something wrong with this??

ok,

1. Can somebody please tell me what an inverted cross means.

2. Are these pics real???

www.ewtn.com...#





[Edited on 27-7-2003 by alienaddicted]

Not being a Roman Catholic, I can not say for sure. However, the Apostle Peter was crucified on a inverted cross, hanging upside down (at his request). Peter considered it a sacrilege to be crucified in a "normal manner" since that was the way Jesus was crucified. I would hazard a quess that the inverted cross on the Pope's chair is a reference to the line of succession of the Pope being also the Bishop of Rome which goes back to the Apostle Peter. However, to be sure check with some one who is a Roman Catholic.

indeed, guess I found a link on that one when you were typin':

www.denofheathens.com...


maybe not as suspicious as I thought

guess I had to search a little further before posting

www.shasta.com...


sorry for being so ignorant

Do I get banned now?



hmmmm, in fact tha pope can tell you what he wants about what he sees in that inverted cross

No alienaddicted, we won't ban you - just force you to attend catechism class taught by nuns who carrying big long rulers to crack the hands of those who fall asleep.
(I had a high school friend who attend Catholic high school and the nuns in that school had a bad reputation of using rulers to get a pupil's attention.)

No need to apologize, you ask a question about something you did not about. Remember there are few dumb questions, but a lot of dumb answers.

Hmmm i never noticed this before........inverted cross with the Pope!

I'll try and see what i can find on it......when did the Pope actually start using the 'inverted cross''???

I know the Russian Orthodox do not have anything like this!
Interesting !

Originally posted by alienaddicted
ok,

1. Can somebody please tell me what an inverted cross means.

2. Are these pics real???

www.ewtn.com...#





[Edited on 27-7-2003 by alienaddicted]

hmmm....thats a good question...i would normally think they are satanic...but...since the pope has them everywhere...i don't know

. The inverted Cross is a Christian symbol, but it's not one belonging to the Christian Satan. When Saint Peter was to be put to murder, it was determined that he would be crusified. Being a humble man, he felt that he didn't deserve to be crusified as his master and God, instead being crusified upside-down. This became known as the Cross of St. Peter. When someone wears the inverted Cross, they're making a statement as being humble in the eyes of God.

The Pope is being humble to god I guess.

[Edited on 27-7-2003 by ModestMike]

How about this perspective- and I add my disclaimer of no offense to Catholics here......but does the cross really mean anything beyond history and symbolism?
I know it is a symbol of the price He paid for us, and it's misuse is known.

Jesus was crucified on a cross. He died and he arose after three days and then ascended into heaven. He did not speak of the cross after he was off of it....

I do not see any real significance to the cross towards Jesus's message.

jagdflieger, I went 6 years to a school ruled by nuns,...
give me a break please

I can't remember anything about peter and his cross, they should've teached me, I wouldn't be so amazed then when I see the popes trone


Read somewhere also that displaying christ on the cross is satanic, they keep jezus on the cross.
Displaying only a cross is saying he went to do good work in heaven.

And isn't the Sabbath on a saturday (last day of the week, the day God rested). What's the deal about sunday being the last day of the week? It should be the first day? Why did they change it?

blasphemy.....?

alienaddicted, I have heard this in the past about it being Satanic keeping Jesus on the cross....I suppose the crosses significance to the message either makes this a moot point or something that really matters.

A long post against alot of confusion .....

At the first link:

notice the staff with the crucified christ which the pope is holding- i saw this staff in a danish masonic church - a church founded by freemasons.
It contained shields with inverted fivepointed stars, a pyramid in the wall as proctective cover for a masonic grave under it.
and so on.. alot of stuff, in a "christian" protestant church!!
But there was this staff also.... excactly the same.

Originally posted by alienaddicted
indeed, guess I found a link on that one when you were typin':

www.denofheathens.com...


maybe not as suspicious as I thought

sorry alienaddicted, but i am going to be hard here...

this is totally nosense, . notice the link promoting the pentagram in the bottom of the homepage.

this guy is probably iniciated in somekind of occult stuff.
(read: freemasonery)
Link



also the other link:

www.shasta.com...

jump to the link "tribute to saint peter" to the end of the page.
You will find this qoute:

"Poor Peter, he never got it right. He was always promising more than he could deliver. He walked on water and then fell in. He promised never to deny Jesus, and then he did, not once but three times. His flaws were mine, his anxieties mine, and then, when I thought about it, his redemption and rehabilitation were also mine." - Peter J. Gomes, The Good Book, 1996.


does it sound like a disciple to worship through an inverted cross?

To go through the church/pope > Peter > Jesus > God?

Is this line autentic . i dont think so.

It sounds to me like %�"% religion

contact God yourself.
ignore the pope. You can do it yourself. - And if not, then let Jesus Christ help you to Him.

Originally posted by tyriffic

I do not see any real significance to the cross towards Jesus's message.

well there is... the cross was a holy symbol long before Jesus Christ was crucified.

The ULTIMATE conspiracy...

The Pope IS the Antichrist!

The aforementioned St. Peter reference is correct of course, but the way the Pope tried to hush the molestation issue, really makes one wonder...hmm???

