A skeptic writes....

I once paid £45 for a one hour session on hypnotic transgression and stayed unhypnotised whilst I concocted two almost unbelievable tales.

The Hypnotherapist had no idea she had been scammed and asked me to visit again free of charge.

Im also pretty sure that I could at least "confuse" a polygraph,in fact I know people who have....its no big deal really.

Im "ace" with photoshop and make really wonderful jpgs of ufos.... incidentally my 12 year old son made a beauty in an art lesson just the other week...simply by pasting a pic of a ufo onto a school window.

And Im reasonably sure that I could make a really good night time video of a ufo just by videoing a 737 or 747 from the "right" angle.

Ive also bluffed my way through a few palmistry readings... they are soooooo easy to do.

I am also good, really good at telling jocular little white lies.

All in all I guess I could, if I put my mind to it, be the next "big thing".

You know, its not that hard, just get a bedsheet and cut it into something wearable and start spreading the word.

I guess Im the same as loads of other people who do that, we are the same even down to the last factor, I like the rest of them have no tangible evidence at all.

"We are not allowed to take photos of them" ... is perhaps the latest excuse for having no evidence. How absurd!!

Implants .... yeah right !! ..... not one, irregardless of what has been said has never been proven to be anything more than shards of glass or tiny bits of gravel resulting from falls and scrapes.

I believe in life on other planets, I remain unconvinced that we have had one iota of concrete proof that we have had any sort of contact or visitation from intelligent life from out of this world.

I wish to God that there was even the tiniest piece of tangible concrete evidence..... I have been investigating this subject for nigh on thirty years and instead of us getting closer to a solution we keep getting our visions clouded by things like Dulce and guys like William Moore and people like new age channelers and such who also post on here.

Not one iota of evidence EVER.... prove me wrong.... you cant.

Sadly, you know you cant!

so we should look forward to lots of deception and little white lies from you ?

thanks for the warning or threat or whatever

I wish to God that there was even the tiniest piece of tangible concrete evidence..... I have been investigating this subject for nigh on thirty years and instead of us getting closer to a solution we keep getting our visions clouded by things like Dulce and guys like William Moore and people like new age channelers and such who also post on here.

Not one iota of evidence EVER.... prove me wrong.... you cant.

Sadly, you know you cant!

Proof? No... Evidence? Plenty....

The Hill Case
Rendlesham
Roswell
UFO over LA
Kinross Incident
UFOs over DC

Etc. etc.

Sooooo
you are an admitted liar and BS artist...

that would explain why you doubt everything... you are assuming that everyone is as unethical as you are... (classic fear projection syndrome)

well, you probably wont ever be fooled, but i doubt you will have many true friends either...

it is good to be a healthy skeptic because this world is full of scam artists...
but then... you seem to be a scam artist, so in your case, it would more properly be termed self induced paranoia... rather than healthy skeptism...

and for the record, I only believe what i witness, and hold everyting else suspect until proven...
I like to think that is healthy skeptism...

We can make a believable movie showing astronauts going to the moon, but it doesn't mean the Apollo missions didn't really happen...

All in all I guess I could, if I put my mind to it, be the next "big thing".

Somebody is a little full of themselves. What a waste of reading time that was.

Ihhh ?..so maybe i should stay away from taking an airplane from now on?
Because if it is as you say, the pilots are crazy too and they "see" nothing but nonetheless they report it sometimes ?
Not that they would be a credible source...after all they are just "mildly" educated and trained and they have no idea when it comes to "things that fly"

Interesting replies....lets deal with them one at a time.

Lazarus.... I presume from your reply that you have never ever lied or BS`ed anybody.......are you 100% sure?

And you hold everything "suspect" until proven.... you are therefore like me inclined to believe that we have had no unearthly visitations or at the very least you remain doubtful.

I say I" doubt events" you say you" hold them suspect".... I am at a loss to differentiate

Incidentally if you do reply perhaps you would be kind enough to explain what classic fear projection syndrome is.... my old friend Mr Google has drawn a blank.

Mr Gazrock, Im possibly your greatest admirer....heaven alone knows how much time and effort you put into those wonderful reports you do......they are compulsive reading and for the newbies coming into "ufology" they are a wonderful insight about what is all so fascinating yet so infuriating about this subject.

A really wonderful set of examples upon which to cut ones teeth.

But dont you, like me, often wish that the evidence in these cases was a little more tangible and a little less circumstantial.

Because thats all it is.

I recall reading a little while ago that your interest was first aroused by an odd "aerial event" when you were very young....I too also had my interest ignited by such an event.

I didnt understand it, I couldnt reason it and hence it drove me forward.

I have yet to see anything definitive in my quest.

I wish I had, did you invesigate your event ??.

