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How Do They Enter and Leave ?
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Originally posted by Paul_Richard
I deem them to be technologically advanced and spiritually primitive.
Could you elaborate on what you mean by this? More specifically, if you don't mind, I'd like to understand what you mean by "spiritually primitive", and why do you say that they are, what you call "spiritually primitive"? My guess is that this is related to them "worshipping" physicality and all that this implies, but I may be wrong.
No, it is based on inductive reasoning. You do know what that is...right?
I think - something to do with you having partial data and certain observations, and then trying to make logical conclusions based on that? I may be wrong though, so please let me know if I am
It would not behoove them to implant a screen memory for the purpose you are suggesting.
I don't think I had any specific purpose in mind, just the opposite, that I don't know what the purpose of what they are doing may be (not in general, but in your specific experience). And so, I cannot assume to know when they would or would not deem it necessary to use screen memories. I may have some ideas, but the are just ideas. So I always leave it open to the possibility that they can use it at any time they deem necessary, I can't categorically state "no, they will not use it in this situation or for this purpose" because that would be my assumption, osit.
Yet another logical argument: if the Zetans could teleport, they would not need a paralysis beam. They could simply teleport their victim into a highly secured room (high-tech cage). There are many cases of paralysis beam abductions and very little or no testimonial evidence pointing to Zetan teleportation ability.
So my question would be, why do they paralyze you? Is it because they have no choice (as you suggest), or is there a specific purpose for paralysis that, even if they had teleportation, they would still paralyze you first anyway? What if they simply need you paralyzed, and don't want you to "thrash around" at all? And who says that anything that people remember after their paralysis is objectively what happened, and not a screen memory? Again, it makes little sense to me that they'd just walk in, pick you up, and somehow carry you into their craft, wherever it may be.
Originally posted by lilblam
Your hypothesis may very well be that they do not possess those abilities, and as probable as it may seem from our human point of view that they would've used those abilities in those particular circumstances, it is still only our assumption.
One person's assumption is another person's hypothesis, and yet another person's fact.
Well in this case, it is always an assumption because this concerns free will. You cannot say that if someone could've done something, they necessarily would've - because of free will to choose NOT to do it at any time and for whatever reason (and there are an infinity+1 reasons for why someone would or would not do anything). Of course we only have probability to work with, and what further muddies the picture for us is the mysterious state of our "abductors", since their minds do not work like our minds, but only in part. Yes, they too are STS oriented and so that implies many things that we can know about their nature, that is true. But I am talking about specifics like how to use their technologies and/or abilities and why in any given circumstance, because their perception of any circumstance and judgement is based on their own knowledge and thought processes, which is drastically different from ours. Just as a human and a dog, both being STS entities that eat and breathe and play, also have drastically different thought processes because of their drastically different levels of awareness and knowledge. And as a result, sometimes a dog simply cannot know why a human does what he does, nor can he even understand the complexities and reasons behind most human actions because the dog simply has no capacity to understand.
Of course SOME things it is possible for us to know about them, but the devil is always in the details. But if we start with an assumption, we will only lead ourselves astray. For example, we cannot assume that we know what the goal is of whoever SEEMS to be abducting us. Yes, you may have seen a white light and even experienced partial or full paralysis, but does this necessarily mean that they intended to do more than that? Does it mean that they "failed"? Does it mean that you are "high priority" and that they try to not mess with such targets, or is that again just your assumption? For all you know, the vast majority of the population of the planet has been abducted hundreds of times EACH, and only an extremely tiny portion in extremely rare circumstances remembers what appears to be an experience of abduction due to some imperfection in their memory blocking technology, or other reasons. But this does not mean that you and I cold not be abducted every day and simply have no conscious recollection about it!
But if we start with something we can know, and only work with that (while making hypothesis about other things but not drawing conclusions based on assumptions), we have a better chance of not straying from objective reality, osit.
For those of us who do the research and look at the material objectively, we know a great deal about their intentions by their actions over the years
I don't mean their "general" intentions, I mean intentions in very particular and specific circumstances. Their intentions towards humanity in general may be one thing, but their intentions, goals, and way of doing things in particular circumstances may have their own particular reasons for it too.
Again, a dog may see a human walk into a "bathroom" to pee, and the dog may conclude that the human is incapable of peeing outside! The dog cannot understand "socially inappropriate" or "embarrasing", and so it is drawing conclusions based on its own assumption, which is false. So you see them do one thing, and maybe even EXPECT (assume) that they want to do something, and if they do not, you assume that they can't? Again, this is your perspective, which is limited to your understanding and level of awareness, which is not theirs, osit.
[edit on 14-6-2005 by lilblam]
Originally posted by lilblam
I'd like to understand what you mean by "spiritually primitive", and why do you say that they are, what you call "spiritually primitive"?
We have a scale of evolution that was given to us from Spirit in the early 1990s and it is in regard to a person's Dominant Aura Color. Souls of common spirituality have a DAC of brown, red or orange. This is where the Zetans generally reside. Souls of basic spirituality, as with some of the people in this forum, have a DAC of yellow or violet. Saints have a DAC of sky blue or white.
With extensive experience in discernment of many people over the years, I find that this scale of evolution to be very accurate.
As a soul progresses, the ability to distinguish right and wrong, good and evil, increases. Conversely, those on the lower levels, as with the Zetans, have a hard time telling the difference. It is much like when you ask a mass murderer/rapist to define what is evil; he has a very hard time doing so because he has more or less destroyed his inner god spark that enables one to spiritually evolve. The Zetans do not view their treatment of Terrans as evil because they have retrogressed to the point of not being able to tell the difference, i.e., they are spiritually primitive or spiritually retarded.
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
No, it is based on inductive reasoning. You do know what that is...right?
Originally posted by lilblam
I think - something to do with you having partial data and certain observations, and then trying to make logical conclusions based on that? I may be wrong though, so please let me know if I am
Deductive reasoning is taking a general circumstance and drawing a specific conclusion. For example, take the statement, "All libraries have books." You see a library without going inside. With deductive reasoning, you conclude that that library also has books. Accuracy in one's conclusions vary.
Inductive reasoning is taking a specific circumstance and drawing a general conclusion. A scientist may test a chemical compound for specific properties and then conclude that all chemicals of that nature have those properties. Accuracy in testing and in one's conclusions vary.
Logic and reasoning are excellent tools in discovering the truth about anything.
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
Yet another logical argument: if the Zetans could teleport, they would not need a paralysis beam. They could simply teleport their victim into a highly secured room (high-tech cage). There are many cases of paralysis beam abductions and very little or no testimonial evidence pointing to Zetan teleportation ability.
Originally posted by lilblam
So my question would be, why do they paralyze you? Is it because they have no choice (as you suggest), or is there a specific purpose for paralysis that, even if they had teleportation, they would still paralyze you first anyway?
The paralysis scenario is a common thread in abduction cases. I view it much like when a zoologist uses tranquilizer darts on animals in order to lessen their resistance for tagging, relocating, etc. Paralysis prevents all opposition or potential opposition to a kidnapping.
Originally posted by lilblam
What if they simply need you paralyzed, and don't want you to "thrash around" at all? And who says that anything that people remember after their paralysis is objectively what happened, and not a screen memory?
Some of can indeed be a screen memory. It takes time to sort it all out. Hypnotic regression therapy is a valuable tool for abductees.
Originally posted by lilblam
Again, it makes little sense to me that they'd just walk in, pick you up, and somehow carry you into their craft, wherever it may be.
It would be cool if they were benign beings who teleported in, invited people to be teleported to their ship, and, without any invasionary tactics or manipulation, then brought the people back. Unfortunately, the testimonial evidence points to many just being paralyzed and treated as laboratory animals, for breeding purposes, etc. Some are dissected and never make it out alive.
Originally posted by lilblam
Your hypothesis may very well be that they do not possess those abilities, and as probable as it may seem from our human point of view that they would've used those abilities in those particular circumstances, it is still only our assumption.
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
One person's assumption is another person's hypothesis, and yet another person's fact.
Originally posted by lilblam
Well in this case, it is always an assumption because this concerns free will. You cannot say that if someone could've done something, they necessarily would've - because of free will to choose NOT to do it at any time and for whatever reason (and there are an infinity+1 reasons for why someone would or would not do anything). Of course we only have probability to work with, and what further muddies the picture for us is the mysterious state of our "abductors", since their minds do not work like our minds, but only in part. Yes, they too are STS oriented and so that implies many things that we can know about their nature, that is true. But I am talking about specifics like how to use their technologies and/or abilities and why in any given circumstance, because their perception of any circumstance and judgment is based on their own knowledge and thought processes, which is drastically different from ours. Just as a human and a dog, both being STS entities that eat and breathe and play, also have drastically different thought processes because of their drastically different levels of awareness and knowledge. And as a result, sometimes a dog simply cannot know why a human does what he does, nor can he even understand the complexities and reasons behind most human actions because the dog simply has no capacity to understand.
I agree that they are STS oriented. Their genius level intelligence is overrated. I've known some geniuses who are also spiritually retarded. I'd rather befriend Saints (which I have).
Originally posted by lilblam
Of course SOME things it is possible for us to know about them, but the devil is always in the details. But if we start with an assumption, we will only lead ourselves astray. For example, we cannot assume that we know what the goal is of whoever SEEMS to be abducting us. Yes, you may have seen a white light and even experienced partial or full paralysis, but does this necessarily mean that they intended to do more than that? Does it mean that they "failed"? Does it mean that you are "high priority" and that they try to not mess with such targets, or is that again just your assumption? For all you know, the vast majority of the population of the planet has been abducted hundreds of times EACH, and only an extremely tiny portion in extremely rare circumstances remembers what appears to be an experience of abduction due to some imperfection in their memory blocking technology, or other reasons. But this does not mean that you and I cold not be abducted every day and simply have no conscious recollection about it!
We each have a brain that is capable of independent thought and analysis. With the passage of time, one's awareness increases. The pursuit of truth is an endless venture and one that is worth the effort. When a better paradigm emerges, I will go with it. Until then, I will stick to what I have found thus far.
Originally posted by lilblam
But if we start with something we can know, and only work with that (while making hypothesis about other things but not drawing conclusions based on assumptions), we have a better chance of not straying from objective reality, osit.
A common characteristic of an abduction is paralysis. Another common characteristic is a medical examination. Yet another one is the impregnation of women here and then stealing their unborn fetuses. I really don't care about their culture, religion, or value system. They are clearly indifferent to our own free will and need to be stopped. Period.
