Nazism

What is actually wrong with the whole concept of facism, or nazism, people don't like it because one of its beliefs is racial purity, or to blame other groups for what has been wrongfully done to you in the past, but then the whole world would really revolve around this whole concept, so does this make the whole world wrong, or evil? What are your ideas on nazism, facism, and neonazism

Racial purity is a utopian concept which will not have liberated the world, but only liberated a selected few. It didn't fit with the world paradigm so it was defeated.

Uhm, I don't think you quite have the idea of Nazism.

I think that to start with, you might want to talk to your grandparents and others who liberated nations from the Nazis. They can tell you first hand what life was like for the ordinary citizen under that system and how the elite lived well while everyone else lived under one of the most unpleasant dictatorships on Earth.

Yes, in the dressed up version, they don't spell this out for you. But they really want the Earth segregated into racial ghettoes.. with the Caucasians (and only the blonde, blue-eyed ones) in control. And they have no moral problems with genocide (killing all people (no matter how young or old or innocent) that belong to one identified group (usually the Jews, but I've seen Muslims and Native Americans targeted as well as Blacks.)

Now, there's about six billion of us who think this is a bad idea.

Nazism is the Germanic version of the Fascist Totalitarianism and advocates the complete control of the state over the individual:
www.remember.org...

There's millions of Americans here who think that having a totalitarian government is a Bad Idea.

They scapegoat large segments of the population including Jews. There's billions of people who think this is a Totally Lame Idea.
encarta.msn.com...

To do this, they will tell you how mass murderer leaders like Hitler and Manson are "misunderstood" and "clear thinkers" don't fall into the trap. By their standards, Nero was simply a misunderstood guy with a bad childhood and Caligula was actually a really great party guy who didn't deserve to be assassinated by his own troops.


Now, maybe you're a Caucasian guy and you don't see any problem with giving your alliegance to a state government that will tell you just how high you can rise (according to the color of your hair and eyes) and maybe you don't see a problem with limiting education and wealth to the people that look like you. Maybe you don't have a problem living in a society where everyone rats on everyone else -- but the rest of the world isn't eager to embrace this concept.

Talk to some of the people who liberated Europe from the Nazis. You'll get a whole different take on what life is like in a fascist state.


[edit on 3-5-2005 by Byrd]

yes, but just because four billion of you believe it to be wrong, then is that strictly why it is wrong, because the majority believe so, the majority of people on earth believe that gay's and lesbians are wrong, so whatever the majority believes must be right right, wrong, why go with the flow

Originally posted by Undergroundpunk
yes, but just because four billion of you believe it to be wrong, then is that strictly why it is wrong, because the majority believe so, the majority of people on earth believe that gay's and lesbians are wrong, so whatever the majority believes must be right right, wrong, why go with the flow

Actually, the issues of the gays isn't quite that well divided (and if you look at history, there were times when gays and lesbians were accepted without comment in society.

The majority of people believe that owning slaves is wrong... so you're saying that "majority opinion" isn't worth a hoot?

The majority of people think that pedophilia is wrong... but you reject this because 6 billion people think it's wrong?

Most people reject Communisim... but you're arguing it is right because the majority think it's wrong?

Are you simply promoting minority views?

no, i'm simply stating that do u truly believe what u say or are u just saying it because 6 billion other people have said the same thing and u have just been manipulated to believe that, maybe i do agree with nazism, slavery, etc. but does that necissarily make me a bad person , no because there is no such thing as good or bad, its just that the "majority" of society has molded our minds into believing that certain things are good or bad

UGP, are you just trying to get a reaction ? Try reading byrd's posts again, think it over, if you still think its about "just cuz lots of people says it wrong doesn't mean its wrong" , you're barking up the wrong tree

Originally posted by Simulacra
Racial purity is a utopian concept

- Not to mention a really really stupid concept for the human race.