To the others who have made fatuous remarks.... well thats up to you.... I asked you to give me proof, maybe thats your way of saying you cant

Originally posted by JayKew

To the others who have made fatuous remarks.... well thats up to you.... I asked you to give me proof, maybe thats your way of saying you cant

How would you define proof ?..or,in your case,what would you like to have to consider it proof ?

i've witnessed something in the sky i couldn't understand. How would i go about investigating it.

"Excuse me MR. ATC man could you check you're logs for me please?"

"Why yes son"

"yes on the night of xx, xx, xxxx did you or your systems happen to catch an inverted trapizoid starting from the left, leaving behind a light trail like in the movie Tron?"

"...uhhh.. no son, we were looking for (Identifiable) Aircraft."

"But this was an aircraft, or a spacecraft, but i don't know whitch one it was. I don't think i'vee seen it anywhere before in my life."

"And it sounds like mabye no one else has eh?"

"yeah..."

"well my friend that's what we call an Unidentified flying object, or UFO"

"oh ok.. thanks mister."


Are you wanting proof of ET's or UFO's? people seam to forget theirs a huge difference here.
I'm sure you wont stop doubting till it walks up and talks to you. I just hope when it happens it's not dressed up like us humans.

Come on man. Good for you with all your skills, but come on.

[edit on 5/4/2005 by VaporTrail]

Here is a list of a few others who have been fooled to add to your list of suckers:

Harry S. Truman, “I can assure you the flying saucers, given that they exist, are not constructed by any power on earth.” White House press conference, Washington DC, April 4, 1950.


Jimmy Carter, “I don’t laugh at people anymore when they say they’ve seen a UFO. It was the darndest thing I’ve ever seen. It was big, it was bright, it changed colors and it was about the size of the moon.”


Mikhail Gorbachev, “The phenomenon of UFOs does exist, and it must be treated seriously.” From Soviet youth, May 4, 1990


Prince Phillip, His Royal Highness, Duke of Edinburgh, “There are many reasons to believe that (UFOs) do exist there is so much evidence from reliable witnesses.”


Ronald Reagan, “I was in a plane last week when I looked out the window and saw this white light. It was zigzagging around. I went up to the pilot and said, “Have you ever seen anything like that? “He was shocked and said, “Nope!” And I said to him, “Let’s follow it!” We followed it for several minutes. It was a bright white light. We followed it to Bakersfield, and all of a sudden to our utter amazement it went straight up into the heavens. When I got off the plane I told Nancy all about it. But we didn’t file a report on the object because for a long time they considered you a nut if you saw a UFO.” From a speech in 1974


Monsignor Corrado Balducci, “We can no longer think is it true or false are they truths or lies---if we believe or not! There are already numerous considerations which make the existence of these beings into a certainty we cannot doubt.” Vatican theologian on a report to the pope concerning UFOs, broadcast on Italian television.


Barry Goldwater, “Hell no, you can’t go. I can’t go, and don’t ask me again.” Senator Goldwater quoted General Curtis Lamey’s reply to the senator’s appeal to visit the “Blue Room” located at Wright Patterson Air Force Base, Goldwater asserts he was told physical evidence exists that would confirm the reality of alien spacecraft.


Dr. Jerry Linenger (NASA astronaut), “In five months in space, I have seen unidentified flying objects for sure.”


Cosmonaut Victor Afanasyev, “It followed us during half of our orbit. We observed it on the light side, and when we entered the shadow side, it disappeared completely. It was an engineered structure, made from some type of mental, approximately 40 meters long with inner hulls.” Commenting on a UFO sighting that occurred while in route to the Solyut 6 space station in April of 1979

And that is your "proof"...that is the best you can offer in the way of proof ??

Originally posted by JayKew
And that is your "proof"...that is the best you can offer in the way of proof ??

I understand that you need proof.

I don’t need proof, I know what I have experience.

It takes a bit of arrogance to presume to know what other people have or have not seen and experienced in their lives.

Unless you are god, if so my apologies.

So Mr Sleeper what experience have you had that gives you enough proof that Aliens are amongst us or that visitations, however fleetingly do occur.

Im honestly not being facetious.... Im being interested... my 30 year quest continues

Originally posted by JayKew
So Mr Sleeper what experience have you had that gives you enough proof that Aliens are amongst us or that visitations, however fleetingly do occur.

Im honestly not being facetious.... Im being interested... my 30 year quest continues

Mr. Jaykew

I have written a few things on this board about my experiences, and more than enough to bore the best of the skeptics, and some believers. Check out my post below for some amusement. But be warned, I don't give lots of details. You will have to buy the book for that-----then again there is no book.

Interesting Mr Sleeper, very interesting as the quote from Rowan and Martin goes..... maybe you will accept a u2u from me one day.