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
For those of us who do the research and look at the material objectively, we know a great deal about their intentions by their actions over the years
Originally posted by lilblam
I don't mean their "general" intentions, I mean intentions in very particular and specific circumstances. Their intentions toward humanity in general may be one thing, but their intentions, goals, and way of doing things in particular circumstances may have their own particular reasons for it too.
Specific intentions vary while the general atmosphere is one of violating our own free will. As stated, some people are abducted for dissection and never return alive. I remember coming across a case of a soldier who went through that. They found his corpse a few days after his disappearance. The manner of the dissection led one to believe that they kept the man alive for as long as possible. Again, their specific intentions are irrelevant. They need to be stopped.
The Machiavellian principle of the ends justifying the means is also a characteristic value of those with an STS focus.
Originally posted by lilblam
Again, a dog may see a human walk into a "bathroom" to pee, and the dog may conclude that the human is incapable of peeing outside! The dog cannot understand "socially inappropriate" or "embarrassing", and so it is drawing conclusions based on its own assumption, which is false. So you see them do one thing, and maybe even EXPECT (assume) that they want to do something, and if they do not, you assume that they can't? Again, this is your perspective, which is limited to your understanding and level of awareness, which is not theirs, osit.
If the emperor wears no clothes, then he wears no clothes. The conclusions that I have are shared by many researchers. The more popular appraisal of the Zetan-aliens, a perspective that is furthered through abductee brainwashing and alien spirit mediums, is that they are our space brothers who are here to further or evolutionary development. Now there's an assumption that I disagree with as it is unsupported.
We should not judge any alien race by their intellect or their technology but by their application (or lack thereof) of The Golden Rule. Everything else is irrelevant because this is what dictates our autonomy and our very survival.
My Gift of Discernment as a spiritual medium and Solist Mystic doesn't always tell me a person's Dominant Aura Color. However, in answer to a probable inquiry: your DAC is presently violet.
[edit on 15-6-2005 by Paul_Richard]
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
We have a scale of evolution that was given to us from Spirit in the early 1990s and it is in regard to a person's Dominant Aura Color. Souls of common spirituality have a DAC of brown, red or orange. This is where the Zetans generally reside. Souls of basic spirituality, as with some of the people in this forum, have a DAC of yellow or violet. Saints have a DAC of sky blue or white.
With extensive experience in discernment of many people over the years, I find that this scale of evolution to be very accurate.
As a soul progresses, the ability to distinguish right and wrong, good and evil, increases. Conversely, those on the lower levels, as with the Zetans, have a hard time telling the difference. It is much like when you ask a mass murderer/rapist to define what is evil; he has a very hard time doing so because he has more or less destroyed his inner god spark that enables one to spiritually evolve. The Zetans do not view their treatment of Terrans as evil because they have retrogressed to the point of not being able to tell the difference, i.e., they are spiritually primitive or spiritually retarded.
From what you are saying, it seems like those with greater empathy towards others (not selectively, but ALL others) are those you'd consider as having higher spirituality level? Now, right and wrong, good and evil, those are all subjective terms unless they are simply semantics for objective concepts. What is right to someone is wrong to another, what is good to someone is evil to another. But as you already know, STO and STS is objective, free will is objective, and so given the understanding of such concepts, "good and evil" can be simply STO and STS, and so the more STS someone is, the more "evil", unsympathetic, heartless, and free-will-violating his actions are, and vice versa.
And I agree that intelligence and polarity are different things. You can be extremely intelligent but can be the most "evil" person in the world, and fool billions. What you speak of anyway reminds me of "Frequency Resonance Vibration", as spoken of by the Cassiopaeans in their transmissions. It seems to correlate anyway, and that's very interesting indeed!
Here are some cut out passages where they mention it, it may or not be interesting to you. By the way, in case you don't know, the source claims to be 6th density beings of light, and also "us in the future" (not ALL humanity, but some who choose that path of knowledge and STO). Whether the source really is who it claims to be is anyone's guess, but all we have is the messages to work with, which must be verified as well, never ever believed. So far, their "track record" is very impressive, but I won't get into that now. Here are the relevant quotes. Their answers are preceeded with A:, and I have bolded the parts that I think are very important. Also, just so anyone reading this is clear, 3rd density is us humans, 4th density would be grays, reptilians, and essentially all who are at a "next level of awareness" after ours (not just smarter or more advanced, but at a higher level completely). Much of this relates closely to some things you have said too. Also, there is no link to any of this, so I cannot just link, but I think this is important enough to paste.
-------------------------
(TR) When I use the acupuncture, I'm just releasing energy blockages within the person?
A: No. TR. You are sensing what all experience when in contact with others. You see in the history of your life are rather drastic changes in mental, emotional and psychic awareness, to say nothing of attitude and awareness. This is symptomatic of the change in frequency resonance vibration. The things that used to interest you do not anymore, and vice versa. One way this is manifested is a decrease in interests of a material or physical nature. One's libido tends to decrease, for but one example.
-------------------------
A: You are all STS. If you were not, you would not be where you are.
Q: (A) There are those who are happy in the STS mode; and there are those who are trying to get out of the STS mode...
A: STO candidate.
Q: (A) These STO candidates cannot just simply BE, even theoretically, because then, STS would eat them.
A: No.
Q: Why not?
A: STS does not eat according to protocol.
Q: What does that mean?
A: What do you suppose?
Q: I have no idea!
A: STS "eats" whatever it wants to, if it is able.
Q: That's what we said. If you are STO in an STS world, you are basically defenseless and they eat you.
A: No.
Q: Why? What makes STO unavailable or 'inedible?'
A: Frequency resonance not in sync.
Q: (A) But then, that would mean that all these people who are saying that we need just to love everything and everybody, are right. They just be, and love,
don't do anything, just give everything to the Lizzies... they are right!
A: No, because motivation is STS.
Q: How is the motivation to love everything and everybody, and to just give, STS?
A: Feels good.
Q: So, they want to do it because it feels good?
A: Want is an STS concept.
------------------------
Q: (L) What is the oldest Neanderthal that's been found? Anybody know? No, well then when did Neanderthal appear on the planet?
A: 5.3 million years ago.
Q: (L) You are saying that when science says that modern man appeared 35 to 40 thousand years ago, and Neanderthal disappeared at the same time, the real time frame was 70 to 80 thousand years ago? In other words, a factor of 2 error.
A: Close.
Q: (L) And, of course, we can't depend on any of the dating methods because of metamorphosis.
A: And genetic manipulation.
Q: (L) So, in effect, we ARE the new Neanderthals on the eve of extinction. You have said that those who transition into 4th density in the body will go through some kind of rejuvenation process or body regeneration or something. Does that mean that these present "Neanderthal" type bodies that we presently occupy will morph into something more in line with the new model? Is it genetically encoded into some of them to do so?
A: Something like that.
Q: (L) So, that's why they have been following certain bloodlines for generation after generation; they are tinkering with the DNA and arming genetic time-bombs that are waiting to go off. (A) What is interesting is how do those who are trying to get these people, to abduct them, how do they spot them? How do they get the information? By following the bloodline, or by some kind of monitor you can detect from a long distance - and they can note that "here is somebody of interest" or "here is somebody dangerous" or "let's abduct this one" or whatever. How do they select? Do they search the genealogies or is it some kind of remote sensing?
A: Now this is interesting Arkadiusz, as it involves the atomic "signature" of the cellular structure of the individual. In concert with this is the etheric body reading and the frequency resonance vibration. All these are interconnected, and can be read from a distance using remote viewing technology/methodology.
Q: (L) Can it be done in a pure mechanical way without using psychic means?
A: At another level of understanding, the two are blended into one.
Q: (T) Computerized psychic remote viewing, maybe. Like artificial intelligence. Maybe a mind connected to a computer?
A: That is close, yes.
------------------------
A: We wish to review some things first. The concept of a "master race" put forward by the Nazis was merely a 4th density STS effort to create a physical vehicle with the correct frequency resonance vibration for 4th density STS souls to occupy in 3rd density. It was also a "trial run" for planned events in what you perceive to be your future.
Q: (L) You mean with a strong STS frequency so they can have a "vehicle" in 3rd density, so to speak?
A: Correct. Frequency resonance vibration! Very important.
Q: (L) So, that is why they are programming and experimenting? And all these folks running around who some think are "programmed," could be individuals who are raising their nastiness levels high enough to accommodate the truly negative STS 4th density - sort of like walk-ins or something, only not nice ones?
A: You do not have very many of those present yet, but that was, and still is, the plan of some of the 4th density STS types.
------------------------
Q: So, we can forget that one for now. Okay, last session you brought up the subject of Frequency Resonance Vibration. You suggested that there are certain STS forces who are developing or creating or managing physical bodies that they are trying to increase the frequency in so that they will have bodies that are wired so that they can manifest directly into 3rd density, since that seems to be the real barrier that prevents an all-out invasion, the fact that we are in 3rd density and they are in 4th. Now, I assumed that the same function could be true for STO individuals. It seems that many individuals who have come into this time period from the future, coming back into the past via the incarnational cycle so as not to violate free will, have carefully selected bodies with particular DNA, which they are, little by little, activating so that there 4th density selves, or higher, can manifest in this reality. Is it possible for those energies to manifest into such bodies which have been awakened or tuned in 3rd density?
A: STO tends to do the process within the natural flow of things. STS seeks to alter creation processes to fit their ends.
Q: This Top Secret document and the Anna Hayes material to some extent, both talk about many abductions being "ourselves from the future" who have come back to the past, or what is for us, the present, to abduct their own bodies to make genetic adjustments so that they can advance and not make the mistakes they made in another timeline. Is that, in fact, part of the scenario?
A: Very close to the truth!
Q: Can you abduct yourself in an STO manner and help yourself in this way? Can that be STO?
A: It is not, because that is not STO.
Q: So, when that is happening, and if it is happening, it is occurring in the STS parameter?
A: Yes.
Q: How do the STO manage?
A: They do not concern themselves with such things.
Q: Well, if the STS guys are genetically tweaking themselves to have some kind of different outcome for some reason that we do not perceive, don't you think there should be a balancing action on the STO side of some sort?
A: You are thinking in STS terms. But that is natural, since human 3rd density is STS.
Q: You say they don't concern themselves with that. What do STO individuals coming back from the future into the past concern themselves with?
A: Answering calls for assistance with knowledge.
Q: What do these STS individuals coming back into the past hope to do by genetically tweaking their ancestors? What happened that they want to have happen differently?
A: Infinite number of possible answers to that question.
Q: So, they are coming from all different timelines with all different kinds of agendas - all designed to serve themselves.
------------------------
Q: (L) Alright, we have our first question that I want to get out of the way before we go into any other things and it's a question for a member of our group D** whose son committed suicide last year (2001) just a few days before the 9-11 thing when everything and everybody was "going off" all over the country...
