Nikola Tesla: Genius or Madman?

Originally posted by ArchangelOfCool
I had never heard about him before this thread....other than the tesla coil in Red Alert....but I'm interested in the tower experiment now!

I think it was a tuned circuit with capacitor and inductor.

Tesla said short waves go straight and long waves hug the earth.

So 60 cps or 60Hz wave length is about 3,000 miles
So 30 cps or 30Hz wave length is about 6,000 miles
So 10 cps or 10Hz wave length is about 18,000 miles.


Did he give up on 60Hz through copper wires.

Shemanator,

I have almost 0 respect for 'myth busters' for a myriad of reasons, I will not get into those now.

Tesla stole ideas from Marconi? ALOT of people would beg to differ.


Something I just stumbled across here:

www.eet.com...

"It cannot be disputed that many fruits of Tesla's intellectual labor were stolen," said Tesla historian Gary Peterson. "Take the case of radio — Marconi's famous trans-Atlantic transmission in 1901, which by his own admission incorporated Tesla's apparatus, had a tremendous psychological effect, drawing investors' attention away from Tesla's work."

Be sure to read the rest of it.

About Tesla's dynamic theory of gravity, I just found this after searching:

netowne.com...

Definitely WAY out there eh? Fun read though. What do you guys think about it?


More here:

peswiki.com...:Tesla's_Dynamic_Theory_of_Gravity

[edit on 19-9-2006 by ViewFromTheStars]

I agree with TheBandit795.

Shamanator, Tesla was a recluse. All the energy that people normally put into relationships and politics was not wasted in that way by Tesla. He put his efforts into comprehending electrical phenomena. The thought skills used in the business world that Edison was involved in, for example, will do a disservice to the scientist trying to make sense of the physical world.

I ask, who was more handicapped by trying to succeed in the business and political world at any cost? Who was more inspired to obtain a true and complete understanding of the physical world?

Originally posted by ViewFromTheStars
I am a HUGE fan of Tesla. The two things that interest me the most nowadays about him are:

1: He repeatedly made references to "non herztian waves". What exactly did he mean by this? According to the current mainstream dogmatic scientific "establishment" 'longitudinal' (Scalar) waves can't exist in space... Or can they? Tom Bearden has information up on the web concerning scalar electromagnetics but I believe he is a disinformant shill for the government to throw any information movement off the trail of advanced technology that is being hidden/suppressed. Some of what he writes about may be true but assume most of it is 'distorted'.


2: His 'etheric' theory of gravity. The link I had is not working but I'll be looking for another source to post here. You can search Google too of course.


Edit.. make that 3!.. I forgot to mention that I believe he may have had something to do with the Tunguska explosion as well.

[edit on 19-9-2006 by ViewFromTheStars]

The big thing with the electron is that the magnetic force field extends into space.
Radio and TV waves I assume are Hertzian and generated by Radio Frequency
coil oscillations. Perhaps Tesla means a pulse of some kind not an oscillation.


Aether radiation is a push that is blocked by mass, so a small object gets
pushed toward the larger mass object. Thats all I got from it.

Tunguska may have happened when Tesla was in Colorado Springs, now near
the home of the Air Force Acadamy. In the DVD movie with Orsen Wells as
JP Morgan, a globe on a tower shoots rays at the surrounding mountains.
Then a light bulb lights up when placed in the ground.

If he shot to the ionosphere to create an aurora it might have bounced and
landed in Siberia. A lot of this in on web pages.

See how Tesla is like Edison but with alternating current.
Edison had investments in DC power and asorted devices, he could hold out
until full DC to AC conversion took it all away.

Tesla invented a one connection filament bulb.

I'd like to add that Tesla invented the AND Gate; a logic gate that made computers possible. As for the mighty Tesla coil causing cancer... really? Because there's a tesla coil in ever transformer you drive past. There's a tiny tesla coil in you computer, in your TV, in your microwave oven, and of course -in every sci-fi or horror movie that features a jacob's ladder.

