for it to bounce back.

[edit on 3-6-2005 by riley]

"I never condemned yours.. I just don't want it being forced onto those who do not wish to follow that religion. "
How is praying for them forcing it on them?

"Correction.. christians are seppose to do all those things."
Actually, you aint really a Christian if you dont.

"Thats not what your post said.. you 'prayed' against atheism. "
Praying agaist atheism keeps kids from the bad things you listed.

Now..... so you say I should have prayed against gangs, violence, drugs, etc. As you are an atheist.... what makes you think those are bad then? What makes them bad, according to you?

Originally posted by DanD9
"I never condemned yours.. I just don't want it being forced onto those who do not wish to follow that religion. "
How is praying for them forcing it on them?

This is not exclusively a christian forum.. if people pray to themselves.. no-one else has to hear.. you were making political opinions public thus trying to affect people's attitudes.. there are people with the same opinions trying to bring 'adam and eve' into science class.. that is forcing religion.

"Correction.. christians are seppose to do all those things."
Actually, you aint really a Christian if you dont.

If thats the case.. how are you able to call yourself one?

"Thats not what your post said.. you 'prayed' against atheism. "
Praying agaist atheism keeps kids from the bad things you listed.

No it doesn't.. did christianity prevent priests feeling up kids or witch burnings? The crusades? Or people posting up atheist bashing threads?

Now..... so you say I should have prayed against gangs, violence, drugs, etc. As you are an atheist.... what makes you think those are bad then? What makes them bad, according to you?

Those things a distructive and based on hate not love.. perhaps if you learnt more about atheism you would realise that our ethics are more based on an appreciation for humanity than what a book says.

[edit on 3-6-2005 by riley]

Originally posted by riley
Okay- I thought you were being hypathetical for a while.. I remember that case and RANT actually rang the school.. the kid got in trouble, not for him 'innocently' reading a bible on his lonesome in a school yard.. apparently [though my memory is vague] it was adults trying to have an organised prayer group in a public school and pretending it was the kids idea.. they put their foot down so the group hoared the situation for some free press.

As I said, the truth is likely someplace in between the two stories.

Evolution and the big bang theory are supported by facts.
So we'll just skip dinousaurs and all of the planets history? The point of school is to learn facts.. if parents want their kids to learn mythology they should send them to schools that teach it.. if you are going to exclude REAL scientific facts from science.. where does it stop? I hear that the sex ed program bush set up thats in line with his beliefs.. [yep thats freedome of religion] teaches that masturbation causes pregnancy [i thought it was blindness] and that most gay kids are HIV+.. where would it stop?

The point of school is to provide an education. Not all facts are relevant to the development of a child.

It never becomes an educated person to resort to logical fallacies to support their arguments. "Slippery slope" is a logical fallacy.

[edit on 3-6-2005 by Raphael_UO]

Originally posted by TheApocalypse

Our beliefs and what we worship starts at home, is not the school job to preach or teach what religion is the best.

When a child is an atheist is because the parents at home are atheists too, not because the school has told the child to be one while teaching evolution.

That is a big lie. My friend who has parents that are Christians and he is an atheist so you can't really prove that just because the parents are a certain religion doesnt mean the child will be that religion.

Oh flying Christ. First of all, you stated earlier that you will not be open-minded for an atheist; and now, you state that an atheist is your friend? Friendship is based on trust and open-mindedness - so which were you lying about?

Moving on, not all parents force their own religion upon their children - and schools don't, either. I grew up in a rinky-dink town, primarily Baptist evangelists, who would preach from time to time, but generally left most folks alone. I was harrassed from time to time, but it stopped after they came onto my property, and I greeted them with a gun, and called the Sheriff for trespassing.

Anyway, my mother's side of the family (with whom I resided) are into Christianity so deep, it's not even worth discussing. I, however, never liked the belief much - even from a young age. I experimented in my younger years - Wicca and neo-Paganism, Satanism, Shinto, etc. - until I finally arrived at the point I stand at now - a Buddhist of the Mahayana school. I never received any contempt or argument from either my family, classmates, or faculty.