A: He was subjected to mind programming due to his fathers work in military.
Q: (L) Was his father aware of this?
A: He was also subject.
Q: (L) In what way was he a subject?
A: He was utilized mainly to deal with the son so as to make him available.
Q: (L) Anything else about this?
A: He must not feel responsible. Many such cases exist outside of the military. His son was selected due to bloodline. The reason for failure was due to strength of resistance.
Q: (L) So, in other words, they couldn't control the son, is that what you're saying?
A: More or less.
Q: (L) So he wasn't stimulated to commit suicide to hurt D?
A: No
Q: (L) Was he programmed to do something that was in conflict with something inside him?
A: Mainly. His FRV was not conducive to such controls.
------------------------
I really don't care about their culture, religion, or value system. They are clearly indifferent to our own free will and need to be stopped. Period.
What about considering THEIR free will? Or do you think if someone violates someone else's free will, it justifies you to violate theirs in return? Would you not then become just like them? Would you not simply be trying to CONTROL them in favor of what YOU think they should or should not do, and so impose your will on them? But besides the fact that you'd be acting in STS ways yourself, fighting fire with fire, how do you think you can stop someone who is infinitely more powerful than you? Again, the analogy I see here is, the animals of our world can't do anything to stop humans from doing anything we want to them, and so no matter how STS we are, the animals being a level lower than ourselves have no choice about it.
Perhaps another solution to this, which would be STO, is to change our "polarity" to not match theirs and make us unsuitable and undesirable for their uses? That's just a thought to consider.
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
For those of us who do the research and look at the material objectively, we know a great deal about their intentions by their actions over the years
Originally posted by lilblam
I don't mean their "general" intentions, I mean intentions in very particular and specific circumstances. Their intentions toward humanity in general may be one thing, but their intentions, goals, and way of doing things in particular circumstances may have their own particular reasons for it too.
Specific intentions vary while the general atmosphere is one of violating our own free will. As stated, some people are abducted for dissection and never return alive. I remember coming across a case of a soldier who went through that. They found his corpse a few days after his disappearance. The manner of the dissection led one to believe that they kept the man alive for as long as possible. Again, their specific intentions are irrelevant. They need to be stopped.
The Machiavellian principle of the ends justifying the means is also a characteristic value of those with an STS focus.
They don't "need" to be stopped, that is a personal opinion only, it is not an objective universal prerogative. I think they have a right to do as they wish, because they have free will, and everyone in the universe has the right to do as they wish. My way of dealing with them would not include "stopping them" by using force, because I think it is not necessary to use STS tactics (and thus become more STS) to deal with STS. Because if they need to be stopped, then so do we, since we use animals on our planet just as they use us! We are then just as evil as they are, and we'd be pretty hypocritical if we decided to impose our will on someone else and tried to stop them from doing the exact same thing that we ourselves are doing.
If the emperor wears no clothes, then he wears no clothes. The conclusions that I have are shared by many researchers. The more popular appraisal of the Zetan-aliens, a perspective that is furthered through abductee brainwashing and alien spirit mediums, is that they are our space brothers who are here to further or evolutionary development. Now there's an assumption that I disagree with as it is unsupported.
I agree that this is an assumption, something probably promoted by the Zetans themselves, and there is no evidence that says that humanity needs outside help to further their "evolutionary development", and that they will not simply develop NATURALLY as a result of their learning and experience. "Space brothers" is a very sneaky term that instantly creates the impression that they must be "good guys" simply because you attach the word "brothers" to them, which is automatically associated in human minds with good will and family, etc. It is much more objective to say "alien entities" or simply "beings", and much more neutral, because it does not manipulate people to automatically assume their polarity and intentions. Some cultures called them "Gods", and this was also a manipulation that led people to assume they have absolute power, simply because they associate the word God with ultimate power, and so created a feeling of helplessness and that they MUST be worshipped and that there was no choice, since they were "Gods". But the excuse that they are here to HELP us because we apparently need their help, works for them to abduct us and do whatever they want with us, and we're supposed to just accept it because it is "for our own good" (or so they tell us). Horse Poop!
We should not judge any alien race by their intellect or their technology but by their application (or lack thereof) of The Golden Rule. Everything else is irrelevant because this is what dictates our autonomy and our very survival.
Golden Rule? I know that the most important "law" in the universe is that of free will, and so the first thing I always try to find out is, does the race or the entity violate free will in any way? And so, I begin to have a better idea about its polarity.
My Gift of Discernment as a spiritual medium and Solist Mystic doesn't always tell me a person's Dominant Aura Color. However, in answer to a probable inquiry: your DAC is presently violet.
You don't have to physically see the individual to see his/her aura?
Also, would you happen to have (or know a link to) channeled material that you think has higher probability of being accurate (from your experience,
etc) than typical new age mumbo jumbo or disinformation? So far, I have found the Cassiopaean transcripts to be above and beyond any "channeling"
I've ever seen before, in terms of objectivity, respecting free will of the channeler, and simply the content of the material given. There is another
channeling that is close but not quite at that level in my opinion, and that is the RA material (don't know if you've heard of it?).
Although a great majority of channeled material is either extremely corrupted, biased, or simply consists of lies or disinformation, there are very rare exceptions, and I am very interested in such exceptions because they sometimes provide very important clues to decyphering our human predicament, and truly helps to understand the objective reality in which we live.
Here are some transcript sections from the Cassiopaean transmissions that are relevant to our discussion, specifically about the Grays and other "alien beings" that are somehow involved with our planet, so just take'em with a grain of salt and a critical mind. They have a particularly unique perspective on this situation, which in many ways goes goes against some other stuff that is written about the grays, etc. It may be of help to you and your studies. These are not entire sessions, just bits out of the sessions I found relevant (like in my post above).
---------------------
#From Session dated: 07/30/1994 (one of the first sessions)
Q: (L) Who is putting implants in us?
A: Orions.
Q: (L) And there is nothing we can do about it? That's sick!
A: A matter of perspective.
Q: (L) What do the Orion's look like?
A: Grays.
Q: (L) Are they big nosed?
A: Both kinds of grays.
Q: (L) Are they insectoid?
A: No.
Q: (L) Do they have hive souls?
A: No.
Q: (L) Do they have emotions.
A: No.
Q: (L) Do they want human bodies as hosts?
A: Some.
Q: (L) What is their planet like.
A: Similar to earth.
---------------------
#From Session dated: 10/16/1994
Q: (V) I had an experience with Preying Mantis beings. Who are they?
A: Minturians.
Q: (L) Where are they from?
A: Orion.
Q: (L) Are the Orions the bad guys?
A: Subjective.
Q: (L) Well, what group do they belong to?
A: Federation as do the Pleiadians.
Q: (L) Did they abduct me or what is the source of this memory?
A: It is a memory of a past life held in the deep subconscious level.
Q: (L) What did they do to me?
A: Retroprogramming for learning purposes.
Q: (L) For what?
A: Lessons are to be learned by you not told by us.
Q: (L) Why did the grays abduct V___?
A: To try to encode her to destroy herself.
Q: (L) Has she overcome this programming?
A: Hopefully. There is always room for error. Remember, free will is the most important law of consciousness in creation.
-------------------
#From Session dated: 10/20/1994
Q: How do aliens control people?
A: Which ones?
Q: How many choices do I have?
A: Open.
Q: Well, how do the grays and Lizzies do it?
A: Mind and body interference with electrical response patterns.
Q: Can they do this remotely?
A: Less effectively.
Q: So they need to work directly on you or be in contact with you by some means that is somewhat material?
A: Yes.
Q: Are there other aliens on the planet abducting people?
A: Much less often.
-------------------
#From Session dated: 10/20/1994
Q: (L) The comment was made at one point that certain alien beings abduct humans and subject them to cruel and torturous deaths in order to create "maximum energy transfer." In this respect, what is this maximum energy transfer that occurs during a long, slow, torturous dying process?
A: Extreme fear and anxiety builds up fear/anxiety energy which is of a negative nature which fuels the beings that you speak of in that they draw from that and produce a sort of a fueling energy which keeps them going as one of their forms of nourishment based on their metabolic structure.
Q: (L) What is their metabolic structure?
A: That is very complex and very difficult to describe because it is on the fourth level of density which you do not understand. But, part of their reason for existence on the fourth level is their ability to nourish themselves both through ethereal methods and through physical methods. Therefore, this energy transfer would represent the ethereal method of nourishment and other means are achieved physically.
Q: (L) What other means?
A: Well, the drinking of blood and blood by-products would be an example of that.
Q: (L) Do they do that?
A: Yes, but the manner of intake is different than what you may be thinking. It is done through pores.
Q: (L) In what manner?
A: Bathing and then absorbing the necessary products and then disposing of the remaining product.
Q: (L) Did Arthur Clarke channel "Childhood's End"?
A: No. Used imagination.
Q: (L) Is the amnesia related to UFO abductions deliberately induced or is it a product of the mind's inability to deal with the event?
A: It is an equal commingling of both.
Q: (L) The part that is deliberately induced, how is that accomplished?
A: By using a cosmic energy flow to influence memory function through a combination of spiritual and chemical interaction.
Q: (L) Can you be more specific?
A: Being more specific would be in another way less specific, but a good way to put it is altering the flow of electromagnetic energy in the brain. Electromagnetic energy, electromagnetism, is the life force that exists within all that evolves through long wave or short wave cycles.
Q: (L) Going back to the beings that absorb nutrients through their pores, what kind of beings are they?
A: Both those that you describe as the Lizard Beings and those you describe as the Grays. This is necessary for their survival in each case. Even though the Grays are not natural parts of the short wave cycle, but rather an artificial creation by the Lizard Beings, but nevertheless they mimic the nourishment functions.
Q: (L) Since they are artificially created by the Lizard beings, does this mean they have no souls?
A: That's correct.
Q: (L) How do they function? Are they like robots?
A: They function by interaction with the souls of the Lizard beings. This technology is extremely far in advance of that with which you are familiar, but the Gray beings are not only built and designed artificially, but also function as a projection mentally and psychically of the Lizard beings. They are like four dimensional probes.
Q: (L) As four dimensional probes, what are their capabilities?