Let me elaborate on 'logitudinal waves' as I understand them but first I want to comment further on the Tunguska explosion of 1908. I find the multitude of theories and scientific 'explanations' unsatisfactory for a number of reasons, perhaps a thread should be started on it if it has not already? The big red flag concerning the explosion for me and the cornerstone of the mystery as far as I'm concerned is the FACT that "whatever" exploded in the sky on the mysterious day in 1908 did NOT hit the ground. One eyewitness in particula said something to the effect that it looked like the "sky itself just opened up and exploded". The information surrounding the incident gets even stranger than this after you dig into it long enough.

That aside,

Longitudinal waves.. I'm sure a lot of people here don't know what a longitudinal wave is and to be honest I'm not 100% sure myself but let me expound on my understanding of it:

Imagine a pool of water. Now imagine a disturbance of some sort occurs and creates an energy wave that now proceeds to travel through the water. On the surface of the water the 'waves' you see are -transverse-. The -pressure- wave going through the water beneath the surface of water is called 'Logitudinal'. Sound waves are longitudinal and therefore can not travel through space.

Electromagnectic waves through space are transverse but is there a type of wave that is longitudinal that can travel through space? That is the big argument here and Tesla apparently believed and supposedly demonstrated there is indeed a type of wave that travels through space and is longitudinal.

If a wave is longitudinal and traveling through space "what" in the world is it "compressing"? Get's deep doesn't it?

According to Tom Bearden, this type of 'scalar' wave does indeed exist and can not only be created but used to manipulate gravity, (closing the gap between electricy and gravity, the holy grail of science)create weapons that make nuclear bombs look like a walk in the park, heal the sick and a plethora of other 'wildly amazing' things that I think are best left to the imagination and to the Hands of God himself. Look him up on the web and read it with an open mind.. My question about some of the claims made by Tom and Nicola is what's true and what's not?

Ok, nuff of that for now.

Have you guys ever thought about electricity and how it travels through a wire? I have a friend of mine that is an electrical engineer and through the years I have gotten a pretty good understanding of the basics of electricity but one thing I could come to grips with is when I was told that 'electricity' was the flow of electrons.. Even though this may be partially true depending on how you look at it, when you get down to it it's absolutely a huge misconception. After some due diligence I discovered that 'electrical charge IS NOT the same thing as 'electrical energy'. Electrons in a wire make up the electrical charge and is not the 'energy' that is moving through it. The electrons merely 'wiggle' back and forth allowing the 'energy' to flow through the wire. Interesting to say the least: Sound waves require air molecules to 'travel' through while electrical energy (waves) require electrons and there 'charge' to move through and these electrons have to be able to move or 'wiggle so the energy can travel through it.

Continued in next post..


[edit on 19-9-2006 by ViewFromTheStars]

What exactly is the different between an energy wave traveling through the air or water and the energy wave traveling through electrons wiggling in a wire? What is the component of an 'electrical' energy wave that causes it to have to have a charge to travel through? 'non electrical' energy waves that travel through water and air don't require a 'charge' to move through.. Think about it.. It's obvious there is more than one type of 'energy wave'.. You can have a type of wave that can move through water and air NOT needing a charge in the process, there is 'electrical energy' that requires a charge that can 'wiggle' so that it can travel through it, adn then you have the great mysterious gravity 'wave'..(I'm not even going to go there right now) Electromagnetic waves can travel through space and even though they are not longitudinal "what' in the world are they travelling through and can this "what" be compressed?

WHAT in the world is an energy wave to begin with.. I mean, it's nothing but it's something. My brain hurts!


Ok, that's my 2 cents worth for right now. What say you?