Genetic 'purity' is a fast track to a species demise; genetic diversity is the key to a species longevity.

and who are u to tell me what tree i'm barking up, your just another narrow minded follower, usless to society because u can't make up your own opinions on things, yet just agree with everything that someone states to u , just like the nazis who followed hitler into the war , just like the nazis who couldn't speak up for themselves but followed someone who they believed was smart, just like all the germans who followed what the majority said,

Originally posted by Undergroundpunk
What is actually wrong with the whole concept of facism

Denigration of the self in favour of The State, actually it shares almost all of the pitfalls of socialism/communism, and additionally it has the problem of placing corporations at the forefront, while still not having a free economy, which means that whats good about corporations is supressed, and whats bad is magnified. A fascist society is also almost allways a closed society, and that in itself if useless.

, or nazism

Gosh, you've never heard the complaints?
National Socialism is very similar to fascism, and as such has many of its problems. Where it goes beyond fascism is in the manner in which society is regulated and information/political reality are controlled. The complete subjagation of the individual to not just the state and community but the dictator himself is horrible enough to begin with. Nazi society has absolutely no free press and no civic freedoms for the people. Its a very closed and tightly controlled society, which means that its bound to self-destruct. Nazi economics are also childish and, realistically, stupid. While war mobilization was able to bring the Weimar Republic out of its extreme financial difficulties, look at the cost. The complete loss of private ownership of all property. The land, the real estate, belong to the State itself, and often was simply abusively controlled by the heads of industry and party heads that actually ran everything. And for all that, what did the people get? A brief, dramatic, but completely unsustainable economy that couldn't function very well in the global economy it found itself in. Germany is a very resource poor country, and most of the wars its fought have been over control of coal fields or ore mines and the like. Those kinds of things are more effectively gathered up by trade, and can't be seized on a global scale. The nazi state, however, forces itself into becomming a pariah by extreme mobilization and military buildup, and thus, literally, shoots itself in the foot. And while the nazis were able to get inflation under control, they were incapable of developing anything like a free market system or even a mixed market system, which is where wealth is generated and capital accumulated and put to use. IE, they were fundamentally incapable of creating wealth and innovation, even tho they were able to do directed research on limited subject areas.
Oh yeah, then there's that whole 'racial superiority' bit, which was demonstrably false at the time, and could've onyl resulted in the slow destruction of the German State had not WWII done that more mercifully. The nazi ideal state was the concentration camp system, wherein everyone is part of the system that controls everyone else. Workers are merely, literally, slaves, providing labour freely and via force. That sort of economy hasn't really worked since the fall of the Roman Empire. The German State sought to control the entire population, untermensch and ubermensch alike. The 'priviliged' status of ethnic germans in the system was meaningless, they were just kapos and wardens in the Concentration Camp State, completely enslaved to the system itself, ie weak and controled human cattle.

but then the whole world would really revolve around this whole concept, so does this make the whole world wrong, or evil?

Racism is wrong, both on a factual level and on an ethical level. Anyone practicing is is factually incorrect, ie ignorant, and un-ethical/immoral. The world, as a whole, does not practice this. The world, as a whole, doesn't do very much of anything.

What are your ideas on nazism

A pathetic and obviously, even demonstrably, foolish errarnd. An extremist racist totalitarian system that will allways self-destruct, and ends up destroying its own citizens.

facism,

a pointless aping of nationalism and communism that provides no benefits to anyone, other than, what, getting the trains to run on time?

and neonazism

Neonazis are usally ignorant fools who don't understand fascism or national socialism at all. Ironically, they're almost always people that would fall into the Untermenschen class in the nazi total state, but ludicrously seem to think that they are 'super-men'.

undergroundpunk
is that strictly why it is wrong, because the majority believe so,

No one has claimed that nazism is wrong because of some sort of a consensus. Nazi is wrong in almost every single aspect. Its a perversion of ethnicity, a perversion of patriotism, and an empty abstractionist ideology that completely seperates man from reality. And, on top of that, its murderous, having destroyed millions of germans directly, let alone the numbers that died fighting for germany. Oh, and it doesn't work.

maybe i do agree with nazism, slavery, etc. but does that necissarily make me a bad person

Why, because other people who fancy themselves as nazis don't think its bad? Your criticism of people who disagree with nazism is simply a reflection of, aparently, your own unreasonable 'reasons' for accepting nazism. Slavery is wrong, man has rights, those rights aren't superseded by an empty abstractionist ideology.

no because there is no such thing as good or bad, its just that the "majority" of society has molded our minds into believing that certain things are good or bad

Ok, you are a moral relativist, who doesn't have the ability to define his own morality. Rather than going 'beyond good and evil', you return to a primitive, senseless barbarism. Fair enough, but simply because you aren't strong enough to work up an ethical system doesn't mean that the rest of us are, or that the rest of us are merely copying what the 'majority' does.