A: They have all the same capabilities of the Lizard beings except for the fact that their physical appearance is entirely different and they do not have souls of their own and also their biological structure is internally different. But, their functioning is the same and in order to remain as projection beings they also must absorb nutrients in the same fashion both spiritually and physically as the Lizard beings do. The reason the negative energy is necessary fuel is that the Lizard beings and the Grays are both living in the fourth level of density, which is the highest level of density one can exist in serving only self as these entities do. So, therefore, they must absorb negative energy because the fourth level of density is the highest example of self service which is a negative thought pattern. The fourth level of density is a progression from the third level of density. With each progression upward in density level, the existence for the individual conscious entity becomes less difficult. So, therefore, the fourth level of density is less difficult to exist in that the third, the third is less difficult than the second and so on. It puts less strain on the soul energy. Therefore, beings existing on the fourth level of density can draw from beings existing on the third level of density in terms of absorption of negative soul energy. Likewise, beings on the third level of density can draw from beings on the second level of density, though this type of drawing is not as necessary but is done. This is why human beings existing on the third level frequently cause pain and suffering to those of the animal kingdom who exist on the second level of density because you are drawing negative soul energy as beings who primarily serve self, as you do, from those on the second level, and on the first, and so on. Now, as you advance to the fourth level of density which is coming up for you, you must now make a choice as to whether to progress to service to others or to remain at the level of service to self. This will be the decision which will take quite some time for you to adjust to. This is what is referred to as the "thousand year period." This is the period as measured in your calendar terms that will determine whether or not you will advance to service to others or remain at the level of service to self. And those who are described as the Lizards have chosen to firmly lock themselves into service to self. And, since they are at the highest level of density where this is possible, they must continually draw large amounts of negative energy from those at the third level, second level, and so on, which is why they do what they do. This also explains why their race is dying, because they have not been able to learn for themselves how to remove themselves from this particular form of expression to that of service to others. And, since they have such, as you would measure it, a long period of time, remained at this level and, in fact, become firmly entrenched in it, and, in fact, have increased themselves in it, this is why they are dying and desperately trying to take as much energy from you as possible and also to recreate their race metabolically.
Q: (L) Well, if we are sources of food and labor for them, why don't they just breed us in pens on their own planet?
A: They do.
Q: (L) Well, since there is so many of us here, why don't they just move in and take over?
A: That is their intention. That has been their intention for quite some time. They have been traveling back and forth through time as you know it, to set things up so that they can absorb a maximum amount of negative energy with the transference from third level to fourth level that this planet is going to experience, in the hopes that they can overtake you on the fourth level and thereby accomplish several things. 1: retaining their race as a viable species; 2: increasing their numbers; 3: increasing their power; 4: expanding their race throughout the realm of fourth density. To do all of this they have been interfering with events for what you would measure on your calendar as approximately 74 thousand years. And they have been doing so in a completely still state of space time traveling backward and forward at will during this work. Interestingly enough, though, all of this will fail.
Q: (L) How can you be so sure it will fail?
A: Because we see it. We are able to see all, not just what we want to see. Their failing is that they see only what they want to see. In other words, it's the highest manifestation possible of that which you would refer to as wishful thinking. And, wishful thinking represented on the fourth level of density becomes reality for that level. You know how you wishfully think? Well, it isn't quite reality for you because you are on the third level, but if you are on the fourth level and you were to perform the same function, it would indeed be your awareness of reality. Therefore they cannot see what we can see since we serve others as opposed to self, and since we are on sixth level, we can see all that is at all points as is, not as we would want it to be.
[...]
Q: (L) Did any aliens at all, and specifically the Lizzies, ever live among mankind and receive worship?
A: They did not live among mankind, but they did interact directly with human beings, at various points in the past. It was at those points when human beings were ready, willing and able to accept deities appearing directly from outside sources and then worship them. Such things would not have occurred in the recent past. But, beware, it may very well occur very soon.
----------------------------------------
lilblame here: I found all this info interesting, perhaps you may find it useful.
Although a great majority of channeled material is either extremely corrupted, biased, or simply consists of lies or disinformation, there are very rare exceptions, and I am very interested in such exceptions because they sometimes provide very important clues to decyphering our human predicament, and truly helps to understand the objective reality in which we live.
Here are some transcript sections from the Cassiopaean transmissions that are relevant to our discussion, specifically about the Grays and other "alien beings" that are somehow involved with our planet, so just take'em with a grain of salt and a critical mind. They have a particularly unique perspective on this situation, which in many ways goes goes against some other stuff that is written about the grays, etc. It may be of help to you and your studies. These are not entire sessions, just bits out of the sessions I found relevant (like in my post above).
---------------------
#From Session dated: 07/30/1994 (one of the first sessions)
Q: (L) Who is putting implants in us?
A: Orions.
Q: (L) And there is nothing we can do about it? That's sick!
A: A matter of perspective.
Q: (L) What do the Orion's look like?
A: Grays.
Q: (L) Are they big nosed?
A: Both kinds of grays.
Q: (L) Are they insectoid?
A: No.
Q: (L) Do they have hive souls?
A: No.
Q: (L) Do they have emotions.
A: No.
Q: (L) Do they want human bodies as hosts?
A: Some.
Q: (L) What is their planet like.
A: Similar to earth.
---------------------
#From Session dated: 10/16/1994
Q: (V) I had an experience with Preying Mantis beings. Who are they?
A: Minturians.
Q: (L) Where are they from?
A: Orion.
Q: (L) Are the Orions the bad guys?
A: Subjective.
Q: (L) Well, what group do they belong to?
A: Federation as do the Pleiadians.
Q: (L) Did they abduct me or what is the source of this memory?
A: It is a memory of a past life held in the deep subconscious level.
Q: (L) What did they do to me?
A: Retroprogramming for learning purposes.
Q: (L) For what?
A: Lessons are to be learned by you not told by us.
Q: (L) Why did the grays abduct V___?
A: To try to encode her to destroy herself.
Q: (L) Has she overcome this programming?
A: Hopefully. There is always room for error. Remember, free will is the most important law of consciousness in creation.
-------------------
#From Session dated: 10/20/1994
Q: How do aliens control people?
A: Which ones?
Q: How many choices do I have?
A: Open.
Q: Well, how do the grays and Lizzies do it?
A: Mind and body interference with electrical response patterns.
Q: Can they do this remotely?
A: Less effectively.
Q: So they need to work directly on you or be in contact with you by some means that is somewhat material?
A: Yes.
Q: Are there other aliens on the planet abducting people?
A: Much less often.
-------------------
#From Session dated: 10/20/1994
Q: (L) The comment was made at one point that certain alien beings abduct humans and subject them to cruel and torturous deaths in order to create "maximum energy transfer." In this respect, what is this maximum energy transfer that occurs during a long, slow, torturous dying process?
A: Extreme fear and anxiety builds up fear/anxiety energy which is of a negative nature which fuels the beings that you speak of in that they draw from that and produce a sort of a fueling energy which keeps them going as one of their forms of nourishment based on their metabolic structure.
Q: (L) What is their metabolic structure?
A: That is very complex and very difficult to describe because it is on the fourth level of density which you do not understand. But, part of their reason for existence on the fourth level is their ability to nourish themselves both through ethereal methods and through physical methods. Therefore, this energy transfer would represent the ethereal method of nourishment and other means are achieved physically.
Q: (L) What other means?
A: Well, the drinking of blood and blood by-products would be an example of that.
Q: (L) Do they do that?
A: Yes, but the manner of intake is different than what you may be thinking. It is done through pores.
Q: (L) In what manner?
A: Bathing and then absorbing the necessary products and then disposing of the remaining product.
Q: (L) Did Arthur Clarke channel "Childhood's End"?
A: No. Used imagination.
Q: (L) Is the amnesia related to UFO abductions deliberately induced or is it a product of the mind's inability to deal with the event?
A: It is an equal commingling of both.
Q: (L) The part that is deliberately induced, how is that accomplished?
A: By using a cosmic energy flow to influence memory function through a combination of spiritual and chemical interaction.
Q: (L) Can you be more specific?
A: Being more specific would be in another way less specific, but a good way to put it is altering the flow of electromagnetic energy in the brain. Electromagnetic energy, electromagnetism, is the life force that exists within all that evolves through long wave or short wave cycles.
Q: (L) Going back to the beings that absorb nutrients through their pores, what kind of beings are they?
A: Both those that you describe as the Lizard Beings and those you describe as the Grays. This is necessary for their survival in each case. Even though the Grays are not natural parts of the short wave cycle, but rather an artificial creation by the Lizard Beings, but nevertheless they mimic the nourishment functions.
Q: (L) Since they are artificially created by the Lizard beings, does this mean they have no souls?
A: That's correct.
Q: (L) How do they function? Are they like robots?
A: They function by interaction with the souls of the Lizard beings. This technology is extremely far in advance of that with which you are familiar, but the Gray beings are not only built and designed artificially, but also function as a projection mentally and psychically of the Lizard beings. They are like four dimensional probes.
Q: (L) As four dimensional probes, what are their capabilities?
A: They have all the same capabilities of the Lizard beings except for the fact that their physical appearance is entirely different and they do not have souls of their own and also their biological structure is internally different. But, their functioning is the same and in order to remain as projection beings they also must absorb nutrients in the same fashion both spiritually and physically as the Lizard beings do. The reason the negative energy is necessary fuel is that the Lizard beings and the Grays are both living in the fourth level of density, which is the highest level of density one can exist in serving only self as these entities do. So, therefore, they must absorb negative energy because the fourth level of density is the highest example of self service which is a negative thought pattern. The fourth level of density is a progression from the third level of density. With each progression upward in density level, the existence for the individual conscious entity becomes less difficult. So, therefore, the fourth level of density is less difficult to exist in that the third, the third is less difficult than the second and so on. It puts less strain on the soul energy. Therefore, beings existing on the fourth level of density can draw from beings existing on the third level of density in terms of absorption of negative soul energy. Likewise, beings on the third level of density can draw from beings on the second level of density, though this type of drawing is not as necessary but is done. This is why human beings existing on the third level frequently cause pain and suffering to those of the animal kingdom who exist on the second level of density because you are drawing negative soul energy as beings who primarily serve self, as you do, from those on the second level, and on the first, and so on. Now, as you advance to the fourth level of density which is coming up for you, you must now make a choice as to whether to progress to service to others or to remain at the level of service to self. This will be the decision which will take quite some time for you to adjust to. This is what is referred to as the "thousand year period." This is the period as measured in your calendar terms that will determine whether or not you will advance to service to others or remain at the level of service to self. And those who are described as the Lizards have chosen to firmly lock themselves into service to self. And, since they are at the highest level of density where this is possible, they must continually draw large amounts of negative energy from those at the third level, second level, and so on, which is why they do what they do. This also explains why their race is dying, because they have not been able to learn for themselves how to remove themselves from this particular form of expression to that of service to others. And, since they have such, as you would measure it, a long period of time, remained at this level and, in fact, become firmly entrenched in it, and, in fact, have increased themselves in it, this is why they are dying and desperately trying to take as much energy from you as possible and also to recreate their race metabolically.