[edit on 19-9-2006 by ViewFromTheStars]

From the first post:

Given these fantastic technologies that Tesla had invented, Marconi decided to approach several financial backers with his own ideas, after seeing the slighting that Tesla had gotten from other backers in his later years. After having the death ray technology condemned by the Pope in 1936, Marconi allegedly faked his death in early 1937, and fled to South America with almost 100 other physicists and scientists, to set up shop in the crater of an extinct volcano. It is also rumored that Tesla himself did not actually die in 1943, as the records state, but also faked his own death, and joined Marconi and the others in South America.

Rumors abound about this hidden high technology city in South America. Many UFO sightings have been attributed to Marconi and others in this city. Assuming Tesla's theories about anti-gravity ships were true, it's quite possible that inhabitants of this hidden city have been flying around in disc-shaped craft. It was theorized in the 1950s that the level of technology within the hidden city is decades ahead of even current 21st Century technology. Rumors of the harnessing of cosmic energy along with free-energy systems abound. Anti-gravity airships are commonplace, and by today, I'd be willing to speculate that they've already mastered nanotechnology to further their own designs.

Is it possible that a city such as this exists? Given the advanced technology that Tesla and Marconi were both working on before their public deaths, I'd have to say that it is possible.

Wow, never heard that one, Marconi and Tesla friends to the end.

Well Edison and Rockefella went on picknics together with I suppose Samuel
Clemens (very rich from book sales and backed many inventions) and others
with large bank accounts, but Rockefella sold kerosene which was the home
lighting source before gas and Edison's DC electricity. However the gas engine
can along and kerosene is jet fuel, so Rockefella and Edison had no qualms.

Well the ufo story might have started with Tesla, but as always finished by
someone else. Perhaps to me and others, not actual mechanism, but notice
Tesla sitting in front of the basket in avatar. It is not a basket, its a coil.
Radial lines from the center might indicate the direction of the strong magnetic
field. In other posts, perhaps here, I wondered if the ufo dot of light is somehow
caught by the field.

In any case, here is the original Tesla flat coil patent, and ion generator using
the coils power, and a small plasma thruster used on a satellite.

www.delphion.com...
www.delphion.com...
www.delphion.com...


So forever it seems, Tesla is at the start of some new invention.

If a wave is longitudinal and traveling through space "what" in the world is it "compressing"? Get's deep doesn't it?

Tesla and other's used the aether to hold the magnetic and electric lines of
force. No one did work in alternating current because the British physicts did
not have or experiment with coils. But they kept an eye on Tesla thats for sure.
This would be before 1900.

The idea of compression must be from that old theory.

In a movie about Tesla, he lived by a mountain that was repeatedly struck by
lightning. It was a scene out of Mount Olympus.

Somehow the thunder, sound, and electricity combined, if thats an answer.

A spark from a spark gap went across a lab to a ring antenna with a spark gap.
It sparked repeatedly. However this I think was Hertz's lab and its a Hertzian
wave.

[edit on 9/19/2006 by TeslaandLyne]

[edit on 9/19/2006 by TeslaandLyne]

With all of the mention of the relationship between Tesla and Marconi, I feel I should mention that Marconi was originally Tesla's assistant, and later started on his own research, while remaining very close friends with Tesla. The book Tesla & Marconi by David Hatcher Childress goes into this relationship. Historically, however, this relationship was greatly clouded by the Tesla vs. Marconi supreme court case, in which Tesla sued Marconi for patent infringement over the invention of the radio.

