Capitalism in Russia and China and Socialism in the West

Hello ATS!

Some Saturday thoughts, this time about capitalism and socialism.

The major non-Western countries, such as Russia and China, have returned to healthy capitalism, and healthy capitalism has gradually pulled Russia and China to a higher technological level. For example, the planet used to buy cars in Germany, England and the USA, since, say, China could not handle the mass production of complex equipment. A German worker earned significantly more than a worker from the Third World, since the German had obvious advantages:

— new advanced machines versus old primitive machines;
— good production organization versus dirt and chaos in workshops littered with garbage;
— well-designed products versus hastily stolen copies of old European products;
— disciplined educated personnel versus illiterate immigrants hammering bolts with a sledgehammer;
— a civilized capitalist market versus criminal chaos or even socialism.

Now all these advantages have evaporated. The Chinese make cars better than the Germans, and buyers vote for them en masse with their rubles not only in Russia, but also in countries that the US has not attacked. The Chinese factory has the same machine as the German one. Production in China is organized no worse. Chinese engineers are at least as good as the German ones — maybe even better. Capitalism in China is better organized than in Europe: the state rarely harasses business and more reliably protects it from external problems.

To be fair, I want to say that I personally have an American car, the previous version of the Escalade. I am happy with both the quality and the design. But one thing is bad — it is a very expensive car, both in operation and in repair. For me, the only plus is the drive and the status of ownership. But I am rather an exception to the rule.

In Russia, if compared with Germany or Finland, the situation is similar - it's just that Russians do not specialize in consumer goods like cars, so it's not so clear. However, if in 1984 or 1994 German factories were something from the distant future compared to Russian ones, now there is no difference in technology and in the general culture of production. But there is a difference, for example, in energy, which is cheap in Russia, and expensive in Germany, England and the USA.

It follows from this that salaries in Europe should be at least no higher than in Russia and China - otherwise the economy will not even theoretically converge, the goods will be too expensive. And this is what is happening. Russian and Chinese workers now receive higher salaries than their counterparts in the West. Hence the migration of skilled labor to the East. If we take into account the green demons, the rainbow, the great substitution, the rejection of cheap energy and other negative factors, we will find that it will be very difficult for Europe to compete with the Russians, even if salaries there are significantly lower than in Russia and China. It is impossible to convince people to buy Mercedes en masse while Honchi of the same level is half the price. And it is even more impossible to convince businesses to buy German chemicals, including household ones, instead of Russian ones, since in this case even the factors of nostalgia and reputation cannot be played upon.

For now, all of Europe is holding on to the inertia accumulated over the last century. However, Europe's business model is already hopelessly broken. There are no raw materials, no energy, no workers, no markets, no reputation, no unique technologies...

You have to pay for friendship with America.

Thank you.

How’s that war economy working in Russia.

I heard that Putin’s missiles keep failing? So they are in the market with China to get a launch platform not designed by Russian incompetence? How’s that for market analysis?

a reply to: RussianTroll

Russian and Chinese workers now receive higher salaries than their counterparts in the West.

The minimum wages in China is around $2-$4 USD an hour depending on what region one lives in. For Russia about the same.

One thing China does have is about 1000 people that are 1 in a million. More than Russia and America combined. They work hard and going out in space alone. Russia has kicked a lot of goals on that front while America has some stranded Astronauts in orbit for a few months now. I don't know about that secret space program stuff?

I know the economic situation on this planet is a mess. What some CEO's have done to well established businesses is criminal. How the war chest is abused by warlords is a chronic condition. I guess in time finding a more consistent value across the globe is where the trend is. As for how we get there, easy way, hard way, some way?

With how America is falling into the dark days of the USSR with its political course, preparing for the hard way is reasonable.

a reply to: RussianTroll

Can't do too serious on a Saturday RT.
I gave it a quick once over but I'll re-read your OP tomorrow.

But my initial observation is that you've made one big glaring omission; no direct Brit bashing in it!

Well done.

a reply to: Lazy88

How’s that for market analysis?

Been watching Ukraine lately?

a reply to: RussianTroll

"There are no raw materials, no energy, no workers, no markets, no reputation, no unique technologies...".

None of that happens to be true.

It is true that China is now a major motor manufacturer.

But not due to capitalism, due to massive state investment and subsidies.

a reply to: Lazy88
The Russian economy survived precisely because it is capitalist. That is, demand creates supply. But in the West, under the socialist Soviet economy, the authorities try to order the economy to act for the sake of political interests. The whole world sees the result)))

a reply to: kwaka

You can continue to believe Western media, but the fact is that now Chinese tourists are the most desirable and profitable in the world))))

a reply to: Freeborn

You are right, Britain is not worthy of being mentioned in my Saturday musings. It is now not even a third world country, but a fourth world country.))))

a reply to: RussianTroll

HA HA....Which clearly explains your obsession with the place and its inhabitants.
Stop being silly RT.....admit it, your standards are slipping.

Must.Try. Harder.

Seriously, I will give it more consideration tomorrow.

a reply to: RussianTroll

I hear that it is likely that a lot of Chinese might be coming to certain parts of Russia.

a reply to: RussianTroll

And this is what is happening. Russian and Chinese workers now receive higher salaries than their counterparts in the West. Hence the migration of skilled labor to the East.

This is the exact opposite reason why skilled labor jobs are increasing in China. It is because labor rates in China are much cheaper than the west, thus the migration of jobs to China. Now, Chinese and Russian wage rates may be increasing relative to what they have been historically, and this is a simple function of supply and demand, but these same wages are far less than wages in the west.

a reply to: Freeborn

Oh, you forgot about the rules of the ATC! You can't discuss the personalities of the ATC members, let alone insult them.
I can see your mental rage. Calm down and conduct the discussion respectfully!

a reply to: Freeborn

Looking on the bright side, now that we have been downgraded, perhaps we won't be worth nuking?

originally posted by: kwaka

Been watching Ukraine lately?

It’s what happens when oligarchs invade a country to steal natural resources. Then make up BS excuses when it backfires and results in conflict costing Russia at least 500 million a day. Lives and equipment.

a reply to: RussianTroll

Never mind the rules of this site, you just insulted the whole of Britain.

originally posted by: RussianTroll
a reply to: Lazy88
The Russian economy survived precisely because it is capitalist. That is, demand creates supply. But in the West, under the socialist Soviet economy, the authorities try to order the economy to act for the sake of political interests. The whole world sees the result)))

How much of the profits are the oligarchs stealing, and how much is making its way to war widows?

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

You are mistaken and are a prisoner of propaganda. If in China now skilled workers in all spheres of economy and science, previously trained and working in the West, now because of, among other things, persecution of them, return to China for higher-paid jobs in the Motherland, then in Russia, the return of the elderly and highly skilled specialists is due to other reasons. Here is the spiritual - the mysterious Russian Soul, and simple calculation. In Russia they pay more.
Next in line are Indian specialists.

a reply to: RussianTroll

So… China has no forced labor camps?

a reply to: Lazy88

And in the West?