Q: (L) Well, if we are sources of food and labor for them, why don't they just breed us in pens on their own planet?
A: They do.
Q: (L) Well, since there is so many of us here, why don't they just move in and take over?
A: That is their intention. That has been their intention for quite some time. They have been traveling back and forth through time as you know it, to set things up so that they can absorb a maximum amount of negative energy with the transference from third level to fourth level that this planet is going to experience, in the hopes that they can overtake you on the fourth level and thereby accomplish several things. 1: retaining their race as a viable species; 2: increasing their numbers; 3: increasing their power; 4: expanding their race throughout the realm of fourth density. To do all of this they have been interfering with events for what you would measure on your calendar as approximately 74 thousand years. And they have been doing so in a completely still state of space time traveling backward and forward at will during this work. Interestingly enough, though, all of this will fail.
Q: (L) How can you be so sure it will fail?
A: Because we see it. We are able to see all, not just what we want to see. Their failing is that they see only what they want to see. In other words, it's the highest manifestation possible of that which you would refer to as wishful thinking. And, wishful thinking represented on the fourth level of density becomes reality for that level. You know how you wishfully think? Well, it isn't quite reality for you because you are on the third level, but if you are on the fourth level and you were to perform the same function, it would indeed be your awareness of reality. Therefore they cannot see what we can see since we serve others as opposed to self, and since we are on sixth level, we can see all that is at all points as is, not as we would want it to be.
[...]
Q: (L) Did any aliens at all, and specifically the Lizzies, ever live among mankind and receive worship?
A: They did not live among mankind, but they did interact directly with human beings, at various points in the past. It was at those points when human beings were ready, willing and able to accept deities appearing directly from outside sources and then worship them. Such things would not have occurred in the recent past. But, beware, it may very well occur very soon.
----------------------------------------
lilblame here: I found all this info interesting, perhaps you may find it useful.
Originally posted by lilblam
From what you are saying, it seems like those with greater empathy towards others (not selectively, but ALL others) are those you'd consider as having higher spirituality level? Now, right and wrong, good and evil, those are all subjective terms unless they are simply semantics for objective concepts. What is right to someone is wrong to another, what is good to someone is evil to another. But as you already know, STO and STS is objective, free will is objective, and so given the understanding of such concepts, "good and evil" can be simply STO and STS, and so the more STS someone is, the more "evil", unsympathetic, heartless, and free-will-violating his actions are, and vice versa.
I agree that STO, STS and free will are objective concepts.
Originally posted by lilblam
And I agree that intelligence and polarity are different things. You can be extremely intelligent but can be the most "evil" person in the world, and fool billions. What you speak of anyway reminds me of "Frequency Resonance Vibration", as spoken of by the Cassiopaeans in their transmissions. It seems to correlate anyway, and that's very interesting indeed!
Here are some cut out passages where they mention it, it may or not be interesting to you. By the way, in case you don't know, the source claims to be 6th density beings of light, and also "us in the future" (not ALL humanity, but some who choose that path of knowledge and STO). Whether the source really is who it claims to be is anyone's guess, but all we have is the messages to work with, which must be verified as well, never ever believed. So far, their "track record" is very impressive, but I won't get into that now. Here are the relevant quotes. Their answers are preceeded with A:, and I have bolded the parts that I think are very important. Also, just so anyone reading this is clear, 3rd density is us humans, 4th density would be grays, reptilians, and essentially all who are at a "next level of awareness" after ours (not just smarter or more advanced, but at a higher level completely). Much of this relates closely to some things you have said too. Also, there is no link to any of this, so I cannot just link, but I think this is important enough to paste.
Lilblam, are you a Cassiopaeanite?
Originally posted by lilblam
-------------------------
(TR) When I use the acupuncture, I'm just releasing energy blockages within the person?
A: No. TR. You are sensing what all experience when in contact with others. You see in the history of your life are rather drastic changes in mental, emotional and psychic awareness, to say nothing of attitude and awareness. This is symptomatic of the change in frequency resonance vibration. The things that used to interest you do not anymore, and vice versa. One way this is manifested is a decrease in interests of a material or physical nature. One's libido tends to decrease, for but one example.
-------------------------
A: You are all STS. If you were not, you would not be where you are.
Q: (A) There are those who are happy in the STS mode; and there are those who are trying to get out of the STS mode...
A: STO candidate.
Q: (A) These STO candidates cannot just simply BE, even theoretically, because then, STS would eat them.
A: No.
Q: Why not?
A: STS does not eat according to protocol.
Q: What does that mean?
A: What do you suppose?
Q: I have no idea!
A: STS "eats" whatever it wants to, if it is able.
Q: That's what we said. If you are STO in an STS world, you are basically defenseless and they eat you.
A: No.
Q: Why? What makes STO unavailable or 'inedible?'
A: Frequency resonance not in sync.
Q: (A) But then, that would mean that all these people who are saying that we need just to love everything and everybody, are right. They just be, and love,
don't do anything, just give everything to the Lizzies... they are right!
A: No, because motivation is STS.
Q: How is the motivation to love everything and everybody, and to just give, STS?
A: Feels good.
Q: So, they want to do it because it feels good?
A: Want is an STS concept.
------------------------
Q: (L) What is the oldest Neanderthal that's been found? Anybody know? No, well then when did Neanderthal appear on the planet?
A: 5.3 million years ago.
Q: (L) You are saying that when science says that modern man appeared 35 to 40 thousand years ago, and Neanderthal disappeared at the same time, the real time frame was 70 to 80 thousand years ago? In other words, a factor of 2 error.
A: Close.
Q: (L) And, of course, we can't depend on any of the dating methods because of metamorphosis.
A: And genetic manipulation.
Q: (L) So, in effect, we ARE the new Neanderthals on the eve of extinction. You have said that those who transition into 4th density in the body will go through some kind of rejuvenation process or body regeneration or something. Does that mean that these present "Neanderthal" type bodies that we presently occupy will morph into something more in line with the new model? Is it genetically encoded into some of them to do so?
A: Something like that.
Q: (L) So, that's why they have been following certain bloodlines for generation after generation; they are tinkering with the DNA and arming genetic time-bombs that are waiting to go off. (A) What is interesting is how do those who are trying to get these people, to abduct them, how do they spot them? How do they get the information? By following the bloodline, or by some kind of monitor you can detect from a long distance - and they can note that "here is somebody of interest" or "here is somebody dangerous" or "let's abduct this one" or whatever. How do they select? Do they search the genealogies or is it some kind of remote sensing?
A: Now this is interesting Arkadiusz, as it involves the atomic "signature" of the cellular structure of the individual. In concert with this is the etheric body reading and the frequency resonance vibration. All these are interconnected, and can be read from a distance using remote viewing technology/methodology.
Q: (L) Can it be done in a pure mechanical way without using psychic means?
A: At another level of understanding, the two are blended into one.
Q: (T) Computerized psychic remote viewing, maybe. Like artificial intelligence. Maybe a mind connected to a computer?
A: That is close, yes.
------------------------
A: We wish to review some things first. The concept of a "master race" put forward by the Nazis was merely a 4th density STS effort to create a physical vehicle with the correct frequency resonance vibration for 4th density STS souls to occupy in 3rd density. It was also a "trial run" for planned events in what you perceive to be your future.
Q: (L) You mean with a strong STS frequency so they can have a "vehicle" in 3rd density, so to speak?
A: Correct. Frequency resonance vibration! Very important.
Q: (L) So, that is why they are programming and experimenting? And all these folks running around who some think are "programmed," could be individuals who are raising their nastiness levels high enough to accommodate the truly negative STS 4th density - sort of like walk-ins or something, only not nice ones?
A: You do not have very many of those present yet, but that was, and still is, the plan of some of the 4th density STS types.
------------------------
Q: So, we can forget that one for now. Okay, last session you brought up the subject of Frequency Resonance Vibration. You suggested that there are certain STS forces who are developing or creating or managing physical bodies that they are trying to increase the frequency in so that they will have bodies that are wired so that they can manifest directly into 3rd density, since that seems to be the real barrier that prevents an all-out invasion, the fact that we are in 3rd density and they are in 4th. Now, I assumed that the same function could be true for STO individuals. It seems that many individuals who have come into this time period from the future, coming back into the past via the incarnational cycle so as not to violate free will, have carefully selected bodies with particular DNA, which they are, little by little, activating so that there 4th density selves, or higher, can manifest in this reality. Is it possible for those energies to manifest into such bodies which have been awakened or tuned in 3rd density?
A: STO tends to do the process within the natural flow of things. STS seeks to alter creation processes to fit their ends.
Q: This Top Secret document and the Anna Hayes material to some extent, both talk about many abductions being "ourselves from the future" who have come back to the past, or what is for us, the present, to abduct their own bodies to make genetic adjustments so that they can advance and not make the mistakes they made in another timeline. Is that, in fact, part of the scenario?
A: Very close to the truth!
Q: Can you abduct yourself in an STO manner and help yourself in this way? Can that be STO?
A: It is not, because that is not STO.
Q: So, when that is happening, and if it is happening, it is occurring in the STS parameter?
A: Yes.
Q: How do the STO manage?
A: They do not concern themselves with such things.
Q: Well, if the STS guys are genetically tweaking themselves to have some kind of different outcome for some reason that we do not perceive, don't you think there should be a balancing action on the STO side of some sort?
A: You are thinking in STS terms. But that is natural, since human 3rd density is STS.
Q: You say they don't concern themselves with that. What do STO individuals coming back from the future into the past concern themselves with?
A: Answering calls for assistance with knowledge.
Q: What do these STS individuals coming back into the past hope to do by genetically tweaking their ancestors? What happened that they want to have happen differently?
A: Infinite number of possible answers to that question.
Q: So, they are coming from all different timelines with all different kinds of agendas - all designed to serve themselves.
------------------------
Q: (L) Alright, we have our first question that I want to get out of the way before we go into any other things and it's a question for a member of our group D** whose son committed suicide last year (2001) just a few days before the 9-11 thing when everything and everybody was "going off" all over the country...
A: He was subjected to mind programming due to his fathers work in military.
Q: (L) Was his father aware of this?
A: He was also subject.
Q: (L) In what way was he a subject?
A: He was utilized mainly to deal with the son so as to make him available.
Q: (L) Anything else about this?
A: He must not feel responsible. Many such cases exist outside of the military. His son was selected due to bloodline. The reason for failure was due to strength of resistance.
Q: (L) So, in other words, they couldn't control the son, is that what you're saying?
A: More or less.