Another point that I want to address is the prior comment about Tesla trying to steal the invention of the light bulb from Edison. Turn of the century (1800s-1900s) America was a very different place than it is now. Information didn't travel instantly. Not everyone had access to a telegraph. Telephones weren't in wide usage (having only been invented in 1876, and still in the realm of wishful thinking for most people), and fax machines and the internet weren't even a twinkle in anyone's eye. Edison was based, at the time, in Menlo Park, NJ, whereas Tesla was back and forth between New York City and Colorado Spring, CO. The patent office was (and still is) based in Washington, DC. Tesla was an inventor, and true electrical engineer. Edison was a businessman first, and electrical inventor second. While Tesla actually did inevnt the light bulb first, Edison made it to the patent office first, and thus was given the first patent on the light bulb, thusly making him the credited inventor. What Edison can be credited with, as far as the light bulb however, is that he invented the first commercially available design for the light bulb. Even the Wikipedia page on Edison states this fact (though it leaves out the fact that Tesla invented the light bulb before him), stating that 8 other inventors had actually created less efficient designs before Edison (as mentioned before, Tesla is not mentioned among those inventors). In fairness, the article does also state that Tesla had invented several more radical ideas for electric incadescent light, including a means to light a wireless bulb, and a single connection bulb (requiring only one wire, and not two [positive and negative], as all current incadescent light bulbs require. The article does also credit Tesla with the invention of flourescent lighting (which is quickly becoming the standard, as more people are worried about energy efficiency).

At the moment, I am unable to find sufficient data to make a comparison as to who invented it first. I will keep looking.

One of the things certainly in Tesla's credit as far as lighting goes (or many of his other inventions goes) is Tesla's incredible ability to maximize efficiency of electrical devices. This can be seen in Tesla's invention of flourescent lighting (which uses roughly 1/10th the power to produce the same amount of light (the reason my entire house is lit with flourescents, as well as why almost every commercial building is lit with flourescents), the Tesla Bladeless Turbine (which is 10 times more efficient than current turbines, but, for some unknown reason, is still not in wide usage), and AC power, which revolutionized industry, especially after the invention of the AC electric motor, as it can provide a greater electric charge over much longer distances.

There is no disputing that Tesla was an incredible inventor, and is responsible for much of the foundation for our current, electrically advanced world.

Even with all speculation surrounding his later career and death aside, Tesla was most certainly one of the most influential figures in the creation of the modern world.

He repeatedly made references to "non herztian waves". What exactly did he mean by this? According to the current mainstream dogmatic scientific "establishment" 'longitudinal' (Scalar) waves can't exist in space... Or can they? Tom Bearden has information up on the web concerning scalar electromagnetics but I believe he is a disinformant shill for the government to throw any information movement off the trail of advanced technology that is being hidden/suppressed. Some of what he writes about may be true but assume most of it is 'distorted'

Here are some theories as to why Tesla had some of the ideas that he had about longitudinal / non herzian waves.

amasci.com...

205.243.100.155...

Electromagnetic waves can travel through space and even though they are not longitudinal "what' in the world are they travelling through and can this "what" be compressed?

Ether.. at least thats what Tesla believed.



[edit on 19-9-2006 by Heckman]

Originally posted by Heckman

He repeatedly made references to "non herztian waves". What exactly did he mean by this? According to the current mainstream dogmatic scientific "establishment" 'longitudinal' (Scalar) waves can't exist in space... Or can they? Tom Bearden has information up on the web concerning scalar electromagnetics but I believe he is a disinformant shill for the government to throw any information movement off the trail of advanced technology that is being hidden/suppressed. Some of what he writes about may be true but assume most of it is 'distorted'

Here are some theories as to why Tesla had some of the ideas that he had about longitudinal / non herzian waves.

amasci.com...

205.243.100.155...

Electromagnetic waves can travel through space and even though they are not longitudinal "what' in the world are they travelling through and can this "what" be compressed?

Ether.. at least thats what Tesla believed.



[edit on 19-9-2006 by Heckman]

Good reading Heckman, always finding out more things Tesla but when you say "at least that's what Tesla believed" you imply that the aether does not exist. Don't forget that there is evidence that whatever space is made out of can be bent and warped. (Compressed anyone?) One scientifically verifiable example of this is gravitational lensing. Gravity is a great mystery.. no one (supposedly) has mechanically explained it or linked it to electricity. If the sun just 'popped' out of existence would the earth continue circling the 'gravity well' for 8 minutes? this is still hotly debated in the scientific community. Is gravity a longitudinal or transverse wave? Enough digressing. My point is this.. Is gravity the only thing that can bend/compress space? I wonder...