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Nazism also uses a sort of pseudo-science to back itself up, iow, it uses gibberish, dressed up in the language of science, to give it authority that it itself does not have. It needs authority from outside itself.

your just another narrow minded follower

Says someone who apes 'nazism and slavery aren't bad', without even trying to support the assertion Simply because you think that your 'thinking' isn't mainstream:

1. Doesn't make you a radical
   
2. Doesn't make you right
   
3. Doesn't mean that you aren't a follower
   

yet just agree with everything that someone states to u

Ever think that so many people agree, because they've independantly arrived at generally similar conclusions?

just like the nazis who followed hitler into the war

The nazis, apparently, couldn't think for themselves, and didn't want to. They didn't try to really support their ideology, hence the suppression of all criticism, at home, on the streets, and in the press, possibly because they knew that their position was one of weakness. Where have you supported your position? You've merely stated, rather blandly, that 'just because everyone does it don't make it right'. Well, the obvious counter, that you should've realized and thought thru, is that simply because everyone thinks something doesn't make it wrong.
People don't reject nazism 'because society tells them too'. People can clearly see, in broadstrokes, why nazism is stupid and piggish. They don't need society to tell them that its wrong. They can think for themselves.

Apparently you all don't understand what your missing out on, the chance to purify humanity from all the wrongs, everyone could be perfect,with eugenics everyone will be perfect your narrowminded democrats, are usless to the world, and will soon be taken care of , we are rising, there are over 100 000 of us allready, i suggest you join, if u don't u will sooon face one of the largest terrorist organizations on the world, on the wrong side.

Originally posted by Undergroundpunk
Apparently you all don't understand what your missing out on, the chance to purify humanity from all the wrongs, everyone could be perfect,with eugenics everyone will be perfect your narrowminded democrats, are usless to the world, and will soon be taken care of , we are rising, there are over 100 000 of us allready, i suggest you join, if u don't u will sooon face one of the largest terrorist organizations on the world, on the wrong side.

Sorry, I'm allergic to wearing clownshoes.

Also, I know the ending to this particular story, this kind of poster, and this kind of thread. Bet this thread doesn't make it to morning.



[edit on 4-5-2005 by brimstone735]

Originally posted by Undergroundpunk
Apparently you all don't understand what your missing out on, the chance to purify humanity from all the wrongs, everyone could be perfect,with eugenics everyone will be perfect your narrowminded democrats, are usless to the world, and will soon be taken care of , we are rising, there are over 100 000 of us allready, i suggest you join, if u don't u will sooon face one of the largest terrorist organizations on the world, on the wrong side.

Blah blah blah...Superior race my arse...piss off you Adolf-Wanna-Be...

BANNED

Originally posted by Undergroundpunk
we are rising, there are over 100 000 of us allready, i suggest you join, if u don't u will sooon face one of the largest terrorist organizations on the world, on the wrong side.

- 100 000 out of 6+ Billions?
Not very impressive really is it?

Nazism is a childish temper-tamtrum attempting to exert one 'will' writ large coupled with a (highly suspicious) fear of difference.

We've seen it, defeated it and now contemptuously laugh at it.

It's the philosophy of the loser - and by God how they, deservedly, lost.

The kids these days

This one didn't even seem to actually know anything about naziism.

we are rising, there are over 100 000 of us allready

Neonais (really 'pseudo-nazis, or faux-nazis' or 'mean rednecks') account for around one percent of the US population. They are nothing.

If they had ever studied any Neitzche then they'd perhaps not be too upset about being nothing, but since they're for the most part ignorant, dim-witted cowards *shrug*

Originally posted by Nygdan
If they had ever studied any Neitzche then they'd perhaps not be too upset about being nothing, but since they're for the most part ignorant, dim-witted cowards *shrug*

- Now that's funny, genuinely made me laugh out loud, thank you.