Q: (L) So he wasn't stimulated to commit suicide to hurt D?
A: No
Q: (L) Was he programmed to do something that was in conflict with something inside him?
A: Mainly. His FRV was not conducive to such controls.
------------------------
There is definitely a strong similarity between that which the Cassiopaeans espouse and what RA espouses in The Ra Material.
I really don't care about their culture, religion, or value system. They are clearly indifferent to our own free will and need to be stopped. Period.
Originally posted by lilblam
What about considering THEIR free will?
After friendly, diplomatic relations are established, everyone's free will is covered. If you want peace, first seek justice.
Originally posted by lilblam
Or do you think if someone violates someone else's free will, it justifies you to violate theirs in return?
It is a service to The Light to defend innocents. If one does this incorrectly, one retrogresses away from The Light. If one does this correctly, one progresses in energy within The Light (when free of matter). So the challenge is to learn how to be an effective Guardian without becoming imperialistic. Granted, this is a fine line to walk. The way one walks it is to always consider The Golden Rule. If you were in a position of enslavement by space-aliens, would you want to be rescued? If the answer is yes, that grants permission to those who would do the rescuing. If a prisoner wishes to remain enslaved by the Zetan-aliens, then he/she should not be helped. Accordingly, a certain degree of discrimination is required before an Act of Mercy is granted.
Originally posted by lilblam
Would you not then become just like them? Would you not simply be trying to CONTROL them in favor of what YOU think they should or should not do, and so impose your will on them? But besides the fact that you'd be acting in STS ways yourself, fighting fire with fire, how do you think you can stop someone who is infinitely more powerful than you? Again, the analogy I see here is, the animals of our world can't do anything to stop humans from doing anything we want to them, and so no matter how STS we are, the animals being a level lower than ourselves have no choice about it.
See the above passage.
Originally posted by lilblam
Perhaps another solution to this, which would be STO, is to change our "polarity" to not match theirs and make us unsuitable and undesirable for their uses? That's just a thought to consider.
Unless we changed our genetic makeup and became Greys ourselves, I have no reason to believe it would make any difference to them what our focus is. They don't discriminate between STO and STS Terrans that they kidnap.
Actually, I don't think becoming a Grey or Reptilian physically would make all that much difference, unless we joined them of course.
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
For those of us who do the research and look at the material objectively, we know a great deal about their intentions by their actions over the years
Originally posted by lilblam
I don't mean their "general" intentions, I mean intentions in very particular and specific circumstances. Their intentions toward humanity in general may be one thing, but their intentions, goals, and way of doing things in particular circumstances may have their own particular reasons for it too.
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
Specific intentions vary while the general atmosphere is one of violating our own free will. As stated, some people are abducted for dissection and never return alive. I remember coming across a case of a soldier who went through that. They found his corpse a few days after his disappearance. The manner of the dissection led one to believe that they kept the man alive for as long as possible. Again, their specific intentions are irrelevant. They need to be stopped.
The Machiavellian principle of the ends justifying the means is also a characteristic value of those with an STS focus.
Originally posted by lilblam
They don't "need" to be stopped, that is a personal opinion only, it is not an objective universal prerogative. I think they have a right to do as they wish, because they have free will, and everyone in the universe has the right to do as they wish. My way of dealing with them would not include "stopping them" by using force, because I think it is not necessary to use STS tactics (and thus become more STS) to deal with STS. Because if they need to be stopped, then so do we, since we use animals on our planet just as they use us! We are then just as evil as they are, and we'd be pretty hypocritical if we decided to impose our will on someone else and tried to stop them from doing the exact same thing that we ourselves are doing.
We are not animals, well, at least not all of us anyway. Some of us are spiritual beings. It is not hypocritical to stop people (alien or otherwise) that use many of us as laboratory animals. Quite the contrary, it is an Act of Mercy in service to The Light.
The reason why we have a police force on this planet is to be a deterrent to people who would commit a heinous crime, and to arrest those that do. Although our system of governmental justice has big problems, it is still better than nothing, as it serves to provide a checks and balances to evil committed to innocents.
Why do police have guns? If they use them, don't they violate the free will of those they shoot?
Free will is not as important as The Golden Rule. Heinous crimes must be stopped and the perpetrators punished and/or destroyed. If they are not stopped, innocents will continue to be abused. When innocents are abused and the guilty are not stopped, it is reflective of a sick society that is in a state of decline.
There is no checks and balances in regards to Zetan-alien abuse. There are no heavenly Guardians or benign space-aliens who come to the aid of those who are used as laboratory animals, slaves, for breeding, etc.
Because of this, Acts of Mercy in defense of innocents who are abused by aliens is a great service to The Light. In fact, ANY Act of Mercy to end the suffering of one or more innocents is a great service to The Light, regardless of what the local govermental laws state. Universal Law, including The Golden Rule, supercedes all other law.
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
If the emperor wears no clothes, then he wears no clothes. The conclusions that I have are shared by many researchers. The more popular appraisal of the Zetan-aliens, a perspective that is furthered through abductee brainwashing and alien spirit mediums, is that they are our space brothers who are here to further or evolutionary development. Now there's an assumption that I disagree with as it is unsupported.
Originally posted by lilblam
I agree that this is an assumption, something probably promoted by the Zetans themselves, and there is no evidence that says that humanity needs outside help to further their "evolutionary development", and that they will not simply develop NATURALLY as a result of their learning and experience. "Space brothers" is a very sneaky term that instantly creates the impression that they must be "good guys" simply because you attach the word "brothers" to them, which is automatically associated in human minds with good will and family, etc. It is much more objective to say "alien entities" or simply "beings", and much more neutral, because it does not manipulate people to automatically assume their polarity and intentions. Some cultures called them "Gods", and this was also a manipulation that led people to assume they have absolute power, simply because they associate the word God with ultimate power, and so created a feeling of helplessness and that they MUST be worshipped and that there was no choice, since they were "Gods". But the excuse that they are here to HELP us because we apparently need their help, works for them to abduct us and do whatever they want with us, and we're supposed to just accept it because it is "for our own good" (or so they tell us). Horse Poop!
I wholeheartedly agree with that appraisal.
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
We should not judge any alien race by their intellect or their technology but by their application (or lack thereof) of The Golden Rule. Everything else is irrelevant because this is what dictates our autonomy and our very survival.
Originally posted by lilblam
Golden Rule? I know that the most important "law" in the universe is that of free will, and so the first thing I always try to find out is, does the race or the entity violate free will in any way? And so, I begin to have a better idea about its polarity.
The Golden Rule is the highest and most important guideline for living a spiritual life and for maintaining eternal life after one leaves the flesh. In one form or another, it is in every major religion and most of the minor ones on this planet. Free will is important too, but not as important as striving to live by The Golden Rule; doing so prevents the accumulation of negative karma and consequent retrogression away from The Light.
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
My Gift of Discernment as a spiritual medium and Solist Mystic doesn't always tell me a person's Dominant Aura Color. However, in answer to a probable inquiry: your DAC is presently violet.
Originally posted by lilblam
You don't have to physically see the individual to see his/her aura?
All Gifts of the Spirit come from people on the Other Side. Spiritual mediums understand this principle more clearly than most psychics. The reason why I didn't need to see you in order to discern your DAC is because I am not the source of the auric awareness; it was given to me from my Guides, AKA The Society Of Light.
TSOL does not adhere to the idea that anyone has been visited by future selves, alien or otherwise. To date, no one has come into this timeline from the future or the past.
Originally posted by lilblam
Also, would you happen to have (or know a link to) channeled material that you think has higher probability of being accurate (from your experience, etc) than typical new age mumbo jumbo or disinformation? So far, I have found the Cassiopaean transcripts to be above and beyond any "channeling" I've ever seen before, in terms of objectivity, respecting free will of the channeler, and simply the content of the material given. There is another channeling that is close but not quite at that level in my opinion, and that is the RA material (don't know if you've heard of it?).
Yes, as stated, I know about The Ra Material.
Perhaps you should try to become a medium for progressive spirits yourself.
I think that alien abductions are miltary experiences. I think they drug people with alucinatory gas, so that they can pratice all kinds of
"biological" tests without having to take resposibility for the results and consequences.
I mean if you blame it on aliens, than you really cant take them to court for your pain and suffering can you ?
that doesnt mean i do not believe in life outside of Planet Earth. I do. But i think MOST of these "abductions" are work of the miliatry/ scientists.
I mean if you blame it on aliens, than you really cant take them to court for your pain and suffering can you ?
that doesnt mean i do not believe in life outside of Planet Earth. I do. But i think MOST of these "abductions" are work of the miliatry/ scientists.
I'll just say that, to deprive people of the lessons they came here for, is to stop their progress. To always "rescue people" and decide that you
will be a guardian who will protect the "innocent", is to deprive people of experiences that can be essential to their progress, because negative
and positive experiences are equally important to teach you about yourself and the world at large. To always give people what they want and try to get
them out of uncomfortable situations, again, is simply to oblige to their animalistic and instinctual side of self-preservation, and to encourage
physical gratification and materialism, and thus STS. Who are you to decide what is a "good experience" and what is a "bad experience"? Just
because someone does not like their state of existance does not mean that someone else must come in and rescue them and make them feel good again.
Usually it is when we are "down" that we learn the most, when we are least comfortable. Unless you think all that matters is that everyone is happy
and feels good, knowledge and progress/growth of the soul being less important?
Well that is a judgement of value, which is subjective, but in the end, if you value what "feels good" over that which helps one grow, you lean towards STS and away from STO, osit.
Also, just because some entity tells you that there is no one from the past or future in this "timeline" does not make it an absolute declaration, does not make it a fact to be believed. Of course just cuz someone says that someoen DOES enter this timeline from past or future, also does not make it true. It does not matter if that someone claims to be a being of light or anything else, it is still merely something they claim, and as all data, must be tested and verified before it is accepted or rejected, osit.
Oh yeah, and what's a "Cassiopeanite"?
[edit on 15-6-2005 by lilblam]
Well that is a judgement of value, which is subjective, but in the end, if you value what "feels good" over that which helps one grow, you lean towards STS and away from STO, osit.
Also, just because some entity tells you that there is no one from the past or future in this "timeline" does not make it an absolute declaration, does not make it a fact to be believed. Of course just cuz someone says that someoen DOES enter this timeline from past or future, also does not make it true. It does not matter if that someone claims to be a being of light or anything else, it is still merely something they claim, and as all data, must be tested and verified before it is accepted or rejected, osit.
Oh yeah, and what's a "Cassiopeanite"?