Good reading Heckman, always finding out more things Tesla but when you say "at least that's what Tesla believed" you imply that the aether does not exist. Don't forget that there is evidence that whatever space is made out of can be bent and warped. (Compressed anyone?) One scientifically verifiable example of this is gravitational lensing. Gravity is a great mystery.. no one (supposedly) has mechanically explained it or linked it to electricity. If the sun just 'popped' out of existence would the earth continue circling the 'gravity well' for 8 minutes? this is still hotly debated in the scientific community. Is gravity a longitudinal or transverse wave? Enough digressing. My point is this.. Is gravity the only thing that can bend/compress space? I wonder...

I should have been more clear. I do believe that aether does exist. I was stating the fact that many "modern" scientist do not. With recent studies of the universe allot of scientist are revisiting some of the old aether theories. I have read several studies of observations that gravity in fact moves much faster than light. Ill see if I can find them....

Here is a website describing gravity's effect on orbits and its apparent 20 times the speed of light effect on the moon / earth / sun during an eclipse
metaresearch.org...


Several scientist maintain that Ed Fomalont and Sergei Kopeikin's measurement of gravity was in fact an error interpretation of the data that they gathered. .
www.space.com...
www.space.com...


[edit on 23-9-2006 by Heckman]

I read a book on the life of Tesla years ago, and there were a few things I wanted to point out, although my memory is a little sketchy.

When Tesla came to America, he was hired on by Edison ( a friend of Edisons sent him a reference letter regarding Tesla, stating that he might just be smarter than Edison himself). Edison hired him on in one of his factories, telling Tesla that he would pay him $10,000 (which was a TON of money 100 years ago) if he could figure out a problem Edison was having. Tesla figured it out enhancing production i think, and when he went to Edison for the dough, Edison said something along the lines of "you are too gullible Mr. Tesla". So Tesla quit and dug ditches for a while until he could get a backer to start inventing again.

Intersting point to bring up was his trauma in university. While he was attending a class on electricity, which was relatively new, he brought up the idea of alternating current, and the class and professor laughed him out of class, saying it would never be an actuallity. Shortly after, he came down with a life threatening illness where he couldn't communicate or get out of bed. He claimed he could hear a coin drop a block away and it would pound in his head. After months of being almost comotose (doctors said his condition was fatal) he suddenly snapped out of it and started drawing up plans for an AC current. Some say he spent the whole time of his sickness pondering this, others say he might have been given ideas from aliens, lol, who knows. It was an interesting read though. I think it was "the Life and Times of Nikola Tesla" if anyone is interested.

I've never heard about the coma story (then again, I've also never read the book). That said, I do know that Tesla devoted all of his waking hours to inventing. He was most certainly employed by Edison in his earlier years (which later led to the massive Tesla/Edison invention war).

Edison, though he'd never admit to it, knew Tesla was lightyears ahead of his own research (another reason for the rivalry).

And yes, upon first memtion, A/C power was greatly laughable to the scientific community. Tesla's invention and application of it, however, revolutionized modern industry as we know it. I bet all those that laughed at him regretted it later.

Great posting on Tesla, got to catch up on the thread.

This friendship of Tesla and Marconi, its been stretched into Marconi
developing a saucer craft and giving Tesla a ride to South America,
yeah where else..

The thing is, who else would understand Tesla more than Marconi?

Now we must find the lost writings of Marconi.

Originally posted by TeslaandLyne
This friendship of Tesla and Marconi, its been stretched into Marconi
developing a saucer craft and giving Tesla a ride to South America,
yeah where else..

The thing is, who else would understand Tesla more than Marconi?