Originally posted by helen670
Hmmm i never noticed this before........inverted cross with the Pope!

I'll try and see what i can find on it......when did the Pope actually start using the 'inverted cross''???

I know the Russian Orthodox do not have anything like this!
Interesting !

=========================================

Fascinating
' The last religious ceremony I attended was in a Russian Ortho Church
I enjoyed it , no preaching just direct quote of biblical occurance.
Seems like Peter had a desire of one up manship, to suffer more than Christ, by being upside down
The thought also occurs to me, of a symbol of distress, ie;
when a flag is raised upside down it indicates 'trouble or distress''

tut tut

those pictures are down right scary
infact, a man hanging on a cross would give anyone nightmares...

how do you all know he died for your sins?? maybe he was accused of some horrific crime and payed the price for it.

it seems everyone giving into religion lacks inner strength and self awarness. something evolution will hopefully attack in the near future. its like having a world full of walking religious fanatic zombies.

religion is deadly.

Most modern scholars agree that Peter was probably never "the Bishop of Rome" as the Catholic Church has always said.

Peter was the leader of a congregation of exiled Jews and procelutes in Rome who believed in Jesus.

When he was executed he denied to be hung uppon the cross the same way as Jesus was, so instead he demanded to be hung upside down, hence an inverted cross is often refered to as a Peter's Cross.

Peter was a prophet who was not ignorant to the Spirit of God and ancient wisdom. He called Rome Babylon. It is not a secret that the AntiChrist is the highest priest of Babylon. In ancient Babylon their zodiak had 36 astrological gods. The highest of them carried the number 666. Among the priests in Babylon, him who played out the role of this god was also on top of the priests' hierarchy and had a title which translated into Latin is "Pontifex Maximus" which translates into English something like "The Great Bridge Builder". Strange it is that this is also the title of the Pope.... The false prophet/the AntiChrist is therefore most likely a man who is the highest priest/bishop of Rome, and bases his prophecies on astrology and accuse people falsely.

Chech out my blog to find a link to the Third Angel's Message where these things are explained.

Blessings,
Mikromarius

stop reading crap books, mikromarius.
there are other books that say quite opposite, so what.
satanists and any other groups also read books that please them to justify their beliefs.

As for some others, It is impossible that pope is antichrist, you have no idea who pope is or how good person he is.
You see, he is being mocked, laughed and hated all the time. And what does bible say about it?

1 John 3:12
Do not be like Cain, who belonged to the evil one and murdered his brother. And why did he murder him? Because his own actions were evil and his brother's were righteous. Do not be surprised, my brothers, if the world hates you. We know that we have passed from death to life, because we love our brothers. Anyone who does not love remains in death. Anyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life in him.

Antichrist will be loved by world and have great political power. Church must exist, and it must remain in unity, without one man as head of church it would split up in countless pieces. It is only organisation that survived almost 2000 years, you think God would allow it if it would be "blasphemous"?

[Edited on 28-7-2003 by Megaquad]

I dont belive the pope to be antichrist.
He is simply too old and has not enough power.

Megaquad ~

Do you believe that we need the organised church in order to believe in God?

I think its peoples belief in God that keeps the church alive, not the other way round.

edit: let me rephrase

If you did not have acess to religion would you belive in God, or "the supreme absolute"?

Its a quite interesting question for me. (no black and white here) So i thought you could use it too

[Edited on 29-7-2003 by innerRevolution]

Originally posted by kitty
those pictures are down right scary
infact, a man hanging on a cross would give anyone nightmares...

how do you all know he died for your sins?? maybe he was accused of some horrific crime and payed the price for it.

it seems everyone giving into religion lacks inner strength and self awarness. something evolution will hopefully attack in the near future. its like having a world full of walking religious fanatic zombies.

religion is deadly.

No flame intended, but how do you know the Sun is going to rise in the morning?

Maybe you have some faith that it will?

Originally posted by innerRevolution
Megaquad ~

Do you believe that we need the organised church in order to believe in God?

I think its peoples belief in God that keeps the church alive, not the other way round.

Christianity would be simply hopelessly lost by now if there is no church. If there was no church, it would be anarchy and christianity would slowly disappear.

But there is something more than that, It is Gods will that it exists, in bible 'church' is mentioned around 112 times look at this example:

Acts 20:28
Keep watch over yourselves and all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers[ 20:28 Traditionally bishops]. Be shepherds of the church of God, which he bought with his own blood.

John 14:26
But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

Holy Spirit reminds and keeps church on a path of truth, this is why I believe in Catholic church which is being led by it, it is set up by God, truth can come to anyone by praying to Holy Spirit.
Church is only one who can serve mass and give body of Christ as Jesus said we must do.

Originally posted by innerRevolution
edit: let me rephrase

If you did not have acess to religion would you belive in God, or "the supreme absolute"?

Its a quite interesting question for me. (no black and white here) So i thought you could use it too

It would be harder sure, I would probably be thinking that physical world is only thing that exists, it is most widespread belief. Some people are by nature 'spiritual' and tend to seek for something more.. they always find something to believe in.

[Edited on 29-7-2003 by Megaquad]