[edit on 15-6-2005 by lilblam]
Originally posted by lilblam
I'll just say that, to deprive people of the lessons they came here for, is to stop their progress. To always "rescue people" and decide that you will be a guardian who will protect the "innocent", is to deprive people of experiences that can be essential to their progress, because negative and positive experiences are equally important to teach you about yourself and the world at large.
As stated, there is no checks and balances to Zetan-alien abduction abuse, so you can rest assured that the kidnapping and torture of innocents will continue.
Regarding service to The Light as a Guardian...
To stop someone from being tortured as a laboratory animal is not depriving them of a life lesson; it is saving them from unnecessary damage so that they can pursue their life lessons
Originally posted by lilblam
To always give people what they want and try to get them out of uncomfortable situations, again, is simply to oblige to their animalistic and instinctual side of self-preservation, and to encourage physical gratification and materialism, and thus STS.
No one is being deprived of anything.
Originally posted by lilblam
Who are you to decide what is a "good experience" and what is a "bad experience"?
The Golden Rule decides, not any one person. That is the way with which we discern any moral action.
Originally posted by lilblam
Just because someone does not like their state of existance does not mean that someone else must come in and rescue them and make them feel good again. Usually it is when we are "down" that we learn the most, when we are least comfortable. Unless you think all that matters is that everyone is happy and feels good, knowledge and progress/growth of the soul being less important?
Compassion dictates evolution, not indifference to suffering.
Ending Zetan-alien abduction abuse does not end suffering, it only ends major suffering to innocents that cannot defend themselves.
If you were abducted and placed in a cage and knew that you were going to be used in an upcoming medical experiment that would result in a slow and horrible death, would you want someone to rescue you?
Originally posted by lilblam
Well that is a judgement of value, which is subjective, but in the end, if you value what "feels good" over that which helps one grow, you lean towards STS and away from STO, osit.
What feels good is not the issue. What The Light is concerned about in regard to our growth is our application of The Golden Rule and our Compassion toward innocents.
Originally posted by lilblam
Also, just because some entity tells you that there is no one from the past or future in this "timeline" does not make it an absolute declaration, does not make it a fact to be believed.
Along the same lines, just because you happen to believe in and posted the channeled information in this thread does not mean that it is accurate in any regard.
Originally posted by lilblam
Of course just cuz someone says that someoen DOES enter this timeline from past or future, also does not make it true. It does not matter if that someone claims to be a being of light or anything else, it is still merely something they claim, and as all data, must be tested and verified before it is accepted or rejected, osit.
Learning how to discriminate between those in the Spirit who are objective, truthful, and knowledgeable in the subject matter, versus those who are not, is a worthwhile venture.
Originally posted by lilblam
Oh yeah, and what's a "Cassiopeanite"?
A name for someone who follows the channeled teaching of the Cassiopeans.
Near death experience research indicates that free will takes a second seat to one's application of The Golden Rule. After death, we all see clearly how our actions affected those around us and we are held accountable for all our actions, thoughts and intentions. Universal Law is inescapable and truth and morality are absolute. We have no choice but to learn from our life review and move on. Those that reject the life review cannot ascend to a pleasant dimension of energy and are forced to stay on the lower dimensions where the corrupt reside; like the discarnate Greys for example (before they go under that is).
This perspective is confirmed through my many years of experience in dealing with (and counseling others about) discarnate demonic attack. This is when you have discarnates use their free will for the perverted cause of the torture of one or more innocents for their own sadistic gratification.
What do you think happens to them?
What happens is that they retrogress away from The Light from their abuse to innocents. Their soul energy gets weaker and weaker until they no longer exist. They literally shrink into oblivion.
"Evil contains the seeds of its own destruction."
That is the reason why evil forces have never been totally successful in taking over Creation. The Group Entities that support them, as with those who supported Nazi Germany, retrogress into nonexistence from their direct and indirect abuse to innocents.
The fate of those who use their free will selfishly and cause the torture of one or more innocents do not survive themselves in the discarnate dimensions.
That is why it is so important to strive to live by The Golden Rule.
Although many would like to think so, our soul existence is not a given. We have to conform to the Universal Law of The Light because no one can survive without it.
We have absolutely no choice in the matter (pun intended).
A moral relativistic focus only hinders one's ability to ascend into The Light and therefore to exist eternally.
[edit on 15-6-2005 by Paul_Richard]
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
Originally posted by lilblam
I'll just say that, to deprive people of the lessons they came here for, is to stop their progress. To always "rescue people" and decide that you will be a guardian who will protect the "innocent", is to deprive people of experiences that can be essential to their progress, because negative and positive experiences are equally important to teach you about yourself and the world at large.
As stated, there is no checks and balances to Zetan-alien abduction abuse, so you can rest assured that the kidnapping and torture of innocents will continue.
Regarding service to The Light as a Guardian...
To stop someone from being tortured as a laboratory animal is not depriving them of a life lesson; it is saving them from unnecessary damage so that they can pursue their life lessons
Neither you nor I nor anyone can judge what is and what is not "necessary" for someone's lessons and growth, and which experiences must be "eliminated" because they are only "unnecessary damage", instead of being helpful. Any experience can potential be useful and can be a lesson.
No one is being deprived of anything.
Yes, the people are being deprived of the experience. It is your assumption that the experience is "unnecessary". You can say that about any experience, and sometimes you may be right, sometimes not! The devil is always in the details. Sometimes people learn from their experiences, sometimes they do not, but in every single experience there is ALWAYS an opportunity to benefit from it by learning something, although it is not necessarily the case that you WILL learn from every experience.
Originally posted by lilblam
Who are you to decide what is a "good experience" and what is a "bad experience"?
The Golden Rule decides, not any one person. That is the way with which we discern any moral action.
And who makes the Golden Rule?
Compassion dictates evolution, not indifference to suffering.
Empathy is very important in order to be STO, but it does imply interference and "changing" someone's lives because you deem their experience as "unnecessary".
Ending Zetan-alien abduction abuse does not end suffering, it only ends major suffering to innocents that cannot defend themselves.
All suffering is because people "cannot defend themselves". If a person knew how to avoid (read: defend himself from) a particular situation in which he is likely to suffer, then he would not be in that situation since he can avoid it, because he learned how to do so (probably because he was in that situation before)! If you are in a situation where you suffer, it is most likely because you did not CHOOSE this situation but simply did not know how to avoid it, or did not see it coming.
How do you judge who is "innocent" and who is not? And what is "wrong" with someone who you judge as not "innocent"?
If you were abducted and placed in a cage and knew that you were going to be used in an upcoming medical experiment that would result in a slow and horrible death, would you want someone to rescue you?
As I said, many people do not like situations they find themselves in, and many people want to be rescued from ALL sorts of things in life, many things they have NO control over. But just because they don't like something and want someone else to interfere on their behalf, does that mean that someone should interfere? Many people get kidnapped, threatened, and are controlled in many different ways in many situations. So as I mentioned, just because you are in a situation from which you WANT to get out, does not justify some "guardian" to miraculously rescue you! We'd not learn anything if whenever we are in trouble, some "divine" force pulled us out each time. And life does not work this way, people die all the time, suffer, are trapped, etc. It is all part of life and its lessons, always has been, always will be. Those that take it upon themselves to "limit" creation and only allow the experiences that THEY personally decide are helpful, are STS, are depriving others of important life experiences and lessons, and are usually not helping except to convey to the one being rescued that he does not need to learn from this, he does not need to perhaps wonder why he is in this situation, he does not need to do anything at all, but just let some divine power rescue him whenever he's in trouble.
Well let me just say, thank God there are no self-obsessed "super heroes" as we see in hollywood movies!
Originally posted by lilblam
Well that is a judgement of value, which is subjective, but in the end, if you value what "feels good" over that which helps one grow, you lean towards STS and away from STO, osit.
What feels good is not the issue. What The Light is concerned about in regard to our growth is our application of The Golden Rule and our Compassion toward innocents.
Who says the light is concerned about anything? Who made the golden rule? If it is universal, who says?
Originally posted by lilblam
Also, just because some entity tells you that there is no one from the past or future in this "timeline" does not make it an absolute declaration, does not make it a fact to be believed.
Along the same lines, just because you happen to believe in and posted the channeled information in this thread does not mean that it is accurate in any regard.
I never said I believe in it, that too is your assumption. I said take it with a grain of salt, and that it MAY or may not help you. Never claimed it was accurate! I do not just resign my free will by believing some source on its word, and thus letting that source define what I believe and thus define what I will be choosing. I do not "trust" or "believe" any source, the truth is not found through assumption, belief, or wishful thinking - that much I do know.
Learning how to discriminate between those in the Spirit who are objective, truthful, and knowledgeable in the subject matter, versus those who are not, is a worthwhile venture.
It sure is, but even those who are objective and knowledgeble do not always have to be truthful! A good track record may be very useful so you can communicate with that entity more, but it does not mean you can just assume that they will always be truthful, or that the message will not be misunderstoor or corrupted on its way to you, or that the messanger has not "changed" or something about it changed, etc. So many possibilities, so much room for "error"! Such is the nature of free will.
Originally posted by lilblam
Oh yeah, and what's a "Cassiopeanite"?
A name for someone who follows the channeled teaching of the Cassiopeans.
What do you mean follows? I don't believe a word they say, I make up my own mind based on critical thought and my own research. Again, in the search for truth, there can be no room for "beliefs" and "assumptions", because if you believe or assume something, you are simply deciding before you know what the reality about something is. But I am interested in objective reality, and only that.
Near death experience research indicates that free will takes a second seat to one's application of The Golden Rule. After death, we all see clearly how our actions affected those around us and we are held accountable for all our actions, thoughts and intentions. Universal Law is inescapable and truth and morality are absolute. We have no choice but to learn from our life review and move on. Those that reject the life review cannot ascend to a pleasant dimension of energy and are forced to stay on the lower dimensions where the corrupt reside; like the discarnate Greys for example (before they go under that is)
Morality is in fact subjective, what is "moral" to one person is "immoral" to another. Truth, in other words, objective reality, also depends on perspective and level of awareness of the observer. There may be "absolute truths", which are simply things which are objective in a universal sense, and to not depend on a certain level of awareness. Perhaps by morality you mean sympathy/empathy towards others, in the sense that, some people have empathy and some do not? And as a result, those with empathy simply cannot do certain things (or only with great difficulty), and those without empathy can easily and heartlessly do anything to anyone and not feel guilty or remoseful after that? Is that what you would call "spiritually retarded"? If so, I agree that this phenomenon does exist, from my experience at least. And what is pleasant is subjective, because what is pleasant to someone is not to someone else! So a "pleasant" dimention may be one of absolute control and a pyramid-like hiararchy with absolute rulers at the top and their subjects at the bottom. Or, it can be one with NO government, NO leaders, and no laws or rules of any kind. Again, what pleases someone does not please everyone.