While taking the unorthodox nature of Tesla's inventions into account, the flying saucer theory is possible, yet still in the realm of unproven urban legend. However, what is known as fact about Tesla and Marconi's relationship is that they did work together on a great many projects, and even with the lawsuit over the radio, they still remained friends. It's also a known fact that Tesla and Marconi were working on several unorthodox propulsion, defense, and shielding systems that still are only in the realm of Star Trek science fiction in the popular science world. This isn't to say that such things weren't actually developed, especially when you consider Tesla's paranoia in his later years, where he left out certain crucial elements in his patent applications, and later stopped applying for patents.

For example, the Tesla Death Ray was patented (or at least applied for - I'm not sure offhand if the patent was granted or not). However, if you look at the patent documents, the details of the emitter array is strangely missing, as well as a few details about how the power source worked. Additionally, it is known that Tesla was working on alternative forms of propulsion, including a version of anti-gravity, that worked as a magnet repelling from the magnetism of the earth itself. He also had several theories on how to sheild from electromagnetic or focused energy attacks (he developed the death day, as well as a means to shield from it).

In continuance of his work, many armchai physicists, myself included, have taken Tesla's proven research, his theories on his later work (which has no complete documentation still available, as his lab journal was strangely missing when his body was found in his NYC apartment), and developed them further (some in theory, some in practice - all my own work is still theoretical) to develop either the things Tesla tried to patent or claimed to have invented after he stopped trying to get patents, or have used these theories to further Tesla's work.

As a for-instance, one of my own theories based on Tesla's work (with much credit to Michael Faraday), is a system that can be used to shield from not only electromagnetic blasts, but direct physical attack (think Star Trek or Star Wars style shields for ships), using some of Tesla's work as a power source, and Faraday's work on the Faraday Cage as an emitter, rather than as a dissipator. With the design I've come up with, on paper and in computer simulations, it works. I have not had the finances to build/test it in reality, though.

To this day, I believe that Tesla was at least a century ahead of his time. If anyone had taken him seriously during his life, we could very well be travelling the stars right now.

Perpetual energy from aether, energy comes from the aether, no energy in mass oh yeah

Got the link from here, above or some forum on Tesla.

As far as electrical forces being strong enough, supposing the mechanism of
aether currents via air capacitors, spark gaps, electro-arc or other technique
that in essence become a wire less trolly line opposed to a super magnetic
coil on board a craft, I got 40 to 40,000 tons when using voltages in the
thousands in the formuls, derived from Force = current(i) x magnertic field(B)
such that Force = (1/2)(V1V2)(1125/10^7) TONS to show there might be
something to it.

That is not even a feasability study but shows something might be possible.

Just assuming it can be done provided amazement when applying a few more
ideas to fake or real ufo pictures, videos and stills from videos.

Just what was going on as I see a bright line with hemisphere globes of
light above and below. A Big Mac of light, elecrtrons in motion.
I read in MAN-MADE UFS 1944-1994 a Bomber crew call the foo yo-yos.
A Yo-Yo of light, electrons captured by the strong magnetic fields.

If the Mag field is radial, it just might capture electrons in a disc or circular
area, yeah I've seen that in real or fake ufo phenominon.

Can a flat coil exhibit Bessel vibrations of light on the bottom of ufos or
is that some extreme cgi artist doing his thing. Before aether currents
build up the ufo might be in a dark cloud or appear as an undefined object.

From that page link:

5. "If through this medium enormous electrostatic stresses are assumed to act, which vary rapidly in intensity, it would allow the motion of a body through it, yet it would be rigid and elastic, although the fluid itself might be devoid of these properties".

So somethng that is not rigid,air, becomes rigid, and supports, and allows
movement as though it were not rigid.

Heavy, is this what we see as the ufo phenomenon.

Does anyone know wether or not Tesla motors is related to the Tesla family or his patents? They are building a car that does 0-60 in under 4 seconds and has a life of 250Miles before it needs recharging. They have already pre-sold all the cars they were going to build already. The car itself is gorgeous. The engine is extremely small and weighs only 70 pounds. The only bad thing is that its very limited and it costs about 100,000.00! Its based on the Lotus Elise body if Im not mistaken.

www.teslamotors.com...