I, unlike so many, chose my beliefs, rather than having them dictated to me - beliefs including the idea that, if you DON'T believe any of it:

They are teaching atheism in school by teaching evolution,big bang theory, and while they are able to teach al this you can't bring a bible to school or read it.

They are not telling the children to believe any of it, however. In fact, if you read the books really closely, generally, they say "scientists theorize such-and-such," or "scientists hypothesize so-and-so," not "scientists demand that so-and-so is true, and you must believe it."

The example of whether or not a bible can be brought to school probably varies from school-to-school. At my school, it didn't matter.

Some of my friends and myself were trying to make a youth group kind of thing and my biology teacher kept complaining and we werent able to make one because of him.

Funny, some friends and I were trying to make an "alternative beliefs" youth group, and we were denied - however, immediately after, a third Christian youth group was created.

Coming to God helps to keep kids from all of those temptations, forgiveness, addictions, abuse, hate, division. That's what I prayed for. Christians help the poor, they love people, and they forgive.

I suppose this is a trait of Christians only? I suppose Buddhists hate, don't love, don't help the poor, and don't forgive?

You want tolerance right? But you dont want Judaism/Christianity/Islam. You cant say your tolerant of religion, then go and condemn mine.

Oh, I don't care about Judeo-Christian beliefs. I'm actually quite tolerant of them. However, I only am as tolerant of Christians as they are of me. If a Christian were to ask me, "so, you worship a fat, bald guy?" I would reply, "yes, and you worship an old, grey-bearded sky-pixie." However, if one were to ask me, "so who IS the Buddha to you? Is he a God? What are the tenets of Buddhism?" I would answer accordingly, and ask similar questions of his religion that I didn't fully understand.

Christianity is starting to behave like Feminism. They want equality and tolerance - but just a little more than everybody else.

Show tolerance for me, and I'll do the same. If you don't, I won't. Simple as that.

Once you get to know God, you want to bring everyone to see how wonderful He really is.

And if they refuse, harrass them to the point of insanity, and when they shoot up the school, blame it on atheism.

Leave us alone

Non-Christians have been saying this to Christians for centuries - and it hasn't worked yet. Why would WE comply?

As you are an atheist.... what makes you think those are bad then? What makes them bad, according to you?

First of all, I am not an atheist, as earlier stated. However, "non-Christian" does not mean "immoral." Everyone has morals - they vary from person to person. Just because one is atheist does not mean that he finds it acceptable to skin a man alive (although it is rumored that this occured during the Crusades. )

The only prayer I have seen so far in this thread is to instigate religious intolerance and ignorance.

The author of this thread has done a great job, if is points what you want you hit the jackpot.

I am finished here.:shk:

Originally posted by marg6043
The only prayer I have seen so far in this thread is to instigate religious intolerance and ignorance.

The author of this thread has done a great job, if is points what you want you hit the jackpot.

I am finished here.:shk:

I agree 1000% marge. You have shown exactly that toward religion in this thread.

It is amazing how a simple prayer request can attract the haters of God like that.

Much of the intolerance and hate toward religion should leave with you.
Thanks for finally realizing.

Originally posted by marg6043
The only prayer I have seen so far in this thread is to instigate religious intolerance and ignorance.

The author of this thread has done a great job, if is points what you want you hit the jackpot.

I am finished here.:shk:

Thanks for leaving
i only wanted a few people to pray with me. I wouldnt even mind if a buddhist came in and posted a prayer for schools. (Although I was hoping for Christians or Jews mostly..lol.) i am getting sick of all the people coming in here and yelling about how bad religion is. I wanted prayers for schools; not people to come in and bash my religion.

jake should I take this as an insult, because if that is what you are trying to do I see that the so call "religious" are indeed the ones instigating the hate and intolerance and you are just falling into the cathegory.

Good job Jake you are one of a kind.

See you again in other threads.

Originally posted by LOBO

Actually Jesus lets anyone who wants to, do a u-turn.

Lord please save our children from school violence and please save us from each other

Originally posted by Croat56
Lord please save our children from school violence and please save us from each other

Amen to that brother, if is something religion has fail in this world in the thousands of years of been born is to unite humans as a whole in love peace and fellowship.

But instead is hatred, intolerance and my God is better than yours, my believes are the real ones and yours are wrong.

Pity.