This perspective is confirmed through my many years of experience in dealing with (and counseling others about) discarnate demonic attack. This is when you have discarnates use their free will for the perverted cause of the torture of one or more innocents for their own sadistic gratification.
What is a "perverted" cause? It is your subjective opinion what is "perverted", because to someone else, helping others is a perverted and sadistic action, and must be stopped. Again, that would be their subjective perspective. Yes, some actions hurt others, some do not. Some limit their choices, some do not. But who can say that any of those actions has no right to exist? Your perspective may be that grays must be stopped, THEIR perspective is that YOU must be stopped. Again, it is an subjective perspective on both ends, and STS in both cases because it is a judgement and imposition of one will on another.
"Evil contains the seeds of its own destruction."
I agree, only I'd replace evil with STS. It's own nature eventually means they become like a black hole, and as they try to accumulate power and control and physical things at expensive of spiritual being, they litereally become nothing, which is exactly that which they GIVE to the world, since they give nothing but try to take everything. They shut out objectivity in favor of wishful thinking and subjectivity, they create their own reality and bask in illusions, and try to achieve perfection by separating themselves from all else, and trying to be God in and of themselves, instead of seeing God in all things. In the process, they themselves become less and less "real" and eventually disappear into nothingness, simply because God is ALL THAT IS, and only NOTHING is not God, and so to try to become God by yourself, but separate yourself from all else and try to control it, you become that which you seek - nothing. Does that make sense?
That is the reason why evil forces have never been totally successful in taking over Creation. The Group Entities that support them, as with those who supported Nazi Germany, retrogress into nonexistence from their direct and indirect abuse to innocents.
I think we have similar understanding here, except that I think abuse of innocents is not at the root of their path into nonexistance, but the choice of entropy, which essentially is to try to HAVE everything (control, possess) at the expensive of your own spiritual being.
That is why it is so important to strive to live by The Golden Rule.
Well it is important to those who choose that path. Because again, those who are STS chose their path, and their choice is important to them (even if they wishfully think that they can eventually control everything).
We all have to do so in order to exist eternally.
Perhaps, but this is still a choice - STO or STS, even if STS means certain destruction in the end. To deny STS a choice to be what it is, is to become STS - because only STS interferes and denies others a choice, osit.
We have absolutely no choice in the matter (pun intended).
Well I think we always exist eternally, because creation has no beginning or end, all that exists always has, does, and will exist. But individual consciousness units (souls) may choose a path that sort of makes you unconscious and lose cognition of reality, because if you head towards STS, you eventually head towards non-existance and so "reap what you sow" (which in STS case is nothing). But the soul does not "die", it simply changes to a level where its experiences and interactions with reality are not conscious anymore, sort of like a deep "sleep". Again, I only speculate, but the reason I say this is because I realise that true NOTHINGNESS does not exist, and all that exists always did, does, and will exist. So you cannot "cease to exist" in a sense of literally becoming nothing, but on the other hand, what is YOU, or I but an individuated consciousness unit? Well we can lose our awareness, which can go back to a primal level of perhaps physicality itself (like a rock), and so we may simply no longer be conscious anymore, since that is the direction we chose.
But I digress. This is an interesting conversation!
Lilblam,
We seem to be going in circles here. I'll try to keep my response relatively short.
If a soul's free will is violated and they are suffering as a result of that violation, then they are innocent.
The Golden Rule, which is universal in all the world's major religions, is a principle of Spirit. It is a facet of Universal Law which governs The Light. The Light represents the only way that reality can manifest itself. Without The Light, there can be no stars, planets or souls.
Morality is dictated by one's ability or inability to unite with The Light after bodily death, as NDE and discarnate demonic attack research indicates.
You never answered the question.
If you didn't believe a word that they stated, then why did you post such a long quote from them? Are we to assume that you believe nothing that you post?
I have found that most souls do not in fact exist eternally. Most souls join a Group Entity and use their free will for selfish purposes and deeds. Consequently, they retrogress into oblivion.
Existence is not a given. We are only allowed to exist if we strive to live by The Golden Rule, as morality and truth are not subjective or relative, but absolute.
Lilblam -- if you wish to continue this discussion, feel free to e-mail me.
I apologize to all applicable persons for getting so far off the subject matter of this thread.
[edit on 15-6-2005 by Paul_Richard]
We seem to be going in circles here. I'll try to keep my response relatively short.
If a soul's free will is violated and they are suffering as a result of that violation, then they are innocent.
The Golden Rule, which is universal in all the world's major religions, is a principle of Spirit. It is a facet of Universal Law which governs The Light. The Light represents the only way that reality can manifest itself. Without The Light, there can be no stars, planets or souls.
Morality is dictated by one's ability or inability to unite with The Light after bodily death, as NDE and discarnate demonic attack research indicates.
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
If you were abducted and placed in a cage and knew that you were going to be used in an upcoming medical experiment that would result in a slow and horrible death, would you want someone to rescue you?
Originally posted by lilblam
As I said, many people do not like situations they find themselves in, and many people want to be rescued from ALL sorts of things in life, many things they have NO control over. But just because they don't like something and want someone else to interfere on their behalf, does that mean that someone should interfere? Many people get kidnapped, threatened, and are controlled in many different ways in many situations. So as I mentioned, just because you are in a situation from which you WANT to get out, does not justify some "guardian" to miraculously rescue you! We'd not learn anything if whenever we are in trouble, some "divine" force pulled us out each time. And life does not work this way, people die all the time, suffer, are trapped, etc. It is all part of life and its lessons, always has been, always will be. Those that take it upon themselves to "limit" creation and only allow the experiences that THEY personally decide are helpful, are STS, are depriving others of important life experiences and lessons, and are usually not helping except to convey to the one being rescued that he does not need to learn from this, he does not need to perhaps wonder why he is in this situation, he does not need to do anything at all, but just let some divine power rescue him whenever he's in trouble.
You never answered the question.
Originally posted by lilblam
Oh yeah, and what's a "Cassiopeanite"?
Originally posted by Paul_Richard
A name for someone who follows the channeled teaching of the Cassiopeans.
Originally posted by lilblam
What do you mean follows? I don't believe a word they say, I make up my own mind based on critical thought and my own research. Again, in the search for truth, there can be no room for "beliefs" and "assumptions", because if you believe or assume something, you are simply deciding before you know what the reality about something is. But I am interested in objective reality, and only that.
If you didn't believe a word that they stated, then why did you post such a long quote from them? Are we to assume that you believe nothing that you post?
Originally posted by lilblam
Well I think we always exist eternally...
I have found that most souls do not in fact exist eternally. Most souls join a Group Entity and use their free will for selfish purposes and deeds. Consequently, they retrogress into oblivion.
Existence is not a given. We are only allowed to exist if we strive to live by The Golden Rule, as morality and truth are not subjective or relative, but absolute.
Lilblam -- if you wish to continue this discussion, feel free to e-mail me.
I apologize to all applicable persons for getting so far off the subject matter of this thread.
[edit on 15-6-2005 by Paul_Richard]
A part of me would want someone to come and "rescue" me from such a situation as you have described, but a part of me would realise that this would
imply the violation of free will of my captors and would NOT want this. Yet another part of of me would realise that this too is something I can learn
from, and yet another part of me does not care at all because it does not care about what happens to teh body, only the spirit. We are entropic and
STS beings, and each person is a mechanical reaction machine that consists of many little selves that each have their own wants and goals. It takes
much effort on our part to create a unified self, instead of being many selves acting as one.
You say innocents are those who suffer as a result of violation of their free will, then perhaps you could consider that you are making the grays suffer if you were to deprive them of us (humans), because you'd be depriving them of a very important source of energy and otherwise entertainment, pleasure, etc. And in the end, "suffering" is subjective, and a matter of perspective. Some people suffer in every life situation, because they seem to get extremely angry and upset at every little thing that goes wrong, and think that it's some sort of punishment from God, and they throw fits and become hysterical wondering why their life is so terrible. Other people laugh such little "wrongs" off, and move on without ever choosing to oblige in "suffering". Some people choose to feel like a victim, some not.
So again, just because you suffer, does not mean there is anything "wrong" with it and that someone must "save you" from your suffering. Suffering teaches lessons, and it can often be much more helpful than feeling really good! And if you judge suffering as "unnecessary", then it is just as easy to judge "feeling good" as unnecessary, or anything for that matter. Nothing is NECESSARY, but everything is part of life experience, and all things can potentially teach you some important life lessons. Sometimes a little suffering does a soul good!
[edit on 15-6-2005 by lilblam]
You say innocents are those who suffer as a result of violation of their free will, then perhaps you could consider that you are making the grays suffer if you were to deprive them of us (humans), because you'd be depriving them of a very important source of energy and otherwise entertainment, pleasure, etc. And in the end, "suffering" is subjective, and a matter of perspective. Some people suffer in every life situation, because they seem to get extremely angry and upset at every little thing that goes wrong, and think that it's some sort of punishment from God, and they throw fits and become hysterical wondering why their life is so terrible. Other people laugh such little "wrongs" off, and move on without ever choosing to oblige in "suffering". Some people choose to feel like a victim, some not.
So again, just because you suffer, does not mean there is anything "wrong" with it and that someone must "save you" from your suffering. Suffering teaches lessons, and it can often be much more helpful than feeling really good! And if you judge suffering as "unnecessary", then it is just as easy to judge "feeling good" as unnecessary, or anything for that matter. Nothing is NECESSARY, but everything is part of life experience, and all things can potentially teach you some important life lessons. Sometimes a little suffering does a soul good!
[edit on 15-6-2005 by lilblam]
We must never forget:
He who orders the guillotine, NEVER drops the blade himself.
And that is why we have people here trying to recruit others to a battle only they have justification for.
When an entity enters my mind without my invitation, and kidnaps me, then I would have something against them. Until then, they can continue to molest those who have invited them in, even if those people were initially tricked.
Hell, you are asking to be tricked, they give it to you, when you search for the answers to life's questions in the form of aliens coming to abduct and bestow knowledge (or more important for some 'proof'), that is the form you get.
He who orders the guillotine, NEVER drops the blade himself.
And that is why we have people here trying to recruit others to a battle only they have justification for.
When an entity enters my mind without my invitation, and kidnaps me, then I would have something against them. Until then, they can continue to molest those who have invited them in, even if those people were initially tricked.
Hell, you are asking to be tricked, they give it to you, when you search for the answers to life's questions in the form of aliens coming to abduct and bestow knowledge (or more important for some 'proof'), that is the form you get.
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