JayKew I hate to say this but all you've done is start up a new thread and claim "aliens arent real" and "give me proof" over and over, and tell us how much of a good con-artist you are. Atleast post a few links.

www.alienscalpel.com...

Possible UFO Debris.

Implants .... yeah right !! ..... not one, irregardless of what has been said has never been proven to be anything more than shards of glass or tiny bits of gravel resulting from falls and scrapes.

"Irregardless of what has been said" ? So now you deny whatever evidence you feel is inconveniant? I would suggest you look into Roger Leir who has taken out many implants.

As for them being shards of glass or tiny bits of gravel. A few splinters are noticable enough to get my attention and yet these people walk around without any feeling of the implant.

ufostreams.com...

But dont you, like me, often wish that the evidence in these cases was a little more tangible and a little less circumstantial.

Regardless of whether you believe the evidence is circumstancial or tangible, you have a lot of work on your hands to debunk roswell. I suggest you get started on it now. And once you've had your case ready, you can post it here, but until then please dont keep asking "give me proof." Instead provide links and present a strong case as to why you think UFO's dont exist.

As for tangibility in evidence, I think an official announcement from the military is proof enough that UFO's are real, considering that these generals have college degrees, have probably served in the army, are highly disciplined, and hell it takes a lot of damn responsibility to run an airforce base. So for an airforce base to come out with the claim that they have captured a flying saucer is completely irresponsible if they were wrong. So if you want to argue as to why they issued such a statement, possibly becuase it was their main purpose to decieve the public for whatever reason, then maybe thats something you can argue for.

Ahh KyateLaBoca, what a wonderful name !!

Firstly how on earth can I post a few links of "non" evidence.

Either there is evidence or there isnt.

One thing I cannot do is provide evidence of non evidence... Im sorry if you think that evidence of non evidence is easily available.

As for Roger Leir, well he hasnt actually taken ANY implants out, he has left it to a mate ofr his, an orthodentist I belive.

TV cameras have been at at least some of these "extractions"... I watched some on Discovery, sadly not one of the "extractions could be defined as anything but shards of glass or gravel.

Incidentally did you know that Leir actually "caught" an alien in between two pieces of window glass.... five years on we are still waiting for the pics he promised.

If it was me I would have had my double glazing people in by now to sort out the faults.

I have no intentions of debunking Roswell, the big players themselves manage it quite well..... even down to the Undertaker and the "disapperaing nurse".

But hey... if there is a dollar to be earned then go for it.

And finally I have never ever seen an official announcement from the military that aliens exist.... please invite me to step in the right direction.






[edit on 4-5-2005 by JayKew]

And finally I have never ever seen an official announcement from the military that aliens exist.... please invite me to step in the right direction.

I was referring to the Roswell announcement of a UFO crash.

Im sorry if you think that evidence of non evidence is easily available.

Well I too am sorry if you think evidence for one of the largest government coverups is easily obtainable.

But I have given you a link to that strange metal.

As for Roger Leir, well he hasnt actually taken ANY implants out, he has left it to a mate ofr his, an orthodentist I belive.

I think he's helped to develop a procedure for doing so and has assistants during the procedure on feet. He probably does have an orthodontis helping him out for teeth because he's obviously not an orthodontis.

And for any implants located in the mouth, its hard to imagine a "rough" fall which causes perfect and stable insertion of the object.

TV cameras have been at at least some of these "extractions"... I watched some on Discovery, sadly not one of the "extractions could be defined as anything but shards of glass or gravel.

I'd have to see those videos becuase some documentaries I've seen on the Discovery channel have shown circular small metallic balls. In addition Roger Leir has found metals,

members.aol.com...

www.alienscalpel.com...

But I am sure there are pranksters who dont have metallic objects inside them, but they know they have some other object inside them resulting from a fall, and they want the doctor to get it out. I think Roger Leir does many of these for free. So, they can easily spin the story any way they want to get a free removal or to get attention.

Incidentally did you know that Leir actually "caught" an alien in between two pieces of window glass.... five years on we are still waiting for the pics he promised.

Link?

I have no intentions of debunking Roswell, the big players themselves manage it quite well..... even down to the Undertaker and the "disapperaing nurse".

Well you come to this board wanting to be challenged with evidence, even though a lot of strong cases have been presented to you. And the only comment you've made about them is that "shouldnt there be more tangible evidence" or wheres the evidence. I was atleast expecting some sort of counter-argument as to why you think aliens dont exist or atleast some reference link to one of you favorite debunkers, so that you can present a logical and informative discussion as to why you think were wrong.

i'm not going far from the trunk here, but this link isn't helping anyone. Unless the points are the truth we're seeking here.

sad JayKew. Sounds like your 30 years looking has mabye caused a bit of disgruntlement at those who have found 'faith' in their experiances.

Lets see some evidance of blind doubt helping improve the quality of or lives.

cya